Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I suspect that the owners are waiting to do just that, make a big score on a cartrige release five years down the road when we're all starving for new 2600 material. Now that so many 2600 protos have been made available, the few missing games can only rise in value. Yes, when you want to make some money with them (big or small), then the copyright argument makes sense. If you just want to release them to the public for free, it doesn't. I can understand that intention, just let's be honest, ok? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Yes, when you want to make some money with them (big or small), then the copyright argument makes sense. If you just want to release them to the public for free, it doesn't. I can understand that intention, just let's be honest, ok? Whoa! Wait a min. Are you accusing me of HORDING the rom to increase its value? First of all, I don't own the prototype and neither does the person I got the rom from, so why would I want to increase its value? The person who does own the prototype isn't interested in selling it anyway. Secondly, I'm honored that I was trusted enough to be given this rom so I could review it. I've had several other people give me roms to review because they felt that they could trust me. I'm not about to betray that trust. Finally, I'm not lying about the copyright issues. The Blue Sky Rangers (Intellivision Productions I think) are very much still around and active in the classic gaming community, so I don't think they'd appreciate me spreading a rom to a game they own around. I also don't think Konami would appreciate it much either (and yes if someone tattled they would come after me, no matter how small this may seem). Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Whoa! Wait a min. Are you accusing me of HORDING the rom to increase its value? No, definitely not you. And I did not "accuse" anybody. First of all, I don't own the prototype and neither does the person I got the rom from, so why would I want to increase its value? The person who does own the prototype isn't interested in selling it anyway. So, what stops "the person" from "leaking" the ROM into the public? Secondly, I'm honored that I was trusted enough to be given this rom so I could review it. I've had several other people give me roms to review because they felt that they could trust me. I'm not about to betray that trust. That's exactly what I wrote too. Finally, I'm not lying about the copyright issues. The Blue Sky Rangers (Intellivision Productions I think) are very much still around and active in the classic gaming community, so I don't think they'd appreciate me spreading a rom to a game they own around. I also don't think Konami would appreciate it much either (and yes if someone tattled they would come after me, no matter how small this may seem). This is the point I do not understand. Assuming someone owns a prototype and wants to make the ROM public, how would e.g. Konami know who he is? And if they knew, how could they prove that the binary comes from him and nobody else has the same prototype too? Or that a third person, who had the cart or dump (e.g. for reviewing ) has distributed the binary? Or the prior owner(s)? How could they even prove that the binary orignally came from them and hasn't been recreated by some talented programmer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Assuming someone owns a prototype and wants to make the ROM public, how would e.g. Konami know who he is? Lets just say that the person who owns the prototype is VERY cautious. Quite frankly I don't blame him either, he has everything to lose and nothing to gain. Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Lets just say that the person who owns the prototype is VERY cautious. Ok, VERY cautious may describe him (her?) correctly. Quite frankly I don't blame him either, he has everything to lose and nothing to gain. Agreed, if he thinks that he has a valid reason to be afraid of, nobody should blame him for that. But is there really any risk? Maybe we should first discuss this, and if we find an "elegant" way, we may be able to convince him to release the ROM without risking anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 But is there really any risk? Yes I believe there is. As I've said, I think that Intellvision productions may want to release this in the future (as they did with Swordfight and Sea Battle). The owner of the prototype seems to think there's a risk, and that's good enough for me. Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Yes I believe there is. As I've said, I think that Intellvision productions may want to release this in the future (as they did with Swordfight and Sea Battle). Ah, now I get it. Ok, as long as the original copyright owners are still actively marketing the games and prefer not to release the binaries to public, I would probably act like "the person" does too. Is that scenario true for all "hidden" prototypes you know about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Cafeman Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Nice work as usual, Tempest. I'm going to read all the updates at lunchtime today (I just browsed the Desert Falcon one for now). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Is that scenario true for all "hidden" prototypes you know about? Nope. Most of the other "hidden" prototypes I know of are being held onto by people waiting to make money off them. However they're not people I have any influence over so I can't really do much about it. Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Nope. Most of the other "hidden" prototypes I know of are being held onto by people waiting to make money off them. So we are right back at the start of the discussion (NovaXpress) and "the person" is just the exception of the rule. However they're not people I have any influence over so I can't really do much about it. Expect for giving them what they want: money! