The Atari interview discussion thread

[rkindig]

All (and especially ACML), Joe Decuir was kind enough to respond to the questions posed by ACML:

 

1) Did you use the Apple II as a metric when designing the 800? They are very different, but was that the reference to beat?

 

Joe: we REALLY wanted slots. Because of the existing FCC rules, we could not. Apple was except from them at the time. We were constrained to drive a conventional TV. The Apple was designed for a monitor; But, you could buy an RF modulator from the dealer, not from Apple.

 

2) Did Hi Toro really want Atari to launch the Amiga?

 

Joe: the original contract between the two companies was “Amiga has this nice chip set; Atari can use it for arcade games. To use in the home market would compete with Amiga (which was thinking about a game console).

 

3) Besides yourself and Jay, who made up the core 800 team (hardware and OS)?

 

Joe: lots of people! Hardware: Jay, Joe, Francois Michel, George McLoed, Doug Neubauer, etc. The BIOS was built by several people in the firmware/software team. Same for the DOS and Basic.

 

4) Did you ever encounter either of the two Steve's (Jobs & Wozniak)? If so, did you ever compare/debate the 800 vs Apple II?

 

Joe: I met both of them at the Homebrew Computer Club in March 1976. I was there when they introduced the Apple 1 in April 1976. Job came buy recruiting, and offered me a job. He hired Rod Holt, but not me. (He tried two more times, in mid-1977 and in mid-1979.) Woz was an astonishing designer, but not a manager. If I had gone to Apple I would want to work with him.

We never debated them.

· From a system cost standpoint, Apple 2 wins.

· That in turn meant it attracted a lot more applications software development, particularly for personal productivity and applications. It started an ecosystem, which persisted until the IBM PC showed up in 1982.

· From an ease of use standpoint, it might be a wash.

· From a games standpoint, the Atari PCS wins.

 

 

Randy

[Savetz]

Nicholas Lefevre listened to his interview and send along these corrections to his statements:

 

"I did notice a couple errors in what I said which could be in an errata but they are probably not significant enough. At the beginning of my discussion of the Microsoft Multiplan story I introduced it by saying these things happened in 1984. Most of it was in 1983. Only the meeting at Softcon with John Shirley and Bill Gates was in 1984, after Jack's departure from Commodore. I also said that our claim was for $24M x 3. I think it was actually for $8M x 3 (total $24M)."

[Dan Iacovelli]

bob brodie boy that goes back, I got to know him via GEnie RTC he did for Atari, he was also my one main contact with Atari with my club,used to send him my fanzines and he would give me info.

when bob left julie wade took his place then don thomas.

speaking of interviews even though mine wasn't great I did do an interview with nolan its still on my ustream channel (see my signature)

I did a second one on stickam but after they went out I lost it.

[Savetz]

David Kano, Hex-A-Bug

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-47-david-kano-hex-a-bug

David Kano wrote the Hex-A-Bug debugger which was published by Atari Program Exchange. He also wrote two educational software titles for the Atari: Monkey See Monkey Spell, and Don’t Shoot That Word, which were both published by Hayden Software.

This interview was conducted March 24 2015.

Teaser quotes:

“I remember when I showed them the finished product they said ‘That’s great, except the monkey is too realistic. It’s too scary. Kids will be scared of that monkey.’”

“It was back in the day, when they were so desperate for programmers, they were taking anybody that seemed like they might be smart enough to learn how to do it. And then you learned on the job.

[Savetz]

Tom Hudson, A.N.A.L.O.G. Computing Magazine

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-48-tom-hudson-analog

 

Tom Hudson is a name familiar to readers of A.N.A.L.O.G. Computing magazine. He worked at A.N.A.L.O.G., where we wrote articles, games, maintained the A.N.A.L.O.G. TCS bulletin board system. His game credits include LiveWire, fire Bug, and Planetary Defense. He also wrote the popular DEGAS paint program for the Atari ST; and CAD-3D, a 3D graphics package, in conjunction with Gary Yost.

This interview was conducted April 17 2015.

Teaser quotes:

“Oh boy, probably one of the worst cases of vaporware I’ve ever seen.”

