flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 (edited) I'm gonna down tools now: yesterday I spent four hours trying to construct an SIO2PC interface inside an SIO plug: it doesn't work. I thought I'd shelve that for a while and start work converting my XM-301 modem into a housing for my SIO2SD. Five minutes into milling out the LCD aperture, the cheapo multi-tool I bought only two days ago gave up the ghost. Increasingly insensed - and momentarily disinclined to journey into town to return said multi-tool to shop - I ploughed on with a craft knife and coping saw, ultimately - in my broiling temper - cutting a hole which managed to be both crooked and slightly too large. The top of the modem case looked even worse after it had been under my foot... Determined to do this mod, I immediately and pofligately ordered another new XM-301 on ebay. This hobby of mine seems at the moment expensive, rewardless and stressful. Doubtless it's a frame of mind, but's been a pig of a weekend... Edited November 29, 2009 by flashjazzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 I feel your pain. REally. Hey come and vent at the Atari chat this morning if you want to... http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/117257-atari-eurochat-telnet-on-sunday/page__view__findpost__p__1415466 Or check out the IRC channel... http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/103724-irc-chat-thursdays-8pm-cdtcst/page__view__findpost__p__1319435 I find chatting with people is not only helpful, but good also good to vent sometimes. And man there have been some times that this hobby is frustrating. Then again, for me I kinda know eventually I'll get it to work, but in the meantime it is fun to rant. Makes the task seem more challenging somehow. Just writing to say, been there many times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+save2600 Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 Ranting is great fun and cleanses the soul! Sorry to hear about your bad luck lately flashjazzcat, but hang in there. We've ALL had those kinds of days/weeks/years. At least those 301's are a relatively cheap investment. Not like you ruined an Amiga 1000 or Atari Falcon case! lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Author Share Posted November 29, 2009 Am trying to set up mIRC but not having much luck... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ransom Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 I've had that kind of weekend! The good thing is, it passes. Step away from the tools, and all will be well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Author Share Posted November 29, 2009 Thanks guys! I think four hours on a failed gadget build tends to get one riled up: it was a bad time to try modding something today. I now have a bundle of wires in an SIO plug, a useless dremel which will have to be returned, and a shattered modem in the bin. Certainly one to forget. Stepping away from the tools is definitely the way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mathy Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 Hello Jon There are two rules I try not to break: 1) Never try to do anything that needs your full concentration when angry/annoyed. 2) Never think: "Oh, I'll just do this or that now. Won't take much time." When I'm angry/annoyed I can't keep my head straight, so that doesn't work. And I know from way to much experience that number 2 above usually results in something damaged (including my ego). Or it'll take way longer then I though it would, which usually results into other problems. And more damage to the ego. greetings Mathy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Author Share Posted November 29, 2009 There are two rules I try not to break: 1) Never try to do anything that needs your full concentration when angry/annoyed. 2) Never think: "Oh, I'll just do this or that now. Won't take much time." When I'm angry/annoyed I can't keep my head straight, so that doesn't work. And I know from way to much experience that number 2 above usually results in something damaged (including my ego). Or it'll take way longer then I though it would, which usually results into other problems. And more damage to the ego. Perfect advice. I was trying to do job number 2 because job number 1 won't go right. It's a recipe for disaster. Far better to get the SIO2PC cable working, feel good about that, then embark on the modem mod. I feel pretty stupid now, and it's cost me a weekend and another 26GBP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 I think we've all had those weekends. Come back to IRC - looks like I missed you by about 10 minutes. Stephen Anderson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mathy Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 Hello Jon Sometimes, coffee or tea will also do the trick. greetings Mathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Author Share Posted November 29, 2009 Too much coffee already, I suspect! Been abstaining for a few days, so time for few light libations this evening, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sloopy Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 flashjazzcat, yeah my first sio2pc didnt work, but i didnt know if it was my wiring or the chips were bad, made a second, and works fine... some times you have to step back and take a break... mathy, yeah any time i tell my wife how long it will take something to do, she will double it... i.e. 'yeah i will have it done in about half hour 45mins' and she will respond with 'ok so you will be done in an hour and a half...' sloopy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Author Share Posted November 29, 2009 (edited) Well, as for SIO2PC, having no electronic skills, I can't tell if my wiring is correct. Maybe I'll order a second MAX232 and have another go just in case... Does anyone know where I could get a 14C89 chip: the circuit is much simpler. Edited November 29, 2009 by flashjazzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiassofT Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 Well, as for SIO2PC, having no electronic skills, I can't tell if my wiring is correct. Maybe I'll order a second MAX232 and have another go just in case... Or get a MAX233 - it doesn't need the 4 external capacitors. A few months ago I built a SIO2PC cable with this chip and managed to fit everything into a standard DB9 housing. It was quite tight (using the DIL version), but after half an hour it was finished and worked fine. BTW: you could also try getting a free sample from Dallas/Maxim, there's an online ordering form on their website. so long, Hias, who had a bad tuesday this week at work: getting a larger web application to run on a hosting provider took 2 days instead of the planned 2 hours - and of course this was part of a fixed-price job... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roydea6 Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 Well, as for SIO2PC, having no electronic skills, I can't tell if my wiring is correct. Maybe I'll order a second MAX232 and have another go just in case... Does anyone know where I could get a 14C89 chip: the circuit is much simpler. Most older Modems have a chip '1489' installed on board. 1489 very like the 14c89--- there may be one in the bin. Welcome to the club.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Author Share Posted November 29, 2009 Most older Modems have a chip '1489' installed on board. 