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 So, let's have a list of prototypes that are (somehow) confirmed to be in someone's hands! I'll start: - Good luck, Charlie Brown - Pink Panther - Locomotion What else do we know of (not just rumour mill, but confirmed)? Cheers, Marco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I know about at least three more, but I don't feel allowed to talk about them. One of them is really good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godzilla Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 just pizzers me off to know that they are just sitting somewhere, unplayed and in many cases unknown. It's just such a pointless waste. You dont see konami bitching about 2600 time pilot being dumped, etc. so please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+johnnywc Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Come on Tom - I'm sure you can at least drop a hint or two? Not much harm in knowing something exists, is there? Waddaya say?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Come on Tom - I'm sure you can at least drop a hint or two? Not much harm in knowing something exists, is there? Waddaya say?? Nope, the owners are here on the AtariAge forums and I am quite sure they are watching this thread. So, they can decide, I won't. Sorry, my lips are sealed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NovaXpress Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I hope Tempest doesn't think that anyone feels he's done anything selfish by not passing on the ROM. Tempest is doing a great service by providing his AtariProtos site and in order to assure access to games, he must abide by all wishes of the owner. To do anything else would be ethically wrong on his part. The point some of us are making is that the owners of these prototyopes have no reason for keeping them out of circulation except for the fact that they feel the games are building value. That's why I won't be kneeling in gratitude when the games finally appear for sale at the conventions. "Hooray, you finally decided to cash in, here's $50." Those who have been generous enough to release their treasures to the public deserve our never-ending gratitude. They are doing a service to video game players and to history itself. Those who are waiting for a big score a year or two down the road should be looked at like the mercenaries they are. We'll all want the games when they're finally available, but we should remember that many people in this hobby, this tribute to the living history of gaming, have no ambitions other than to make a buck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inky Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I know about at least three more, but I don't feel allowed to talk about them. One of them is really good! I hope you're not referring to the 'Turbo' prototype? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+johnnywc Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Tom - I completely respect your decision. I was poking a little fun at the whole situation. I mean - it's getting pretty bad when people don't even want you to know that a prototype exists, never mind releasing the ROM to the public!!! Either way, the whole point about this thread is to commend Tempest on his fantastic site. So to that end, I say GREAT JOB!! to Tempest and keep up the good work!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 30, 2003 Author Share Posted September 30, 2003 I know about at least three more, but I don't feel allowed to talk about them. One of them is really good! I hope you're not referring to the 'Turbo' prototype? No, I think he was referring to Choplifter. ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inky Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I know about at least three more, but I don't feel allowed to talk about them. One of them is really good! I hope you're not referring to the 'Turbo' prototype? No, I think he was referring to Choplifter. ..Al Or maybe Airworld? :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 30, 2003 Author Share Posted September 30, 2003 I know about at least three more, but I don't feel allowed to talk about them. One of them is really good! I hope you're not referring to the 'Turbo' prototype? No, I think he was referring to Choplifter. ..Al Or maybe Airworld? Come to think of it, I believe it's I, Robot. ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inky Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I know about at least three more, but I don't feel allowed to talk about them. One of them is really good! I hope you're not referring to the 'Turbo' prototype? No, I think he was referring to Choplifter. ..Al Or maybe Airworld? Come to think of it, I believe it's I, Robot. ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godzilla Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I still love those screen shots/box art work/etc. Looks plausable to me. If only we could afford to high Doug Neubauer (sp?) to code it :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 I can understand why someone wants to keep it a secret that he has a certain prototype game (there's some very, let's say, pro-active ROM hunters out there), but I wasn't asking about names of owners. I was only interested to find out which titles are known to be in the hands of collectors. Disclosing titles isn't disrespecting someone's privacy, right? Cheers, Marco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sku_u Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 Disclosing titles isn't disrespecting someone's privacy, right? Good point. Yes, please give us a teaser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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