Atari 5200 XM

[fernando marrin]

So, adding a shitty steering wheel and brake pedal to a Golf and calling it and A3? Is that the formula? Because if it's not, then your comparison makes no sense.

 

no ,

adding quality materials makes a hell of a difference...

[adam242]

no ,

adding quality materials makes a hell of a difference...

 

As a fan of both VW and Audi, I understand the point you're trying to make. But by adding 'quality materials' such as AV out and a digital stick such as a Competition Pro, you're eliminating the only differences between a 5200 and an A8.

 

I'm not bashing the 5200.. I own one and play it regularly. But the only meaningful thing that differentiates it is the controller. Games that take advantage of the analog stick (Centipede, Missile Command, Pole Position) or the extra button and/or keypad (Qix, Star Raiders) are a joy! When you start changing the 'steering wheel' to something digital to make the rest of the library playable, you might as well just use an A8. There is no difference.

[fernando marrin]

As a fan of both VW and Audi, I understand the point you're trying to make. But by adding 'quality materials' such as AV out and a digital stick such as a Competition Pro, you're eliminating the only differences between a 5200 and an A8.

 

I'm not bashing the 5200.. I own one and play it regularly. But the only meaningful thing that differentiates it is the controller. Games that take advantage of the analog stick (Centipede, Missile Command, Pole Position) or the extra button and/or keypad (Qix, Star Raiders) are a joy! When you start changing the 'steering wheel' to something digital to make the rest of the library playable, you might as well just use an A8. There is no difference.

 

are we talking about the same systems?

 

cheap plastic,

low quality mushy keyboard

 

vs

 

aluminium trim,

high quality finish,

nice big carts w/with nice labels,

beautiful design,

controller holder,

analog /digital controllers with 2 action buttons, NOT 1!

cables twice as thick/long,

 

can be put over the carpet in the basement, and so on...

[adam242]

 

 

are we talking about the same systems?

 

cheap plastic,

low quality mushy keyboard

 

vs

 

aluminium trim,

high quality finish,

nice big carts w/with nice labels,

beautiful design,

controller holder,

analog /digital controllers with 2 action buttons, NOT 1!

cables twice as thick/long,

 

can be put over the carpet in the basement, and so on...

 

Actually, I was talking about the games themselves in terms of graphics, sound and actual gameplay. They are the freaking exact same thing.

 

If the aesthetics matter that much, then most of what you prefer about the 5200 is mirrored in the XL series. Quality construction, pleasant design, aluminum trim, etc. I won't defend the inherent cheap feel of the XEs.

 

But again, the games themselves are EXACTLY the same. And most of them (on the 5200) require a 3rd-party controller to be playable!

It's like having an Audi S4 with a worn-out, sloppy suspension. :-)

[fernando marrin]

Actually, I was talking about the games themselves in terms of graphics, sound and actual gameplay. They are the freaking exact same thing.

 

If the aesthetics matter that much, then most of what you prefer about the 5200 is mirrored in the XL series. Quality construction, pleasant design, aluminum trim, etc. I won't defend the inherent cheap feel of the XEs.

 

But again, the games themselves are EXACTLY the same. And most of them (on the 5200) require a 3rd-party controller to be playable!

It's like having an Audi S4 with a worn-out, sloppy suspension. :-)

 

 

don't agree that you need a 3rd party controller on most games,

don't agree the differences are just aesthetic either,

 

high quality materials and 2 button gameplay make a hell of a difference to me ,

even gameplay wise!

 

anyway, enjoy your A8, i do, as all Atari systems

[Charlie_]

So, adding a shitty steering wheel and brake pedal to a Golf and calling it and A3? Is that the formula? Because if it's not, then your comparison makes no sense.

It's so funny how hard people try to justify that a 5200 ain't an A8. But it's not my job to convince them. Just don't expect me to agree, and opinions are the nature

of chat boards.