1489 very like the 14c89--- there may be one in the bin. Welcome to the club.. No such luck. I've ordered another MAX232 for pennies, just in case I have no luck with this one. I found a better circuit diagram, and what I've made is right, so something's failed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiassofT Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 Most older Modems have a chip '1489' installed on board. 1489 very like the 14c89--- there may be one in the bin. I really wouldn't recommend the 14C89 SIO2PC/1050-2-PC versions, they are a bad hack and clearly out of the RS232 specs. RS232 needs a negative voltage (-3V ... -15V), but the 14C89 interfaces only go down to 0V (the 14C89 is a RS232 receiver, for proper operation you'd also need a 14C88 RS232 transmitter plus a symmetric voltage supply). The reason why this hack works is that most RS232 receivers use a switching threshold of approx 1-2V, so the typical 0.1-0.4V from the 14C89 is (slightly) below the threshold and recognized as a logic "1". BUT: now there's almost no safety margin (compared to using +/-9 or +/-12V), so you have a higher risk of transmission errors caused by interference - especially when using longer cables. So: better go the MAX23x route, this is the proper way to do it. so long, Hias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 29, 2009 Author Share Posted November 29, 2009 Agreed. Having ordered another IC, I stripped down what I'd made and rebuilt it according to this diagram: SIO2PC Much more "non-PCB" friendly, this, and what I made second time around is faithful to the instructions. However, it still doesn't work: COM port not found. Perhaps the IC's kaput? Note: the only component I left out was the 0.1uf cap between ground and +5v. I only hope the serial port on the PC has no fault on it. It's the first time anything's been plugged into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urchlay Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 However, it still doesn't work: COM port not found. Perhaps the IC's kaput? ... I only hope the serial port on the PC has no fault on it. It's the first time anything's been plugged into it. "COM port not found" sounds like it doesn't have anything to do with your soldering. I bet you get the same error with nothing plugged into the serial port, or with anything else plugged in... you're running windows? Check "device manager" or whatever it's called in recent windows versions, see if you even have a COM1: device. Might be you need to enable it in the BIOS setup menu...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+poobah Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 Agreed. Having ordered another IC, I stripped down what I'd made and rebuilt it according to this diagram: SIO2PC Much more "non-PCB" friendly, this, and what I made second time around is faithful to the instructions. However, it still doesn't work: COM port not found. Perhaps the IC's kaput? Note: the only component I left out was the 0.1uf cap between ground and +5v. I only hope the serial port on the PC has no fault on it. It's the first time anything's been plugged into it. Really should have the cap in place, especially on a MAX2xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sl0re Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 (edited) I'm gonna down tools now: yesterday I spent four hours trying to construct an SIO2PC interface inside an SIO plug: it doesn't work. I thought I'd shelve that for a while and start work converting my XM-301 modem into a housing for my SIO2SD. Five minutes into milling out the LCD aperture, the cheapo multi-tool I bought only two days ago gave up the ghost. Increasingly insensed - and momentarily disinclined to journey into town to return said multi-tool to shop - I ploughed on with a craft knife and coping saw, ultimately - in my broiling temper - cutting a hole which managed to be both crooked and slightly too large. The top of the modem case looked even worse after it had been under my foot... Determined to do this mod, I immediately and pofligately ordered another new XM-301 on ebay. This hobby of mine seems at the moment expensive, rewardless and stressful. Doubtless it's a frame of mind, but's been a pig of a weekend... This weekend I started venturing out into a new strategy for the same kind of thing. Rather than making new stuff fit into old cases, make new cases with fiberglass. I started my first box today. Its a test and I already made mistakes, but it might be easier... plus after being sanded and painted, it looks great (ie, fiberglass in general, can look great). Edited November 30, 2009 by sl0re Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sloopy Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 is there really that many problems with the 1489 version of the sio2pc? hmm thats what i built and only issue i have is it stops every few seconds and when it does a retry continues on, i thought it was because my pc was too fast (AMD 6000+ X2) and signals were getting missed. oh well it works... flashjazzcat, good luck on the new circuit... sloopy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 I built both mine using 1489s. IIRC the first one didn't work properly but I took out a component and it did (capacitor, I think? ) http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/102152-making-an-sio2pc-cable/page__view__findpost__p__1240743 The original page seems to be gone but I saved it. Download and unzip what's in that post, I based my second on on the SIO2PC on that page. 1489s should still be readily available... I can drive 5 minutes to the local electronics store and grab them for under $5 each. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted November 30, 2009 Author Share Posted November 30, 2009 "COM port not found" sounds like it doesn't have anything to do with your soldering. I bet you get the same error with nothing plugged into the serial port, or with anything else plugged in... you're running windows? Check "device manager" or whatever it's called in recent windows versions, see if you even have a COM1: device. Might be you need to enable it in the BIOS setup menu...? My suspicions are roused as to the PC too. The serial port's enabled in the BIOS as far as I can tell, and something's telling me I should be getting some kind of response by now. I had about as much luck this time last year trying to build one of the old SIO to parallel port cables: I gave up on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urchlay Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 My suspicions are roused as to the PC too. The serial port's enabled in the BIOS as far as I can tell, and something's telling me I should be getting some kind of response by now. Go to a used computer store, or the goodwill, you can probably find an old external modem for $5. See if you can get that to work (at least as far as responding to AT commands). If you've got 2 PCs with serial ports, get a null modem cable (probably $12 or so), and some PC-flavored terminal software, see if you can type stuff on one and have it show up on the other. If none of the above can be made to work, there's no point even trying to hook up your SIO2PC yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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