Anyone knows the DENVER 10" LED TV?

[Marius]

I have bought this little LED TV for my Atari, to use when I'm not at home... it's a nice small television, and has "zillions" of input sources. Great...

 

http://www.denver-electronics.com/denver-led-1030dvbt/

 

Image is rather good.... at least good enough for my purpouse.

 

But now it comes. I have the feeling there is a little flaw in the firmware of this TV.

 

The sound has some kind of "treshold" ... as soon as there is no (or too little) sound for let's say 3 seconds, the sound is turning off, and goes only on after enough inputsound.

 

Atari KeyClick is not enough sound to go on!! Only when I hold a key, and the keyclicks repeat a lot then after 5 or 6 seconds the sound enables again.

 

This "s*cks" bigtime. In some games there is not so much sound (like crossfire) so this means I have no sound at all.

 

In the settings I found "AVL" enable/disable. So I thought: well let's disable it... but it doesn't change anything.

 

This issue happens on all sources I could try: scart, Coax, AV...

 

I wrote the folks at DENVER Electronics a mail. Perhaps this TV set can be update with newer firmware. I guess it is fixable by firmware. As long as there is sound that lasts long enough, the sound works perfect.

 

If anyone else has a solution: please let me know.

 

Thanks

Marius

[Thorsten Günther]

That TV set seems nearly identical to the Medion MD 83688 (which has the same problem). Both won't show a stable picture on an ST connected via RGB SCART, either.

 

As nice as it looks, this is not a very good TV for retro computing. It is sufficient for XL/XE use, but I'd recommend external speakers due to that irritating "feature".

 

Thorsten

[Marius]

That TV set seems nearly identical to the Medion MD 83688 (which has the same problem). Both won't show a stable picture on an ST connected via RGB SCART, either.

 

As nice as it looks, this is not a very good TV for retro computing. It is sufficient for XL/XE use, but I'd recommend external speakers due to that irritating "feature".

 

Thorsten

 

So you don't expect the folks from Denver to come with a firmware update (I don't even know if it is possible to do a firmware upgrade on this one)

 

The only computer I'm using this TV for is my atari XL/XE, so that's ok. Picture is good enough for my goals. It is not my main display, only for use on vacation and all that.

 

There must be some way to modify this TV so it 'thinks' there is a permanent audio signal.

 

Greetz

M.

 

p.s. when I play the highest tone on the Atari (I can't hear it) the audio gain stays open... so there is hope.

[Marius]

Perhaps there is such a mute detector IC installed in this TV.

 

If yes... it might be possible to bypass that circuit.

 

I have no idea. TV is one day old, I'm not going to open it already ...

 

Greetz

M.

[Marius]

Rather idiot workaround, but ok...

 

I connect only Right Audio Signal from Atari (my Atari is Mono) to TV

The LEFT signal comes from my iPod

 

I play music on my iPod without any pause

 

On TV I turn Balanca 100% to the right channel, so the music out of my iPod does not come out of the TV Speaker. The audio coming in the TV is never zero, and loud enough, so the sound system stays "on" Rather idiot, but ok...

 

I think that when I duplicate the video out plug, and I plug this one in this Left Channel this will also work. Video plug in Audio connector gives a permanent noise.

 

Now it is time for bed... keep you informed.

 

Greetz

M.

[Rybags]

What about if you use a splitter to send Atari audio to both left and right channels?

 

Also, some TVs have a setting called "Blue Mute" or similar - they give a blue-screen instead of static if in Tuner mode and you're not on a channel. Maybe that also affects other inputs.

[Marius]

I already had audio on both channels... It did not help ...

 

Sending the video signal (what is a lot of noise) to one of the audio channels does the trick but I am a bit afraid that will harm the audio circuit

 

I just received an email from fox-1 where his advice is to put at least a resistor between video out (atari) and audio in (tv). I hope that is enough protection.

 

Anyone?

[Rybags]

You could use PC speakers for the Atari instead - still a bit of a pain but typically your cheap PC speakers will be better than the speakers in 95% of TVs.

[Marius]

Today I received first message from Denver.

 

They asked me on which input I connected my computer to the TV.

 

Since every input (Analog TV, Scart, A/V) has the same problem, I could email that in to my reply.

 

I also added in my reply that even an external DVD player has this problem (before they are going to complain this is an Atari issue, non related to the Television)

 

Anyway I'm very interested in their next reply.

 

In the meantime I bought myself a second hand 55CM (21.7") 4:3 CRT Television and I really have to say: a CRT gives a much better image for Atari XL/XE.

 

The LED TV will be only for 'extra' when I'm on vacation. At home ... when I'm programming and all that, I'll use this CRT.

[+Stephen]

Today I received first message from Denver.

 

They asked me on which input I connected my computer to the TV.

