Are YouTubers Ruining Retro Gaming?

[Tanooki]

That's kind of my take on it. I'm getting rid of the fat, enjoying what is worth owning still, and if the urge to splurge ever hits the prices suck so hard the Everdrive N8 is a godsend price wise and capability too. You can look at it at 1/10th the price of Little Samson and you get a few 1000 games to enjoy in one space FDS included.

[game_escape]

Wow, what a fiery and entertaining thread. I need to come by the forums more often. I know I'm late to the game here, but I'll offer a few observations.

 

On YouTubers ruining retro gaming: I think they are "ruining" it in two ways. I do believe there is a strong correlation between big YouTubers videos' and the prices of retro games, and that the more exposure a game gets, the more the price spirals upward. In that sense they have unintentionally limited access to the hobby for younger people looking to learn about and experience gaming history. I also think that the nature of the YouTube business model pushes lots creators to make derivative, boring, standardized content that has diluted the community over the years, thus ruining it a second way. In fact, I call this the problem the "retro personality" syndrome. Once the formula for "retro" was established by the PeterDorrs, HCGs, and MJRs of the world, the rest of the scene seemed to develop the same nostalgia for the same games, the same sense of fashion, and the same in-jokes. So while the act of retro gaming is still rewarding, the cost of entry and sense of community have suffered greatly.

 

On the financialization of gaming: Regardless of what one thinks of capitalism or how market incentives poison or propel hobbies, I don't take issue with people trying to maximize their profit when they sell games. If someone is willing to pay X, why charge less? Money is a finite resource for many of us, and there is no reason to leave it on the table when it is not necessary to do so. Yes, it is bad for me if I want to buy a game, but at the same token, I have no real need to play games on physical hardware, so if I can emulate something or get it on Steam or the Virtual Console, I am okay with it. As I get older, it is more about the experience and the memories and less about the fetish of physical hardware.

 

On monetizing YouTube channels: I personally believe in the value of good criticism and fair assessment, and believe that this work should be compensated. I'm a small-time YouTuber and I've monetized my channel, because it would illogical not to try and earn some money on the time invested, even if I ultimately invested that time because it was a hobby. That having been said, I've encouraged people to run adblocker on my channel if they are bothered by the ads. It is ultimately their choice if and how they want to support what I'm doing. The problem, again, is the business model of YouTube. That is what can lead people to compromise their integrity and produce click-bait. And I know that I, as a viewer of YouTube, am watching less and less because of this. Very sad for such a promising medium. I think we acutally need a Consumer Reports type outlet for gaming journalism in general- completely independent (or as close to it as possible) and financed by subscribers. It won't happen, because there probably isn't a market to pay for it, but one can dream....

[derFunkenstein]

When historians chronicle YouTubers ruining all the fun old stuff in their history books, they'll call it The Great Retrocide of 2017.

[Flojomojo]

When historians chronicle YouTubers ruining all the fun old stuff in their history books, they'll call it The Great Retrocide of 2017.

But I thought plastic cartridges were the One True Form of gaming, since downloads and games as services are ephemeral and subject to being ganked by the rights holders at any time, for any reason, because Orwell?

[derFunkenstein]

But I thought plastic cartridges were the One True Form of gaming, since downloads and games as services are ephemeral and subject to being ganked by the rights holders at any time, for any reason, because Orwell?

 

Don't look at me, man. I buy Everdrives.

[82-T/A]

The answer is unequivocally yes! Youtube puts all the smartphone-era idiots in the spotlight. And more than 90% of game reviews on YT are loud screaming messes without focus. Not to mention it encourages hoarding.. And they often get the historical facts wrong.

 

And just when you think it's over, you get bombarded with requests to follow their channel.

 

 

I love you Keatah! Hahah...

 

Here I am, ruining the used kitchen appliance industry...

 

 

 

This is a video I took of my new (used) cooktop I installed in my kitchen when I was still renovating it, when I moved ahead of my family for work.

[Keatah]

On YouTubers ruining retro gaming: I think they are "ruining" it in two ways. I do believe there is a strong correlation between big YouTubers videos' and the prices of retro games, and that the more exposure a game gets, the more the price spirals upward. In that sense they have unintentionally limited access to the hobby for younger people looking to learn about and experience gaming history. I also think that the nature of the YouTube business model pushes lots creators to make derivative, boring, standardized content that has diluted the community over the years, thus ruining it a second way. In fact, I call this the problem the "retro personality" syndrome. Once the formula for "retro" was established by the PeterDorrs, HCGs, and MJRs of the world, the rest of the scene seemed to develop the same nostalgia for the same games, the same sense of fashion, and the same in-jokes. So while the act of retro gaming is still rewarding, the cost of entry and sense of community have suffered greatly.

