Crazy Climber Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 So prototypes that were advertised like the Pink Panther game is considered vaporware, right? Pink Panther is real So are games considered vaporware never actually made into a cartridge? Its my understanding Vaporware is a game that was announced and work was started but then cancelled for whatever reason never to see the light of day. Pink Panther was completed and exsists Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Random Terrain Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Anyone will be able to submit information, but there will be a select number of people who can approve the changes (as well as edit existing information in the database). Does that mean batari Basic will also be getting its own AtariAge wiki thingy that AA members will be able to edit with a select number of people who can approve the changes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 That sounds great! Now just as a random example, what if someone proposes adding a game called "Red Sea Crossing", who would approve of that? Anyone with the authority to do so, which would include me and others I trust to make database edits. ..al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Whilst romhunter adds cartriges to the Atarimania database even based on advertisments (e.g. Gogo home monster), the AA database has a history of adding only confirmed carts. That's why games like gamma attack and birthday mania were added recently, but not red sea crossing, even though the cart had been found before the AA database upgrade. Almost offending, this one. According to your theories, Birthday Mania should be way more vaporware than Red Sea Crossing, therefore be removed from AA immediately. Since the only evidence we've ever seen of that cart, is a crappy picture and some blurry screenshots. And may I add that titles based on ads added to the Atarimania database are Home Vision titles only and that they each have a footnote on their page stating that its most likely a vaporware title? May I also add that Albert has a lifetime's work to do before all confirmed to exist VCS carts have been added to the nowadays completely outdated and quite inaccurate AA database? Both databases can't be compared anymore, Dino. You, of all people, should know that. No offence intended Rom. You know very well that I love the Atarimania database, I contribute to it and appreciate the time you have spent updating it. The truth is that you do add carts to the database that have not even surfaced (like Gogo Home Monster). Most would not even notice the footnote at the bottom (in fact I have never noticed it myself). Its a difference in timing between when you decide a title should be added and when Albert does. Nagn is asking why Albert won't add the game to his database and I'm providing him with a response. The fact that the AA database is outdated is irrelevant to this point. Albert had the option of adding RSC at the time Bithdaymania and Gamma Attack were added but he chose not to and for good reason. Gamma Attack has had the Rom dumped. Birthday Mania is in the hands of a well known collector and has been analysed by experts and confirmed. Whilst this may not be public knowledge (and it doesn't need to be) the game has been verified and deserves to be in the Atariage database. So the ball is in nagn's court. If he want his game added to the AA database, he needs to firstly do more to prove its authenticity. Until then, I doubt the game will be added by Albert, but at the end of the day that's Albert's call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 (edited) Ok then (sorry, it's too tempting): - Nagn2 discovered an ad in a Christian magazine. - He decided not to mention this to the community, because he wanted to create The Ultimate VCS Hoax. - He found or created a fitting cartridge type for the game. - He self-designed a fitting front label and end label containing not exactly the same, but slightly different info than the info in the ad. - He made up a model number for the game. - He found a way to print the front and end label in the same way as they did back in the eighties. - He made the cart look older with some dust, scratches and end label folds. - He programmed a playable game based on the single screenshot from the ad. - He lied to the community about finding the cart himself. - He eventually wants to fool the whole community after years and years of stalling the ROM dump. Makes perfect sense to me. But still I think I'll keep the game in our database, if you don't mind. Edited May 9, 2012 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nofrills100 Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 lead us not into temptation Rom! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 lead us not into temptation Rom! LOL No, I'm done now. Promised. For me this whole thing is crystal clear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Ok then (sorry, it's too tempting): - Nagn2 discovered an ad in a Christian magazine. - He decided not to mention this to the community, because he wanted to create The Ultimate VCS Hoax. - He found or created a fitting cartridge type for the game. - He self-designed a fitting front label and end label containing not exactly the same, but slightly different info than the info in the ad. - He made up a model number for the game. - He found a way to print the front and end label in the same way as they did back in the eighties. - He made the cart look older with some dust, scratches and end label folds. - He programmed a playable game based on the single screenshot from