 

Since every input (Analog TV, Scart, A/V) has the same problem, I could email that in to my reply.

 

I also added in my reply that even an external DVD player has this problem (before they are going to complain this is an Atari issue, non related to the Television)

 

Anyway I'm very interested in their next reply.

 

In the meantime I bought myself a second hand 55CM (21.7") 4:3 CRT Television and I really have to say: a CRT gives a much better image for Atari XL/XE.

 

The LED TV will be only for 'extra' when I'm on vacation. At home ... when I'm programming and all that, I'll use this CRT.

Definitely agree on the CRT vs. LCD for these older machines. You also have the benefit of being able to use your light pen

[SpicyChronos]

Here is an idea to amplify the output of the Atari, to prevent the mute circuit from kicking in. I remember reading about this a few years back, and never built one, but it looks pretty easy.

 

Here is the link: http://tangentsoft.net/audio/cmoy-tutorial/

 

Maybe something like this would help?

[Marius]

@SpicyChronos

 

Thanks for your contribution. That is an interesting project anyway!

 

Perhaps the sound-system of the TV would open sooner when the input level is higher, but at this moment I found out that the TV has same issues when I'm using an external DVD player

 

As soon as there is no sound, or a very silent scene in a movie, the sound turns off too.

 

I really think this is a flaw in the design of this TV.

 

I now use the solution I described above:

 

1. The TV has an USB port, so I use +5V from that source.

2. I connect a very cheap MP3 player that I don't use anymore to this +5V source

3. I play MP3 files (loud enough) and put that signal into the LEFT channel of the TV

4. I turn balance of tv completely to the right

5. I connect Atari audio to the RIGHT channel of TV.

 

And that's it. It works great. Now I stay very mobile on this setup. Rybags is right: an external speaker would be best in any case, but I don't want that... an extra speaker means: more to carry and to install everytime.

 

Fox-1 also suggested something: why not connect TV-out to audio in, and create a little "no-feedback-circuit" into that. I could do that too.

 

First I'll wait for the response of the Denver people. I'm not sure whether this TV can be updated (Firmware) and I'm also not sure whether this flaw can be fixed by a firmware upgrade.

 

The only thing left to investigate is: will the sound of the TV turn on sooner when the input level of the sound is loud enough. When that is the case, your solution (a pre-amplifier) might be worth a try indeed.

 

Greetz

M.

[Rybags]

Do you have a tape player?

 

You could probably simulate "amplified quietness" by POKE 54018,52 with it connected.

[Marius]

Do you have a tape player?

 

You could probably simulate "amplified quietness" by POKE 54018,52 with it connected.

 

That is not enough sound.

 

This works too:

 

SOUND 0,1,10,10

 

or in Assembly

LDA #$01

STA $D200

LDA #$AA

STA $D201

RTS

 

I can almost not hear that pitch, but it works to open the audio on the TV.

 

But as soon as you start a game, the tone is gone... and the problem is there again.

 

It's rather stupid issue.

Greetz

M.

[Fox-1 / mnx]

Here is an idea to amplify the output of the Atari,

 

As with most pre-amps, it's Op-Amp based, requiring a symmetric power supply, which is probably not at hand in that situation. It may be the TV has one, internally, but this would mean he has to open it and tap it from there, which is not what he's after.

 

Another solution is to use a DC-DC converter for the Op-Amp to create a symmetric power (like Candle's I/O board does IIRC) but this may introduce some nasty side-effects which you'll have to take care of also.

[Marius]

Yesterday I got another reply from the Denver people. They wrote me that they sent my "problem" to the factory. They also wrote that the factory promised to get back with a solution.

 

I hope this TV has a firmware upgrade setup function. I did not see it anywhere in the menu, but perhaps it is some startup-key-combination. It has a USB, CF and SD port.

 

When I know more, I'll let you all know.

 

Greetz

M.

[Marius]

A few weeks ago I got an email from Denver Electronics. They were able to do a firmware upgrade. Unfortunately I could not do it myself. I had to send the TV to them (Denmark) and they'll update the firmware for me.

 

The paid shipping costs to me. I only had to send it on my own costs to them.

 

Well... that was interesting.

 

Today I received it back, and guess what?

 

It works!

 

No sound issues anymore. Great service from Denver Electronics. Really... I would never expect to see my Television back so fast, and with the issue 100% solved.

 

Yes. I think it is a nice TV for my Atari 8bit. The screen output is decent enough. When you look very close it is not 100% steady (there is some interlacing look a like going on) but when I'm behind my Atari, it is perfect.

 

Even fast scrolling games (like dropzone) look decent on it (ok a CRT gives a better perfomance on that kind of games), but overall it is a good screen for a very decent price.

 

+1 for Denver Electronics Service.

 

Greetz

M.

[+orpheuswaking]

Awesome... That's great to hear