Alien vs Predator - overrated?

[PFG 9000]

If anything, I think Alien Vs. Predator is UNDERrated. So many gamers today have never even heard of the Jag version, but it was so far ahead of its time that it deserves all the praise it can get. Back in the day I saw some early screenshots of the game (in the October 1993 issue of GamePro, for the record), and I was absolutely floored by them. Digitized graphics were still pretty uncommon back then, and completely unheard of at the resolution in AvP. The game just looked amazing. I didn't actually get to play it until several years later, about 1997. Even then, the game felt revolutionary. It's important to frame this in the time when it was still fairly new. The so-called Corridor Shooters or Doom Clones were just starting to come out, and they were still a fairly innovative concept. Jag AvP played very differently from the bulk of them. The entire thing was one big level, and the game was therefore completely non-linear. You couldn't muscle your way through a herd of aliens. You had to run away or come back with superior firepower. And the enemy locations were somewhat randomized, which was completely unheard of at the time, and still very rare in FPSes today.

 

It's sort of like Metroid Prime. When that game came out, it was so different from other FPSes because it's not a First Person Shooter. It might look like one in screenshots, but it's really a First Person Adventure. AvP is exactly the same way, right down to the open-world gameplay, exploration, and character building.

[PFG 9000]

Yes but did you figure out where things were on your own or using tips or cheats from magazines or players guides etc? Personally I think it is a flaw in a game if you have to resort to getting help to progress through a game, that means the game is too hard in my eyes. My favorite games ever were games I could just play and eventually beat without getting too frustrated because the game was too hard or confusing. I have a feeling almost anyone who has beat avp at one time or another resorted to cheats or tips or some kind of help. To beat AVP all on your own, marine scenario, extemely difficult. you must have the patience of a saint.

I have to disagree with you too. I played through all three campaigns without any sort of cheating. I mapped out each level as the Marine, which I played through first. I found all the keys and weapons on my own. If you're finding it too hard, you're probably playing it wrong. Like I touched on in my last post, it's not meant to be played like Doom. I don't think it's all that unreasonable to expect players to map out their own levels, if you consider when the game came out. The automap feature helps quite a bit. I had to map out other games back in the day, like the first couple Metroid games. Of course, that was back when I had time to really get into those games. But I don't think I invested more than 10-15 hrs into my first Marine playthrough. And once you have your maps drawn up, the Predator and Alien campaigns are almost a breeze.

 

No, in late AvP PC games there are some Alien/Predator hybrids, Cyber Aliens etc. Rebellion could add more human characters (like officers? Civilians?). The same problem had Gloom on Amiga.

Those games came out long after AvP on the Jag. They went a bit into the extended AvP lore from the comics with the Predaliens, Praetorians, and other hybrid-type enemies. The Jag version is based solely on the enemies featured in the films (not including the aliens described in the computer files, which didn't actually appear in the gameplay). I think it's a much more authentic experience for that reason. The games that took their own liberties with the creatures seemed like a spin-off from the movies and less "canon" as a result.

Edited April 7, 2012 by PFG 9000

[JagChris]

The game is not too hard. I beat all 3 without any cheats. Half the fun was mapping everything out. And it wasn't that hard.

[JagChris]

I cant believe people think the game is all that hard. No way is it too hard. It was fun ride. Fun scary ride.

[potatohead]

Yeah, it is a great game. The technology issues are a separate thing, IMHO.

 

Here's a great analogy to help understand why this title stands out like it does. Consider the text adventure. The basic mechanic for most of them was a turn based game engine, with various tricks on parsing differentiating good titles from poor ones, right along with the "level design" and clarity of scenario presentation.

 

A few of them were real time. Whole different ball game there. At first glance, a text adventure was a text adventure, with some "harder" than others, etc... A deeper look at the real time ones revealed simple text SIMULATION, where the entire state of things is evaluated in real time, resulting in very different challenges to the player.

 

That's what AvP did for 3D, that a whole lot of other titles, however more sexy, do not.

[ZylonBane]

The game is not too hard. I beat all 3 without any cheats. Half the fun was mapping everything out. And it wasn't that hard.

I cant believe people think the game is all that hard. No way is it too hard. It was fun ride. Fun scary ride.

 

I think Chris is trying to say that he thinks AvP is too hard.

[mancity]

The game is not too hard. I beat all 3 without any cheats. Half the fun was mapping everything out. And it wasn't that hard.

I cant believe people think the game is all that hard. No way is it too hard. It was fun ride. Fun scary ride.

 

I think Chris is trying to say that he thinks AvP is too hard.

 

Haha I think your right!

[Master Phruby]

What I think is scary is the price on ebay for this thing. WTF?

[Austin]

What I think is scary is the price on ebay for this thing. WTF?

 

It's nothing compared to other Jag games. Considering the praise this game gets and the theoretical enjoyment certain gamers are likely to get out of it, something along the lines of $50 isn't totally unreasonable for this game (CIB of course).

[Master Phruby]

I had the game when I first owned a Jaguar. I remember I didn't play it very much probably due to the time it took to run the maze. It felt a little boring to me. Anyway, my son is really into shooters and I want to find something that will get him to play my new Jaguar. $50 is too much for me to spend on a game he may or may not jump on. $20 at the most sounds better to me. I just wish the emulator worked better so I could test it out on him.

[ZylonBane]

Anyway, my son is really into shooters and I want to find something that will get him to play my new Jaguar.

 

If he's really into shooters, he'll probably hate AvP's slow pace. Get Doom instead.

[im_reg]

Anyway, my son is really into shooters and I want to find something that will get him to play my new Jaguar.

 

If he's really into shooters, he'll probably hate AvP's slow pace. Get Doom instead.

