Playing Sam's Journey, would an A8 version be possible

[MaDDuck]

Sam's Journey is the most amazing game that I have ever played on a C-64! Play it if you can...

 

Are there any intrepid A8 programers out there that can bring something of this quality over? Is there even a market for new games on the A8 line??

 

Not trolling, I swear!

[emkay]

Sam's Journey is the most amazing game that I have ever played on a C-64! Play it if you can...

Why? It's just another platformer. Using weird colors and dull music.

If you like it, play it

 

Are there any intrepid A8 programers out there that can bring something of this quality over? Is there even a market for new games on the A8 line??

 

Not trolling, I swear!

The game is of course possible on the Atari. But that means nothing.

An approvement of possible and nice looking platformers is Crownland.

 

 

 

A tad lower resolution, 128 instead of 16 colors, POKEY tunes instead of SID tunes....

 

But I'd rather like to see smooth Ego-View games on the Atari. It's so much more fun.

[MaDDuck]

Hmmmm,,,,,,,,,,,,

Crownland looks great, I may have to play it when it comes out. Hope it runs on my NTSC 130XE.

 

The colors on Sam's Journey may be a bit loud, but the soundtrack is great, heck they even included a CD of it when I purchased the game.

it sounds great!

 

 

 

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by MaDDuck

[kiwilove]

I'll guess it'll be a matter of time for when the right people get together to fill that void of a suitably impressive platform type game to appear on the A8 hardware - that is up to the standard of Crownland? If not - would someone hack Crownland for a better control system?

 

I don't go looking for PC games that much - but these two caught my attention - because of free downloads and the quality of their updates/revisited status.

 

A homebrew of StreetFighter II Deluxe - which includes way more characters than ever before. M.U.G.E.N development system - which is suppose to be for non-programmers - who like the sideways beat' em ups - the likes of SF2 and such like games.

 

 

And a Streets of Rage Remake - which has loads of toggle options

 

While these games have nothing to do with the A8 hardware etc - it might give hope that something like this - could be done for the A8?

That the right people come together - to bring a certain game genre to completion?

 

Harvey

[Gunstar]

Hmmmm,,,,,,,,,,,,

Crownland looks great, I may have to play it when it comes out. Hope it runs on my NTSC 130XE.

 

 

Crownland has been out...for YEARS. Yes it runs on NTSC130XE.

 

http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-crownland_20358.html

Edited March 16, 2018 by Gunstar

[Gunstar]

But just because the Atari has Crownland doesn't mean we don't need more scrolling platformers. There is still a lack of those. The Atari has plenty of screen-to-screen and one screen per level platformers, but less than a dozen scrolling platformers, half of which aren't that good. I'm even considering Treasure Island Dizzy in the scroller catagory, even though it's half and half.

Edited March 16, 2018 by Gunstar

[emkay]

Hmmmm,,,,,,,,,,,,

Crownland looks great, I may have to play it when it comes out. Hope it runs on my NTSC 130XE.

 

The colors on Sam's Journey may be a bit loud, but the soundtrack is great, heck they even included a CD of it when I purchased the game.

it sounds great!

 

You know what's strange about your post?

In the upper Video you tell how great the tunes in the game were. In the lower video, the game is presented with "modern synth sound"

Edited March 16, 2018 by emkay

[Bill Loguidice]

Crownland looks nice, but I don't see how it's equivalent to Sam's Journey. Not having played it directly, it looks like it pretty much only scrolls to the right and is a much simpler game. Sam's Journey scrolls in all directions and has a much nicer use of color and a polish that Crownland lacks (not to take away from the excellent achievement that is Crownland, of course).

[emkay]

Crownland looks nice, but I don't see how it's equivalent to Sam's Journey. Not having played it directly, it looks like it pretty much only scrolls to the right and is a much simpler game. Sam's Journey scrolls in all directions and has a much nicer use of color and a polish that Crownland lacks (not to take away from the excellent achievement that is Crownland, of course).

 

As I wrote above. It means nothing, if such a game is possible on the A8 or not.

At 1st, it is build on the strengths of the C64, so it cannot be reached this way on the A8. But the colors were much friendlier in Crownland even in the Demo state.

At 2nd, there will never be a group of intrepid coders, doing such a game optimized for the Atari.

At 3rd, Games were not possible on the Atari, to write them on the Atari itself, but conversions from other games get valid. But then they run better than on the original machine.

