Have a spare Newell OSN and Fastchip?

[1050]

Thanks for the backside shot, it confirms that they found a use for the spare gate on that board so if you want one, you'll have to piggy back one on there or really any other 14 pin candidate and do jumpers from there. No more jumpers than the outline before, you'll just have to trace down the easiest place to get the same signals from. Could still go surface mount if piggyback DIP-14 package winds up too tall, I was afraid that problem would shut my water off. Understand any reluctance to put on jumpers just for FastChip use, but that's just how it is - if you want it you'll have to jumper for it. Or go full out ass rig with dead bug glued onto eprom which winds up jumperless except for all over the eprom itself. When I get my chips, I'll make one and post photo of proper ass rigging method. What I have in mind will be Rico Suave. Hold the a sound on the end of that until you get punched in the face is the only proper way to say that.

 

Just a further note on 2516 - pin 18 PD/PGM (power down/program) appears to be positive logic chip enable when in fact it is negative logic just like most eproms, because of double reverse function nomenclature it also appears to need a bar across the PD portion of the pin name, but this would really only add even more confusion AND it's actually wrong to do so. Take it high and the chip goes offline with minimum power consumption pretty much same behavior as most other OE/ and CS/ eprom pins.

 

And I'm glad someone is getting verified use out of the Omnimon 800 code finally. It wasn't doing anybody any good inside that pill bottle, that's for sure. Seems like this eprom hack would have been on some BBS of old, way too easy for me to be the first to propose this too.

 

And it can all be done as covered above. So we done here for the time being? It's been fun, all the best.

[+sm3]

I'll check back to see what you come up with. We've already helped out at least one other person (that we know of) besides me with this project, so that is cool! Thanks again for the assistance you have provided getting me this far.

[+sm3]

Well, it's been almost 2 years. In that time I haven't noticed any Newell boards with OSN or the Fastchip until last week (I think it was). I believe one was being sold by someone from atariage along with an 800 and then there was a separate Fastchip by itself.

 

I missed out on both of those. My offer still stands of course, I will pay cash or cash + trade (I have 3 unused Incognito) for an original OSN and a Fastchip or any combination.

 

I was going to just cut my losses and buy an OSNXL and Omnview for my XL from B&C but haven't yet.

 

1050, I was a little confused about the instructions in your other thread and didn't want to derail that one with talk about the Fastchip. Last time we talked about the Fastchip you mentioned a hardware modification to make a standard EPROM work. That was not something I wanted to try of course. Sounds like you have come up with a different way now?

[1050]

Yes, hardware modification I proposed as a fix was

done back before you posted the more complete and

much more information packed installation PDF. In

there I read that standard 2716 is the chip to use

for Z8 on page 3 not including the title pages or

page 5 by adobe reader count.

 

Conclusion - no chip select tricks used on this one,

so I don't have go tricky to match them. I --DO--

have to use an eprom of the proper speed though.

And they even mention the speed - it's 350ns and

that equals a full stop to get and try to use that

speed of eprom.

 

So it's easy to do that with 2716, but 2732 are rare

in that exact speed today. I do have some 200ns

ordered and they may work and they may not work.

I will keep looking for 350ns in the meantime.

 

The speed issue may have been the only problem

with you burning your chips there. Some chips

will act fine and still be no good too, rare

but it does happen. More common is extra time

needed to erase fully and that's a bad sign

it's not to be trusted.

 

If you have the correct speed 2716 and it still

doesn't work with my math pack files then I

wonder if they aren't selling us soap about that

chip being a 2716? It could easily be 2732 with

double image of the math pack code burned into

it. Reading the FastChip you have as a 2732 might

show us this information. I doubt it will harm the

FastChip you have, but I can fully understand if

you never want go there. Reading the FastChip you

have as a 2716 may also prove fruitful, if you

get no code from it, then it just might need the

hardware mod I mentioned 2 years ago after all.

[+sm3]

Hi 1050, I took another look at my EPROM purchase from 2015 for this. It says Intel D2716-1 EPROM 350ns 2K x 8 VPP 25V.

 

So what the description reads is what I need I believe. I haven't tried burning another one since our first go though.

[1050]

Couple of problems immediately jump to mind.

 

1) Can your programmer do 25 volt programming?

Far too many modern units simply can't.

Might see if this exact chip number is in the

list of supported devices bearing in mind these

lists are put together by office help and/or

anybody walking by the wrong door on the wrong

day.

Other alternative is to use verify to compare

code in the burnt chip with burn file. This may

require a reboot to eliminate the burn program

from hanging onto old data and using that instead

of an actual read of the eprom done - gets dicey

when old falsified data pops up due to programmer's

code written in lazy 'no flush the buffer' mode.

