Atari 5200, why do you like it?

[Cebus Capucinis]

Hey! My blow-up doll is the Antonio Banderas Blow-up Love Doll! No wonder my butt hurts!!!! Good call!

[tyranthraxus]

Its a love/hate system. Compared to other consoles of the same era the thing feels like more of a quality product. Good plastic, very sturdy build and the design is really sleek. The games are of above average quality. Almost all of the common games (and the rares) are really fun, with some of the best home ports of the time. The trackball is a great (if under utilized) controller and its pretty cool using analog joysticks on a machine of this age. I had a four port with the funky TV interface that has its own disadvantages but I like it and consider it to another sign that Atari was trying something different with the 5200. And if you are collecting all the Atari systems, it sitting next to a 2600jr and 7800 looks pretty great!

 

But the system has a lot of marks against it. Most of the games are available on other Atari systems & has few unique titles. The console itself is very large (and the cartridges are likewise over-sized), which is something that matters to an apartment dweller like myself. The controllers you can get used it but they constantly break down and you need to spend a fair bit of money upgrading them.

 

5200 vs 800, it comes down to whether you prefer a vintage console or a computer. The 800 has pretty much all the games and more on cartridge, like key titles like Donkey Kong (arguably the best home version). Ultimately I chose the 800 over the 5200 but have no regrets over getting it. Its a really unique classic console which stands apart from the others and while you can't recover shipping costs, the system holds its value, especially if you have good joysticks with it so you can always sell it. Give it a try!

[Mirage]

nm

[DracIsBack]

Excuse me? It's pretty clear that what I'm expressing is exactly that -- my opinion.

 

You are correct in that I did hone in on that. Just finished watching a bunch of people on a different forum tearing each other a new one and it all stemmed from people essentially forgetting common nettiquette and saying "IMO". I shouldn't have singled you out. The ugly blood bath I just witnessed made me a little more hyper-vigilant to it.

 

Peace.

Edited April 11, 2010 by DracIsBack

[DracIsBack]

I think that's more of an Internet endemic rather than something specific to AtariAge. I know I catch it once in a while and caught it in this thread for a bit!

 

True dat. Sadly, number one cause of flame wars in forums.

 

It's amazing what a difference an "I didn't like", "I felt", "in my opinion" makes at quelling the flames that otherwise get stirred by "everything on this system sucks", "there's no reason to own this system" statements viewed by people who don't share the opinion.

Edited April 11, 2010 by DracIsBack

[Mirage]

Excuse me? It's pretty clear that what I'm expressing is exactly that -- my opinion.

 

You are correct in that I did hone in on that. Just finished watching a bunch of people on a different forum tearing each other a new one and it all stemmed from people essentially forgetting common nettiquette and saying "IMO". I shouldn't have singled you out. The ugly blood bath I just witnessed made me a little more hyper-vigilant to it.

 

Peace.

 

Okay, sorry for coming back at ya so hard too, you're alright.

 

I sort of feel differently about the whole "IMO" thing, at least in theory. It seems to me that what is opinion and what is fact should be obvious without having to always say "IMO" or similar. Or maybe we need to post opinions in white (background color LOL) and facts in bold red. BUT, I sometimes say "IMO" myself if I'm not sure how it will be taken. And I totally agree with you that very often, some more IMO's here and there would diffuse situations. On the other other hand, the people that get into those ugly blood baths usually would still argue and bicker no matter how many qualifiers and hedges you add to an opinion!

 

It's often the usual suspects getting into flamewars. I'm sure we all know who some of them are. Some people just like to argue even if they don't know what they're arguing about.

 

All someone has to do is simply offer another thought... for example, in this case, what are some other great characteristics of the 5200 make it worth having that have not yet been mentioned? I'm sure there are some more. Some homebrews or games that I or others didn't think of perhaps. That's how opinions are molded and morphed, not by people yelling insults back and forth at each other, as much of an internet tradition as that may be!

