Nintendo Switch

[Reaperman]

So, I don't have a smart phone, and I'm never going to buy one--how useful will the switch be to me?

From what I hear, phones do all the matchmaking and chatting, so multiplayer is out. What else will I miss out on?

 

If they need more background processing power, how much work would it really have taken to put a low-end phone soc into the thing?...next to the one that's already there...

Edited January 21, 2017 by Reaperman

[omegadot]

Realistically I imagine that many making these mega popular franchises on PS4/Xbone don't care about the Nintendo audience. We are partway through a generation where the MS and Sony consoles have been pretty darn successful and anyone that gets a Switch will very often have another platform or they are a person that wouldn't buy into the franchise anyway. If there isn't a compelling reason to release on the platform on it's own merits why bother? If the portable aspect takes off, maybe? Otherwise it's another box among many attached to a TV with Nintendo-typical oddities.

[BillLoguidice]

So, I don't have a smart phone, and I'm never going to buy one--how useful will the switch be to me?

From what I hear, phones do all the matchmaking and chatting, so multiplayer is out. What else will I miss out on?

 

If they need more background processing power, how much work would it really have taken to put a low-end phone soc into the thing?...next to the one that's already there...

 

I would imagine there would be rudimentary matchmaking and play in the online stuff outside of a smartphone app, but who really knows at this point? For more sophisticated matchmaking and overall interactions, as well as voice chat during gameplay, I believe you'd need a smartphone and associated app. It's a bold move, although something I again find odd in the face of what everyone else does. The other thing to keep in mind is that online play eventually won't be free. You'll need a subscription. And unlike the competition, said subscription will only get us a single rental of their choosing each month. Hopefully that eventually changes.

[Tanooki]

Here is an article where it's argued that the Switch must have a successful launch in order to be a success, and that the first two weeks are critical. I'm admittedly ignorant in economics, but I'm wondering whether or not these types of forecasts are correct.

 

 

http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20170121/business/170129929/

They rarely are. Usually it is a know nothing analyst from a company that happens to also cover games. A popular know nothing is Michael Pachter who keep spitting out dumb comment after another yearly, rarely is right, but the media feed off his title like he's an authority. System sales in 2 weeks when a company usually can expect a total sell out with preorders and remaining stock indicates nothing, it never does, outside of those two weeks having few sold and rotting on shelves like WiiU.

 

It's staying power. Will they fill all the need and then stuff sits. That would be seen in a couple quarters. If they can't sell out at Christmas on popular indicator stuff, that's a bad one. If third parties make games and get few sales and they piss and whine then bail, that's another.

[toptenmaterial]

They rarely are. Usually it is a know nothing analyst from a company that happens to also cover games. A popular know nothing is Michael Pachter who keep spitting out dumb comment after another yearly, rarely is right, but the media feed off his title like he's an authority. System sales in 2 weeks when a company usually can expect a total sell out with preorders and remaining stock indicates nothing, it never does, outside of those two weeks having few sold and rotting on shelves like WiiU.

 

It's staying power. Will they fill all the need and then stuff sits. That would be seen in a couple quarters. If they can't sell out at Christmas on popular indicator stuff, that's a bad one. If third parties make games and get few sales and they piss and whine then bail, that's another.

Michael Pachner, I'm convinced, is an industry shill against Nintendo. He has been forecasting their doom even before the DS/Wii glory days. I really wonder if he's getting dough from someone in the competition. Edited January 21, 2017 by toptenmaterial

[godslabrat]

Michael Pachner, I'm convinced, is an industry shill against Nintendo. He has been forecasting their doom even before the DS/Wii glory days. I really wonder if he's getting dough from someone in the competition.

I don't know about him specifically, but I strongly believe a lot of gaming press see a financial incentive (direct or indirect) to appeasing the gaming companies. It's one big reason I can't take "gaming journalism" as a concept seriously.

 

Frankly, I always found it more useful when the gaming press was actually run by the parent company (Nintendo Power, Sega Visions, etc). At least then they could acknowledge their bias right up front and get on with things.

[Flojomojo]

My opinion: the first two weeks isn't that important, unless you're just trying to tell a story about hot demand. Most hit machines these days have more of a slow burn as they add more and more software, and perhaps price drops. This was certainly true of PS3, 3DS, and Xbox One. I see the Switch kickoff on March 3rd as more of a "soft launch" than anything, especially since there won't be much software at first. Analysis of Switch sales prior to its first holiday season are especially useless. These jokers don't get to proclaim the not-yet-launched thing dead until a few months AFTER the release of Mario Odyssey.

 

I hope it's a big hit so they can make a Mario Odyssey 2, guest starring K.C. Munchkin!