the ad. - He lied to the community about finding the cart himself. - He eventually wants to fool the whole community after years and years of stalling the ROM dump. Makes perfect sense to me. But still I think I'll keep the game in our database, if you don't mind. Sounds remarkably similar to the steps Krypton would have taken to make his green labelled Guardian cart. For $6.5k (which I believe is nagn's MINIMUM asking price) it doesn't seem unreasonable to put that kind of effort in. i bet cpuwiz could easil have pulled this off. What makes me so suspicious about this whole affair is how nagn's attitude totally changed once mention was made of analysing the rom to confirm it didnt use "modern techniques Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Climber Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Sounds remarkably similar to the steps Krypton would have taken to make his green labelled Guardian cart. I remember that one The one he got from a "friend" lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer4x4 Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Ok then (sorry, it's too tempting): - Nagn2 discovered an ad in a Christian magazine. - He decided not to mention this to the community, because he wanted to create The Ultimate VCS Hoax. - He found or created a fitting cartridge type for the game. - He self-designed a fitting front label and end label containing not exactly the same, but slightly different info than the info in the ad. - He made up a model number for the game. - He found a way to print the front and end label in the same way as they did back in the eighties. - He made the cart look older with some dust, scratches and end label folds. - He programmed a playable game based on the single screenshot from the ad. - He lied to the community about finding the cart himself. - He eventually wants to fool the whole community after years and years of stalling the ROM dump. Makes perfect sense to me. But still I think I'll keep the game in our database, if you don't mind. http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/196425-red-sea-crossing-atariage-database/page__st__50?do=findComment&comment=2501410 Yep, just what I said, it is possible. BUT, all kidding aside, I think it should be archived online of it's existance if only as an unconfirmed/rumor/prototype/garage production. To me, a production release is one that someone could walk into a store and buy, or buy online, from anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Climber Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 To me, a production release is one that someone could walk into a store and buy, or buy online, from anywhere. Well, you would have to remove a TON of games from the database since many 2600 games were borderline garage releases Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxsolo2000 Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 What gets me is the sheer greed of some of these guys who go around toting holy than thou games. If anyone offered me 3 grand for a game I owned I would have snapped his hand right off but now it appears Nagn2 has a minimum figure of 6.5K. I mean Jesus Christ pure greed at its finest. At least the star castle guy had a valid point for asking so much for something he created. Nagn2 just found this suppossed game and is trying to hold the gaming community to ransom over it. Screw him I say for despite what Gordon Ghecko said Greed is not Good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zach Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Where did this 6.5K figure come from? Last time I checked, Nagn2 wanted to auction the cart then changed his mind. Did I overlook something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxsolo2000 Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Dino mentioned it further up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Climber Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Where did this 6.5K figure come from? Last time I checked, Nagn2 wanted to auction the cart then changed his mind. Did I overlook something? I think it was the first time he (nagn2) posted about it. IIRC Wonder offered $6500 for Birthdaymania (kind of a similar example to this I guess) so nagn2 must have figured thats what RSC is worth. I'm not 100% though, just going on memory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer4x4 Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 To me, a production release is one that someone could walk into a store and buy, or buy online, from anywhere. Well, you would have to remove a TON of games from the database since many 2600 games were borderline garage releases In a way, I do think that they should be listed differently, I don't think they should be removed, just noted how they were made available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer4x4 Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 What gets me is the sheer greed of some of these guys who go around toting holy than thou games. If anyone offered me 3 grand for a game I owned I would have snapped his hand right off but now it appears Nagn2 has a minimum figure of 6.5K. I mean Jesus Christ pure greed at its finest. At least the star castle guy had a valid point for asking so much for something he created. Nagn2 just found this suppossed game and is trying to hold the gaming community to ransom over it. Screw him I say for despite what Gordon Ghecko said Greed is not Good! Personally I don't care what price is put on anything that is rare. Its true value is whatever 2 people agree it is, if I don't agree, I don't buy. In a way a high value