Cartridge Market Crash

[Atari_Bill]

Zero doubt in my mind that the "market" will crash and crash hard. I've been saying this for a while now and I'm perfectly fine with my collection not having monetary value. There is no way I can see future generations having any interest in these. Today's generation has such a short span of attention moving from one technology to the next it's a certainty in my mind.

[Keatah]

Zero doubt in my mind that the "market" will crash and crash hard. I've been saying this for a while now and I'm perfectly fine with my collection not having monetary value. There is no way I can see future generations having any interest in these. Today's generation has such a short span of attention moving from one technology to the next it's a certainty in my mind.

 

Why do we have such a short attention span with technology? Is it marketing forces at work? It didn't used to be that way..

[CatPix]

Leaking cap should be the LEAST of our worries... They are easy to replace, find, and cost nothing.

 

I already saw caps kits sold for GG consoles. But even if I had one I wouldn't buy one. Why?

Those kits were sold for awfully expensive. Pricing the caps at more than 60cts each, where they cost about 5 to 10 cts in most online shops.

This formula can't work. Any people with knowledge in electonics will buy the caps him or herself.

One not knowing anything will nevr dare to open his system.

 

Yet a database of all chemical caps in a system will be much more valuable, this is a good idea.

And a little list of common failures ( PSU failure, RAM failure) would be handy as well.

[Keatah]

Included in the database should be the system cap's value and specs, location designation (c24 for example), axial or radial, and perhaps optionally some part numbers from popular parts shops like mouser or digi-key.

 

As an engineer I probably wouldn't buy cap kits. I want to ensure I'm getting a quality name brand part. And in some instances (rare) I might up the spec.

[CatPix]

Especially since most chemical caps now have dry equivalents in ceramic, plastic or tantalum versions, it's worth putting up more money and ending with everlasting caps.

 

And it's no exageration. I have 80 years old radios with original dry caps working like new (considering the wider tolerance of the era of course).

[glazball]

I have to disagree with the majority of you saying the market will crash. Though I personally wish that would be the case (allowing all of us to own and play games we want), we're seeing the exact opposite. Perhaps the market for 2600 carts is pretty stable, but generally EVERYTHING video game related (and especially Nintendo/Mario) is going up, up, up. Even in 200 years, after all of us are gone, video games will still be around and sought after. Sure, retro games will be considered "antiques" but like books, comics and art, video games have become an integral part of our society, so unless interest in video games dies out, we will only see prices for physical carts and discs go up. The fact that all these "smartphone kids" buy their games digitally is only going to make physical items even more collectable once they get to be our age. Has anyone seen what the limited PS4 release Retro City Rampage DX is selling for (just came out last month)? Or amiibos?

 

For the record: my 10-year-old stepson loves old games, in particular my Colecovision and NES. He also watched the documentary Video Games: The Movie on Netflix by himself. The interest is there.

[Keatah]

The fact that all these "smartphone kids" buy their games digitally is only going to make physical items even more collectable once they get to be our age.

 

Too bad there won't be any physical copies of apps and games much anymore. How many D'L games come with boxes? And how will updates be handled in 25 years? Will they still be able to be done?

 

Best I can think of is full sector-by sector imaging of the SSD inside the iDevice (or whatever platform is in vogue). And then you'll need to hack and crack the DRM, thus making things all that more complex and tedious.

[lord_mike]

This is certainly the "peak market" for these sorts of things right now... People who grew up in the late 70's and 80's now hitting their peak earning years and (even more importantly) peak midlife crisis years trying to relive their childhood a little bit. We can see that effect with the massive increase in interest (and market value) of the Nintendo NES market as that generation gets to midlife, and now we are starting to see an uptick in interest with SNES and especially Sega. I suspect that in a few years, specialty consoles like the Dreamcast will suddenly become popular, too, with the next generation of grownups. The interest in the Atari/Intellivision generation has decreased in comparison, and will continue to do so as the younger generations take over, but I don't forsee much of a "crash" or cratering of support. Why? Two reasons. First, there will always be people interested in stuff that happened before their time. There are folks still building mechanical TV's that haven't been used for almost a century, some of them right here in this forum! Second, the decrease in availability offsets the decrease in demand. The fact is, older hardware gets thrown out or fails and there is much less of it to go around. That is why the standup arcade market is seeing exponential price inflation even though their target customer is starting to move out of their peak midlife spending years. Every day old equipment ends up in the garbage heap making it much more difficult, and expensive to find. That scarcity (and novelty) will prevent any "crash" IMO, even though prices will still wax and wane with demand.