[Reaperman]

Given the phone-style hardware of the thing, I'm surprised it's not launching with hundreds of games.

 

As is, interesting march titles for me consist of Fast RMX, and maybe Bomberman. I really do like the form factor, but it seems like I'm trying too hard to sell myself on it.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Reaperman

[Andromeda Stardust]

Here is an article where it's argued that the Switch must have a successful launch in order to be a success, and that the first two weeks are critical. I'm admittedly ignorant in economics, but I'm wondering whether or not these types of forecasts are correct.

 

 

http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20170121/business/170129929/

Don't drink the gloom Koolaid. The fanboy stuff tastes much better!

 

In all seriousness, the constant comparisons to current PS4/XB1 pricing is moot. Those aren't launch prices, but what's more assinine is that PS4 Pro and XBox Scorpio are the 9th gen "upgrades" to the Sony/MS boxes, and this will be what the Switch is actually competing against. The "Pro" versions of the MS/Sony consoles will undoubtedly cost more than the Switch, so I see $300 as a competitive price point. The cost reduced PS4 Slim and XB1S units are meant to be budget entry level consoles rather than bleeding edge.

 

And I agree with Flojo, we will have a more accurate forecast on the Switch at end of year when the holiday shipping season is over with. Switch needs day one support from consumers, and judging by preorders selling out, it will have the day one userbase to sustain it until it picks up momentum. Zelda, MK8 Deluxe, Splatoon 2, and Mario Oydessy are all system sellers! Seems we got a big 1st party AAA blockbuster for each quarter this year:

 

Q1 2017: Zelda BOTW

Q2 2017: Mario Kart 8 Deluxe

Q3 2017: Splatoon 2

Q4 2017: Mario Odyssey

 

These will all sell millions, and I hope Nintendo bundles the hell out of them for Christmas...

[Andromeda Stardust]

So, I don't have a smart phone, and I'm never going to buy one--how useful will the switch be to me?

From what I hear, phones do all the matchmaking and chatting, so multiplayer is out. What else will I miss out on?

 

If they need more background processing power, how much work would it really have taken to put a low-end phone soc into the thing?...next to the one that's already there...

I'm honestly surprised by the number of people claiming to not have Smartphones (or being reluctant to use them) getting the Switch. I thought I was the only one. I'm fairly convinced the smartphone app is just a helper app or an alternative towards using the built in software. Why else do we have Switch branded wired headsets with the four ring mini phono jacks? These plug directly into the headphone port of the Switch tablet and presumably do not use a Bluetooth connection. This above all else tells me the option to use voice chat will be included stock. I hope Mario Kart 8 Deluxe will support it.

 

Contrary to what Bill and others alluded to, I am convinced the helper app is not the only method for online matchmaking or voice chat. That said, emphasising this over and not even revealing whatever built in functionality exists, is just really bad press. Fans and even some industry insiders are convinced you cannot even play or connect online without a smart device. This is a serious PR snafu and needs to be addressed immediately by corporate. It's like a car salesman raving about the optional rim package before detailing the car features itself and why I need this vehicle. Sell me the car first, then we can talk about what kinds of wheels I want, or the optional rear spoiler package.

[toptenmaterial]

To digress: what is the purpose of the updated Sony and MS consoles we're seeing? Do they all play the same games?

[Flojomojo]

Contrary to what Bill and others alluded to, I am convinced the helper app is not the only method for online matchmaking or voice chat.

 

I believe that one of the reasons they're offloading voice chat to a separate device is so that kids on the console can have a friendlier/safer experience online, just like they do with the last round of Nintendo hardware. On those platforms, you're limited to what you can say and do, and it keeps it from being an adolescent cursing & racism factory like Xbox Live.

 

I guess a lot of kids already have smart devices, so we'll see if this actually works in practice. I would think that some limited matchmaking could happen on Switch itself regardless of what other devices you might have.

 

I certainly see the appeal of getting invitations and notifications when I'm not actively playing a game. Portables are not like TV consoles, where you're already settled in for a play session.

 

Maybe another reason could be to offload all the development and updating to the other devices, so Switch doesn't need a firmware update every month?

 

Hater explanation (been seeing a lot of this around the internet): Nintendo is just plain dumb and don't understand online at all and this is more proof that they don't know what they're doing. Free NES game for a month and you don't even get to keep it, how stupid. And I have to pay for online. Fail

 

That said, I'm ready to be pleasantly surprised by letting us play prior Virtual Console purchases on the new Switch without paying all over again. Surely they have a good reason to have just put F-Zero X and Star Fox 64 on the dying Wii U Virtual Console?

[Flojomojo]

To digress: what is the purpose of the updated Sony and MS consoles we're seeing? Do they all play the same games?

Higher resolution, more processing power.