May have to resort to reboot read and compare

contents with burn file in DOS mode or other file

compare method.

 

2) Does it say -350 or state the speed on the

chip itself (you said so=redundant but still

important for others) because only datasheet from

intel says 450ns for D2716 and they don't cover

the D2716-1 variant at all. Meaning we have access

to only older datasheets, but that -1 theme for

350ns was found with ST eproms so not happy with

speed information here. Fast according to

Intel datasheet that is available is 450ns

and that's not so very fast at all. I've seen

FAST text on the chip only to learn later that

it's NOT very fast at all.

 

2a) Can always get another, different eprom.

Putting all your eggs in one basket can lead

to 'issues' where you have no good eggs at

all. Different manufacturer is the meaning

here. Some burners will and some won't,

changing the make sometimes does the trick

all by itself. I have had to resort to lying

to my burner saying it's this chip instead of

the one by the number and bob's my lying

uncle, but it worked and I don't much care

past that bigger part of the issue.

 

Still at eprom burning level 015, so no college

credit for this course but it's still required

minutiae. All Tees crossed and eyes dotted, no

rock left unturned because that's where the

oversight lives. And it's a minefield on the

best of days. Should have done 2a) two years

ago just to cover the bases. Sorry about not

mentioning it as something to try next way

back then. In my defense, I was distracted by

how to implement the inverted chip select mod

which never happened anyway. I swear I got

those eproms in, but can't find them now.

[+sm3]

1050, I purchased a programmer from MCUmall in Canada specifically for this project (Newell OSN/Fastchip EPROM creation) and it was my first time burning an EPROM. It was a GQ-4X and supposedly with the external power adapter, it could do the 25V chips, although I'm having trouble finding where it said that now, since there is a new version of GQ-4X out. Maybe it was the programmer software that told me to connect the external adapter when I selected the type of chip I was trying to burn, I don't recall exactly.

 

As far as the 2716 EPROMs I purchased, I have to locate them now I kind of put all this away after my less than successul results with the intention of purchasing an OSN XL from B&C.

[+sm3]

Well, after 3 years of watching and searching I found a real Newell Fastchip and have it installed in my RAMROD MMOS board along with OSN and it seems to work just fine! I have Omnimon also, but the version I found on AtariAge seems to differ from the manual on archive.org. It's version Omnimon A1 and while it seems to work, the commands are different (mostly).

 

My 800 now has graphics modes 12-15 so I'm assuming OSN is working correctly, I believe those were only available on the XL models. I ran a few calculations using floating point, so my basic test of the Fastchip seems to show it's working as well.

 

I've attached a photo because I know people like that stuff.

 

Not sure what I'll do now that I found my unicorn

[BillC]

Well, after 3 years of watching and searching I found a real Newell Fastchip and have it installed in my RAMROD MMOS board along with OSN and it seems to work just fine! I have Omnimon also, but the version I found on AtariAge seems to differ from the manual on archive.org. It's version Omnimon A1 and while it seems to work, the commands are different (mostly).

 

My 800 now has graphics modes 12-15 so I'm assuming OSN is working correctly, I believe those were only available on the XL models. I ran a few calculations using floating point, so my basic test of the Fastchip seems to show it's working as well.

 

I've attached a photo because I know people like that stuff.

 

Not sure what I'll do now that I found my unicorn

Better cover up the windows on the EPROMs!

[+sm3]

Better cover up the windows on the EPROMs!

 

Thanks for the reminder! I had electrical tape over them. I didn't know if it mattered or not. I'm not exactly experienced burning ROMs and stuff

[BillC]

 

Thanks for the reminder! I had electrical tape over them. I didn't know if it mattered or not. I'm not exactly experienced burning ROMs and stuff

EPROMs are erased by shining ultra-violet lightt though the window, without being covered they could be partially erased by extended exposure to ambient light.

[+sm3]

EPROMs are erased by shining ultra-violet lightt though the window, without being covered they could be partially erased by extended exposure to ambient light.

 

Yeah, I had to use the UV light while I was burning these 3. But the tape is back on them now.

[+slx]

Well, after 3 years of watching and searching I found a real Newell Fastchip and have it installed in my RAMROD MMOS board along with OSN and it seems to work just fine! I have Omnimon also, but the version I found on AtariAge seems to differ from the manual on archive.org. It's version Omnimon A1 and while it seems to work, the commands are different (mostly).

 

 

Would you be able to post dumps of the OSN and Fastchip (unless they are the same ones posted in other threads here). Thanks!

[+sm3]

The ROMs I burned I got from this thread.