[BassGuitari]

I'd love it if the market for cartridges (and other physical media) crashed. Collecting would be cheap(ish) again.

I think markets for different platforms are generationally cyclical. As the generation that grew up with Console X starts hitting around 30 and nostalgia and disposable income become factors, sales of Console X-related merch booms. We're seeing that now with the NES and 16-bit consoles. We saw it 10 years ago with the Atari 2600 and its contemporaries.

Eventually, you get to a point where anyone who was ever gonna go back and buy stuff for Console X...already has. And all that's left to fill the void are serious collectors who by this point are only interested in rare items and are inclined to pay more for them. We're seeing that with things like the Atari 2600 now. A lot of shops have stopped carrying (or at least displaying) pre-NES stuff -- unless it's rare or special or otherwise appealing to collectors -- because it just doesn't move anymore. From personal experience, GOAT Store brings 2600 and Coleco and Intellivision stuff to MGC probably more for "retro cred" now than anything else; people look at it, say "Hey, remember that?" and move on.

The case of the n00b who wants to get into collecting really old stuff (usually starting with commons) is more the exception now than the rule, but it does happen (I was one, back when this stuff was cheap! ).

[Gernot]

So we believe strongly in something hmm?

 

I really guess it won't crash, we have very individual choices we also have very individual pov's.

 

I often refere myself to my kids, but my kids aren't the kid's of my neighbour.

 

My boy liked the old crap up to a certain age, though one can't say it won't interest the kids.

And if i understood that right is this what surprises most of them what you call the "old guard".

There are some who are lunatic enough to fall in love with these crappy games and who even fall in love with BASIC.

I really guess it will stay as a niche market, it's already a niche.

You won't get billionair with game cartridges, but i guess since the web is really worldwide, a few will always have enough custumers to live prob. even by this.

 

Yep, i'm neither a young boy anymore, but hmm bought me a inty, or i await the shipping to be precise.

And even if i'm a long time unemployed and live by welfare more less as good, i certainly will by me a game or two if it tickles me.

 

Ok, we think about the next gen. but i really met some here who are (i assume) younger as my son.

Eh, my son won't touch that old crap anymore, not even with a clamp.

But not every girl / boy is like my son, he's not much interested in computers at all, playing a game on the PS3 is OK, but computers never interested him much.

But others they are maybe like us, curious and like the games, like to know how that works or are surprised with how little it is to manage.

To me it looks they even have more respect as i, to me things was always made to use and i used them up, and if i couldn't fix it anymore it was burned in a "holy" fire.

Though some lunatic and some collectors will stay, it's a collectible and this has always a market.

 

There exists a market for cream cup covers ("Kaffeerahmdeckeli" as we say), why not for game cartridges?

And cartridges make far more sense to collect as "Kaffeerahmdeckeli" or "pocket-monsters" or any else so called collectible which is in fact a mass product and a sold advertisement

(super business strategy we don't sell a product it's enough to sell the advertisement, collectors are stupid enough to buy the crap, har-har).

If you collect game cartridges you collect a rarity and this makes at least as much sense as my collection of vinyls.

Has been spoken dead, but market for vinyls exists and if i'm right it's slightly growing again.

A german sociology student wrote a good dissertation about this new vinyl-"boom".

Similar reasons,

some collectors who MUST have every record available, they don't actually listen, they just have to collect them.

DJ's can't withdrawn vinyls.

some "lunatics", not really collectors, they don't collect because it's precious or rare, nostalgia or whatever.

some collect because of a specific interest in a specific genre (i.e. Jazz).

some price hunters, still you can buy vinyls with good music for a low price.

