bjk7382 Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 A while ago I was talking to Howard Scott Warshaw thru PM and I asked him if he came up with the original idea for Yars' Revenge. Here is the response I got: Dear Brad, Good question. As a matter of fact, I came up with the entire Yars concept and even wrote the original fictional story behind it. There are many good stories behind the creation and naming of Yars (It's Ray spelled backwards you know, for Ray Kassar, the CEO at the time) but it was all my concept. The game was originally supposed to be a coin-op conversion of Star Castle, but rather than do another not-quite-good-enough rip off, I told them my play concept for what became Yars and they went for it. The rest is just wasted youth Thanks for asking, Brad, HSW I think it is quite amazing that he came up with the entire idea himself and made a best-selling game. If you look at the Star Castle webpage you will find that it was a game that was done in vector graphics, and I am sure that would be hard to convert. But the game concept is basically the same as Yar's Revenge, but on Star Castle when you destroy the entire ring of shield a new one appears. I think this would be a good hack for Yar's Revnge also, if the shield kept regenerating itself... Anyway, I just thought I would share what HSW told me, because I was interested in if he came up with the idea or not, and he did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZylonBane Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 This is common knowledge. And how can you be amazed that he came up with this idea himself in the same paragraph that you point out how close to Star Castle it is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocko Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 I think its cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanJr Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Not common knowledge to me, guess I am a buffoon. Cool story. Thanks for sharing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NovaXpress Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 The typical story is that Atari has the license for Star Castle pulled out from under them and coverted the code to Yars' Revenge, hence "Ray's" Revenge on Cinematronics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZylonBane Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Errr, no. The typical story is that HSW rightly concluded that a proper version of Star Castle couldn't be done on the 2600. So he fiddled around and came up with Yars' Revenge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMika Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Yars Revenge for GBC has, in later levels, shield rebuilders. I put them in after a couple of talks with Howard and listening to him say what he would do differently. To go further, Howard had an idea for a sequel to Yars. It was a really cool idea. It was like a multi-game Olympics sort of thing, using momentum and the ability to lob things after you pick them up, transfering that momentum into a makeshift projectile. There were a few other parts he shared, but I don't recall the details. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uosipa llamxew Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 This is common knowledge... how can you be amazed that he came up with this idea himself in the same paragraph that you point out how close to Star Castle it is I think that there is enough differece between Yar's Revenge and Star Castle that as they are, they both stand firm on their own as individual games. I'm amazed of how well thought out Yar's Revenge is to make a similar idea play out so well with the limitations of the VCS. Not common knowledge to me, guess I am a buffoon. I guess there are two buffoons that surf these forums - I never knew this either. I recognized the similarity between Yar's Revenge and Star Castle, but had never read confirmation of their relationship. I had heard the Ray/Yar thing before - but there's nothing wrong with the repetition... it's a good story, and a lot of people on these boards may not have heard it before. :-) @bjk7382 & MikeMika: Thanks for sharing. kbye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moycon Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 3 bufoons. I've seen Star Castle before. (Isn't there a Vetrex version of it?) But don't recall ever playing it. I didnt even know Yars Revenge was modeled after it. I did know Yar was Ray backwards though. Maybe it's only common knowledge in ZylonBane's house..... WHAT OTHER COMMON KNOWLEDGE ARE YOU HIDING FROM US!!??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjk7382 Posted December 24, 2003 Author Share Posted December 24, 2003 I had never seen star casle before I talked to HSW, and my main question to him was if he was the only one or if someone else came up with the idea for YR. I just got 1600 mame roms and I have at least played star castle, and it is a lot harder to play than YR for sure. Having 3 things flying at you all the time and having the star castle shoot at you every time there is an open spot in the shield makes for a much harder game. I like star castle a lot, but not more than Yars' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oesii Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Star Castle was my main game at the bowling alley for few hours each week while my parents were bowling in a league. Going to that bowling alley arcade was awesome back in the early 80's. If I had known about the Star Castle port on the Vectrex back then I probably would have whined until I got a Vectrex but in any case I'm glad HSW was properly inspired because Yars is a great action game on it's own. @MikeM, I've haven't played the GBC Yars in a few years but after I saw your post I popped the cart in and enjoyed a few rounds. Fun port Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.FoodMonster Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 more baffoonery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZylonBane Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Maybe it's only common knowledge in ZylonBane's house..... Try