Saccharin Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 ...with a 3rd party Sega Genesis controller? The reason I ask is because I would like to use an arcade-style stick controller. Has anyone tried this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZylonBane Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 What the !@#$?! is it... ...that makes people do this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted January 30, 2006 Author Share Posted January 30, 2006 Short subject title fields maybe? Just a guess. I take it you don't know then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted January 30, 2006 Share Posted January 30, 2006 I think the simple answer would be... If the Redemption is Sega Genesis controller compatible... and the joystick you want to USE is Sega genesis compatible... common sense says you've got a match. Maybe I'm wrong... but it makes sense to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted January 30, 2006 Author Share Posted January 30, 2006 (edited) Thanks. If that's true, then that means more options for 5200 controllers. Edited January 30, 2006 by Saccharin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Player Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 It depends on which Redemption Adapter you purchase. I own the Atari 2600 / Sega adapter, which as you can guess means you can use either controller. The Sega controllers have the added bonus of working with the two button 5200 games as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 I'm just curious if anyone has ever tried to use an arcade-style Sega stick with the Redemption. I bought a Wico Competition Pro and I'm not too impressed with it. Anyone looking for a Wico? Mine's up for sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I'm just curious if anyone has ever tried to use an arcade-style Sega stick with the Redemption. I bought a Wico Competition Pro and I'm not too impressed with it. Anyone looking for a Wico? Mine's up for sale. 1010349[/snapback] I have only used Sega Genesis and Sega Master System control pads with the 2600/Sega version of the Redemption 5200. However, as long as 3rd party Sega controllers are electrically equivalent to the original controllers (which I would hope they are), then they should work fine. ..Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 I think the problem is that most of the Atari 5200 games were designed to at least partially accomodate the quirky 5200 joysticks. For example, in Frogger, the need to move the joystick in a direction *and* press a button in order to move. I think Q*Bert employs a similar method. A lot of times, this original programming to work with the stock Atari 5200 controller makes for a game that doesn't work well with MOST alternative controllers. Back in the day, I'm fairly certain I had the 5200 Wico joystick, and I recall not really liking it because of this. (But these are 20+ year old memories, so, I could be mistaken). The end result, IMHO, is that MOST 5200 games are *best* enjoyed with an original 5200 controller in great condition. If I had $50 extra that I was thinking of putting into my Atari 5200... I think I'd spring for a couple sets of the gold buttons and new flex pads. I'm not knocking the Redemption... and I wouldn't *mind* having one of those too... but having rock solid original controllers is my first priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 (edited) Yeah, I've got some rebuilt 5200 controllers with the gold contacts, etc. They're pretty sturdy but they're just a huge pain in the ass to use with games where you have to turn on a dime like Pac-man, Ms. Pac-man, Pengo and the like. The Competition Pro is better but still not responsive enough. I guess Famicom/NES spoiled us with those lovely "+" controllers. Edited February 1, 2006 by Saccharin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 I think the problem is that most of the Atari 5200 games were designed to at least partially accomodate the quirky 5200 joysticks. For example, in Frogger, the need to move the joystick in a direction *and* press a button in order to move. I think Q*Bert employs a similar method. A lot of times, this original programming to work with the stock Atari 5200 controller makes for a game that doesn't work well with MOST alternative controllers. Back in the day, I'm fairly certain I had the 5200 Wico joystick, and I recall not really liking it because of this. (But these are 20+ year old memories, so, I could be mistaken). The end result, IMHO, is that MOST 5200 games are *best* enjoyed with an original 5200 controller in great condition. If I had $50 extra that I was thinking of putting into my Atari 5200... I think I'd spring for a couple sets of the gold buttons and new flex pads. I'm not knocking the Redemption... and I wouldn't *mind* having one of those too... but having rock solid original controllers is my first priority. 