Rybags Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 I've seen at least 3 or 4 different styles of C-64 PSUs here. Got 2 different ones myself - the ribbed plastic one (probably epoxy-filled), and a solid steel-cased one. They come up for sale fairly often and pretty cheap - as with the A8 PSUs, just throw out the epoxy-filled junk at the first hint of trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 as with the A8 PSUs, just throw out the epoxy-filled junk at the first hint of trouble. By that time, your computer is likely fried. Seriously, I don't know about the A8 ones, but the C64 ones will go out with no notice whatsoever and take out your machine with it. This isn't a problem you "wait" until it goes bad to rectify the problem... really. EDIT: Note that I'm referring only to the standard US-release brown (black) and off-white epoxy ribbed PS units. I don't know the first thing about the PS's from other countries. They may be better, or not, I have no idea. I lost a really prized and special C64 to one of those PS, and it was not that long ago, when I already knew better, but thought it would be okay "just for awhile". I was wrong, and still haven't gotten around to trying to repair that one yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herbarius Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Well there seems to be quite a variety of reason of why the C64 PSUs fail, and only some of those take out the machine with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Well there seems to be quite a variety of reason of why the C64 PSUs fail, and only some of those take out the machine with it. Yes, but does this change anything really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herbarius Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Well, at least it gives me a chance of having the C64 survive should the PSU fail, whereas you said "the first sign of trouble" would equal a fried C64, although it may also mean a fried PSU only. If you could give me hints on where or how to get one of those "regulated and servicable" replacement PSUs of yours it would change something Currently I only have 2 options. Well three, but two of those aren't really different. a) Continue using my PSU and hoping for the best. b) Get another used PSU from ebay and use that - again hoping for the best. c) Don't use the C64 anymore. You see, both options a and b don't really change anything, at least unless I find someone with an oscilloscope to maybe determine, how well my current PSU or the "new" one from ebay is holding up, and deciding on the one which appears to be the most reliable, if I have multiple ones. I've also talked to a friend of mine about the issue. He said, the 5V DC current is easy to get with a 10 Euro standard thingie, while the 9V AC is more difficult. What is that 9V AC used for anyway, just the tape drive? If yes, what would happen if you just ignore it, only use the 5V DC, would the computer function, except for the tape drive - that may be a reasonable alternative. Regardless, you'd have to somehow put the rather unusual plug on it. So what would I trust more, my poor soldering skills or a 25 year old PSU? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Yes, it gives you a chance if the PSU fails... it's not like it will definitely kill the 64, but point is that it could, right? I mean, it's not like there's a way to predict whether it will hurt anything else if it goes out. They are dangerous, period, so in a best-case-scenario, they shouldn't be used. I totally understand what you're saying, and if it's the only one you have, it's the only one you have. And like I said, it's "only" a 64, so maybe it's a calculated risk that's worth taking and maybe there will never be an issue. So, I'm totally with you on that. Doesn't change the fact that it's potentially dangerous to your hardware to use them. Anyway, I think we're on the same page there. a) Yes, you could do that, and just get a new 64 should the worst happen. b) Yes, I would do that, but get a serviceable style one that has screws in the bottom. There were many made, not just C= brand. There were ones made by Suntron that are plentiful (EDIT: Maybe they're not plentiful on ebay anymore, but I've had 50 or more through my hands in the past 5 years, so they're out there -- and no, I'm really not dealing in C= stuff anymore). I can't think of the other brands, but they're out there. c) No, that's just crazy talk! There is an option D) that I think may be your best option. Get a C128 (flat) power supply. They are serviceable and much better than the stock C64 one. Wire it up with a connector from a C64 and you're all set. They have a fuse built-in! Unfortunately, I can't help you directly as I sold all of my serviceable PS's and modded-128 PS's last year. They went quickly! Options are out there though, just be patient and look and your current stock PS will likely be fine in the meantime. It's not a vital issue since these aren't rare computers, but I still feel the responsibility to point it out to anyone when I see it discussed. Good luck! Oh yeah, and the SID and user port both use the 9v also. Not sure if anything else does. Really, I'd say your best bet is to mod a 128PS. You'll be better prepared then if you add any extras as well, and even if you don't, you're better off. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herbarius Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 (edited) Thanks alot for the input. Edited March 31, 2010 by Herbarius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wood_jl Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 (edited) It has been my observation that "quality" power supplies for the Commodore 64 seem to be in relatively short supply. I think I do remember seeing Suntron brand ones on Ebay, but it was early-on with my "getting into" C64 and I did not know there was a need. I have looked quite a bit and do not see them often. The C128 power supply is an idea he mentioned. But you have to change the plug to that of the C64. On mine the DIN connector somehow does not make good contact with the power jack on the C64, so if you wiggle anything it spikes the power off and on - which is disturbing. As a result, I am still using the ribbed C64 junk power supply. I do not know enough about ordering connectors to understand if I will be getting a quality one - as I do not understand why the one on my C128 PSU does not make good contact because it looks ok. I am considering breaking up my working (but undesirable) C64 PSU and procuring the power cord (the one heading toward the computer) and then installing it on the C128 PSU; that way I know I'll be getting a connector that fits. I figure if you can take the whole cord (break open the old C64 PSU) then you can be sure to keep the molded-on strain relief, place it in the C128 PS and then you'll have a neat job. I don't want to just cut the molded plug off and then have a bunch of crappy electrical tape - I want a smooth, factory-looking cord. Or, if I could find a decent installable DIN plug. I always keep the C64 PSU unplugged from the mains when I am not using it - in the hopes the heat reduction will help it to last. Obtaining a Commodore 128 PSU (without the accompanying C128) ain't all that easy, either. However, there is guy selling aftermarket ones on Ebay right now, but they ain't cheap - that's for sure. They are new in the box, RECOTON brand. I have composite cables from Recoton, but I was not aware of their PSU; one can only assume it is of greater quality than the defective Commodore unit - like the better-known Suntron brand is. Ultimately, I think if I did not have a 128 PSU already I would be tempted to try this. My old computers are important to me, and I keep expensive "1541 Ultimate" plugged in and I wonder if it would take that down as well? If I used the C64 very much I would try to fix this 128 PSU I have. C128 PSU uction on Ebay: eBay Auction -- Item Number: 250583331518 We're talking $40 plus $20 shipping!!! the guy does also have Amiga 500 PSUs (new in the box, by Suntron) and as you might EASILY guess, they are not going cheap either. eBay Auction -- Item Number: 250583328991 edit: THESE ARE YANKEE POWER SUPPLIES; I DID NOT SEE WHERE ORIGINAL POSTER LIVES Edited March 31, 2010 by wood_jl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 ...On mine the DIN connector somehow does not make good contact with the power jack on the C64, so if you wiggle anything it spikes the power off and on - which is disturbing. This is because your plug is aftermarket, it's not an original plug that came on a C64. I didn't know about the quality of those plugs when I sold it to you... but the other identical ones I had exactly like that were fine so far as I could tell, so I do think it's just an anomaly with that specific plug. I used one exactly like yours for a good while with no issues whatsoever. Good thing I sold it to you cheap! If you took a real C64 plug and put it on there like you're saying (you haven't been able to find a dead C64 PS with a plug to donate?) I'm sure you wouldn't have that issue. As for all those other prices, well, that's what you get with epay. That's why I haven't bought anything on there for a long time. Yeah, for stuff like that you're going to pay an extreme fortune. Ebay is (generally) for people who just don't want to wait at all and are willing to pay a premium. Especially for retro-computing stuff lately, I've noticed! I'm shocked at many of the prices that people are asking on BIN-bay! If you really want something (like a 128 PS), just check CraigsList or whatever. C64s and 128's turn up quite frequently, sometimes for peanuts. Snag it just for the PS cable. Or, just post up here, at Lemon, on Homestead, and wherever else wanting either a PS or a whole 128 or whatever. Patience and they will turn up for a much better price. All I'm saying is that this is possible. Yes, they're getting harder to find and are getting more expensive, but it's no reason to go spending $60 on ebay! You can definitely snag a whole new C64 (with original PS, but at least it would get you going again) for less than $60 on CraigsList unless your area is strangely bereft of them (I'm talking US here of course). C64 PS in Australia ebay auction number: 300410908653. I've never seen this PS before, as it may be Australia only, but it looks serviceable. C64 PS in US ebay auction number: 320509247827 (this looks like one of the C= brand serviceable ones, though granted it's in a big lot, but a nice big lot!). C128 PS's that have recently sold for relatively low prices (for ebay): 270553527725, 270552865418 (this one didn't even sell, maybe he still has it, or more of them since he listed others), another: 270548890497 (same guy, I'd contact him if I were you, except I just noticed his 94.5% feedback, aye, ebay!)