“We were dealing with stuff like cassette duplication. . . and none of us were crazy about that. I said, ‘Hey, why don’t we do a bulletin board? Have it’s so it’s subscription. Anybody who’s on the bulletin board won’t need to get cassettes anymore, because they can just download the stuff.”

[+DrVenkman]

Oooh! Looking forward to this one! His 8-bit games were a staple in my misspent teenage years. I can't tell you how many times I cursed at copies of A.N.A.L.O.G. trying to track down a typo in those never-ending lines of hexadecimal code! And a year or three later, I used both DEGAS and CAD-3D on my ST extensively in college. In fact, I used CAD-3D to generate a proportionate rendered model and image for my senior design thesis for my aerospace engineering degree. I can't wait to listen tomorrow.

[bbking67]

There is an analog game called Bacterion written by Tom Hudson and Kyle Peacock that I still play to this day. It's an amazingly good clone of the arcade game Rip-Off and it's very fun for two players.

 

I actually had no clue that Tom Hudson was responsible for Degas, which I used extensively in the ST era.

[ACML]

 

 

rkindig,

 

Thank you for forwarding my questions to Joe Decuir. And thank you Joe for taking the time to answer my questions. Any chance you could forward him a few more questions?

 

1) Joe Decuir (yourself), Jay Miner, Doug Neubauer, etc leave Atari very early in the 400/800 lifespan. I know each had their own reasons, but why did the "brain trust" of Atari leave the company? Was it Warner management (Ray Kassar or Manny Gerard)?

 

2) I heard Nolan Bushnell did not want Atari to enter the Home Computer market. Is that true?

 

3) Who in Atari management made the decision to make a home computer (Ray Kassar)?

 

4) I asked if you used the Apple II as a metric when designing the 800. Do you think Commodore used the 800 as the metric when they designed the C-64?

 

5) What is your favorite piece of Atari 8-bit hardware?

 

6) I've read that the Activision four wrote the OS for the 400/800. How much involvement did the hardware and software teams interact?

[FifthPlayer]

I have an interview suggestion: I'd love to hear one of the podcasts interview Richard Mansfield, the editor of Compute! magazine.

 

He'd be fair game for any of the three Atari podcasts; Compute! published some great productivity software including SpeedScript and SpeedCalc, making it fair ground for Inverse ATASCII. Since Compute! is a magazine, it would be great subject matter for Player/Missile. And of course, ANTIC covers just about everything.

 

Compute! magazine was a big part of my teenage years; I submitted a couple articles to them and even had one published. I recently found some letters from Compute! in my archives, including a rejection letter from Richard Mansfield himself. I'd love to know more about the story behind the magazine.

Edited May 29, 2015 by FifthPlayer

[Savetz]

@FifthPlayer — Richard hasn't responded to my inquiries. So far.

[Savetz]

Eunice Wlcek, Atari Quality Assurance

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-50-eunice-wlcek-atari-quality-assurance

Eunice Wlcek started at Atari as a secretary in the sales and marketing department, then moved to quality assurance where she did software testing. Later, she worked as a QA tester at Mindset, the graphics workstation company which was founded by several former Atari employees.

This interview was conducted March 19, 2015.

Teaser quotes:

“‘You’d be a great Ms. Pac Man.’ They made me Ms. Pac Man and I always had to dress up for these events with this big Pac Man costume on.”

“Mike’s company car was a Porsche. Whenever he wanted something done I got to take it and drive that around. And go do errands with the Porsche.”

Kevin's note: my interview with her dad Ken will be published in two days.

[Irgendwer]

4) I asked if you used the Apple II as a metric when designing the 800. Do you think Commodore used the 800 as the metric when they designed the C-64?

 

They did, as you can read in this very insightful book:

http://www.amazon.com/On-Edge-Spectacular-Rise-Commodore/dp/0973864907

 

there is also a German version:

https://gameplan.de/gameplan_VC/

[Lynxpro]

rkindig,

 

Thank you for forwarding my questions to Joe Decuir. And thank you Joe for taking the time to answer my questions. Any chance you could forward him a few more questions?