1010591[/snapback] When we were initially testing the Redemption, I tried it with every released 5200 game and the homebrew games available at the time, as well as some of the prototypes (like Super Pac-Man). The majority of 5200 games work just fine with the Redemption and only need a single fire button and four discrete joystick directions. For the games that require the analog nature of the stock 5200 controllers, it's definitely worth having some controllers in pristine condition. In general I've received quite a few positive comments from people who've bought the Redemption. I made a list of the games that worked fine with a regular 2600 joystick (and one fire button), the games that needed two fire buttons, games that were playable but would be better with a 5200 stick (such as Galaxian), and then games that require a 5200 stick (such as Missile Command). I'll have to see if I can find that, it was a few years ago. ..Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 When we were initially testing the Redemption, I tried it with every released 5200 game and the homebrew games available at the time, as well as some of the prototypes (like Super Pac-Man). The majority of 5200 games work just fine with the Redemption and only need a single fire button and four discrete joystick directions. How about the Sega controllers? How well did they work with 8-directional movement and 2-fire button games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Helmet Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 (edited) I have a redemption adapter (the 7800 edition). It works with my 7800 stick and joypad, as well as my modified NES pad and modified Radica Space Invaders stick on every game that I have that does not require the analog function of the stick (IE Pole Position, Star Wars, Star Raiders, and Missle Command). Centipede works, but you have to get used to how fast your dude moves. Both buttons function perfectly on games that need them, and all 8 directions work just fine. I would imagine that the sega version works just fine...IE all 8 directions and both buttons. There is no reason why the Sega pad would not work in 8 directions if it was tested to work in four directions. The redemption adapter is a must have piece af hardware for 5200 owners IMHO. I play my 5200 twice as much since I got my adapter. Edited February 1, 2006 by Lord Helmet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Cafeman Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 I love playing 5200 with a Sega genesis pad, the small 6-button one. All might not realize it, but the famously expensive and rare "Masterplay Interface" (allows you to use 2600 controllers, and hence Genesis pads too) is no fun at all with any 5200 games using 2 buttons. The MI has its own 2nd button-on-a-wire -- it's nearly impossible to use it in an action game. Thus the Redemption's 2-button compatibility with the Genesis pad is a big improvement, for far less money than tracking down a MI. It's just my own tastes, but I can't imagine wanting to use the 7800 controller over a good Genesis d-pad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nems Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 (edited) I never cared for the original 5200 stick so I converted those to paddles. I love using the redemption adapter with my 2600 controller (with added second fire button). Edited February 2, 2006 by nems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightSprinter Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 I never cared for the original 5200 stick so I converted those to paddles. I love using the redemption adapter with my 2600 controller (with added second fire button). 1011116[/snapback] Hot damn! That is a beautifully-modified CX-40. What joystick do you use for games that do require the analog controls? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 When we were initially testing the Redemption, I tried it with every released 5200 game and the homebrew games available at the time, as well as some of the prototypes (like Super Pac-Man). The majority of 5200 games work just fine with the Redemption and only need a single fire button and four discrete joystick directions. For the games that require the analog nature of the stock 5200 controllers, it's definitely worth having some controllers in pristine condition. In general I've received quite a few positive comments from people who've bought the Redemption. I made a list of the games that worked fine with a regular 2600 joystick (and one fire button), the games that needed two fire buttons, games that were playable but would be better with a 5200 stick (such as Galaxian), and then games that require a 5200 stick (such as Missile Command). I'll have to see if I can find that, it was a few years ago. ..Al 1010783[/snapback] I would like to see that list. My "killer app" for the Atari 5200 is Countermeasure. It just doesn't play as well on anything else but the Atari 5200 controller. It isn't so much a function