! Here's a whole C128 that just sold for just over $21 with power supply: 250597277309. Another complete 128 just sold for $27 and had an issue with the connector on the PS... great, since you're just going to cut it off! Another nice 128 for under $45 (which is too much IMO, but that's ebay for ya)... ... my point is that all this was just with a quick search of current (and recent) auctions. These things are out there. It's not like they're rare, and you just need to ignore all the crazy listings like the 128's with $240 BIN's. Those people are nucking futz and there's no way they're worth that. If you MUST go the ebay route, and honest-to-goodness really can't find a frikkin' cheap C64 locally for a stock connector and spare 64 unit (I'd be shocked, no matter where you live in the US), just put in a saved search with notification and if you really want a new 128 or serviceable 64 PS, you will find one in short time for not a lot of money, and may even get a spare 64 (or 128) in the deal for less than the price of those PS's you posted! Now I wish I hadn't sold all my extra PS's so cheap! (except to you, but to others I mean). I'm just out of the C= reseller business, and the CraigsList stalking business for that matter... it was a lot of work to buy and sell all that stuff in bulk! LOL But because of that experience, I know what's out there and that it's easy as heck to find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wood_jl Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 (edited) ...On mine the DIN connector somehow does not make good contact with the power jack on the C64, so if you wiggle anything it spikes the power off and on - which is disturbing. This is because your plug is aftermarket, it's not an original plug that came on a C64. I didn't know about the quality of those plugs when I sold it to you... but the other identical ones I had exactly like that were fine so far as I could tell, so I do think it's just an anomaly with that specific plug. I used one exactly like yours for a good while with no issues whatsoever. Good thing I sold it to you cheap! If you took a real C64 plug and put it on there like you're saying (you haven't been able to find a dead C64 PS with a plug to donate?) I'm sure you wouldn't have that issue. Hey, I wasn't complaining! You gave me a smokin' deal on the PSU and I'm still grateful! I was just cautioning - to the inevitable PSU modder - that finding a good connector is important, and may not be as easy as just ordering the correct DIN plug. The PSU is a treasured part of my C= connection. I took it apart and scrubbed it with a toothbrush and considered retr0briting it then decided that was ridiculous. When I posted on a C= board about finding a good connector there wasn't any useful info posted, hence my inclination (but reservations as well) to debauch a working ribbed C64 unit. Would be nice to get a seller to open a broken C64 unit (nobody would try to sell it anyway, but they advertise "untested" ones) and *carefully* remove the cord. Heh - if I tell anybody I want a cord, they'll just take some snips and cut off the moulded strain relief; I want them to go "cave man" on the epoxy box and then remove the cord with kid gloves!! Would end up paying shipping on the epoxy part in reality. As for all those other prices, well, that's what you get with epay. That's why I haven't bought anything on there for a long time. Yeah, for stuff like that you're going to pay an extreme fortune. Ebay is (generally) for people who just don't want to wait at all and are willing to pay a premium. Especially for retro-computing stuff lately, I've noticed! I'm shocked at many of the prices that people are asking on BIN-bay! I don't understand how they can afford to keep paying for the listing for things that are never going to sell. Example: This ST drive mech (that I could probably use) listed as BIN for $186/make offer. 4 offers been refused already. Is he paying to list it? eBay Auction -- Item Number: 200262708080 Seller has lots of retro-computer items like that. Ebay makes no money on listed things that do not sell - why? Edited March 31, 2010 by wood_jl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 Hey, I wasn't complaining! Oh, no, sorry! I wasn't trying to imply that you were complaining or anything... it's just a super-critical bit of info you didn't mention in your post, so I wanted to make sure anyone reading this would understand that. Didn't mean to harp on about this either -- no one needs to replace their stock PS if they don't want to... but the truth needs to be out there, then it's up to each person to decide how to deal with it. There's no right or wrong answer there, if you go into it knowing the risks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyromaniac605 Posted April 15, 2010 Author Share Posted April 15, 2010 (edited) *after 5 failed attempts to fix it still isn't working bump* anyone have a spare working Power supply to sell? Darren Edited April 15, 2010 by Pyromaniac605 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted April 15, 2010 Share Posted April 15, 2010 http://retrobrad.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=536 That's a fairly ancient thread, but he's nearby and you never know, he might still have some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyromaniac605 Posted April 15, 2010 Author Share Posted April 15, 2010 How hard are third party replacements to find? Darren Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted April 15, 2010 Share Posted April 15, 2010 Probably non-existant. I don't know of any devices other than the C-64 and Plus/4 that use both the 5V DV and 9V AC which it's PSU has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyromaniac605 Posted April 15, 2010 Author Share Posted April 15, 2010 Damn. Just have to stalk eBay then. Darren Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMR Posted April 16, 2010 Share Posted April 16, 2010 i've never tried it myself so can't vouch for this directly but i've read about people tower mounting C64 and C128 machines and "persuading" them to use the AT/ATX PSU to drive the machine. A quick Google found this but people who know hardware should probably read it and comment because i haven't got a clue. =-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted April 16, 2010 Share Posted April 16, 2010 I wonder why the CIA Timer needs that extra work... does it rely on the 9V AC phase timing to provide it's input ticks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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