Paranoid Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Yeah, I already read the FAQ that says, "take your great game idea and shove it... the guys who CAN program have their own great ideas"... So... I'm not trying to sell this to anyone in particular. I don't really care if it gets done... I don't even know if it is technically feasible... and I'm certainly not going to do the research to sell any homebrew developer on how plausible this idea is to deliver on. But I still want to post it... I remember reading somewhere that Berzerk is credited with being the first maze-shooter and thus is indirectly related to the modern FPSs like Quake and Doom. Which makes sense... I think we can see the Berzerk to Castle Wolfenstien (the original) then the 3d Wolfenstien and the genesis of the modern FPS... Which is all cool. Last night I finally got Berzerk and Frenzy working on MAME... although I've had it for the 5200 and the 2600 for awhile... Anyhow... playing a couple rounds, I thought, wouldn't it be cool to pay homage to the link between Berzerk and the modern FPS by making a classic-console based, 2-D interpetation of one of the modern 3-D shooters like Quake 3 or Doom 3? There would certainly be challenges with trying to depict multiple level rooms and such... but you could get the basic maps down... the basic enemies and pick-ups. The 5200 would be ideal... the bottom button could cycle through weapons, the top fire... or... whatever... you've also got the keypad for other actions. It would be kind of interesting to see the dark, disturbing imagry of something like Doom displayed in 8-bit glory, too... pixilated upside down crosses and pentegrams on the floors of the rooms, etc... I was thinking that it would probably make a good Berzerk rom HACK... most of the code is already there... and I think the pause between one map and the next is artificial... that you could probably have it scroll from screen to screen as fluidly as say, Adventure 2. It would just be cool to have a copy of Kwake3 2D for the Atari 5200 Suspersystem in my cart collection. Actually, if the original Escape from Castle Wolfenstien exists on the 8 Bit Atari... that might make an even better set of code to hack into an interpetation of a modern Quake or Doom game. Anyhow... I just thought it was a cool idea. I'm not saying I want anyone to do it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sku_u Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Kind of along these lines? http://cafeman.www9.50megs.com/atari/5200d...dventureII.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted March 6, 2006 Author Share Posted March 6, 2006 Yup. But the homage is in reverse... from newer, more powerful machines to an older, less powerful machine... from a real complex, atmosphere-rich environment to a less defined atmosphere that calls on you to use your imagination to fill in the blanks that the machine isn't capable of. Adventure II is paying tribute to an Atari 2600 game and adding graphics and gameplay complexity... This is 180 degrees from that... It would be cool to see it done with cover art and a manual that fills in the back story so that you understand that those things that look like angry bipedal elk chasing you down are actually demonic imps... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 (edited) Yup. But the homage is in reverse... from newer, more powerful machines to an older, less powerful machine... from a real complex, atmosphere-rich environment to a less defined atmosphere that calls on you to use your imagination to fill in the blanks that the machine isn't capable of. Adventure II is paying tribute to an Atari 2600 game and adding graphics and gameplay complexity... This is 180 degrees from that... It would be cool to see it done with cover art and a manual that fills in the back story so that you understand that those things that look like angry bipedal elk chasing you down are actually demonic imps... 1029085[/snapback] I think what your looking for (as well as I would love to see) would be the original 286 640k runable wolfinestien 3d on the 5200. I think it is totally possible. I don't know the mechanics either but I belive it would be something not out of the 5200's range. Finding someone dedicated enoug to make it, well that is where the issue lies. EDIT: Hell, I bet you could get the original wolf to go on 512k with EGA (16 colors). Edited March 7, 2006 by Shawn Sr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted March 7, 2006 Author Share Posted March 7, 2006 Yup. But the homage is in reverse... from newer, more powerful machines to an older, less powerful machine... from a real complex, atmosphere-rich environment to a less defined atmosphere that calls on you to use your imagination to fill in the blanks that the machine isn't capable of. Adventure II is paying tribute to an Atari 2600 game and adding graphics and gameplay complexity... This is 180 degrees from that... It would be cool to see it done with cover art and a manual that fills in the back story so that you understand that those things that look like angry bipedal elk chasing you down are actually demonic imps... 1029085[/snapback] I think what your looking for (as well as I would love to see) would be the original 286 640k runable wolfinestien 3d on the 5200. I think it is totally possible. I don't know the mechanics either but I belive it would be something not out of the 5200's range. Finding someone dedicated enoug to make it, well that is where the issue lies. EDIT: Hell, I bet you could get the original wolf to go on 512k with EGA (16 colors). 1029359[/snapback] Oh yeah, it ran on the C=64 and Apple II systems... But I'm thinking just porting Escape from Castle Wolfenstien isn't enough. What I'd *really* like to see is an interpetation of one of the Doom or Quake games, with maps as accurate as possible in a 2-D representation... with as much of the darkness as possible to recreate... I actually saw in the 2600 hacks library there already *are* a couple attempts at this general idea, generally based on Berzerk as the source. And I agree... the 5200 would be the machine to do it on... just common sense about what has been done on the machine (re:Adventure 2, the 5200 port of Berzerk) points in that direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercat Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 (edited) EDIT: Hell, I bet you could get the original wolf to go on 512k with EGA (16 colors). 1029359[/snapback] The predecessor to Wolf, Cat3d, was indeed designed for EGA. Attempting something like Wolf3d on a 5200 would pose some interesting technical challenges, to put it mildly. Even the 2600 can do limited texture mapping, sort of (see my blog), but I don't know any good way to texture-map onto anything other than a trapezoid two of whose sides are horizontal. If one wanted an overhead-view version of Wolf3d on the 2600, that might be possible with my RPG kernel (also in my blog; a less-flickery version is in the works), or it might be possible to manage a wireframe Doom on the 5200 or possibly even 2600 (a wireframe Wolf3d could most likely be done, but wouldn't be nearly as cool). Edited March 7, 2006 by supercat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranoid Posted March 7, 2006 Author Share Posted March 7, 2006 Yeah... I'm talking stictly an overhead 2-d interpetation of the literal ID games. I guess I should be clear about that. If you did multi-level rooms it would probably have to be a 2-d interpetation of the Duke Nuke 'em mapping engine (there couldn't be anything UNDER a raised platform)... But an actual 3-D port would be cool, too... and would certainly be far more challening. I hadn't even considered that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 Doom2D has already been thought of, and done: http://www.microfault.com/doom2d/doom2dus.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 Yeah... I'm talking stictly an overhead 2-d interpetation of the literal ID games. I guess I should be clear about that. If you did multi-level rooms it would probably have to be a 2-d interpetation of the Duke Nuke 'em mapping engine (there couldn't be anything UNDER a raised platform)... But an actual 3-D port would be cool, too... and would certainly be far more challening. I hadn't even considered that. 1029393[/snapback] Oh, I mis read your post, I thought you wanted 3d not 2d. I ment 3d wolf (or doom but watered to the pont of wolf..lol) could be done. You would need alot of solid colors in place of shading, and I bet it would be choppy at times do to scrolling issues (that could e worked around by someone I'm sure, I just wouldn't hav a clue how). Button 1 to fire and button 2 or a keypad button to change weapons, ya it would rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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