 

Heh. Once something goes mainstream and is shaped by formulas and preconceived notions preached by marketers, all originality goes out the door. Monkey see monkey do. I'm just happy to have built my own experiences. And also happy to have my own emulation experiences - which are completely different than those provided by YAEBs you get on kickstarter.

 

 

 

On the financialization of gaming: Regardless of what one thinks of capitalism or how market incentives poison or propel hobbies, I don't take issue with people trying to maximize their profit when they sell games. If someone is willing to pay X, why charge less? Money is a finite resource for many of us, and there is no reason to leave it on the table when it is not necessary to do so. Yes, it is bad for me if I want to buy a game, but at the same token, I have no real need to play games on physical hardware, so if I can emulate something or get it on Steam or the Virtual Console, I am okay with it. As I get older, it is more about the experience and the memories and less about the fetish of physical hardware.

 

That's right. While emulation may not provide an exact precise 100% replication, it's pretty damned close. And emulation provides many other benefits which add to the experience. Multiple consoles and cartons full of cartridges can be quite burdensome.

 

 

 

On monetizing YouTube channels: I personally believe in the value of good criticism and fair assessment, and believe that this work should be compensated. I'm a small-time YouTuber and I've monetized my channel, because it would illogical not to try and earn some money on the time invested, even if I ultimately invested that time because it was a hobby. That having been said, I've encouraged people to run adblocker on my channel if they are bothered by the ads. It is ultimately their choice if and how they want to support what I'm doing. The problem, again, is the business model of YouTube. That is what can lead people to compromise their integrity and produce click-bait. And I know that I, as a viewer of YouTube, am watching less and less because of this. Very sad for such a promising medium. I think we acutally need a Consumer Reports type outlet for gaming journalism in general- completely independent (or as close to it as possible) and financed by subscribers. It won't happen, because there probably isn't a market to pay for it, but one can dream....

 

I rarely take youtube reviews seriously. And when I do it's likely when I'm hunting for specific facts. And I skip all ads. I don't care how much anyone proclaims independence or how loud they bark. I don't care how outrageous the circus acts become. Chances are it is being done for monetization - and that means bias. And I don't have time to sort through it all or determine levels of honesty and loyalty.

[Austin]

 

I rarely take youtube reviews seriously. And when I do it's likely when I'm hunting for specific facts. And I skip all ads. I don't care how much anyone proclaims independence or how loud they bark. I don't care how outrageous the circus acts become. Chances are it is being done for monetization - and that means bias. And I don't have time to sort through it all or determine levels of honesty and loyalty.

 

I could imagine you doing this right before getting into bed each night:

 

[Tanooki]

True story, his bedroom is actually a faraday cage.

[DJ Clae]

So "retro personality" is causing all of the SNES preorder and Sonic Mania vids. Makes sense the way you put it.

[high voltage]

I can't believe that there are actually people (watchers), who send YTers games and stuff for free, even paying the expensive P&P. Are they mad?

[StopDrop&Retro]

Is this thread still alive?

 

If it continues any longer it might just kill retro gaming.

[82-T/A]

I can't believe that there are actually people (watchers), who send YTers games and stuff for free, even paying the expensive P&P. Are they mad?

I've given tons of stuff away for free on here and paid for shipping as well. I did so because I wanted it out of my house to declutter and I could afford to do so.

[HoshiChiri]

I can't believe that there are actually people (watchers), who send YTers games and stuff for free, even paying the expensive P&P. Are they mad?

 

Quality items too- the Game Grumps got gifted a Phillips CDi and multiple copies of Zelda's Adventure.

 

Not gonna lie- there is a part of me that's willing to bark memes at a camera if it means a free Keio Flying Squadron.

[Tanooki]

 

Quality items too- the Game Grumps got gifted a Phillips CDi and multiple copies of Zelda's Adventure.

 

Not gonna lie- there is a part of me that's willing to bark memes at a camera if it means a free Keio Flying Squadron.

The sad thing is you'd probably get it. I for one hate being on or even really to a point behind a camera. I don't think anyone could throw enough gaming junk at me to change that to be another mindless face on youtube wasting space on the internet.

[Good_Times]

I watched a bunch of random YT 'gaming' videos last night and now I've got unexplained pox covering my body and my tongue is swollen and green! THANKS for ruining my LIFE, YouTube!!