[Cebus Capucinis]

Bah, as jetset said we all need to stop taking the internet so seriously. I know I am guilty of it from time to time (in this thread even!).

[Mirage]

Yeah, me too. I don't usually, but I do get sucked in sometimes.

 

Hey, original poster (Dastari Creel)... if you're not totally confused or put off by this whole discussion, be sure to let us know what you decide, and if you get one, how it turns out! Back when I used to look on CraigsList all the time, I would see 5200 setups for sale occasionally. Sometimes even reasonably priced!

[VectorGamer]

 

I sort of feel differently about the whole "IMO" thing, at least in theory. It seems to me that what is opinion and what is fact should be obvious without having to always say "IMO" or similar.

 

These are messages board so I stopped saying IMO or IMHO because it would be redundant to do so...

[Mirage]

 

I sort of feel differently about the whole "IMO" thing, at least in theory. It seems to me that what is opinion and what is fact should be obvious without having to always say "IMO" or similar.

 

These are messages board so I stopped saying IMO or IMHO because it would be redundant to do so...

 

Exactly. If someone can't deduce what is an opinion and what is not, they probably haven't had their internet training wheels taken off yet and should peddle on back home.

[Videogamecollector123]

I have one because I just wanted to get the original three Atari home systems(aka Jaguar not included, might get one one of these days). I first heard about it through the AVGN's review which was really harsh on the system and marred my opinion on it until I was able to play one at midwestern gaming classics in 09. The game on display was pacman and the second I tried it all that stuff about the controllers being non-responsive was thrown out the window(I realize their not recentering but most people complain about them for games like Pac-Man and they actually work fairly well for it.) Decided to buy one later that month, and am still happy with it. I paid about 140 dollars for a lot from OldJD's ebay store, got 20 games all with overlays and most with instructions, two rebuilt controllers, trackball controller, and a fairly good condition four-port system. It's not the cheapest system to acquire, but the games are fairly cheap, I got the excellent Berzerk port for about 8 bucks complete. I haven't gotten into older computers yet so I can't really talk about the overlap with the A800. Rebuilt controllers are a necessity though as they will last much much longer then original ones. My one real complete is no end labels on the games, I'm tight on space right now for Atari games so I have to stack them all vertically. Meaning that whenever I want to get a new game I have to go through a stack of 22 games looking for it. I haven't gotten to many other games for it because there are really no more that interest me. Okay sorry for the long ramble but final thing, favorite games for the 5200

Robotron 2084, Qix, Pengo, Pac-Man

[+wood_jl]

I've "dissed" on the 5200 before in relation to the 8-bit computer. However, I still want one, just not super-badly.

 

It's been years and years since I played one, but I seem to remember that the analog control (when the piece of s**t controller WORKS that is) was cool in "Star Raiders" because you could "whip around" quickly when changing directions. When "warping into" a new sector right into the dogfight, you could whip around and face the enemy more quickly than the digital joystick allows for on the computers. Thus you could use your momentum and cruise to the enemy more quickly, and using less energy in the process (which can mean a higher score). It doesn't make the game, but it was nice.

 

As previously mentioned, Adventure II looks great, but I never played it. I have to wonder why it wasn't released for the computers. I'm guessing the maker figured it would be easily pirated like everything else on the computers.

 

The stuff Mirage talks about also sounds good.

 

But since the 5200 versions of the games have pretty much been ported to the computers, there's not a whole lot of reasons....very few, actually. And add in the tremendous expense of fixing those controllers and there's even less incentive. But I still want one. It's an Atari. I want it.

[ledzep]

I basically asked the same thing on the 8-bit computer board so I guess for completeness I should ask here. I grew up with a 2600 and now I own a 7800 that I got with 24 games for $40. The 7800 lets me have the 2600 nostalgia along with some new games I never played before.

 

I know nothing of the 5200. I was aware of it when I was little but never knew anyone who owned one. Since then I've heard that it was a flop but the only reason I've read for that is that the joystick sucked. Is that the only reason? Why do 5200 fans love it so and what are the best games?

