PlaysWithWolves Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 COLECO isn't producing a console; Kickstarter is. It literally should be called the "Kickstarter Chameleon". To play a little devil's advocate, how is this re-branding to use another brand name any different than when it has happened in the past? For an example, the Jaguar's little brother the Atari Lynx wasn't really made by Atari. It was made by Epyx and it's original name was the Handy Game until Atari bought it from Epyx. Then Atari called it the Portable Color Entertainment System before changing the name again to Lynx. And to top that all off the Atari company being discussed here wasn't even the original company. It was sold in the 70's and then the brand was sold again in the 80's. My point is there isn't much of a difference between putting Coleco on a Jaguar case and Atari on a Jaguar case because by the time the Jaguar came out it was Atari in name only. How many of us took interest in the 2600, 5200, 7800, Lynx, Jaguar, Atari 8-bit computers, etc. because we saw the Atari name and logo on them even though every one of them weren't released by the original Atari? Were we all deceived or is that just how branding works? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzvIS63h-7s 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godslabrat Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 The difference is you're talking about two real companies and one real product. Here there is just one man with a retroland dream, one brand name for hire and still no actual physical product. To add to this, Atari could have made a portable if it chose to, it had a long history of hardware development prior to the Lynx. Mike hasn't shown an ability to develop anything but pipe dreams. When Atari rebranded the Epyx machine, they were making a sound business decision. Mike has yet to actually have a business PLAN beyond "I bought Jaguar molds, give me money." 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toiletunes Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 New ad slogan: "The Coleco Chameleon - B**** You Need Me" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 To play a little devil's advocate, how is this re-branding to use another brand name any different than when it has happened in the past? For an example, the Jaguar's little brother the Atari Lynx wasn't really made by Atari. It was made by Epyx and it's original name was the Handy Game until Atari bought it from Epyx. Then Atari called it the Portable Color Entertainment System before changing the name again to Lynx. And to top that all off the Atari company being discussed here wasn't even the original company. It was sold in the 70's and then the brand was sold again in the 80's. My point is there isn't much of a difference between putting Coleco on a Jaguar case and Atari on a Jaguar case because by the time the Jaguar came out it was Atari in name only. How many of us took interest in the 2600, 5200, 7800, Lynx, Jaguar, Atari 8-bit computers, etc. because we saw the Atari name and logo on them even though every one of them weren't released by the original Atari? Were we all deceived or is that just how branding works? To be fair, the 7800 was still somewhat old guard in the Tramiel years. The Atari consumer and arcade divisions were now separate entities, with the consumer sold off from Warner, but at the time Atari name was still a player in the arcades and the home, even if Atari games produced for NES instead of 7800 under the Tengen brand. Kind of a douche move but they followed the money trail. It wasn't until the death of the Jaguar in the late 90s that Atari as a game company folded and had it's brand whored out multiple times by random companies trying to make a fast buck. 7800 and Lynx may have been "new guard" versus the "old guard" 2600/5200, but nobody disputes them. Yes both consoles were conceived by third party companies, but I look at it as more of a contract work. 7800 and Atari consumer would not have lasted into the 90s were it not for the 7800s backwards compatability. Smart move that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzvIS63h-7s Another "drunken rant" for the RVGS team to complain about. Must be something added to that "Smart water", LOL! In all seriousness, Pat and Ian make a good point by laughing at the absurdity of all this. Mike seriously thinks that the same pitch with a new name will save them? They really have not learned. #noturdpolish 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toiletunes Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 It's the difference between a company you know buying an unknown product (and marketing as their own) vs an unknown product borrowing a company name to gain credibility. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaperman Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 (edited) To play a little devil's advocate, how is this re-branding to use another brand name any different than when it has happened in the past? The big difference I can think of is that in your examples, real gaming systems and reputations of real brands with big money were involved, instead of just a couple guys putting out sham videos and fairydust renders. If the coleco branding where all that was questionable here, I doubt we'd have such an issue. As is, it's another twist in gaming's worst joke. At this point, it's not possible for me to do anything but hate on this project. There's nothing anybody involved could ever say (even in unrelated conversation) that I'd find credible, and even releasing 'something' could not overcome this project's history for me. Besides, in a hypothetical world where the vgs chameleon exists, there are much more entertaining uses of my time than stupid video games--riding all of the flying pigs comes to mind. The closest thing I can think to a successful outcome is the 'see I told you I could do it' butthurt reaching the level of just buying anything that could pass as a game system and stuffing it in a jag case (because it's clear the jag case is the most important part of this project for some reason). And yes, I'm being a bit diplomatic. If I started talking about how I really feel, I'm pretty sure I'd be quickly banned. Have they even decided on system capabilities yet? Or do they still change weekly? Edited December 19, 2015 by Reaperman 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Comments on their Facebook posts make it look as though everyone is rah-rah excited about this, and no one has questioned the use of the zombie Coleco trademark. I assume Mike and friends are deleting negative comments again. Does anyone know for sure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg2600 Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 As I said 2 years ago, they should keep quiet until the product is finished, then try to sell it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlaysWithWolves Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Free subscription ("eventually") to everyone owns a Chameleon. You lucky devils who already have the subscription will also get to read articles on "upcoming Chameleon games and developer interviews"! Retro Video Game Systems, Inc. added 2 new photos. 