 

1) Joe Decuir (yourself), Jay Miner, Doug Neubauer, etc leave Atari very early in the 400/800 lifespan. I know each had their own reasons, but why did the "brain trust" of Atari leave the company? Was it Warner management (Ray Kassar or Manny Gerard)?

 

2) I heard Nolan Bushnell did not want Atari to enter the Home Computer market. Is that true?

 

3) Who in Atari management made the decision to make a home computer (Ray Kassar)?

 

4) I asked if you used the Apple II as a metric when designing the 800. Do you think Commodore used the 800 as the metric when they designed the C-64?

 

5) What is your favorite piece of Atari 8-bit hardware?

 

6) I've read that the Activision four wrote the OS for the 400/800. How much involvement did the hardware and software teams interact?

 

Joe is an active poster over in the Atari Museum Facebook Group… You could ask him there.

[Lynxpro]

 

They did, as you can read in this very insightful book:

http://www.amazon.com/On-Edge-Spectacular-Rise-Commodore/dp/0973864907

 

there is also a German version:

https://gameplan.de/gameplan_VC/

 

Well then, they didn't do a good enough job because the C64 didn't eclipse the A8. Mainly a draw despite it debuting 4 years later.

[Savetz]

Ken Balthaser, Atari Manager of Software Development

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-51-ken-balthaser-atari-manager-of-software-development

Ken Balthaser stated at Atari as part of a skunkworks group where he wrote software for speech hardware, then became manager of application software development. He oversaw the creation of the SWEAT system software, which were development tools for non-programmers to make graphics and sound assets; and the creation of arcade conversions such as Centipede and Defender to the 8-bit platform. Prior to Atari, he was part of the team that created all of the software for the CyberVision 2000, an early personal computer that was sold by Montgomery Ward.

Ken is the father of Eunice Wlcek, an Atari employee whom I previously interviewed.

This interview was conducted April 9, 2015.

Teaser quotes:

"Those were really hectic, crazy days. I mean, at that point, Atari was the fastest growing company in the world. No company had ever grown that fast that quickly. ... And just as quickly, it flamed out."

"There were a lot of people involved in the creation of the personal computer and video game industry. We tend to think that it was all Steve Jobs and Apple, and Bill Gates and Microsoft, but it wasn't. It was hundreds and thousands of other people who were participating and who were scrambling, and who were creating, and inventing along the way as well."

"It was wild there in the engineering building. If you walked past a restroom you might get high just from smoke coming out of it, you know?"

[ricortes]

I have a suggestion for an interview. Following the thread 'Halt and Catch Fire' a bit so...

 

Have you ever seen those beer commercials "The worlds most interesting man?" The real answer could be the founders of Corvus. Brilliant but somewhat misspent youth followed by brilliant young adult with conspicuous consumption. Huge McMansion in the hills above Cupertino and five car garage filled with Teutonic automobiles. If you can get personal, one has a love at first sight with his wife story which is kind of cute IMHO.

 

They could make a TV series about those guys and not have to invent anything. Closest thing to it would probably be if "Entourage" was a true story and based in Silly Con Valley.

[+Allan]

Ken Balthaser, Atari Manager of Software Development

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-51-ken-balthaser-atari-manager-of-software-development

Ken Balthaser stated at Atari as part of a skunkworks group where he wrote software for speech hardware, then became manager of application software development. He oversaw the creation of the SWEAT system software, which were development tools for non-programmers to make graphics and sound assets; and the creation of arcade conversions such as Centipede and Defender to the 8-bit platform. Prior to Atari, he was part of the team that created all of the software for the CyberVision 2000, an early personal computer that was sold by Montgomery Ward.

Ken is the father of Eunice Wlcek, an Atari employee whom I previously interviewed.

This interview was conducted April 9, 2015.

Teaser quotes:

"Those were really hectic, crazy days. I mean, at that point, Atari was the fastest growing company in the world. No company had ever grown that fast that quickly. ... And just as quickly, it flamed out."

"There were a lot of people involved in the creation of the personal computer and video game industry. We tend to think that it was all Steve Jobs and Apple, and Bill Gates and Microsoft, but it wasn't. It was hundreds and thousands of other people who were participating and who were scrambling, and who were creating, and inventing along the way as well."

