Best IDE Interface for use WITH other SIO Devices?

[Atari8guy]

Any thoughts on this...what I'm hoping to do with my week off and my staying home on this particular vacation (bad economy and all) is put one of my systems into a tower...but I'd like to have a hard disk and a floppy in it.....hoping/asking for thoughts....

[sl0re]

Any thoughts on this...what I'm hoping to do with my week off and my staying home on this particular vacation (bad economy and all) is put one of my systems into a tower...but I'd like to have a hard disk and a floppy in it.....hoping/asking for thoughts....

 

What model do you have? Makes a difference.

[Atari8guy]

Any thoughts on this...what I'm hoping to do with my week off and my staying home on this particular vacation (bad economy and all) is put one of my systems into a tower...but I'd like to have a hard disk and a floppy in it.....hoping/asking for thoughts....

 

What model do you have? Makes a difference.

 

Well my options are an XEGS or a 130XE both of which I have doubles of...I also have a working 800XL but not sure I want to strip that down.

[sl0re]

Any thoughts on this...what I'm hoping to do with my week off and my staying home on this particular vacation (bad economy and all) is put one of my systems into a tower...but I'd like to have a hard disk and a floppy in it.....hoping/asking for thoughts....

 

What model do you have? Makes a difference.

 

Well my options are an XEGS or a 130XE both of which I have doubles of...I also have a working 800XL but not sure I want to strip that down.

 

Well, I don't know the xegs setup off the top of my head, but for a 130xe I'd skip sio and go IDEa / parallel bus. This comes with the 130XE adapter included.

http://afs.atari.org/idea.htm

 

If you need sio for some reason, IDE2SIO works on both of those. It has the added advantage of using fat16 so you can put the disk or memory stick in a PC to put ATRs on it... On the other hand, mine won't work on my atari 800 (which is part of why I asked about models).

Edited February 6, 2009 by sl0re

[Marius]

This depends on what you want to do with your atari.

 

1. Does speed really matter? Then you might not want a SIO based solution.

 

2. Do you want to keep your OS original or are you able to built in several OS-es in one?

 

3. Is it a must-have that is is IDE?

 

When you want the best-of-the-best. Go for a BlackBox or MIO, and use a SCSI harddisk (or use an IDE->SCSI converter).

 

Alternatives: SIO2IDE, SIO2SD, SIO2USB. In combination with some highspeed-SIO OS these devices are very cool too.

 

Or...

 

MyIDE. That is a nice one too, but it requiers a custom OS. With a standard OS, this is not your first choice, but with a special MyIDE OS, it is a very nice and cheap alternative.

 

But as said: Get yourself a BlackBox or MIO. You'll love it.

 

Marius

[Atari8guy]

This depends on what you want to do with your atari.

 

1. Does speed really matter? Then you might not want a SIO based solution.

 

2. Do you want to keep your OS original or are you able to built in several OS-es in one?

 

3. Is it a must-have that is is IDE?

 

When you want the best-of-the-best. Go for a BlackBox or MIO, and use a SCSI harddisk (or use an IDE->SCSI converter).

 

Alternatives: SIO2IDE, SIO2SD, SIO2USB. In combination with some highspeed-SIO OS these devices are very cool too.

 

Or...

 

MyIDE. That is a nice one too, but it requiers a custom OS. With a standard OS, this is not your first choice, but with a special MyIDE OS, it is a very nice and cheap alternative.

 

But as said: Get yourself a BlackBox or MIO. You'll love it.

 

Marius

 

Would love to pick up a BlackBox or MIO, but no idea where to acquire those these days. Speed is not an issue, compatibility is...on the project as a whole I'm thinking the XEGS is slightly easier to put in a box then the 130XE. But its also more limited and I'd have to move console buttons and what not, where as the 130XE is most compatible and I have an AKI to use....I'm thinking the internal MyIDE in either case at this point, but I'll still need to move the cartridge port....