 

Basically I'm trying to determine if its worth me getting one.

 

For me it's mostly nostalgia. Meaning that Atari is my favorite game system/company from when I was young, both for the home systems and their fantastic arcade games, so I'm loyal to them. When I was a kid we had the 2600, my friend had the 5200 (and Intellivision). So we were pretty well covered (another friend had a Vectrex). I grew up with Atari, loved their games, loved their systems. On the other hand I became interested in other things by the time the 7800 came out so, so far, I have no interest in getting that system. I did buy a Jaguar and some games but I'm not really interested in that anymore, either, because that came even later. Childhood memories are very powerful.

 

The controller buttons are an issue. Annoying but not a deal-breaker. The analog joysticks are, to me, fantastic, except for the rare games that truly need a digital controller. And the trackball is perfect. I like the keypad idea, I wish more games took advantage of it.

 

There is something to be said for old, slow, simple game systems in comparison to new ones like XBox and Playstation games. Back then, graphics were poor, sound was bad, speed was crap, memory was low. So programmers had to be really clever to make a game playable, not just pretty. And almost all Atari games (especially 2600 games) fall in to that category. I feel that the 5200 beats the Atari 800 computer because of the controllers, they just feel more dedicated. I know that probably sounds nuts to people who blame the analog sticks for all the ills in Ataridom. I just wish they'd released paddles back then. So what, I have two now.

 

And I've never cared for adapters. In my view, just buy the other system. Again, for the nostalgia but also for the collector factor. Why else would the new Flashback 2+ be made to look close to an original Atari 2600? If nostalgia didn't matter then that thing could be shaped like a black sphere with two controller ports and be done with it, right? But people like the original design. Same goes for the 5200 for me. I love that black spaceship wedge look. I always try to buy the complete game, boxed, with overlays (unless it's a homebrew or something that didn't come that way) when I can. But I'm not a completist, I don't need Kangaroo or Pac-Man because I don't like those games. I do wish the 5200 had more games available. Hopefully the homebrew community will fix that.

 

But your question is basically the same as asking why do Mopar fans like Darts or why do fans of a specific band like demo versions of known songs. In both examples, the common thought should be that those are sort of inferior products but fans are fans because they're fans (yes, obvious) so they have reasons for liking some things that on paper might not be really worth it. I love my 5200, I paid to have it converted to RCA outputs, I paid for 2 paddle controllers, I paid a lot of money for a boxed Adventure II game. I still own my old Atari 800 computer and all the stuff that went with it (lots of Compute! books). I just like them too much to get rid of. Why else would I have multiple arcade cabinets in my house?

[Mirage]

 

But your question is basically the same as asking why do Mopar fans like Darts or why do fans of a specific band like demo versions of known songs. In both examples, the common thought should be that those are sort of inferior products but fans are fans because they're fans (yes, obvious) so they have reasons for liking some things that on paper might not be really worth it.

 

<OT>

Totally OT, but why exactly are Darts inferior? With a 340, 383, 440 or 426 Hemi (yes, factory), they (and their re-bodied A-body brother the Barracuda) kicked just about everything's butt on the street and on the strip in their day. They're sort of legendary, actually. Most of the muscle cars were just grocery-getters with badass drivetrains... that was the entire point... they were affordable cars that were modified at the factory for high-performance. Sure, to most people the Barracuda looked "better", but the Dart still had style of it's own and ruled the streets just as much. I guess it's sort of like the 5200... some may not like it today just because it doesn't appeal to them... it doesn't get as much respect as some other cars or systems sometimes -- that's fine -- but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with it. Darts actually do have quite a huge following even outside of Mopar circles, and the people who do like the 5200 seem to really love them. To each their own. [Disclaimer: Yes, I'm a '70 Dart Swinger 340 owner LOL ].

</OT>

[kool kitty89]

Electrictroy is that you?

The controllers (faulty buttons more than the analog sticks), bulky size, cost, and lack of 2600 (or 400/800) compatibility are only some contributors to the 5200's problems.