"It was wild there in the engineering building. If you walked past a restroom you might get high just from smoke coming out of it, you know?"

http://www.atarimuseum.com/computers/8BITS/sweat/

 

Here's a link to the SWEAT software and manuals. The sound disk is missing though. Maybe you could include the link in the show notes.

 

Allan

[Avram]

Would it be possible to interview Steve Coleman? He created some excellent games on the Atari.

[rkindig]

We will look into than, Avram

 

thanks for the suggestion!

 

Randy

[Savetz]

Cassie Maas, Atari Marketing and Tech Support

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-52-cassie-maas-atari-marketing-tech-support

Cassie Maas started at Atari as a sales order processing clerk; then as a member of the marketing team, she evaluated new product ideas; then she worked in technical support, where she was the high-end technical support for word processing, and managed a BBS for user groups. She contributed to the 1984 book "InfoWorld's Essential Guide to Atari" and wrote for Antic magazine and Infoworld.

This interview occurred on April 6 and April 14 2015. Check the show notes atAtariPodcast.com to see the letter to Spencer Villwock that we discuss, plus links to her Atari writing.

Teaser quotes:

“I was really excited about the computer and I said, ‘Do you think I could get a job there?’ He laughed and snorted... Within a year I not only had a job at Atari, I had his job.”

“I’m not accepting your resignation. You’re going to be laid off like everybody else, on Friday, with a severance package!”

“That place was a fiasco. That place was just - woah! Money was being spent willy-nilly on all kinds of crazy things. People were sleeping with each other. People were cheating on their spouses. I mean, just crazy, crazy stuff went on.”

“So inside I’m totally freaking out, I’m this young kid, I don’t know, am I in really serious trouble? Am I breaking the law?”

Kevin's note: This is one of my favorite ANTIC interviews. Cassie has so many great stories. Listen to this one.

[+Allan]

I really love the Cassie Mass interview. One of my favorites. Lot's of names dropped in there as well, Kevin.

 

Allan

[Savetz]

Fred D'Ignazio, prolific writer

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-53-fred-dignazio-prolific-writer

Fred D'Ignazio wrote more than 20 computer books, including Atari in Wonderland and The Atari Playground. He hosted four television shows about computers and robots, and was the "gadget guru" on Good Morning America. He was an associate editor and columnist for Compute! magazine, where he wrote the columns World Inside The Computer and On The Road With Fred D'Ignazio.

This interview was conducted April 10, 2015.

Teaser quotes:

"Katie and the Computer, my advance was $300. And I had to split it with my illustrator."

"You know Nolan Bushnell, right? ... He'd put his arm around me and say, 'Fred, How's it goin' in the world of the ankle biters and the little people?'"

"You could hear a pin drop after my speech. There was just this embarrassed silence, like 'Who the freaking heck is this joker they hired to speak at our convention?'"

[Savetz]

Steve Molyneux, German Software Development Manager

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-54-steve-molyneux-german-software-development-manager

Steve Molyneux was Atari’s Software Development Manager in Hamburg, Germany from 1981 through 1984. He was responsible for the European side of Atari Program Exchange, and launching games at European trade shows.

Parts of this interview discuss adult situations, and are not appropriate for children.

This interview occurred on April 13, 2015

Teaser quotes:

“...In sort of private helicopters up to this chalet. I mean the amount of money that they spent when we had Warner money. . .”

“Castle Wolfenstein? That was definitely a no-no in Germany. I mean, that was just something you couldn’t talk about, you just couldn’t sell.”

Kevin's note: The only interview I've done (so far) with an adult content warning.

[Savetz]

John-Michael Battaglia

http://ataripodcast.libsyn.com/antic-interview-55-john-michael-battaglia

John-Michael Battaglia worked as a copywriter at Atari for about a year from 1981 through 1982, writing manuals and box copy for Atari 2600 and 5200 video games. He wrote the manuals for Atari 5200 Football, Space Dungeon, WaterWorld, Phoenix, and Adventure. He later worked at Catalyst, Nolan Bushnell’s incubator for technology startups.

This interview took place March 2, 2015.

Teaser quotes:

“Debacle, yes. Debacle is quite the right word. That was probably my proudest moment.”