[keepdreamin]

Is this thread still alive?

 

If it continues any longer it might just kill retro gaming.

 

If you want to kill the thread, you need to make a video about it.

[AtariLeaf]

I can't believe that there are actually people (watchers), who send YTers games and stuff for free, even paying the expensive P&P. Are they mad?

 

Both LGR and the 8BitGuy, two channels I really enjoy, do videos where a lot of people send them a lot of stuff. And not just random junk. Some good quality, expensive items. Some like whole vintage computing systems must be worth hundreds of dollars plus the insane cost of shipping. Some are items that I've coveted for years and for them it's a few seconds of screen time, a "thank you very much" and then on to the next item. Jealous? Sure, but both guys are worth watching so it's all good for me and that's part of the fun of watching it is the quality of the free goodies.

[Flojomojo]

Not gonna lie- there is a part of me that's willing to bark memes at a camera if it means a free Keio Flying Squadron.

Meh, I'll send you a ROM if it will shut you up.

[HoshiChiri]

Meh, I'll send you a ROM if it will shut you up.

 

But I can afford a ROM!

[game_player_s]

There was a gaming convention held where I live for only the second time ever yesterday, first time they did it was last year but they failed to advertise so I didn't know of it then. So anyway, it's the first time I have ever had the opportunity to even attend a gaming convention, so I gladly paid the $5 door fee to get in to the meager convention hall at the area Hilton Hotel, which I had never been in before as I live in the area so why would I?

 

The dealer hall and vendor tables were both sights to experience, mostly to chuckle at the ridiculous prices of some items that made Ebay look like some sort of discount store. Still managed to spend $75. Was rather disappointed no one was interested in the items I had brought to try to sell or trade, but then most of the fellow attendees were either to young to remember what a NeoGeo Pocket Color was or didn't care because it wasn't made by Nintendo... ouch, and likewise for the WonderSwan Color.

 

To my utter dismay there was no gaming industry presence at the con whatsoever, all of the sponsors were privately owned shops from three different states. And the panels being held were equally disappointing as they were all being run by YouTubers I'd never heard of who were all in their twenties on topics very uninteresting to say the least. Only one panel was held that even really seemed fitting to have at a gaming convention, that having been the first of the day; "Intro to Speed Running". The rest of the panels actually had nothing to do with video games or the gaming industry at all. Kinda made me think that whoever dreamed up this convention hadn't thought of having panelists until the last minute and then just searched out local YouTubers to send random invites to.

 

Two of the "vendors" in the dealer hall were also YouTubers/collector's, again never heard of either of the fellows. I did buy from one of them, they had interesting stuff for sale, but I think this is a really weird trend to see people setting up shop as "YouTube Channel X" instead of the convention typical "business name" or the ever so common business licensed vendor with no business name displayed for which there were more than a couple of present as well. But I digress, one of said YouTube Vendors actually had on his sign that he's a "video game historian"... but he said something rather stupid when I was checking out some of the rather out of place games for a rather obscure gaming platform which he had on his table that made me realize his knowledge was evidently confined to only the recent years since he implied lack of knowledge and lack of interest in whatever said games were for. Might note they were the only games on his table which pre-dated the year 2000 for when they had been released. I did acquire two of said games from him at the very reasonable pricing of $5 each. But that is still nagging at me he was a self-proclaimed "historian", I would have felt better about it had he engaged in conversation to inquire at least some interest in learning a little about that which he clearly lacked knowledge of as any good student of history would have done, but he didn't!

 

The other YouTube vendor had nearly a third of his table covered in stacks of VHS tapes and DVDs he admitted he was just trying to purge from his own collection, and not moving them as one could imagine since one doesn't attend a gaming convention and go to the dealer hall expecting to find VHS tapes, unless they're for the Action Maxx or the like which his were not. He didn't have prices on anything! Instead you asked how much and he had to look up the going rate of said title using his smart phone, and from the glimpse I caught believe he was using Amazon.com as his point of reference for "current going rates", needless to say he was exceptionally overpriced on everything! His Turbo Grafx 16 games, as prime example, started at $100... while I do not argue that some of said platform game titles he had do actually go for that on Ebay when complete, he only had one game present that was complete, and I was quoted $150 on it... which I have confirmed is the happy median a complete copy goes for on Ebay, but still, the rest of the games were overpriced.

