Street Fighter 2 Statistics...

[KAZ]

I'm posting this in case anyone is curious about what character is better than whom on Street Fighter 2.

 

This is the Playstation disk: "Street Fighter Collection 2"

The mode that it is set on is the 2nd one:

Street Fighter 2: Champion Edition

 

My friend and I started keeping statistics on our battles about 2 years ago. We set up a system where each character would meet every other character twice. A "set" would consist of 288 matches where each character would get a chance to fight every other an equal amount of times. I have kept statistics, for my own curiousity. It has been nearly as much fun as playing the game.

 

These are just the most general comprehensive statistics.

 

We've played exactly 8064 matches:

 

Adding both my records and his, these are the results ranked in order from best to worst:

 

Bison: 762

Vega: 742

Blanka: 732

Zangief: 717

Honda: 712

Ryu: 698

Ken: 665

Chun Li: 639

Guile: 636

Dhalsim: 634

Sagat: 585

Balrog: 542

 

I have more specific data, coming in later posts, for anyone who is interested.

[KAZ]

Here's the breakdown for each character's best matchups:

 

The maximum any character could get would be a perfect 100/100 battles won:

 

Ryu: Guile (72)

Honda: Dhalsim (83)

Blanka: Zangief (83)

Guile: Balrog (89)

Ken: Chun Li (70)

Chun Li: Dhalsim (67)

Zangief: Balrog (91)

Dhalsim: Balrog (84)

Balrog: Blanka (82)

Vega: Dhalsim (86)

Sagat: Guile (65)

Bison: Balrog (86)

 

Some explanation might be useful for some of these.

Let me try to analyze some of it, since I've seen it all in this game.

[KAZ]

Some no-brainers first off:

 

Vega will pretty much always beat Dhalsim. Dhalsim is much too slow when jumping, and often a missed move by Dhalsim will result in an easy hit for Vega. Plus, Dhalsim has a really tough time defending against the wall climb. Occasionally his head-butt move will work. If Dhalsim can trap Vega in the corner, he can utilize a "Yoga Flame cheap move". Vega's only escape would be a throw in this instance.

 

Guile will beat Balrog alot, mainly because of the "sonic-boom cheap move". You trap Balrog in the corner (somehow), and throw a sonic boom, and while Balrog blocks, you can do a suplex to him. You just loop this move over and over. The only escape is for Balrog to attempt a throw, which doesn't work very often.

 

Balrog will beat Blanka often, this has been found to be a really wierd stat. Blanka is always ranked really high, but his one main weakness is Balrog. Any roll that Blanka does will be countered by Balrog. If Blanka attempts to do any sort of jump kick, jump punch...Balrog can easily nail him with a ducking fierce punch (a regular uppercut), or the charging uppercut. Blanka's only weapon then is to slowly cut away at Balrog with strong punches...but Balrog's ducking fierce just simply has too much range. It is a no-win situation for Blanka all around.

[NE146]

Back in 1991 or so I was lucky enough to be going to college in the Bay Area. And by lucky I mean I got to hang around Golfland arcade in Sunnyvale where Capcom (whom I lived down the street from) playtested a lot of Street Fighter 2's. So yeah those were some tough crowds and some tough competition with some of the best players around.

 

Here's the info if you're ever in the area: http://www.shoryuken.com/apex/?division=np...fic&arcade=svgl

 

Anyway, here we are 11 years later and after playing sf2 a zillion times since, E. Honda has risen over time to be my #1 favorite. He is a tank and hard to beat if used properly.

 

I see he's #5 on your rankings.. 'Bout time I saw E. Honda get his due.

[KAZ]

I'm not a slouch at the arcade coin-op version, but I just can't get that sheer perfection that I can with a thumb pad, like playstation's controllers.

 

The standard moves are pretty much no problem with a joystick. The charging moves...and the repeated tapping moves.

 

I can do a fireball pretty good with a joystick, and a dragon punch about 60% of the time.