makes it HARDER to sell/buy. Say I found a 1978 blue widget that no one else has, but several want it. I think COOL, I can make some bucks on this old thing. Then I find out someone will pay a couple thousand dollars, WOW, WAY COOL. So now I wonder, Hmm, how much could I REALLY get if I find the best buyer, then see a 1978 red widget sold for $10,000, surely my blue one is worth that! So I hold out for $11,000 instead of the insulting low price of $2,000 I was offerred before. And for some people, it never ends, they will always wait for a better offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2600 Forever Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Might as well put The Hulk into the database, I am almost done with "finding" the prototype. After that, I think I am going to "discover" James Bond: Octopussy. Get your savings accounts ready. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Where did this 6.5K figure come from? Last time I checked, Nagn2 wanted to auction the cart then changed his mind. Did I overlook something? I think it was the first time he (nagn2) posted about it. IIRC Wonder offered $6500 for Birthdaymania (kind of a similar example to this I guess) so nagn2 must have figured thats what RSC is worth. I'm not 100% though, just going on memory I'm going from memory too (of the original thread, not this one). Nagn had read that Wonder offered $6.5k for Birthday Mania and he was expecting at least that too. I'd have to go back though the dozens of pages to find the original post, which I'm not prepared to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 To me, a production release is one that someone could walk into a store and buy, or buy online, from anywhere. Well, you would have to remove a TON of games from the database since many 2600 games were borderline garage releases In a way, I do think that they should be listed differently, I don't think they should be removed, just noted how they were made available. Well mail order was the internet of the 1980s, so you must include those to be consistent, and kiosk releases sghould be include then, as they were shops you could walk to and buy retail, then there's no much left that shouldn't be included Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss 2600 Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Where did this 6.5K figure come from? Last time I checked, Nagn2 wanted to auction the cart then changed his mind. Did I overlook something? I think it was the first time he (nagn2) posted about it. IIRC Wonder offered $6500 for Birthdaymania (kind of a similar example to this I guess) so nagn2 must have figured thats what RSC is worth. I'm not 100% though, just going on memory I'm going from memory too (of the original thread, not this one). Nagn had read that Wonder offered $6.5k for Birthday Mania and he was expecting at least that too. I'd have to go back though the dozens of pages to find the original post, which I'm not prepared to do. He mentions it in post #364 of this thread (I don't know how to make a link that goes directly to a specific post). It may have been mentioned earlier in the thread as well. http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/113497-help-information-on-red-sea-crossing/page__st__350#entry1376959 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 (I don't know how to make a link that goes directly to a specific post). Click on the post number, which is a link directly to the post. I fixed your link. ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss 2600 Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Thank you, Albert. I'll try to remember next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zach Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 I remember that conversation now. There was no specific asking price from nagn2, but the $6500 Birthday Mania offer was taken into account. I hope nagn2 got the message that the offer had been retracted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
high voltage Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 What gets me is the sheer greed of some of these guys who go around toting holy than thou games. If anyone offered me 3 grand for a game I owned I would have snapped his hand right off but now it appears Nagn2 has a minimum figure of 6.5K. I mean Jesus Christ pure greed at its finest. At least the star castle guy had a valid point for asking so much for something he created. Nagn2 just found this suppossed game and is trying to hold the gaming community to ransom over it. Screw him I say for despite what Gordon Ghecko said Greed is not Good! Personally I don't care what price is put on anything that is rare. Its true value is whatever 2 people agree it is, if I don't agree, I don't buy. In a way a high value makes it HARDER to sell/buy. Say I found a 1978 blue widget that no one else has, but several want it. I think COOL, I can make some bucks on this old thing. Then I find out someone will pay a couple thousand dollars, WOW, WAY COOL. So now I wonder, Hmm, how much could I REALLY get if I find the best buyer, then see a 1978 red widget sold for $10,000, surely my blue one is worth that! So I hold out for $11,000 instead of the insulting low price of $2,000 I was offerred before. And for some people, it never ends, they will always wait for a better offer. Look at those stupid NES tournament carts. Not an official release, but included in every NES database, and people pay stupid amounts of money for them, and they are not even that rare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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