Classic Gaming Expo 2000: Atari 2600 Keynote "Ideas come from everywhere. Ideas are a dime a dozen, it's execution that pays, is what a lot of people say. Where do you come up with ideas for games like… my idea for Yar's Revenge was easy, I ripped off Star Castle… I took Star Castle and I took the 2600 and I merged them in my mind… You analyze the gameplay. You look at the game play and say, really, what's happening, what's the objective, what is the style of play. And then you look at the hardware and you say what is the hardware optimized for. Also, a simple Google search yields about four pages of relevant hits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Mitchell Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 I've seen Star Castle before. (Isn't there a Vectrex version of it?) Yes .. the Vectrex version is faithful to the arcade .. except the ship physics isn't right as I've been told. (I've never played Star Castle in the arcades.) Rob Mitchell, Atlanta, GA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE146 Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Yes, it is pretty much "common" knowledge especially for classic gaming/2600 freaks BTW.. I've NEVER liked Star Castle (I couldn't understand how some kids could be so good at it ). I suck at it of course. Haven't played it though in about 20 years.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susuwatari Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Yes, it is pretty much "common" knowledge especially for classic gaming/2600 freaks BTW.. I've NEVER liked Star Castle (I couldn't understand how some kids could be so good at it ). I suck at it of course. Haven't played it though in about 20 years.... I know you sucked. You've been using the wrong "joystick" The joystick you're supposed to control isn't a part of human anatomy. I couldn't pass that easy bait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Random Terrain Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 I read that on web pages such as this one: http://www.digitpress.com/archives/arc00131.htm We used a VAX system to compile/assemble, and then downloaded the code to an emulator box for execution, patching, and debugging. I was given the system’s manual and, after learning it, was assigned to do my first game – a version of Cinematronic’s Star Castle. I soon realized that a decent version couldn’t be done, so I took what I thought were the top logical and geometric components of Star Castle and reorganized them in a way that would better suit the machine. This eventually became Yars’ Revenge. I don't know how common it is, but I've known for at least a couple of years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oesii Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 BTW.. I've NEVER liked Star Castle (I couldn't understand how some kids could be so good at it ). I suck at it of course. Haven't played it though in about 20 years.... Yeah, us Star Castle nuts never got along with the Space Invader freaks Star Castle is emulated very well through Mame, you can even get the virtual overlay for it to simulate the smokey orange and grey colors it had in the arcade. Add a Hotrod joystick (which I have) or an X-Arcade and it's hard not to get that fresh from the arcade feeling. I need to buy me or try to make the Vectrex overlay because that's about the only Vectrex game I feel is naked without its overlay. Too many years playing it at the arcade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCmodeler Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Star Castle is too quiet. So, if Atari "lost" the license for Star Castle, which system got it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZylonBane Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Please pay attention. Atari didn't lose the license to Star Castle. They chose not to use it. By the way, there's an excellent version of Star Castle for the Atari8's called Star Island. By the same guy who did Galactic Chase (Galaxian clone-- better than Atari's version). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csonicgo Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Maybe it's only common knowledge in ZylonBane's house..... WHAT OTHER COMMON KNOWLEDGE ARE YOU HIDING FROM US!!??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Monkey Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 Star Castle is too quiet. It was one of the loudest most brash videogames in the whole arcade.... Or are you playing it in MAME without sound samples? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjk7382 Posted December 24, 2003 Author Share Posted December 24, 2003 Star Castle is too quiet. It was one of the loudest most brash videogames in the whole arcade.... Or are you playing it in MAME without sound samples? Yeah, my mame version doens't have any sound to it. Is there a way to fix the mame roms with problems like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uosipa llamxew Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 I'd expect that you need to download the sound samples as LostMonkey was hinting (really loudly). I've only ever played it for Vectrex, and don't remember sound. go here: http://www.arcadeathome.com/mamewav.phtml and download the samples. Put them in your mame/samples directory if I remember right. I think it should work from there. It has been many months since I have fired up Mame. kbye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjk7382 Posted December 24, 2003 Author Share Posted December 24, 2003 I'd expect that you need to download the sound samples as LostMonkey was hinting (really loudly). I realize that I need to get the sound samples, but where do I get them? I downloaded my 1600 roms at one time and some of the sounds work on them, and some (like star castle) don't work. So where exactly do I go to get the sound samples?? also I was talking about fixing others because some of the games don't emulate properly (some with bad sound and some with colors being off, and others with no sound at all) Edit, I just seen you added a link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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