1 hr · Our sister publication RETRO Magazine is preparing to publish its 10th issue. This is a special two cover issue celebrating both the history of first person shooters and Star Wars video games. Our two cover artists really went above and beyond for us. Eventually everyone who purchases a Chameleon console will also get a 1-year subscription to the magazine which will also feature information on upcoming Chameleon games and developer interviews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 As I said 2 years ago, they should keep quiet until the product is finished, then try to sell it. They want your money first. That ass-backwards approach is the main (of many) problems with their concept. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 (edited) Coleco brand or not, I for one want to wait until I know what's inside. It could be a "simple" ARM SoC based console, or maybe based on Altera Cyclone V (ARM hard core + FPGA) or something totally different. I am just curious to see what they come up with. I honestly expect just an ARM SoC of some sorts with integrated GPU, so in the end not much different than the slew of android based devices out there already. Edited December 19, 2015 by phoenixdownita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidmt Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 I'm in if there is an Adam computer attachment. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triverse Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Judging by the interview that Mike did with Retro Gamer (#148 I believe) I will have to call the old names he dropped the first time around that all denied even knowing what the RVGS was, again. He dropped Sega, Konami and I believe Capcom in the one page interview as "in talks with" or something similar. He alluded to them working with his company to possibly bring out new games for old franchises. Why is Retro Gamer NOT fact checking before they publish that stuff? A simple phone call would solve that problem right up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schizophretard Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 To be fair, the 7800 was still somewhat old guard in the Tramiel years. The Atari consumer and arcade divisions were now separate entities, with the consumer sold off from Warner, But Warner wasn't the original Atari company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Retro Gamer is an enthusiast publication from the UK , they aren't exactly known for hard-hitting journalism. Their "interview" resembled one of Mike's podcasts. Given the 8 hour time difference, I strongly suspect they talked to him over email, not live. I think they gave the RVGS more space than it deserved. It's not really in their style (or interest) to be overly critical of what amounts to a fan/indie/homebrew project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sega_SHARK Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 (edited) Judging by the interview that Mike did with Retro Gamer (#148 I believe) I will have to call the old names he dropped the first time around that all denied even knowing what the RVGS was, again. He dropped Sega, Konami and I believe Capcom in the one page interview as "in talks with" or something similar. He alluded to them working with his company to possibly bring out new games for old franchises. Why is Retro Gamer NOT fact checking before they publish that stuff? A simple phone call would solve that problem right up. All Mike has to do is leave a message on the answering machine at Konami and PRESTO. "We're in talks with Konami." It's classic Clintoneese. Retro Gamer is an enthusiast publication from the UK , they aren't exactly known for hard-hitting journalism. Their "interview" resembled one of Mike's podcasts. Given the 8 hour time difference, I strongly suspect they talked to him over email, not live. I think they gave the RVGS more space than it deserved. It's not really in their style (or interest) to be overly critical of what amounts to a fan/indie/homebrew project. >Hard Hitting Jornalism >Video Games Pick one Edited December 19, 2015 by sega_SHARK 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toiletunes Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Given the success of last year's Coleco Flashback, I don't expect this to go retail. Coleco + 60 games + $40 = no shelf space this year. How can Coleco + 1 game + $125-275-??? compete with that? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leods Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Given the success of last year's Coleco Flashback, I don't expect this to go retail. Coleco + 60 games + $40 = no shelf space this year. How can Coleco + 1 game + $125-275-??? compete with that? Why will this cost more than 100 bucks again? Oh yeah. Cartridges. Sorry. I had a lapse for a Moment there. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newsdee Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 A Coleco flashback with HDMI output would be nice, but without the original controllers and overlays it would lose a lot of the experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 But Warner wasn't the original Atari company. Yes but they kept much of the same guys during the aquisition. It wasn't a massive fire off, but more or less the company was split in two at the seams. Irregardless, let us just say that the company brand was being run by competent businessmen. That is more than can be said of this most recent abuse of the Coleco name. At least the Flashbacks paid homage. Chameleon still runs off smoke and mirrors, perhaps even live cockroaches performing the actual calculations that govern the machine. Regardless, the new guard / old guard changing hands at Atari is not the same as say necromancing a long dead and buried IP from the grave 30 years later. Mike and his cohorts are clearly tugging at the heart strings of fans and they had better get their act together before presenting this atrocity to potential investors. If the Toy Fair deals go south, then the RetroVGS team will have permanently wrecked any chances of a future business deal. After all, an elephant never forgets... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 A Coleco flashback with HDMI output would be nice, but without the original controllers and overlays it would lose a lot of the experience.Maybe so, but this thread is neither about the Flashback nor the Colecovision. The "chameleon" is only using dead old Coleco's name. It's really quite sad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StopDrop&Retro Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 A Coleco flashback with HDMI output would be nice, but without the original controllers and overlays it would lose a lot of the experience. Someone here already does that. http://atariage.com/forums/topic/245910-colecovision-flashback-upgrade-service/ The sad part is that this guy probably provides more value than the Coleco Chameleon ever will. I thought the Flashback included button overlays? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Why will this cost more than 100 bucks again? Oh yeah. Cartridges. Sorry. I had a lapse for a Moment there. It shouldn't cost $100+ A retrobit clone is like $20 and comes with two pack in controllers and a cart slot. A Raspberry Pi 2, $40 (with SD and HDMI built in). Put those together and you get $60 total. Pirate Famicom carts out of China cost like $10. SD media is cheap, so $5 for gigabyte sized game storage. Put a $5 markup on the games for packaging and sell them for $20 each. So $80 total for system, two controllers, and Tiny Knight pack in. And don't forget all this stuff sells for twice what it cost to produce, so there's room for negotiation in price. There's your armchair cost anal-ysis for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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