 

Maybe I should start a new thread on the project on the whole....lol...

[+Larry]

Would love to pick up a BlackBox or MIO, but no idea where to acquire those these days. Speed is not an issue, compatibility is...on the project as a whole I'm thinking the XEGS is slightly easier to put in a box then the 130XE. But its also more limited and I'd have to move console buttons and what not, where as the 130XE is most compatible and I have an AKI to use....I'm thinking the internal MyIDE in either case at this point, but I'll still need to move the cartridge port....

 

Maybe I should start a new thread on the project on the whole....lol...

 

Some folks have already done this Atari-in-a-tower project -- perhaps they will weigh in.

 

For some reason, the KMK-JZ IDE interface goes unmentioned. It shouldn't -- it is quite advanced over the MyIDE. And unfortunately, the MyIDE choices are pretty limited now. You can now purchase a MyIDE Flash Cartridge or a MyIDE Internal Flash Interface/OS. It is possible that you might be able to purchase one of the internal MyIDE interfaces used. (?)

 

I have one of the MyIDE internal flash interfaces, and it is currently partly non-functional. In order to make it functional, I will need to remove the flash memory chip, install it in a 1-Mbit flash cartridge, then put the OS file into a script and reprogram the flash. I'm really looking forward to that... So in all honesty, it is difficult to be very enthusiastic about that interface.

 

With the 130XE MyIDE (the Ken Jones interface), you can have have the MyIDE and have multiple OS, if you choose. I have a 130XE setup just like this. But like the BB/MIO, you'll have to find one of those.

 

-Larry

[Marius]

@larry

 

When I was talking about myide, I meant the 'original MyIDE' ... so not that thing with FLASH cart.

 

I have bougth a few in the early days of MyIDE, and it still works great. It is a simple device, and I think using a custom Atari OS for a device, is not a perfect solution, but it works great, so I am happy with it.

 

It is not so hard to build a MyIDE yourself...

 

But I agree, with that flash cart, it is a very strange device. I thought it would skip that menu when you'd use it on an atari with the MyIDE OS, but I was wrong.. it keeps starting with that flash menu.

 

Marius

[Atari8guy]

@larry

 

When I was talking about myide, I meant the 'original MyIDE' ... so not that thing with FLASH cart.

 

I have bougth a few in the early days of MyIDE, and it still works great. It is a simple device, and I think using a custom Atari OS for a device, is not a perfect solution, but it works great, so I am happy with it.

 

It is not so hard to build a MyIDE yourself...

 

But I agree, with that flash cart, it is a very strange device. I thought it would skip that menu when you'd use it on an atari with the MyIDE OS, but I was wrong.. it keeps starting with that flash menu.

 

Marius

 

All good comments, I actually do already own a KMK/JZ interface....but I want to keep it on my 320XE. The box project is a side thing. I realize its been done before, but I have much learning to do about the guts of these 8 bits and I thought this would be a good way. I never found a good website or thread regarding the Atari-in-a-tower and I did some serious googling...so I figured I'd use blogger and post about it once I get going in earnest.

 

Ideally I'd like to run SpartaDos X, use the 130XE I have because of the extra ram and hook up a PC keyboard. All the while using Hard drive while still keeping a floppy in the SIO Chain....put it all in a snazzy case with some CFL's and LED's and probably dremel the heck out of it so have accessible joystick ports, cartridge ports etc....

 

So I'm really restricted to IDE drives, they just seem like the most viable option currently.....

[+Larry]

All good comments, I actually do already own a KMK/JZ interface....but I want to keep it on my 320XE. The box project is a side thing. I realize its been done before, but I have much learning to do about the guts of these 8 bits and I thought this would be a good way. I never found a good website or thread regarding the Atari-in-a-tower and I did some serious googling...so I figured I'd use blogger and post about it once I get going in earnest.