Support for 4K televisions.

On the Sony system, support for VR headset.

 

If you have to ask, you don't need it. I'm sticking with my old gear because I'm not as into PS4/Xbone as other stuff.

[cybercylon]

Given the phone-style hardware of the thing, I'm surprised it's not launching with hundreds of games.

 

As is, interesting march titles for me consist of Fast RMX, and maybe Bomberman. I really do like the form factor, but it seems like I'm trying too hard to sell myself on it.

 

For $300, whatever a smart phone is needed for should just be baked into the console.

[omegadot]

I think it's absurd to require a phone app but I will probably enjoy it. If it's a gaming first box I won't be sitting online streaming as much and a phone app to organize seems pretty attractive.

[BillLoguidice]

Higher resolution, more processing power.

Support for 4K televisions.

On the Sony system, support for VR headset.

 

If you have to ask, you don't need it. I'm sticking with my old gear because I'm not as into PS4/Xbone as other stuff.

 

The VR headset works just fine on the standard PS4, which is what I'm using it on. The PS4 Pro supports 4K HDR video streaming and 4K for some games. It can also run certain games at a more consistent or higher frame rate (say, 60 FPS versus 30 FPS). HDR itself is supported on all versions of the PS4, although, oddly enough, it doesn't work with the VR headset connected (a design flaw). Another oddity, the PS4 Pro doesn't support 4K Blu-Rays, although, again, 4K streaming is not an issue. The PS4 Slim is just a regular PS4 in a smaller size. So basically you have PS4/PS4 Slim and the PS4 Pro.

 

On the Xbox One side, the present new model is the Xbox One S, which enables HDR support, 4K video streaming, and 4K Blu-Ray. There is otherwise no major performance difference between that and the old model of the Xbox One. The Xbox One Scorpio, which will come out later this year, will supposedly one-up the PS4 Pro in terms of performance. When that comes out later this year, you'll have Xbox One, Xbox One S, and Xbox Scorpio (whatever it's name will be), although there will likely be few regular Xbox Ones left in circulation by then (same thing with the non-Slim PS4).

 

The key thing to remember here is that the console cycle is now more or less following the PC/mobile cycle. Instead of releasing all-new systems, the idea is to release more powerful iterations of the same platform. All games are (at least for the moment) required to work on all models, it's just that owners of the newer, more advanced models, might have enhanced performance. I fully expect Nintendo to follow this model (just like they did with the 3DS and New 3DS) with the Switch, should they get that far (say late 2018 or 2019). Although some people don't like this idea, I'm all for it. It helps maintain investments in games and makes it easy to upgrade to a better performing system when you're ready.

[Mord]

I think it's absurd to require a phone app but I will probably enjoy it. If it's a gaming first box I won't be sitting online streaming as much and a phone app to organize seems pretty attractive.

 

Is the app required? That'd actually be somewhat of a deal breaker to me given I have yet to get a mobile phone and I don't see the need to buy one for a game console.

[omegadot]

Is the app required? That'd actually be somewhat of a deal breaker to me given I have yet to get a mobile phone and I don't see the need to buy one for a game console.

I phrased that poorly. Were it to be as I gathered some posts above tend to think.

Edited January 22, 2017 by omegadot

[Flojomojo]

Is the app required? That'd actually be somewhat of a deal breaker to me given I have yet to get a mobile phone and I don't see the need to buy one for a game console.

I would think it's only "required" in the sense that the online multiplayer service is ...this is a games machine, after all, and the only think it "needs" is electricity and a game or two.

[Tanooki]

Higher resolution, more processing power.

Support for 4K televisions.

On the Sony system, support for VR headset.

 

If you have to ask, you don't need it. I'm sticking with my old gear because I'm not as into PS4/Xbone as other stuff.

 

To digress: what is the purpose of the updated Sony and MS consoles we're seeing? Do they all play the same games?

 

Just to be clear he's right, but one thing all you probably know (or not?) is that for both makers one of the laws of game develoment for their PRO boxes is that it's not allowed to develop a game that will not work on the original hardware. That means the systems are just for technophile weenies to milk the crap out of who need 4K or VR goggles to think they somehow enjoy the same games more. The games will work on any hardware, they're scaled, much in the say respect as the SWITCH is scaled in portable vs docked mode. Same Game -> Nice Looking Output.