 

5200 is not an A8. It is a console.

Atariage has it listed right under the 2600, just above the 7800.

[Charlie_]

Actually, I was talking about the games themselves in terms of graphics, sound and actual gameplay. They are the freaking exact same thing.

 

That is true, but as devices they are different. One sits you at a desk, with all the computer and peripherals that go along with it.

The other gets used like a gaming console, in your living room.

 

The original XBOX was based on a Nvidia graphics based Pentium computer? It wasn't the same as a computer though.

Because it was designed for a specific use, even though the hardware was identical to a computer.

 

That is exactly what the 5200 is.

[adam242]

 

That is true, but as devices they are different. One sits you at a desk, with all the computer and peripherals that go along with it.

The other gets used like a gaming console, in your living room.

 

That's funny, I used to have a 600XL sitting on my coffee table (which is in my living room) that I used as a gaming console.

[Charlie_]

That's funny, I used to have a 600XL sitting on my coffee table (which is in my living room) that I used as a gaming console.

 

Did you use your foot on the space bar to use the bomb in defender? Cause that is what I think is funny.

 

It also shows the point, they are different as devices despite sharing a common hardware.

[jetset]

Did you use your foot on the space bar to use the bomb in defender?

 

:lolblue:

 

[+wood_jl]

5200 is not an A8. It is a console.

Atariage has it listed right under the 2600, just above the 7800.

 

There are many ways, to notice that an A5200 is essentially an A8. Here are just a couple:

 

(1) Simply play Pac-man, and other games from the era. I think I was 12 or 13 years old, when I noticed this. That was almost 30 years ago. Yet this fact is oblivious to some, in 2012? How?

 

(2) Popular media noticed it was the same, almost 30 years ago. Proof of concept? Here's an almost 30-year-old article from Creative Computing, which denotes just what I've said:

 

http://www.atarimaga...tpost_Atari.php

From that article:

I have been hard in past columns on the Atari 5200, the supposed "Supergame" successor to the VCS. It is widely known that the 5200 is an Atari computer in drag, with the compatibility built out.

 

If that's a source of tension, or irritation for some (to quote Col. Jessup from "A Few Good Men"), I don't give a shit. Sometimes, the truth offends. It was MARKETED as something else. Marketing is largely bullshit, as should be common knowledge However, it was marketed as "different," and Atariage has a section for it, as a result of that marketing. The fact that Atariage has a section for it is proof of nothing, other than that it was MARKETED as "different." The fact remains it was an Atari 400 remix, as Creative Computing so wisely stated, 29 years ago.

 

(3) For a more modern reference, here's what Wikipedia says, from.....

 

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Atari_5200

The 5200 was based on Atari Inc.'s existing 400/800 computers and the internal hardware was almost identical, although software was not directly compatible between the two systems.

 

Now, can we please move on past this "debate" (not really) that was settled 30 years ago, that a 5200 is a bastardized 400? I think the evidence is plain enough.

 

Anyone who puts the C64 above the A8 should put the C64 above the 5200. They're the same. It's all opinion whether or not you like the C64 or A8/5200 better, but to separate the 5200 from the A8 and claim superiority is insane, unless "superiority" is defined as shitty controllers that break within weeks, and CONTRIVED SOFTWARE INCOMPATIBILITY.

 

While too-late in the marketplace, the XE Game System....

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_XEGS

 

....was a much better concept. If this gets someone's panties in a flap, I am unapologetic; it's not my fault that the truth offends. I didn't create this situation; I merely observe it.

[Charlie_]

....was a much better concept. If this gets someone's panties in a flap, I am unapologetic; it's not my fault that the truth offends. I didn't create this situation; I merely observe it.

 

It doesn't offend. You just don't get it. No one is saying it is not the same hardware base.

A console system is not a computer in its use. That is a simple fact.

[+wood_jl]

It doesn't offend. You just don't get it. No one is saying it is not the same hardware base.