“I think of my first day I probably sent e-mails to my friends saying: you’ll never believe where I am now. I’m playing video games and getting paid for it.”

“It was another one of those instances where a writer could actually have input into the game design, provided the game designer was open to that kind of feedback.”

[+wood_jl]

Some feedback! The Antic episodes are now getting drowned under the mass of interview editions (which are all good of course) - perhaps the web site could have a way to list each separately as people may miss them

 

 

Many props to "therealbountybob," who is a fine Atarian and frequent contributor to the Atari scene, but I simply disagree.

 

The Antic interviews are just about the purest form of GOLD that I can imagine, to my Atari-centric and retrocomputing-interested (in a more general sense) ears.

 

Frankly, I *can't believe* how many heavy-hitters you boys have interviewed! It's beyond fantastic. How to distinguish between "Antic Interview" and "Antic Episode?" Well, quite obviously, Antic Episodes are titled "Antic Episode" and Antic Interviews are titled "Antic Interview." One need only click on what one desire; it's no more complicated than that. Understanding that simple process, I see no circumstances under which *any* content is "drowned under" any other content, for it is all listed independently.

 

The work in (1) preparing the podcast in general, (2) taking the time to seek out and contact potential interviewees, and (3) taking the enormous time and effort to EDIT those interviews must be mind-boggling to amateurs such as myself. That's right, I'm an amateur. Or I would be. As opposed to Kevin and Randy, who are *EXPERTS* (have become so in short order!) in the art of the interview. In the past year and a half (or whatever?), I've listened to these guys not only become entertaining podcasters (which they sort-of were from episode 1), to excellent interviewers per se, as the number of interviews increases.

 

Furthermore, Kevin and Randy are pretty-much indelibly becoming significant icons of Atari-8 history and folklore themselves, as they actively lay down the history of those who did that, previously. I'm much more than impressed; I am quite moved by the work (the time and the editing that I can't imagine) that those boys do, and I'm humbly ingratiated, every time I listen to either an interview, or the actual podcast itself. I'm astonished not only at the final presentation, but curious as to the many behind-the-scenes hours that probably went into it, completely unbeknownst to me. Should I (in an unlikely scenario) attempt to establish my own podcast, I'd take huge lessons from these fellows, and I probably couldn't even do it, at that.

 

The monthly Antic podcast is now a regular treat, but the interviews - most professionally-conducted - are a super-bonus. Please continue! You're laying down (for the record) and archiving Atari history - from those who were actually there and remember (as well of those who were not) - at an alarmingly-pleasing rate! MORE INTERVIEWS, not less. To my limited knowledge, nobody has either attempted nor achieved such success in such an endeavor. It truly is incredible what you've done so far, to anybody of interest in the Atari. Please continue! You've pulled so many people out of Atari history that I'm flabbergasted.

 

However, as mere suggestions to people who (obviously) already know what they're doing, could you possibly:

 

(1) Contact Arthur Leyenburger. As far as I can remember, he was an author of Creative Computing's "Outpost: Atari." (also Analog Magazine). As I understand "Outpost: Atari," it went from Dave Small (already interviewed) to John J. Anderson (unfortunately deceased in the 1989 California Earthquakes but was amazing Atarian) and then to Arthur Leyenberger. It would be grand to hear from him.

 

(2) Doug Neubauer, of POKEY and Star Raiders fame. The stellar Joe Decuir interview referencedhim. Sounds like a difficult man to get ahold of, but would be grand! Perhaps you can encourage participation in Decuir's upcoming book when you snag the interview.

 

(3) Bob Puff from Computer Software Services, of Rochester, NY. Atari-inventor-extrordinaire/ inventor.

 

(4) Clayton Walnum - faboulous Atari man/columnist.

 

(5) David H Ahl / Betsey Staples - Believe to be married couple (at one time) who ran Creative Computing and then Atari Explorer magazines.

 

(6) Darek Michocka - First emulator for A8 on ST and then on PC

 

(7) Atari800win - whoever that was

 

( Alterrra - from AtariAge user Phaeron

 

 

All of these people would be of extereme interest. Perhaps not all will wish to participate, but it would be really nice to hear one of your interviews from any of them!

Please keep up the excellent work!