Get him to play AvP in a dark room and turn the sound up. He'll be jumping out his skin.

[ZylonBane]

Get him to play AvP in a dark room and turn the sound up. He'll be jumping out his skin.

 

You're not getting the "really into shooters" stipulation, are you? Yes, AvP makes an effective survival horror game. That's not relevant here.

[Master Phruby]

So AVP should be considered one of the first survival horror games?

[sh3-rg]

survival terror?

[Amstari]

I now have the Motion Tracker! Once you have this the game gets even better.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Amstari

[VladR]

Get him to play AvP in a dark room and turn the sound up. He'll be jumping out his skin.

Well, that happens only with the 15-years-old PC version of AVP, since the Aliens can jump from the opposite wall directly to your face. Or the facehuggers stop making any sound which is usually a split-second away from jumping at your face. Both features give you a nice dose of adrenaline :-)

 

But the Jag version is a different game at a totally different pace (just the setting stays).

 

On an unrelated note, yesterday I watched Alien 3 on IFC. I totally freaked out when I realized that Alien 3 is 20 yrs old (1992 !!!).

[Lynxpro]

 

 

On an unrelated note, yesterday I watched Alien 3 on IFC. I totally freaked out when I realized that Alien 3 is 20 yrs old (1992 !!!).

 

 

Did they ever re-cut the film for the DVD/Blu-ray release? I know Paul McGann had most of his role cut out from the theatrical cut... Fox really seemed to enjoy screwing him over... first by whittling his role down to next-to-nothing in that film and then punking him through the Doctor Who tv movie that they scheduled up against ratings powerhouse Roseanne. End result...near total obscurity in the US except for us Whovians...

[Godzilla]

man jag avp, still to this day, does things I have never seen any other ftps do. The atmosphere, the way it forces the player to actually do some role-playing to figure out how to survive. The game has palpable fear in ways I've never felt in any game before or since. I beat all the campaigns but the Marine is still my favorite. Such a great game. I agree, not nearly over-rated enough.

[Hyper_Eye]

I personally am not to big a fan, its fun but not engaging enough to keep me playing for a very long time. Its a shame I can't save and pick up my progress later as that would greatly increase how much I enjoy it. As is its just collecting dust, been thinking of parting with it.

 

You can save your game! See this section of the manual: http://www.atariage.com/manual_page.html?SystemID=JAGUAR&SoftwareLabelID=1060&ItemTypeID=&currentPage=6&maxPages=33

 

This game impacted my perception of 3D games. I would call it what it is, a SIMULATION type game, not a run 'n shoot or death match. As a SIMULATION, the overall feel of the game is spot on. If one is expecting the far more common "3D on rails" experience, then this game will be very frustrating. Try thinking of it as a sim and see whether or not that doesn't help some. I think it actually says that somewhere. Can't remember now, but I'm sure I saw it in the docs, title screen, somewhere...

 

The game is described as a tactical simulator in the manual: http://www.atariage.com/manual_page.html?SystemID=JAGUAR&SoftwareLabelID=1060&ItemTypeID=&currentPage=4&maxPages=33

 

Also, the section on saving is titled "Saving and Restoring Simulations".

[ZylonBane]

man jag avp, still to this day, does things I have never seen any other ftps do.

I guess you've never played either System Shock game then.

[+poobah]

man jag avp, still to this day, does things I have never seen any other ftps do.

I guess you've never played either System Shock game then.

 

System Shock was *amazing*. One of my favorite games of all time

[Godzilla]

zylon: still own and played both back in the day. Both great games with some similar play elements, but I still stand by my previous statement. How are you? Good to see you again

[akator]

Alien vs Predator - overrated?

 

In the early 90s it was only slightly overrated. I can't recall a single bad review of it back then, which raised my expectations too high. It was the first Jag game I played, and while I liked it, I didn't think it was the 100%-perfect-most-amazing-thing-ever-created-in-the-history-of-gaming. The coolest thing about it was the concept, playing as either the protagonists or antagonists from the movies, so I figured that was why people raved about it so much -- and I agreed, it was awesome. Not perfect, but pretty damn good.

 

It definitely deserves a place in gaming history. That said, I have no desire to play it today. I don't believe that AVP is in my top 5 FPS titles of the 20th century. Over the last few years I have replayed and enjoyed Battlezone, Star Wars (arcade), Wolfenstein 3D, Doom, Marathon, Descent, and Duke Nukem multiple times -- yet I have only replayed AVP once since 2005 and am not interested in picking it up again in the foreseeable future. To me that means it is currently overrated.

[ZylonBane]

zylon: still own and played both back in the day. Both great games with some similar play elements, but I still stand by my previous statement.

 

They're extraordinarily similar. Both games have you waking up from cryogenic suspension in a gigantic space station (or spaceship for SS2), to find the entire crew slaughtered by creatures running rampant, and with no idea what's happened. They feature an open design that allows you to freely roam the entire game world (conveniently divided into decks), scavenging supplies from the fallen, with progress constrained by finding access codes and/or the equipment required to survive in certain areas. They dole out narrative in the form of computer logs left behind by the crew, forcing you to mentally reconstruct the chain of events leading up the current situation. The mood of both games is one of utter isolation. The combat in both is relatively slow-paced, almost strategic, with very limited ammo supplies. They both have respawning enemies, making it impossible to permanently clear out any areas and thus forcing the player to always be on guard. They even both have a thrilling self-destruct sequence.

 

About the only thing AvP has that System Shock doesn't is the "play as any race" angle. AvP could have also had three-way battles between the humans, Aliens, and Predators, but as implemented the Predators were just another enemy-- they don't even attack Aliens standing right next to them. Unfortunate.