of the analog joystick in this case, as the location of the two buttons right on top of each other on the side. The other came that comes to mind is Super Breakout. I *much* prefer the analog joystick for this game to any paddle I've ever played a brick type game with. And I really don't have problems with Pac Man on a 5200 controller... I mean, Pac Man and Ms. Pac Man are notorious about being picky about control across every platform they've ever played on, from the Atari 2600 to MAME... People build their own custom 4 way joystick control panels JUST for Pac Man type games on MAME. The JAKKS units are despised for their bad control in Ms. Pac Man... It is just the nature of the game... and all things considered, I think the 5200 version with a 5200 joystick is a lot more tolerable than some of the more recent and game-play accurate versions of the game that have come along. MHO. Again... a Redemption controller, a Stella adaptor... they're both on my I want list. Along with a 5200 multicart and a 2600 cuttle cart. If money were no object... But... these are all big ticket items to relive a little nostalgia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted February 2, 2006 Author Share Posted February 2, 2006 And I really don't have problems with Pac Man on a 5200 controller... I mean, Pac Man and Ms. Pac Man are notorious about being picky about control across every platform they've ever played on, from the Atari 2600 to MAME... People build their own custom 4 way joystick control panels JUST for Pac Man type games on MAME. The JAKKS units are despised for their bad control in Ms. Pac Man... It is just the nature of the game... and all things considered, I think the 5200 version with a 5200 joystick is a lot more tolerable than some of the more recent and game-play accurate versions of the game that have come along. MHO Man, how do you make those razor-sharp turns when all those ghosts are hot on your ass? I really, really, wanted to be able to use the original 5200 controllers to enhance nostalgic effects. But so far I just can't get the feel for them. You have to anticipate in advance where you want to turn, and that's hard to do in a game like Pac-man. Please share your secrets! And about Ms. Pac-man on the Jakks units, I think they're killer, FWIW. Best controls I've used outside of the arcade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Man, how do you make those razor-sharp turns when all those ghosts are hot on your ass? I really, really, wanted to be able to use the original 5200 controllers to enhance nostalgic effects. But so far I just can't get the feel for them. You have to anticipate in advance where you want to turn, and that's hard to do in a game like Pac-man. Please share your secrets! And about Ms. Pac-man on the Jakks units, I think they're killer, FWIW. Best controls I've used outside of the arcade. 1011264[/snapback] The Jakks Ms. Pac Man "best" outside of the Arcade?!? I think you're the FIRST person I've ever heard to give the wired OR wireless Jakks a Thumbs-up. The wireless IS better than the wired one... though. But disappointment with Ms. Pac Man (and Xevious) from Jakks was the straw that broke the back and drove me finally build a MAME cabinet with an arcade control panel. It does take some practice to learn the feel of the 5200 controllers. You *do* have to anticipate in advance... but... that should REALLY be a part of your Pac Man strategy (unless you've memorized patterns... which may not apply outside of the arcade). The 5200 joysticks are not very quick or responsive... but they do give you pretty precisce control once you learn to work with their limits. You also learn to center the stick after moving in a direction (it doesn't have to be perfect... you just need to get it back into the dead-zone, which seems to be pretty large on Pac Man)... and let go of the stick until your NEXT move. This is *really* the most common complaint about Pac Man and Ms. Pac Man in any format, including with the Jakks machines. If you watch "Pac Man experts"... they always played kind of the same way that you would play Dragons Lair... they nudged the joystick ONCE in the direction the wanted to go, then let go... then nudged in the NEXT direction, let go, etc... As opposed to games where you've got a firm and constant grip on the controller. People who hug the controller like it was a prison meal (envision that... one arm wrapped around over the top of the controller on an arcade cabinet) and other hand glued to the control stick), typically they even have problems with false direction input on the 4 way sticks in the arcade... and find the home versions completely frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted February 3, 2006 Author Share Posted February 3, 2006 The Jakks Ms. Pac Man "best" outside of the Arcade?!? I think you're the FIRST person I've ever heard to give the wired OR wireless Jakks a Thumbs-up.Keep in mind that this is coming from someone