A console system is not a computer in its use. That is a simple fact.

 

Yeah, "I get it" perfectly. The 5200 is a botched Atari 400. If I throw an Atari 400 on the living room floor and play cartridge games, it's exactly the same "in use" as a console. That is a simple fact.

[Charlie_]

Yeah, "I get it" perfectly. The 5200 is a botched Atari 400. If I throw an Atari 400 on the living room floor and play cartridge games, it's exactly the same "in use" as a console. That is a simple fact.

 

No you don't tough guy. When your using smart bombs leaning over the coffee table to slam the space bar , or hitting it with your foot, is that 400 a console? Can you even do that with the 400 style KB? It is a computer. Used as designed at a desk it might not be a bad design.

Admittedly these days with SIDE and SIO2SD make it is easier to treat a computer as a console. However it is still not a console.

 

5200 is marketed as a console, because it is a console.

 

You don't have to be so belligerent. The world knows what the hardware is based from.

 

I prefer the 5200 for the same games that can be found on the A8. At this point I'm glad it bothers you so much.

When I sit down behind a computer the C64 and its software library fills that bill perfectly.

 

Anyway, Welcome to the ignore list. A smart ass self loving presumptuous "person" like you would only provoke me to more "debates"

heh........

[+Cafeman]

The Atari 5200 Supersystem does not need a modern-day XM style cartridge. It's sound chip - POKEY - is forever going to be good enough. Its memory size of 32K is big enough, and it can support bigger bank-switched games. Its 16K RAM is big enough for the games 5200 was designed to play.

 

A better A/V option would be nice, but that's a huge hassle because you need to mod to S-video, of which many flatscreens today don't even have an S-video port anymore.

 

IMO, there are two things that can be worked on today to keep 5200 alive and well. I'm not counting the flash carts since we already have those, as mentioned above.

 

1. Keep the ports and homebrews coming! This year's excellent Tempest 5200, with analog controls, proves that the 5200 has something that the A8 can't give you. The A8 can not give you the pinpoint analog control that you get with 5200 Tempest. The A8 can also not give you the at-your-hands 2-button + keypad + start/pause-reset functionality that the 5200 controller allows!

 

2. Controller improvements and support. These already go a long way to improve the stock mushy buttons/worn out flex circuits. If anyone could make a converter to use a modern analog stick for the 5200, that would be a great too. Such as a Dreamcast, N64, Gamecube, or Xbox controller. Not sure that's ever really going to happen though.

[+wood_jl]

No you don't tough guy.

 

"Tough guy?" HA HA HA! At what point did I threaten anybody - or anything - with anything other than a dose of common sense, for those desperately in need of such? HA HA HA!!

 

 

When your using smart bombs leaning over the coffee table to slam the space bar , or hitting it with your foot, is that 400 a console? Can you even do that with the 400 style KB? It is a computer. Used as designed at a desk it might not be a bad design.

 

To answer your question: If barefooted an accurate, can hit the 400 space bar with the big toe. Not the easiest, but have done it. With 800/1200XL/600XL/800XL/65XE/130XE it's not as difficult, because you have a full-stroke keyboard. So, if I get this correctly, your defense of the 5200 depends upon "smart bombs" used in ONE GAME, "Defender?" HA HA HA. That's as absurd of a defense, as I've ever heard. I note for the record, however, you're not the first person to diss on the 400/800/XL/XE line while defending the C64. I submit to you (or anyone else who is reading, since I'm allegedly on "ignore") that that position is completely absurd. I state it for the record. The 5200 is the same thing, with shitty controllers.

 

Admittedly these days with SIDE and SIO2SD make it is easier to treat a computer as a console. However it is still not a console.

 

No shit! A Donkey Kong cartridge, an Atari 400 on the living room floor with a long RF cable, and a joystick are all it takes to make a "computer" a "console." That was 30 years ago. How quick you are!!!!

