Tempest Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Is the Commodore 128D mostly compatible with the C-64? I know the 128 is, but IIRC the D added some extra stuff that was subsequently never really used. The reason I'm asking is that I think they they look neat and I was thinking about upgrading to one. How much to they generally go for and how hard are they to find? Is there any real advantage to owning one over a C-64 other than the few 128 enhanced games they made? Tempest Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 I have one. It's pretty much 100%, if not exactly 100% compatible. It has the extra video ram that is rarely used. It has an RGBI port too. The detached keyboard is nice, but the cable is shorter than I'd like it to be. The internal drive is a 1571, but you can modify that to be device 9 if you want. I can't think of any real advantages to it, unless those items are appealing to you. I haven't used mine in 128 mode too much. The case is pretty nice, compared to other 64 stuff. I've had mine forever, so I don't know how hard they are to find now or what they go for. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1702194 Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinball22 Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 There are a few 128-mode games that take advantage of the ability to have two screens. I can't think what any of them are right now, though. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1702266 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 Well if anyone has a reasonably priced 128D that they want to sell or trade, let me know. I think it would be nice to have. Tempest Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1702278 Share on other sites More sharing options...
crunchysuperman Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 I still have mine from back in '87. There were a few bug fixes and a couple of minor changes from the 128, the only one I remember off hand was the video RAM upgrade from 16 to 64k. I remember some of the Kracker Jax copiers took advantage of it (even in 64 mode) as a swap space for single drive disk copying. Basic8 would also allow 640x400 graphic commands that you couldn't do with a plain 128. I JiffyDOS'd mine, put switches up front to change the drive number from 8-11, a dedicated drive reset button, moved the system reset to the front, had a battery-backed RAMLink and SuperSnapshot 5.0 for which I also moved the enable button the front. I don't remember ever having any incompatibilities with 64 mode software, and I had a ton of it! (still do) Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1702339 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrax Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Developers usually made software that would also run on the C64, the 128D came out towards the end of Commodore's eight bit days so a software manufacturer would want to maximize sales by making software run on all the systems. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1702497 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BydoEmpire Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 I never owned one, but always drooled over them. One question, though. I assume they have the c64 cartridge port - is it located in the back of the machine? That was inconvenient enough on the c64, but it seems really tough on a 128D. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1702505 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 I never owned one, but always drooled over them. One question, though. I assume they have the c64 cartridge port - is it located in the back of the machine? That was inconvenient enough on the c64, but it seems really tough on a 128D. Yes, and yes, it is a little inconvenient. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1702589 Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuppicide Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 I've like the look of the C128D, but was always afraid to buy one. I've had several revisions of both the C64 and C128. I don't really like the C128 as far as compatability, which is why I never went for a 128D. I remember my Dad got me my first C64 as a present one year and some clone 1541 drive, the Enhancer 2000 . They got them in NYC since things were cheaper in some of the stores there. I was so pissed off because very early on I started having issues. I had bought Arcade Game Construction Kit and that never worked. I also paid for some nice BBS software (DMBBS I think by Artisoft) which cost me about $40 or $50, also didn't work. The drive ruined them. Even getting an alignment didn't help. My Dad's Girlfriend took it back to the city and the place they got it told them there was a manufacturer defect and gave them another. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703173 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 I've like the look of the C128D, but was always afraid to buy one. I've had several revisions of both the C64 and C128. I don't really like the C128 as far as compatability, which is why I never went for a 128D. I remember my Dad got me my first C64 as a present one year and some clone 1541 drive, the Enhancer 2000 . They got them in NYC since things were cheaper in some of the stores there. I was so pissed off because very early on I started having issues. I had bought Arcade Game Construction Kit and that never worked. I also paid for some nice BBS software (DMBBS I think by Artisoft) which cost me about $40 or $50, also didn't work. The drive ruined them. Even getting an alignment didn't help. My Dad's Girlfriend took it back to the city and the place they got it told them there was a manufacturer defect and gave them another. What compatibility issues are you referring to with the 128? Surely it was the drive causing the incompatibilities, unless you found some really bizarre 128 incompatibility, because the 128 in 64 mode is as near to 100% compatible as you can get. I don't recall what was found that doesn't work, but it was just one or two really obscure items... it's considered to be ~100% 64 compatible, including the 128D. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703182 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 I remember my Dad got me my first C64 as a present one year and some clone 1541 drive, the Enhancer 2000 . That drive officially sucks. It's not a 1541 clone, but rather a cheap knock off that sorely lacks true compatibility of a real 1541. As far as I can tell it only answers to the IEC command set (like many non true compatible solutions these days such as 64HDD) and therefore it doesn't run fastloaders or any custom drive code. Boo hiss! Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703191 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted March 15, 2009 Author Share Posted March 15, 2009 Boo hiss! Were you saying Boo or Boourns? Tempest Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703196 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 Yeah, I had a Blue Chip drive BITD, and while it would run most programs/games, there were some compatibility issues. It was slightly faster than a stock 1541 though, and quite a bit quieter. Most all compatibility issues with C64's/128's are due to using non-1541 drives. Even the 1541-II and 1571's have compatibility issues, so for best compatibility, always use a real 1541. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703198 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyranthraxus Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 I think Ultima V was the most prominent release to take advantage of the 128 but IIRC it was only additional music. I'm partial to the 64C but the 128D is a very good looking machine, the peak of the Commodore 8-bits. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703200 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 Were you saying Boo or Boourns? Definitely a Boo Hiss. Cool looking form factor aside, I'd recommend spending money on something like the 1541Ultimate instead of a 128D - it's incredibly more useful. Depends on what your intentions are though. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703207 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathAdderSF Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Were you saying Boo or Boourns? I was saying Boourns... Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703726 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ze_ro Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 I think Ultima V was the most prominent release to take advantage of the 128 but IIRC it was only additional music. Unfortunately, there are a lot of pauses in the music when you move around, making it sound crappier than it should have. Basically, the only incompatibilities in the 128 in the first place is that a few previously unused registers in the VIC-II are now used, so "unfriendly" software that changes these registers can accidentally throw the machine into 2MHz mode and such. As far as I know, the only major changes in the 128D is the extra video RAM for the VDC chip (which shouldn't cause any new problems), and the inclusion of the 1571 (which is already about as 1541 compatible as you can possibly be). --Zero Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703734 Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuppicide Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Compatibility as far as games not working. I didn't have that drive the whole time.. I had 1541's, 1571's, and 1581's throughout my Commodore days. I will say the Enhancer 2000 was the worst out of all, but the 1571 for me falls in close second place. Taken from wiki: "Early 1571s had a bug in the ROM-based disk operating system that caused relative files to corrupt if they occupied both sides of the disk. A version 2 ROM was released, but though it cured the initial bug, it introduced some minor quirks of its own - particularly with the 1541 emulation. Curiously, it was also identified as V3.0." -- I do not know if this affects the 1571 which is inside a C128D or not? What compatibility issues are you referring to with the 128? Surely it was the drive causing the incompatibilities, unless you found some really bizarre 128 incompatibility, because the 128 in 64 mode is as near to 100% compatible as you can get. I don't recall what was found that doesn't work, but it was just one or two really obscure items... it's considered to be ~100% 64 compatible, including the 128D. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703867 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Compatibility as far as games not working. I didn't have that drive the whole time.. I had 1541's, 1571's, and 1581's throughout my Commodore days. I will say the Enhancer 2000 was the worst out of all, but the 1571 for me falls in close second place. Taken from wiki: "Early 1571s had a bug in the ROM-based disk operating system that caused relative files to corrupt if they occupied both sides of the disk. A version 2 ROM was released, but though it cured the initial bug, it introduced some minor quirks of its own - particularly with the 1541 emulation. Curiously, it was also identified as V3.0." -- I do not know if this affects the 1571 which is inside a C128D or not? What compatibility issues are you referring to with the 128? Surely it was the drive causing the incompatibilities, unless you found some really bizarre 128 incompatibility, because the 128 in 64 mode is as near to 100% compatible as you can get. I don't recall what was found that doesn't work, but it was just one or two really obscure items... it's considered to be ~100% 64 compatible, including the 128D. I'm sure it was the 1571 causing it. If you had an external 1541 attached, but didn't change the internal 1571's drive number, that was probably the issue with the 1541. Many games simply won't work except from drive 8. The 128 is nearly 100% 64 compatible with a 1541 set to drive 8. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1703882 Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinball22 Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Cool looking form factor aside, I'd recommend spending money on something like the 1541Ultimate instead of a 128D - it's incredibly more useful. Depends on what your intentions are though. Oh wow... I hadn't heard about the 1541Ultimate before. It's just what I've always wanted! Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1704059 Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuppicide Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 I've heard of the 1541 Ultimate before, and have wanted one for awhile now. I suddenly am in the mood to play some Impossible Mission. http://members.tripod.com/~impossible_mission/voice.wav Out of these, which is the most compatible for fast loading games: * Final Cartridge III * Action Replay * Retro Replay * Super Snapshot I am really use to my old JiffyDOS. Really a shame about that Maurice character. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1704515 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 I've heard of the 1541 Ultimate before, and have wanted one for awhile now. I suddenly am in the mood to play some Impossible Mission. http://members.tripod.com/~impossible_mission/voice.wav Out of these, which is the most compatible for fast loading games: * Final Cartridge III * Action Replay * Retro Replay * Super Snapshot I am really use to my old JiffyDOS. Really a shame about that Maurice character. For about the past month, Maurice has been posting again on the Homestead mailing list (I don't even know why I still subscribe to that pointless and annoying list... it's almost enough to make me hate Commodore), promising that he's going to go full-bore back into production and support. It's amazing to me how most people on there just ate it up... forgiving him and telling him welcome back. But he hasn't actually done a thing yet. These are the same people who have been angry with him for years and years, and he still has some of their equipment, and/or years-old unfulfilled orders... but they all just say "yay, Maurice is back". I would wait until he actually does something... actions speak louder than words. I hope I'm wrong, but I think he's all talk and still won't do anything. Anyway, you can still get JiffyDOS if you look around, and it really is still the best, and the only thing I use anymore. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1704609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 (edited) Err.. Action Replay creates cloned memory dumps of a program that's running, so the loading isn't that much of an issue. No idea if it has a Fast-Loader that you can use in the normal course of things ... I've actually got an Action Replay cart here, don't think I've ever bothered to try it out. Edited March 17, 2009 by Rybags Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1704610 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artlover Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 For about the past month, Maurice has been posting again on the Homestead mailing list So that washed up drunk is still around? Problem with Maurice is that he runs CMD like he's ran his life - Lies, excuses and drunkenly running it into the ground. I'm sorry, but I honestly have nothing good to say about him. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1704612 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artlover Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 So poking around on comp.sys.cbm was interesting. Seems he still doesn't have many friends there, seeing how as recently as last month people were still calling him a theif and "A hillybilly f--kup"..... Looks like what he has been doing in recent years, instead of taking care of his business, was getting back into Nascar again. Since atleast 2007. http://pentastarmotorsports.com/ http://www.mstrc.com/index.php?showuser=692 http://www.autocityspeedway.com/contact.php http://www.mlive.com/sports/flint/index.ss..._takes_ove.html Like to know how the hell he is going to do anything CBM/CMD related when he has all this other more important stuff to worry about. Anywho.... I think I know why he decided to crawl out of the woodwork all of a sudden and start making new claims. Talk of a class-action lawsuit was brewing again, amung other things. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/140755-commodore-128d/#findComment-1704770 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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