 

Ideally I'd like to run SpartaDos X, use the 130XE I have because of the extra ram and hook up a PC keyboard. All the while using Hard drive while still keeping a floppy in the SIO Chain....put it all in a snazzy case with some CFL's and LED's and probably dremel the heck out of it so have accessible joystick ports, cartridge ports etc....

 

So I'm really restricted to IDE drives, they just seem like the most viable option currently.....

 

How are you planning on doing the cart jack access? That always seemd like a big stumbling block to me. And since you would like to use SpartaDos X, that also affects your cart usage options. Someone was working on being able to use Sparta Dos X with the MyIDE, but I don't *think* it ever happened. (?)

 

Still, a nice project -- hope you will keep us posted now and then on how it progresses and you solve the issues that arise.

 

-Larry

[mimo]

I guess that you have seen this?

http://translate.google.com/translate?clie...;langpair=pl|en

[Shawn Jefferson]

Larry, I thought the Atarimax internal MyIDE was in-system flashable?

 

Marius, the MyIDE flashcart menu is just software. You can just reprogram your flash cart (using the flashcart tools), so that it loads the MyIDE OS and then continues the disk boot. I haven't done it myself, since I don't find it that onerous to use the flashcart menu, but it is possible.

[Marius]

Larry, I thought the Atarimax internal MyIDE was in-system flashable?

 

Marius, the MyIDE flashcart menu is just software. You can just reprogram your flash cart (using the flashcart tools), so that it loads the MyIDE OS and then continues the disk boot. I haven't done it myself, since I don't find it that onerous to use the flashcart menu, but it is possible.

 

Hi!

 

that is not what i want. I just want to skip the whole Flash thing, and use my build-in myide rom, so that this cartridge just acts like a regular myide interface WITHOUT flash system.

 

Is that possible too?

 

greetz

M.

[+Larry]

Larry, I thought the Atarimax internal MyIDE was in-system flashable?

 

It is, except that the 130XE "fail-safe" portion is not. That is evidently a safety measure to prevent changing the "fail-safe."

 

But mine became corrupted, so I have to reprogram it the "hard way" in a flash cart (or device programmer, if I had the correct module). It might have caused other problems, but I would have preferred to have a separate jumper to allow reprogramming. As it is, the MyIDE portion works fine, but the 130XE goes immediately to the system test and shows a bad rom.

 

To be fair to Steve, I have used this with a jumper switch so that I don't have to open the case to use the 130XE OS (for purposes of compatibility), so I have used it often. Still, I don't see why that is different -- jumper or toggle switch.

 

-Larry

[+bob1200xl]

Jumpers can pretty much make a reliable connection. Switches may not. If the switch opens up at the wrong time, even for just a few milliseconds, a lot of bad things can happen in a system running at 560 nanoseconds. I have seen many switches go south when you tapped anywhere near it.

 

Some flash memory has a Boot Block that cannot be altered once programmed and 'locked'. What kind of flash chips are you using?.

 

Bob

 

 

 

Larry, I thought the Atarimax internal MyIDE was in-system flashable?

 

It is, except that the 130XE "fail-safe" portion is not. That is evidently a safety measure to prevent changing the "fail-safe."

 

But mine became corrupted, so I have to reprogram it the "hard way" in a flash cart (or device programmer, if I had the correct module). It might have caused other problems, but I would have preferred to have a separate jumper to allow reprogramming. As it is, the MyIDE portion works fine, but the 130XE goes immediately to the system test and shows a bad rom.

 

To be fair to Steve, I have used this with a jumper switch so that I don't have to open the case to use the 130XE OS (for purposes of compatibility), so I have used it often. Still, I don't see why that is different -- jumper or toggle switch.

 

-Larry

[sl0re]

All good comments, I actually do already own a KMK/JZ interface....but I want to keep it on my 320XE. The box project is a side thing. I realize its been done before, but I have much learning to do about the guts of these 8 bits and I thought this would be a good way. I never found a good website or thread regarding the Atari-in-a-tower and I did some serious googling...so I figured I'd use blogger and post about it once I get going in earnest.

