Cartidge/Extender Board for an Atari 130XE -- 2 Left cartridges? 1 Left, 1 Right cartridge?

[reifsnyderb]

Hello,

 

I am considering modifying an extender board to connect the Atari 130XE to a 1090 and was wondering what the preference would be for the 2 cartridge slots.  I don't know of a reason why I'd need 2 left cartridge slots.  So, are the cartridge connectors both for the left cartridge or one for the left and one for the right?

 

Thanks!

 

 

[Rybags]

The later OSes don't support Right cart.

Part of startup is checking the addresses around $9FFA-F for flags/vectors which is only done on the factory OS of the 400/800.

So even if configured properly with pinout and end connections it wouldn't start up properly unless a modified OS was made.

 

[reifsnyderb]

1 minute ago, Rybags said:

The later OSes don't support Right cart.

Part of startup is checking the addresses around $9FFA-F for flags/vectors which is only done on the factory OS of the 400/800.

So even if configured properly with pinout and end connections it wouldn't start up properly unless a modified OS was made.

 

Thanks!  Then why 2 left cartridge sockets?

[Rybags]

Maybe it's switchable?  Also there's alternate cart types like Covox or RTCs that can present hardware around $D500 but no Rom which allows coexisting with a conventional type.

[Sikor]

15 minutes ago, Rybags said:

Maybe it's switchable? 

Yes, but remember also about Sonari, Yamari, etc... So, exist many type of cartridges coexisting with other one (hmm... Sparta Dos X also, maybe Diomond GOS?)

[sup8pdct]

The only extender i am aware of that has 2 cart slots is from ICD  and used with the MIO.

The 2nd slot was for R-Time cart , also from ICD. Saved having a Superstack back in the day of SDX, R-Time 8 and a language cart other then internal Basic.

 

James

[_The Doctor__]

I am guilty of the double tower of power using left carts, there are threads with evidence of it. some later extender boards do not work like the SUPRA and ICD  eci pbi boards do. I would love a nicely done modern board so long as it has thick enough and properly routed traces so it actually can handle multiple carts and MIO running together as seen in the threads below.

 

 

 

as for a right cart port, that might need to be a switchable third port, while an RTIME8 would still work from that port, the machine would need to have an 800 OS running from either a 32 in One, or other OS switcher/switching device for other carts.

Edited January 26, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[reifsnyderb]

16 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said:

I am guilty of the double tower of power using left carts, there are threads with evidence of it. some later extender boards do not work like the SUPRA and ICD  eci pbi boards do. I would love a nicely done modern board so long as it has thick enough and properly routed traces so it actually can handle multiple carts and MIO running together as seen in the threads below.

I read through some of the threads last night and couldn't determine whether they were left ports or right ports.  I'll leave both ports then.

 

I was thinking about eliminating one cartridge port but found some threads, like yours, that had several cartridges.

 

16 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said:

 

as for a right cart port, that might need to be a switchable third port, while an RTIME8 would still work from that port, the machine would need to have an 800 OS running from either a 32 in One, or other OS switcher/switching device for other carts.

RTIME8 is a right cartridge only, I believe?

 

 

[_The Doctor__]

RTIME8 works in left and right cartridge ports, so it works in both.

The 'Tower of Power' photos are all using XL/XE style Cartridge ports and there are two of those so basically left/main carts.

The quality and routing of the board matters to supply enough to run all the carts and pbi without loss or interference, paying attention to the runs.

My thoughts were, it's more important to have 2 full cart slots for XL/XE main/left and one right slot if people were OS swapping.

If the choice is either or then the 2 full would be more important to the masses than a right cart.

Edited January 26, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[reifsnyderb]

Ok.  Thanks for the input on this.  I've got a 130XE and want to get it working with a newer 1090 reproduction board with the option to just use it as a PBI interface. 

 

If the XE Pin A is connected internally to the CAS Inhibit, the PBI will be fully capable for almost, if not all, of the options available..  

 

Other notes:

 

The XE D1xx line isn't connected as it isn't on the PBI.

On the PBI, CAS, RAS, and RDY aren't connected as they aren't available on the XE ECI and usually aren't used on the PBI.

On the PBI, HALT is added to pin 33.

 

Pins 47 and 48 can either be RD4 and RD5, respectively, or +5 VDC.  If the XE pin A is connected to the CAS Inhibit, pins 47 and 48 aren't needed for the newer 1090 board.

An original 1090 should be fine with pins 47 and 48 in any setting.  Having the wrong settings for pins 47 and 48 won't damage a 1090 and shouldn't damage anything anyhow.

 

Here's the board:

 

 

 

[_The Doctor__]

B Reifsnyder     @reifsnyderb

 

Q)    and we are still able to use this with MIO and whatever PBI oddities that are out there, yes?

so as I understand it thus far,

this is a buffer-less ECI CART to PBI adapter that can be used with 1090 extended.

 

The only other thing worth considering is an ECI alongside one of the carts allowing a sys check, maxi, memory, or freezer etc. to live there.

If there is a way to have a full ECI CART slot in the 1090 it would be interesting in that such devices could live there instead.

Food for serious thought.

Edited January 26, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[reifsnyderb]

6 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said:

and we are still able to use this with MIO and whatever PBI oddities that are out there, yes?

this is a buffer-less ECI CART to PBI adapter. The only other thing worth considering is an ECI alongside one of the carts allowing a sys check, maxi, memory, or freezer etc. to live there.

If there is a way to have a full ECI CART slot in the 1090 it would be interesting in that such devices could live there instead.

Food for serious thought.

Is there any way to find out exactly what I/O pins are used on these devices?  

 

Edit to add:  On the 1090, Refresh is buffered and can't be used to shut down the MMU for memory expansions.

Edited January 26, 2023 by reifsnyderb

[_The Doctor__]

I'd talk to @tf_hh to start, His sys check is indispensable. I am pretty sure he's looked and spoken to a large number of such devices over time. He has had great insight for a number of corrections and fixes over time as well.

I'd reach out to him via DM and email.

Edited January 26, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[+tf_hh]

20 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

I'd talk to @tf_hh to start, His sys check is indispensable. I am pretty sure he's looked and spoken to a large number of such devices over time. He has had great insight for a number of corrections and fixes over time as well.

I'd reach out to him via DM and email.

 

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