 

Electrictroy is that you?

Hmm, I don't know who that is...

 

Anyway, I wasn't trying to directly rag on the machine, just trying to explain a few of the things he commented on (like why it was discontinued and reasons it was/is considered a *failure*). I don't hate the system, I think it could have been handled better, but as I mentioned in my previous post, I don't think the hardware was doomed on its own, and had it stayed longer, most of the shortcomings might have been corrected. The underlying problems at Atari (which relate to some of the consoles flaws to begin with) led to the crash (with help from CBM) which resulted in the death of the system.

 

It's certainly an interesting system and a shame it didn't stick around to show its full potential. (which is a lot more than what it did shown by the later A8 games -albeit some wouldn't have been possible with only 16 kB of RAM)

 

I liked it because up until the point it was relseased, it was simply the best console available in terms of graphics, gameplay, and having an "at home" arcade experience.

Huh? That doesn't make sense... how could it be the most advanced up until its release? (and the A8 computers were also arcades at home... and cheaper too in some cases --A400 dropped below $200 with some rebate offers by late '82)

 

Contrary to popular (lack of gaming skills) belief, the controllers were not all that bad. In fact, they were way ahead of their time in design and usability. Unfortunately, the fire buttons were prone to wearing out and required a repair/replacement often.

Yes, but the usefulness of the analog controller (especially in the form that it was) was rather limited when the majority of games were meant for 4/8-way control, same thing with the IV's 16-way disc: control was slightly weaker than a 4-switch joystick at best, and hugely detrimental at worst. Not solely due to the analogality of the controller, but the long throw and lack of self centering.

The Vectrex pulled off a nce, short throw, springy analog joystick/thumbstic, and Atari had a prototype with similar stick (though still flawed buttons) with compact, springy pot module completed before Warner dumped A.Inc.

 

The usability as dual controllers and with a trackball say rather little about the controllers themselves, just the general form factor (if that) and peripherals. A 2-stick controller (or peripheral for holding 2 sticks) for the VCS or A8 should have been pretty simple... (I'm sure some people made simple home rigs for that too -just a bit of wood and you can make a frame to hold 2 CX-10 or 40s)

 

---Again, these comments don't mean I don't like the system or am biased toward the A8 for that matter (VCS is the only one I even own), just commenting on the topic.

 

For the record I would certainly not refuse to play a 5200 if a friend had one, I'm sure there's plenty of fun to be had. (unless the controllers are totally trashed -but that applies to a lot of other systems too)

Edited April 12, 2010 by kool kitty89

[+Mitch]

The usability as dual controllers and with a trackball say rather little about the controllers themselves, just the general form factor (if that) and peripherals. A 2-stick controller (or peripheral for holding 2 sticks) for the VCS or A8 should have been pretty simple... (I'm sure some people made simple home rigs for that too -just a bit of wood and you can make a frame to hold 2 CX-10 or 40s)

 

There was a CX-40 two joystick holder made by Atari and included with the original run of A8 Robotron. I do not own one but I've heard it works fairly well.

 

Mitch

[ledzep]

<OT>

Totally OT, but why exactly are Darts inferior? With a 340, 383, 440 or 426 Hemi (yes, factory), they (and their re-bodied A-body brother the Barracuda) kicked just about everything's butt on the street and on the strip in their day. They're sort of legendary, actually. Most of the muscle cars were just grocery-getters with badass drivetrains... that was the entire point... they were affordable cars that were modified at the factory for high-performance. Sure, to most people the Barracuda looked "better", but the Dart still had style of it's own and ruled the streets just as much. I guess it's sort of like the 5200... some may not like it today just because it doesn't appeal to them... it doesn't get as much respect as some other cars or systems sometimes -- that's fine -- but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with it. Darts actually do have quite a huge following even outside of Mopar circles, and the people who do like the 5200 seem to really love them. To each their own. [Disclaimer: Yes, I'm a '70 Dart Swinger 340 owner LOL ].