 

With a thumb pad, I swear, I will NOT miss a dragon punch.

 

But here's something interesting about the Playstation game.

Sagat's Tiger Uppercut is technically more difficult to perform than Ken or Ryu's. You have to be much more exact with it for some reason.

 

I want to talk some about Honda....since he's your favorite.

He is a tank like you say. His "sumo missile" is invincible if you do it with a light jab punch, right as your opponent is trying to hit you. If you get someone in the corner with Honda, it is pretty much over. You can do any number of cheap jump kick (make the opponent block) hug them, followed by the hundred hand slaps.

 

His main weakness is against fireball throwing characters. If you play Ryu or Ken right, you can force Honda to jump the fireballs, and do simple sweep kicks to him forever. IF you mess up with Ryu or Ken, and Honda forces you in the corner....you need a well timed dragon punch to get out of that situation.

 

My Honda is ranked #5 for me with: 302 wins

My friend's Honda is ranked #3 with: 410 wins

 

Over time my friend has gotton a better record than me, but you couldn't tell it by the intense battles. In fact his worse ranked character is better than my best ranked character, in total wins.

[sdstuff64]

You have alot of free time,don't you???But really,that is cool.I think I like Vega the best,or Ryu...

[KAZ]

Well my friend used to work during the day, and I worked during the evenings, so we never would hang out during the weekdays.

 

So this was mainly for like 3 hours or so on a Saturday or a Sunday.

 

It doesn't take long for the matches to start adding up, just doing it like this for 2 years.

 

As with the statistics, I suppose that does take some time, but I've always wanted to know the objective strengths and weaknesses of each character, and how they'd do over a long time.

 

Here's another analysis that you might find interesting:

 

For the beginner type player, you will do best with characters like:

Chun Li

Dhalsim

Bison

 

For the intermediate player, you will do best with characters like:

Ryu

Ken

Vega

 

For the advanced player, you will do best with

Sagat

Zangief

 

What I mean is that the beginner won't do well at all if he picks a character like Zangief. Once he gets to an advanced level, Zangief will begin to totally conquer everyone. Chun Li on the other hand tends to become a really really bad character at advanced playing. I should know, I've seen Chun Li move down and down and down, from a relatively high position on our charts. Sagat is a pure nightmare at advanced playing. His knee combo is devastating, and most of his moves are the most powerful in the game.

 

Some characters like Bison and Blanka will remain good all the time, no matter your skill level.

[NE146]

He is a tank like you say. His "sumo missile" is invincible if you do it with a light jab punch, right as your opponent is trying to hit you.

It depends on the version of SF2 you play as well. In the original sf2, yes it's the only way to go.

 

His main weakness is against fireball throwing characters. If you play Ryu or Ken right, you can force Honda to jump the fireballs, and do simple sweep kicks to him forever.

 

That's no weakness. That's a weakness of weak Honda players (and the computer of course. Let me just say it's all in the timing and positioning of the jump naturally. Try fireballing me, and you'll end up with a facefull of Honda-foot 80% of the time.

[Atari-Jess]

someone has an SF2 champion edition cab in his room

 

oh, right, thats ME!

 

so i get to play all that i want on free play!

 

on arcade controls, can it get much better?

 

point being,

 

How did Bison get so high?

geez

 

Honda IS a very good character to use especially since his

fury punching allows him to move forward and backwards

 

his "sumo missile" can easilly be stopped by chun li

 

but Bison is too easy to beat even on the arcades hardest mode!

 

Ryu is much harder to beat than bison

 

jeebus

[KAZ]

You are absolutely right about Honda's "sumo missile" being easily stopped by Chun Li. Her "toe tap" does the trick every time. When he does his sumo missile, you just jump backwards, and press down+forward kick.