 

I guess that looks similar for old consoles and cartridges, old computer "crap" in general.

DJ's you can compare to those who need something to fiddle around with something which gives them a reason to use a soldering iron.

Collectors who MUST collect, they are omnipresent.

"lunatics", one is typing right now.

Specific genre = specific machine you are in love with.

price hunters, ok this you will miss here.

 

Horrible is on the other hand, i opened a article about how to AV mod th Inty without the small board you can buy, he rebuilded it based upon the diagram.

Seems he's able to rebuild something.

 

But later he explained he would need for something a AND gate and didn't knows how to make such one.

Well i had to smile, i'm no crack, but at least i had the chance to build my first logical gates at the age of 10.

He surprised me a little if you know what i mean, he can work with a soldering iron but it looks he leaks a little of rudimental knowledge.

The Base.

(besides i'm sure logical gates you find diagrams and how to interprete the output "en masse" in the web)

 

Erm, again yes there will be some lunatic and if that is just 1 of 1000, then it's already enough to live by.

 

And i can only propagate it, do it, get into it kids, electronic is a universe of it's own and it would be damned sad if we had no more real good technicians who understand the crap for real tomorrow.

 

Ppl surprise me they ask "how they made this how they lifted in example the tons heavy stone dome which was made from a single rock, on Theoderichs grave (it's in ravenna, young Gernot dared to sit in Theoderichs bathtub or sarkophag, scientists are uncertain about what it is). But they did it like we still do it on the construction site if have to lift something very heavy without a crane.

Use a lever and shift it, use lever on other point of at least three - shif it, use lever - shift it, use lever - shift it... how high you like to go?

It's slow, but it won't matter 1m or 10m or 30m.

 

It's a danger if the knowledge gets lost and for computers we are on the best way (no idea how to build a AND gate, phht), if there wouldn't be some lunatic, fortunately.

 

 

yeah talking 'bout electronics,

Not to long ago i had a service technician in the house i live in, he had to fix, resp. connect the web for me (in the building).

As he wen't into my room to check the connection, my amp started to humm. a common grid feedback, but unexpected,

means i kow it the installation in my room is crappy self-made, not by me, can happen sometimes installations are like large em field generators.

 

However, as it started i just waved with my hand over the amp (didn't touched it by far) and it stopped humming,

 

he looked at me a little surprised and i said only "it's magic, hm?", no it's a em field which started the feedback and i interrupted it with my bodies em field, that's all.

But i wonder me who is only a "elende siededrückeler" (a miserable silkscreen printer, a ex textile technician)?

he should know this and not me, he's the technician or what is he exactly?

simply a "white coat"?

A white coat doesn't classyfies you!

Edited January 17, 2015 by Gernot

[Gernot]

I have to disagree with the majority of you saying the market will crash. Though I personally wish that would be the case (allowing all of us to own and play games we want), we're seeing the exact opposite. Perhaps the market for 2600 carts is pretty stable, but generally EVERYTHING video game related (and especially Nintendo/Mario) is going up, up, up. Even in 200 years, after all of us are gone, video games will still be around and sought after. Sure, retro games will be considered "antiques" but like books, comics and art, video games have become an integral part of our society, so unless interest in video games dies out, we will only see prices for physical carts and discs go up. The fact that all these "smartphone kids" buy their games digitally is only going to make physical items even more collectable once they get to be our age. Has anyone seen what the limited PS4 release Retro City Rampage DX is selling for (just came out last month)? Or amiibos?

 

For the record: my 10-year-old stepson loves old games, in particular my Colecovision and NES. He also watched the documentary Video Games: The Movie on Netflix by himself. The interest is there.

 

Up to this age i pre-assume.

Great, yes similar to my experiences, david loved the old games as a young child.

Ok, the Inty was to blocky for him, but well we played a lot on the A500 and the SEGA master system.

It's i guess the simplicity which catches them, you don't have to learn something first, just start playing.

It was his top criteria for games later on, he never liked games where you had to read a manual for.