 

So I'm not going to flat out say that YouTuber's ruined the convention, but I will say the convention planners poorly chose their panelists. If they wanted to bring in YouTubers as panelists they should have at least asked their candidates to submit proposals on the topicality of what their panels would be on before selecting them. As it was I felt like I paid a $5 entry fee to go to a flea market targeted at video game collector's, again not that I'm complaining as I did find and purchase a few things that made it worth my trouble. Even so, the local annual anime con, which so far has never gotten any industry endorsements or famous guests or panelists, tends to be a better overall experience as far as my convention experience goes.

 

But back to the original topic of this discussion, I have a mixed feeling about this matter. There are many YouTubers I have watched that I feel are passionate about the games and the collecting hobby and pricing discussion and play-through videos are not things they engage in doing, these folk I don't believe harm retro gaming in any way aside from possibly drawing attention to scarce titles from time to time. But then you have the play-through folk who literally record the entire game play experience from start to end and in many cases spoil the game for the viewer to the point they're unlikely to ever play it for themselves. Then you have the flippers and the hunter dealers. who have to show off their recent finds, discuss what they paid and how much profit they're going to resell for, those guys have just about destroyed the ability for actual players and collectors to find retro games in the wild. I know all of us who collect end up with loads of dupes over the coarse of time that we end up selling or trading off through various means, but the vast majority of us like for that side of the collecting equation to remain a private factor, not something of public record that we plaster video of ourselves online bragging about for all the world to see.

[Neo 64]

 

Quality items too- the Game Grumps got gifted a Phillips CDi and multiple copies of Zelda's Adventure.

 

Not gonna lie- there is a part of me that's willing to bark memes at a camera if it means a free Keio Flying Squadron.

Its insane how people will send multiple hundreds of dollars in games, and all they get in return is some youtube personality to say their first name and a thanks.

[derFunkenstein]

Y'know, usually it's Millennials getting blamed for killing something, but when it comes to vintage gaming, the Youtubers generally look like people my age (which is firmly planted in mid-GenX). Finally, my generation can claim credit for ruining something.

[Flojomojo]

Y'know, usually it's Millennials getting blamed for killing something, but when it comes to vintage gaming, the Youtubers generally look like people my age (which is firmly planted in mid-GenX). Finally, my generation can claim credit for ruining something.

Ha! Well put. "Generation X Is Killing Retro Gaming." Even though Millenials are killing everything else, at least that's what the change-hating headline-writers would have you believe.

 

[WispFollower]

It's hard for me to imagine anything probable which would ruin retro gaming for me besides maybe something from within, like burning out on playing or collecting too much. Anything with value will have a market, which has variables affecting the supply and demand. YouTube is just another market variable, and no amount of angry fist shaking will cause it to cease to exist. Maybe I just don't watch enough content I hate to put that much thought into it. Life is too short to find more reasons to raise one's blood pressure. I enjoy my retro games and a few people who put out videos about them while avoiding annoying or uninteresting ones.

 

I do not want to condescend anyone here, but I guess this kind of rage confuses me a bit. Don't run a feed of frustrating content into your life. It's surprisingly simple. We can't choose how to spend every second of our lives, but we have reasonable control over our recreational experiences, right? I hate bullshit spin, so I don't watch the news. I can't stand pop music, so I listen to better stuff. People who dominate the conversation annoy me, so I do not befriend them. I understand no one wants to pay more money for anything, so if the prices go up, it's a bummer. However, I do see a plus side to the rise in values and even the ridiculous craigslist, ebay, etc. posts which have some common game for a crazy price. If retro games are being overvalued by people who have or find them, they are more likely to be saved or preserved. I find it much better than the countless stories people have told me about how their family member, spouse, etc. threw away all their games, "because it was just old trash not worth anything." If everyone thinks old games are gold, they will be more likely to save them. If they put them on the market for way too much, they will eventually learn the real value due to no interest.

 

I do some collecting, but maybe I'm not serious enough to be horribly affected by a rise in prices. If I want a game which is a hundred bucks, I think about what I have to do for a hundred bucks, and ask myself if I will get the worth of it if I trade my efforts for the game. If I decide I want it, the purchase is made, the game is enjoyed, no regrets. If it isn't worth it, I must not want it that badly, so I walk away and find something else to spend that money on. I'm not trying to oversimplify things here, but my point is you control how you spend your free time, which games are on your shelf, how you spend your disposable income, what YouTube videos you watch, which people you listen to, and countless other things in your life. Why fill it with things which bring you down? Why spend so much time directing your mood to unpleasant places?

 

Upon reflecting on the time I spent writing this post, I will end it here and go back to increasing my relaxation to maximum levels.

Edited August 20, 2017 by WispFollower