 

If Honda gets too close to Ryu or Ken while they are throwing fireballs, it will result in them getting kicked in the face. Honda's jump is awfully slow tho (and he even does a little flip in the air too) and if not timed right, Ryu or Ken will simply counter with a dragon punch (if the fireball "retracts" fast enough) If Ryu can keep Honda back far enough tho, Honda MUST block the fireballs, and can't jump over them. If he does, Ryu can do a sweep kick. If Honda gets too close, Ryu must stop throwing fireballs, and use other tactics.

 

If Honda stays close during the battle, Ryu will lose.

 

But let's look at our stats...let's see who has faired better here

I have the stats right here:

 

My Ryu vs. My friend's Honda: 23/50

Therefore this match is pretty even up, 25/50 would be a perfectly even match.

My friend's Ryu vs. My Honda: 36/50

Perhaps I simply can't play Honda right, because my friend just sends a constant stream of fireballs at me, pushing me back. I try my best to keep getting closer, but he keeps his distance.

 

I realize that the computer Bison may be easy to beat. He does alot of jumping (the computer always jumps eventually). And then you just simply nail him with a dragon punch.

 

But against a human competitor they won't do this. And Bison has good offensive power, and he defends well against hits. I don't know why my friend does so well with him (he doesn't even like the Bison character!!)

[ubersaurus]

I'm no CE expert (Hyper Fighting is my fav SF2) but if I recall, Sagat and Honda were among the best in that game, with Guile and Dhalsim over them. Guile just owned all the SF2 games, him and Sagat. I think Ryu was pretty good in it too, not sure though. Like I said, not a CE man ;p

[KAZ]

Sagat suffers from a huge weakness, namely that his uppercut is not invincible. If it does connect it does an obscene amount of damage. He isn't terribly fast especially against characters like Chun Li, Vega, Blanka.

His tiger knee combo is definitely the second most powerful attack (the spinning pile driver being the first). Ken's 4 hit combo is pretty nice too.

 

Sagat has been fighting up the ranks for us, I've seen him move higher and higher. Whereas a character like Chun Li is starting to go down the ranks. The other "mover" is Dhalsim. He's currently my #2 character (within just the last 10 sets we've played) but it wasn't always that way. These stats I've listed above are over a long period of time, and don't show current trends very well.

 

Dhalsim is much quicker than you might think. He can move around the screen with jumping down fierce, or jumping down-roundhouse. If you get your opponent in the corner, you perform the Yoga Flame trap. You hit your opponent on the ground, and you Yoga Flame. The opponent has to block (or possible do an ultra fast dragonpunch) and then Dhalsim simply moves a little closer and throws the opponent. Then he starts all over again, and does the flame throw again.

 

Ways out of this tactic:

Ryu's Hurricane Kick

Dragon Punches

Spinning Star Kick (sometimes)

Guile's Flash Kick (sometimes)

 

Balrog has no known defense to this tactic, so once you get him in the corner, you just finish him off completely with this single move.

Bison has a rough time with this move too.

[ubersaurus]

Sagat's strength was not his uppercut, it was his fireball game. They move incredibly fast. Plus, tiger knee was very useful. He didn't need uppercut for anti air, because he had so many other options for it. Added to his good normals, and he was a top player in all games he was playable...especially Super SF2...oh man he owned everyone!

[KAZ]

Sagat is my second favorite character, for the reason that it is the most rewarding to win matches with him, because the more technical your game is, the better you do with Sagat.

 

My order of favorites:

 

1. Vega (not too surprising)

2. Sagat

3. Zangief

4. Ken

 

Perhaps you didn't realize that Zangief's spinning pile driver does NOT need to be done by rotating the joystick (thumbpad) around 360 degrees, and then hitting a punch button.

 

It can be done like this:

Back, Back-Down, Down, Up + a punch button

The up +punch button must be hit at the exact same time.

 

I don't know why you can do it like this, but try it sometime, I think you will be pleasantly surprised that you can do his move. I am the master of the spinning pile driver (not the 360 degree way).

 

I think it is neat when you throw out an ultra slow fireball with Sagat, and follow it up with a really fast fireball. You can actually achieve a "combo" like this, hitting your opponent twice before he can block the second

 

I know too much about this game.