Unlike me, i readed as example the SimEarth manual i guess three times, even if it's 300 pages strong.

But i even read surgeon warnings on cosmetica on the toilet, i read everything when i'm in the mood.

 

Stepson, right, when we met, when i started to fall in love with his mom, his favorite game was (before he didn't even had any electronic toy, that poor boy

no better stop thinking about that gernot or your depression starts to rise again, took care for the boy but i had to leave my beloved daughter behind.

It broke my heart twice and there is no cure)

to beat some groundhogs with a hammer.

Fantastic game!

Beat a groundhog with a hammer.

(his mother; don't you think this game is to rude for him?

Crisis, i bought him GTA when he was aged 11, she nearly killed me, but he liked it and he disliked it also very soon, "no real good game" yeah but you wanted it am i right?)

For a long, a very long time each game was being measured at "Zelda" by him, if it only offered fun for a weekend or a week it was "no good game".

Right my son!

 

But it changed soon and viewed from the point of a grown up "right next day" he was beatin me in a racing game simultanously talking to his mother and watching TV.

I felt old, i felt horrible old.

Edited January 17, 2015 by Gernot

[Scotterpop]

There will always be a market and a collector base for carts. I just see it eventually becoming more of a niche thing. In the gaming world it seems that everything is moving toward digital distribution and storage. So even optical discs will eventually become irrelevant. Rumors that consoles themselves are in jeopardy of becoming obsolete are already being circulated. I've read that Sony is considering making the next Playstation a download-only machine, if it exists in a physical form at all. There's a Samsung TV coming out this year that plays PS games requiring no extra hardware. So changes are definitely coming. It's not just the format that I worry about disappearing, it's the entire ecosystem of the game/console/used game store(and second-hand market) that I fear will be lost to us collectors over time. Because of this, I can only speculate that the costs of these little plastic and silicon treasures will only go up in the future. So maybe the whole idea of a "video game collector" will become an outdated notion at some point. Just my two cents... what do you guys think?

[Keatah]

I hate to say the following, but it is what I gleaned from conducting interviews in the most casual and non-interview-like conversations.

 

Everyone absolutely loves the digital download model. Just look at how popular it has become. You can't argue with the numbers. And people don't want to become encumbered with boxes of carts and consoles. If the industry can get rid of the hardware by stuffing a console into a chip, all the merrier! It's all about letting someone else worry about the technical details and "keeping track of stuff".

 

Digital downloads eliminate compatibility problems, physical space problems, and the inconvenience of having to go to the store or Amazon/Ebay to buy games. In today's highly accelerated pace of living that is a HUGE plus!

 

Videogame collecting (like collecting most things) is in the eye of the beholder. I know that today's kids of the smartphone generation have absolutely no interest in the games of yore. Ohh you might get the proud parent who plays COMBAT or MISSILE COMMAND with their toddler. But that toddler would never seek out the classic games on its own. But they WILL seek out the latest flopper bird or farmerville game. They'll even throw fits to get to play those!

 

It is important to note, that videogame collecting has a certain air of immaturity about it. Much like comic book collecting. People view those kinds of collectors as hoarders with small minds. I hate to say it. But it is true. Collectors of computer games are even worse off.

 

A collector whom collects for one or two systems has a better chance of being respected than one that has numerous consoles. This is for many reasons. One of them being that emphasis is placed on sub-part of the hobby which creates the illusion of in-depth knowledge of the collected hardware. A one-system collection is somehow "accepted" as being normal, even enjoyable. This one chosen system and all its accessories can be treated as one physical item in the eyes of non-gamers.

Edited January 21, 2015 by Keatah

[Omega-TI]

As each generation comes to middle age, (I believe) many want to relive some of their youth, be it that car they always wanted or a computer or gaming system. I agree with those that say the early to mid 80's systems are at their peak right now. The sad part (I believe) is, that as we die off, many of our systems will be thrown out as so much trash because the younger generation has no emotional ties to OUR large and bulky stuff. Sure, some stuff will be auctioned off on eBait, but the pool of potential purchasers will be diminishing along with the prices.