that hasn't played Pac-man for decades until recently with the 5200. Maybe it's that they seem so responsive because of the time gap. Or perhaps I've actually got a good working model (mine's got the wire too!). The Jakks units are light years (IMHO) ahead of the original 5200 controllers or Competition Pro as far as playability. The best? Well probably not but after the experience with the other controllers I'm in heaven with the Jakks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Keep in mind that this is coming from someone that hasn't played Pac-man for decades until recently with the 5200. Maybe it's that they seem so responsive because of the time gap. Or perhaps I've actually got a good working model (mine's got the wire too!). The Jakks units are light years (IMHO) ahead of the original 5200 controllers or Competition Pro as far as playability. The best? Well probably not but after the experience with the other controllers I'm in heaven with the Jakks. 1011690[/snapback] http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=78822 A thread on the Jakks Pacific joysticks from the Dedicated Systems forum... What is this wire? Someone over there was mentioning that the wireless model has a selection to choose 4 way or 8 way joystick, too... and I missed that... I don't think it is a hardware quality issue, though. It is either crappy programming or crappy engineering of the I/O logic... the control flaws are consistent across the Jakks Ms. Pac Man lines. Not that I'm knocking your opinion. If the Jakks systems do it for you... don't let me be the one who casts the shadow of doubt into your gaming experience. And, the Atari 5200 controller is a love it or hate it experience, I think... so far... it seems that here for every 10 that hate it you'll find 1 that loves it... so... I happen to be in the minority. I *dig* the 5200 joystick... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted February 3, 2006 Author Share Posted February 3, 2006 Yeah, I'm kinda confused too after reading that thread. Alls I can tell you is that I bought my Jakks Ms. Pac-man about a week ago at Wal-Mart and it rocks. Really responsive controls. It comes with 5 games: Ms. Pac-man, Mappy, Xevious, Galaga, and Pole Position. The "twist steering" in Pole Position is awesome and clever as hell. My unit also accepts "game keys" (cartridges) to "unlock" more games. I read a lot on Amazon about some units being faulty, while others love the controls. That's why I believe the one I have may actually be a good one. Or perhaps I have the "second release" (if there is one). Either way, I'm happy with it. Damn close to the original arcade experience. It's given me a hard-on for a good quality, responsive arcade stick for the 5200. Hence, my inital question about arcade-style Sega sticks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted February 3, 2006 Author Share Posted February 3, 2006 What is this wire? Someone over there was mentioning that the wireless model has a selection to choose 4 way or 8 way joystick, too... and I missed that... Just to clarify, by the "wire" I mean the AC adapter unit sold seperately that is inserted into the battery compartment so you don't need batteries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Oh yeah, you've got one of the key based units. That is rev 3.... I think it is even MORE frustrating for me to think they finally got the control issues worked out after two bungled attempts (the first priced at $19.99 and the second at $29.99)... Interestingly, I just recieved Ms. Pac Man for the 5200 in the mail today. Popped it in, and got to the first intermission without losing a single man... I had never played it before... it wasn't one I owned when I originally had a 5200. I'm really impressed with it, though... and felt the control of it was accurate and responsive, too. Far more so than either of the first two Jakks Pacific TV units I have. I'm just a fan of the 5200 joystick, though. It *is* a different feel of control in the Pac Man games though, and the Jakks games do come closer to replicating an arcade, digital feeling... when they work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saccharin Posted February 4, 2006 Author Share Posted February 4, 2006 That's cool. Everyone has their own tastes. Here's a link that may help clear up some of the confusion about the Jakks units: Mappyland :: scrapbook Scroll down to "July 2004", and then read the 2005 entry. I think I get it now. Mine is the July '04 version. Come to think of it, the 8-way controls are a bit touchy, but I do like the feel better than the original 5200 or Competition Pro sticks. Speaking of Mappy, that has to be the most addictive game ever. I'm actually thinking of getting an NES so I can play the Famicom release with an adapter. The version on the Jakks rocks and I'd just like to compare the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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