5200 is marketed as a console, because it is a console.

 

You don't have to be so belligerent. The world knows what the hardware is based from.

 

That was my entire f*cking point. Glad to see you finally picked up on it. Took some doing, no?

 

I prefer the 5200 for the same games that can be found on the A8. At this point I'm glad it bothers you so much.

 

Ha, I'm not bothered at all. Calling out fools on their bulls*it is kind of a sport. As always, putting the 5200 in its true context tends to do such. You're entirely welcome!

 

When I sit down behind a computer the C64 and its software library fills that bill perfectly.

 

I rather enjoy the C64, courtesy of 1541 Ultimate2, so I can relate to this.

 

 

Anyway, Welcome to the ignore list. A smart ass self loving presumptuous "person" like you would only provoke me to more "debates"

heh........

 

Wow - name-calling? Desperation? Well,. I sort-of looked to you as [possibly] someone else who owns 2 Mega STe's and potentially an STe confidant with information and experience in that regard. However, it is clear that you maintain an elementary-school level of intellect, so I'm quite happy to have sorted this out, before I actually posed any questions of any substance to you. It is obvious that at your remedial level of intellect, you can potentially offer me NOTHING in ST/STe/Mega STe regard, so once again, I fail to apologize. Good luck to you! You should sell your ST as you misrepresent the community. Being on the "ignore" lists of idiots is a fine place to be, as I can still comment on their bullshit but they can't mine.

 

[candle]

5200 is a crimped atari 400 without its game base, and with less of ram - always a bad idea

controller wise - you can do very the same keypad + analog joystick on any a8 hardware that includes a POKEY chip that you can do on 5200, you don't need POKEY to handle the keypad, PIA will do it gracefully

 

but to the point

 

marketing a cartridge as 5200 XM is just tasteless

let me hear that YAMAHA chip playing right off so called 5200 XM cartridge shell

hats off...

[Charlie_]

...........

 

 

Confidant? If only you knew how ignorant you sound. Someone doesn't agree with you and you start talking down at them like your some kind of authority. Cursing, but your too much of a pussy so you have a * in there.

 

Get your head out of your ass. Go be a fanboy in the A8 section.

 

Oh, tapatalk doesn't use ignore apparently...

Edited December 4, 2012 by Official Ninja

[jetset]

 

Be hidden/invite only the 5200 section should be. Too many trolls there are.

[ApolloBoy]

Wow - name-calling? Desperation? Well,. I sort-of looked to you as [possibly] someone else who owns 2 Mega STe's and potentially an STe confidant with information and experience in that regard. However, it is clear that you maintain an elementary-school level of intellect, so I'm quite happy to have sorted this out, before I actually posed any questions of any substance to you. It is obvious that at your remedial level of intellect, you can potentially offer me NOTHING in ST/STe/Mega STe regard, so once again, I fail to apologize. Good luck to you! You should sell your ST as you misrepresent the community. Being on the "ignore" lists of idiots is a fine place to be, as I can still comment on their bullshit but they can't mine.

 

 

Confidant? If only you knew how ignorant you sound. Someone doesn't agree with you and you start talking down at them like your some kind of authority. Cursing, but your too much of a pussy so you have a * in there.

 

Get your head out of your ass. Go be a fanboy in the A8 section.

 

How about the both of you stop being belligerent? You're both calling each other names over a couple of game consoles/vintage computers, get over it.

[Cebus Capucinis]

Just once, just once I'd like to have an actual conversation about the 5200 without it turning into some massive A8 vs. 5200 flame-war. I like the 5200. It's boxy, weird, and has odd controllers, but it's got charm, and it's fun to play! I also have an A8 of several flavors, and I like those too! Is it really that hard to just understand that their differences (albeit minor in some cases, major in others) are what make them both unique and fun play experiences, and leave it at that?

 

Thread locked to prevent further trolling. Let's try to enjoy our 5200s yeah?