 

Street Fighter Turbo (which I don't play often), adds a few moves to the characters. Honda's vertical thing. Blanka's vertical thing. Vega's "something". Chun Li's fireball (she shouldn't have a fireball).

 

So we play the very first version where you could play as the bosses.

Street Fighter Champion Edition.

[ubersaurus]

I subscribe to the belief-

"Magic throw that shit!"

 

I like Turbo more for the reason of mirror matches. And the speed was awesome too. The mirror matches made the game SOOOOO much better. Like say your best was Honda, but your opponent already had him picked. You had to settle for a lesser character in previous games, but not anymore! Very good for the tourney enviroment.

[Atari-Jess]

i really wanted chun-li's fireball damnit

 

but hey, im happy with any arcade cab

[NE146]

My favorite is SF2: Turbo / Hyper Fighting as well

[KAZ]

Street Fighter 2 Champion Edition (the first one with playable bosses) allows for mirror matches as well.

 

The very first Street Fighter 2 (known as The World Warrior) doesn't automatically allow for mirror matches. Ryu and Ken are exact clones in this game (both of their moves are identical). Honda cannot move with his hand slap, and neither can Zangief with his spinning clothesline.

 

In the champion edition version, Ryu is a little more powerful than Ken, and his hurricane kick is totally different looking.

 

In the turbo version, Ryu and Ken can both do "mid air hurricane" kicks, where you can perform the move in mid air. A pretty neat move, all considered.

 

I like Champion Edition the best, tho I actually like Blanka's vertical roll.

[Atari-Jess]

point being, Im still crazy that there is a SF arcade cab in my room

i cant tell if im dreaming or what not... lately there has been a lot

of things happening to me that seem much like a dream....

[KAZ]

Wow, that is really cool you have the actual arcade cabinet in your room. I envy you! Someday maybe I'll be so lucky. I have to settle for Playstation for the time being.

[Atari-Jess]

it used to be a tempest machine!

 

i need to replace the caps on it though, i get crappy black lines on it

[NE146]

It used to be a Tempest and now it's a Street Fighter? OH THE HUMANITY!!

 

*sigh*.. oh well. I guess it could have been worse.. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...item=2115895763

[Atari-Jess]

i wish it was still a tempest machine

 

LOL that is a pretty sad lookin chair...

 

but whats sadder is the side art looks a bit better than mine

mine is a tad scratched up and has marks on it but it has very little

damage to the wood that thing is just ugly now man EGH!

[liveinabin]

I wish I was good at beat-em-ups. I'd love to have some degree of skill at Street Fighter. Been playing em on and off for years and I still really suck:(

I think SF should be set up so a complete newcomer can't choose M.Bison.

My wife sucks at SF too but just chooses Bison and hammers the keys. Instant flaming death for my Chun Li

I liked that Skull guy in Ex+Alpha - he was neat, he was supposed to be some kind of mild-mannered business man gone bad wasn't he?

[KAZ]

If hammering the buttons is your style of playing, play as some of these characters:

 

Blanka (you can even repeatedly press a strong or a jab punch for electricity)

Chun Li (you can also press forward or light kick repeatedly for her hyper leg move)

Honda (same thing here, just press strong or a jab punch repeatedly fast for his hundred hand slap)

 

Avoid Sagat, Balrog, and possibly Zangief for a beginning player.

Set your strongest punches or kicks to two buttons close to one another, and use those primarily. Whoever blocks better will likely win when two people are just jamming on the buttons.

 

Ex plus alpha is ok-and I actually own it, but I like the purity of gameplay of the very second street fighter (champion edition), without all the jazzy graphics, and 10 hit combo messages flying in your face.

 

Zangief's spinning pile driver in the Ex alpha version is wonderful to watch. There are definitely parts in that game that are unbelievably cool. The semi 3 dimensional gameplay is a very nice touch!