</OT>

 

Hahaaha, there you go, you've just proven my point. Hey, I like Darts. A lot, especially the little '68s that look like mini-Road Runners. But Chrysler made new (horrible looking) Chargers and (beautiful) Challengers for a reason, because they're more popular (and if Plymouth still existed a 'Cuda would be for sale, too) and recognizable. But you are a Dart owner and fan so to you it's obvious why Darts are cool. Same with the 5200. The Atari 800 computer should be good enough for every 5200 owner, it has more games, it can be programmed, has more standardized controllers, etc. Yet they (ok, we) love the 5200 to the point that many like it more than the Atari 800 which is practically the same damn thing. And Darts are practically Barracudas and ancestors of the E-bodies so aren't they all the same? To their fans they're better, to their non-fans, not really. It's hard to describe, easy to experience. Me personally, I prefer the 5200 controllers and have a thing for game carts but I love the Atari 800 because it's an actual computer. And my favorite car is a '71 R/T Challenger (like you couldn't tell from the beginning of my answer, right?).

 

Why don't I like the Colecovision or the Odyssey2? I don't know. Why don't I care about the 7800? Don't know. I never grew up with them, never got into their style or their game libraries, never played them. I did grow up with the 2600 and the 5200 so I like both of them a lot even though some games on the 2600 look like refried dogshit. Some are so bad that I can't tell what I'm looking at even when the name claims to be a familiar arcade game. But I still love that system. So it's not easy explaining why I love the 5200 so much to someone who never owned one. I hope the original poster buys one and sees in it what I see because it's something I recommend. I'm sure that if my parents had bought a Fairchild Channel F instead of a 2600 then I'd probably think that that miserable little machine was fantastic. What do I know, I want to buy a couple Girders & Panels sets because I had those as a kid, too. I must hate money.

[kool kitty89]

There was a CX-40 two joystick holder made by Atari and included with the original run of A8 Robotron. I do not own one but I've heard it works fairly well.

 

Mitch

 

 

Do you know what it was called? I see articles and pictures mentioning the 5200 joystick coupler, but that's it...

Edited April 12, 2010 by kool kitty89

[hhwolfman]

There was a CX-40 two joystick holder made by Atari and included with the original run of A8 Robotron. I do not own one but I've heard it works fairly well.

 

Mitch

 

 

Do you know what it was called? I see articles and pictures mentioning the 5200 joystick coupler, but that's it...

 

http://www.atariage.com/box_page.html?SystemID=5200&SoftwareID=2103&BoxStyleID=65&ItemTypeID=BOX

[atariksi]

Bah, as jetset said we all need to stop taking the internet so seriously. I know I am guilty of it from time to time (in this thread even!).

 

So we should treat everything you write as a joke or meaningless rubbish? Internet can be used for serious and nonserious uses.

 

Back to topic, A5200 does have plug-n-play cartridges and is faster to swap games. So you can train a 5-year old to swap cartridges.

[Cebus Capucinis]

So we should treat everything you write as a joke or meaningless rubbish?

 

I was under the impression that most everyone on this website did that already!

[+Mitch]

There was a CX-40 two joystick holder made by Atari and included with the original run of A8 Robotron. I do not own one but I've heard it works fairly well.

 

Mitch

Do you know what it was called? I see articles and pictures mentioning the 5200 joystick coupler, but that's it...

 

There's one on ebay right now. Here's a pic:

Now I'm thinking about bidding on it.

 

Mitch

[Christophero Sly]

There was a CX-40 two joystick holder made by Atari and included with the original run of A8 Robotron. I do not own one but I've heard it works fairly well.

 

Mitch

Do you know what it was called? I see articles and pictures mentioning the 5200 joystick coupler, but that's it...

 

There's one on ebay right now. Here's a pic:

Now I'm thinking about bidding on it.

 

Mitch

Neat. I never knew this existed. First time I've seen it.

[zylon]

That's still available at Best Electronics. I've been thinking of getting one too.

[+Mitch]

Bah, someone outbid me. I should have kept my mouth shut.

 

Mitch