 

As Bill pointed out Sony and MS are suffering too because they went with PCs in a pretty shell basically that are closed systems, they ran up a hell of a bill. Because of this they're ditching what had been console generations to the computer upgrade model. The games and apps still will continue to work, but they'll just look nicer on the front end because you get beefier parts much like buying a Nvidia card 2 years ago in the low 900 series and going to the top 10X0 card now. Both run the same junk, just looks nicer and runs some 4K level stuff the lesser won't. Due to this Nintendo may be behind as they're not doing 4K (though the hardware could do it at a 4k/30fps level as Tegra X1 does that, but game wise they will be able to run a good bit of the same because Sony/MS have to 100% support the base hardware. As long as the base hardware isn't dropped you'll have that option of conversion just like PS3/360 got for years as they're not miles apart like the barely HD WiiU failure was.

 

 

That phone app though is intriguing me. I think it was always incredibly stupid MS and Sony did not have one of those apps. Most people have smart phones or tablets, especially the younger game hungry types. Nintendo may be ultimately doing something very right the haters just crap on as it's Nintendo (again) doing it first. Imagine having full eShop access. Full friends list access and all that entails with private messages, conversations, setting meetings to get online and play Switch. You get messages and notifcations on the instant for game sales, package deals from third party(game) vendors, and more right on your Android/iOS device. People want to mock and lie about it only being for in game voice chat and crap...whatever. Then why sell headsets for it from various makers for in game chat meant for the hardware, none of their early packaging say -- Turtle Beach SwitchX1 Headset for your phone, no it says FOR Switch. Best to just take Nintendo in respect to US politics and the media...a rote pile of f'ing lies and manipulation to mess with people with layers of half truths and fake news. Let it roll out, THEN whine if they come up short.

[BillLoguidice]

 

 

That phone app though is intriguing me. I think it was always incredibly stupid MS and Sony did not have one of those apps. Most people have smart phones or tablets, especially the younger game hungry types. Nintendo may be ultimately doing something very right the haters just crap on as it's Nintendo (again) doing it first. Imagine having full eShop access. Full friends list access and all that entails with private messages, conversations, setting meetings to get online and play Switch. You get messages and notifcations on the instant for game sales, package deals from third party(game) vendors, and more right on your Android/iOS device. People want to mock and lie about it only being for in game voice chat and crap...whatever. Then why sell headsets for it from various makers for in game chat meant for the hardware, none of their early packaging say -- Turtle Beach SwitchX1 Headset for your phone, no it says FOR Switch. Best to just take Nintendo in respect to US politics and the media...a rote pile of f'ing lies and manipulation to mess with people with layers of half truths and fake news. Let it roll out, THEN whine if they come up short.

 

Sony and Microsoft do have full mobile apps for their consoles (and in Microsoft's case, Windows 10 PCs; a lot of stuff is available via Web browser too--I don't recall Nintendo providing that option). The only thing that's different is that they don't force you to use those apps for things that are arguably best served by being onboard the console. We'll have to see if Nintendo has figured out a good reason not to or it's just "Nintendo being Nintendo" again.

Edited January 22, 2017 by BillLoguidice

[Keatah]

They are already way too small. I much prefer the standard size of SD card, less likely to get lost in the couch and sucked up by a vacuum cleaner. I wish more devices stocked the full size slots. Really getting sick of the miniaturization trend. Smaller than Micro? What, you want to pick them up with tweezers? As a chronic nail biter with stubby man fingers, I have a hard enough time lifting a MicroSD card off a smooth tabletop.

 

Heck, even the Nintendo DS/3DS and Switch cards are a bit too small for my liking. I would prefer something more Game Boy sized for a home console, but hey, I'm a retro geek who likes em big!

 

There needs to be a limit on how small they make these things. They have to be handled by real people in the real world. I personally won't choose anything smaller than a micro-SD. That's the limit, and I hope the industry stops there. And I strongly prefer SD card size - big enough for custom labels too.

 

As far as picking them up with man-fingers? Use man-spit to wet your fingers, the stickiness will allow them to adhere and you'll be pick'n'up lickety-split! Not sticky enough you say? Use something more adhesive like snots or ear-wax.

[Tanooki]

Hmm I must have missed that one then a I don't recall Sony having a full setup on android/ios. I know they had a fairly decent iteration of their PSN store through the web though as I checked it out a few times over the year (I've had all of their hardware.)

[Andromeda Stardust]

Anyone remember Sony smartphones and laptops? Whatever happened to those?

Hmm I must have missed that one then a I don't recall Sony having a full setup on android/ios. I know they had a fairly decent iteration of their PSN store through the web though as I checked it out a few times over the year (I've had all of their hardware.)

[Flojomojo]

I don't know anyone in real life with a Sony phone, but it seems like James Bond and Tony Stark use Android-esque stuff like this. http://xperiaz7.com... not that Sony or Microsoft's Playstation or Xbox apps (respectively) do much. The Windows 10 app is supposed to stream Xbone games, but I had trouble getting it working yesterday.

 

Here's an attractive countdown clock to the Switch launch. http://mafro.ca/switch/