 

Ideally I'd like to run SpartaDos X, use the 130XE I have because of the extra ram and hook up a PC keyboard. All the while using Hard drive while still keeping a floppy in the SIO Chain....put it all in a snazzy case with some CFL's and LED's and probably dremel the heck out of it so have accessible joystick ports, cartridge ports etc....

 

So I'm really restricted to IDE drives, they just seem like the most viable option currently.....

 

How are you planning on doing the cart jack access? That always seemd like a big stumbling block to me. And since you would like to use SpartaDos X, that also affects your cart usage options. Someone was working on being able to use Sparta Dos X with the MyIDE, but I don't *think* it ever happened. (?)

 

Still, a nice project -- hope you will keep us posted now and then on how it progresses and you solve the issues that arise.

 

-Larry

 

Don't forget the SIO2IDE. It does fast sio, does not require a special bios, works with spartados, et cetera.

[Shawn Jefferson]

that is not what i want. I just want to skip the whole Flash thing, and use my build-in myide rom, so that this cartridge just acts like a regular myide interface WITHOUT flash system.

 

Sure, why not?

 

The MyIDE + Flash Cart is just a normal MyIDE interface, with flash memory included. You could build a cartridge image for it that only really does a RTS.

[Defender II]

Any thoughts on this...what I'm hoping to do with my week off and my staying home on this particular vacation (bad economy and all) is put one of my systems into a tower...but I'd like to have a hard disk and a floppy in it.....hoping/asking for thoughts....

If you go ahead with this project, and use yout 130XE, I'm looking to replace a broken case and shielding. PM me if I can get them.

[+selgus]

If you go ahead with this project, and use yout 130XE, I'm looking to replace a broken case and shielding. PM me if I can get them.

Best Electronics has replacement cases for the 130XE for $12 used. I bought 2 to actually cut up and make cases for other devices. Even though they are considered "used", they are in great shape.

--Selgus

[+selgus]

Best Electronics has replacement cases for the 130XE for $12 used. I bought 2 to actually cut up and make cases for other devices. Even though they are considered "used", they are in great shape.

Correction, I got these from B & C ComputerVisions, Not Best.

--Selgus

[Defender II]

Best Electronics has replacement cases for the 130XE for $12 used. I bought 2 to actually cut up and make cases for other devices. Even though they are considered "used", they are in great shape.

Correction, I got these from B & C ComputerVisions, Not Best.

--Selgus

 

Did they come with the sheilding?

[+selgus]

Best Electronics has replacement cases for the 130XE for $12 used. I bought 2 to actually cut up and make cases for other devices. Even though they are considered "used", they are in great shape.

Correction, I got these from B & C ComputerVisions, Not Best.

--Selgus

 

Did they come with the sheilding?

No, it is just the plastic case.

--Selgus

[+Larry]

Jumpers can pretty much make a reliable connection. Switches may not. If the switch opens up at the wrong time, even for just a few milliseconds, a lot of bad things can happen in a system running at 560 nanoseconds. I have seen many switches go south when you tapped anywhere near it.

 

Some flash memory has a Boot Block that cannot be altered once programmed and 'locked'. What kind of flash chips are you using?.

 

Bob

 

Got around to opening it up today. The flash chip has what looks to be an "ST" logo on it. "Singapore"

 

Flash chip was bad. But something else is wrong -- I replaced the flash chip and re-flashed it, and it still shows up as a bad XE rom.

 

-Larry

[+Larry]

Got around to opening it up today. The flash chip has what looks to be an "ST" logo on it. "Singapore"

 

Flash chip was bad. But something else is wrong -- I replaced the flash chip and re-flashed it, and it still shows up as a bad XE rom.

 

-Larry

 

Update:

 

It turns out that my XE MB was bad, and not the interface. I installed the interface (with the replaced flash chip) in another 130XE and it worked fine. But from everything I can tell right now, the internal flash interface was fine.

 

-Larry