 

 

 

Btw. On which software is the soundtrack build ? Could be interesting to hear more "airy" editions of them played by POKEY

[Bill Loguidice]

As I wrote above. It means nothing, if such a game is possible on the A8 or not.

At 1st, it is build on the strengths of the C64, so it cannot be reached this way on the A8. But the colors were much friendlier in Crownland even in the Demo state.

At 2nd, there will never be a group of intrepid coders, doing such a game optimized for the Atari.

At 3rd, Games were not possible on the Atari, to write them on the Atari itself, but conversions from other games get valid. But then they run better than on the original machine.

 

 

 

Btw. On which software is the soundtrack build ? Could be interesting to hear more "airy" editions of them played by POKEY

 

I get you don't like the sound on the C-64 for whatever reason - that's down to personal preference - but I genuinely struggle seeing how you think the colors are better on Crownland.

 

Anyway, I think the original question was about bringing something of Sam's Journey quality to the Atari. For that I guess, we'll have to wait and see. It seems like eventually we'll get there.

[carlsson]

The two games also are 10 years apart, so not ideal to compare them as much really has happened both on the C64 and Atari 8-bit computers in the past decade. I wonder which C64 games are honest to compare with Crownland (2007), if Sam's Journey is a bit too "developed", if you understand what I mean.

 

Bugs in Buggyland (2006) is a preview version made by Mad / Bauknecht, later known for Majesty of Sprites and Pets Rescue on the Plus/4, which have been discussed here just a few weeks ago. Since Bugs is just a preview, it doesn't necessarily mark top of the C64 scrolling platformers at the time, just that is very close in time to Crownland.

 

Knight 'n Grail (2009) is very highly regarded on the C64 though not exactly the same kind of game. I don't know if anyone in the Atari community has wished for a port of this game.

 

Generally I think it is better to work from the strengths and weaknesses of your target system, than trying to port a new, impressive game in an existing genre where you'll spend more time on trying to work around limitations than working with strengths. It seems to me a fair number of the recent Atari games from ABBUC and other places are well developed, though perhaps not utterly optimized unlike what many C64 programmers keep doing.

[emkay]

The two games also are 10 years apart, so not ideal to compare them as much really has happened both on the C64 and Atari 8-bit computers in the past decade.

You cannot compare the timeline of both in any way.

[Bill Loguidice]

Wow, no disrespect to the people involved and the work put into it, but "Bugs in Buggyland" looks like a monstrosity in that state.

 

And yeah, as a flick-screen game, I wouldn't count Knight n Grail.

 

Anyway, I agree that it's tough to match the overall quality of recent releases like Sam's Journey and Galencia. Those are probably tops in their respective genres and will be difficult to exceed for a variety of reasons. Again, I think the original poster was talking about matching the overall polish/scope of Sam's Journey on the Atari side, not necessarily the technical specifics.

[emkay]

I get you don't like the sound on the C-64 for whatever reason - that's down to personal preference

It's not a personal preference, if the music is pressed through a telephone speaker. It's a technical thing...

[Bill Loguidice]

It's not a personal preference, if the music is pressed through a telephone speaker. It's a technical thing...

 

You know, it's OK to admit it's a personal preference.

[carlsson]

Sure, I would much rather throw in Mayhem in Monsterland from 1993, but it would almost seem like an insult to compare an Atari homebrew from 2007 with a commercial C64 game released almost 15 years before.

 

I wonder if it is the fact there are commercial publishers of new C64 games, and people willing to buy them, that makes recent homebrews so polished. I used to think that most of the new C64 games were quick and dirty releases, not much to pay attention to despite being a C64 user for 30+ years, but apparently the bar has been raised a couple of levels in the past few years. I'll assume there are commercial publishers of new Atari 8-bit games too, for developers to have something to strive towards.

[Bill Loguidice]

Sure, I would much rather throw in Mayhem in Monsterland from 1993, but it would almost seem like an insult to compare an Atari homebrew from 2007 with a commercial C64 game released almost 15 years before.

 

I wonder if it is the fact there are commercial publishers of new C64 games, and people willing to buy them, that makes recent homebrews so polished. I used to think that most of the new C64 games were quick and dirty releases, not much to pay attention to despite being a C64 user for 30+ years, but apparently the bar has been raised a couple of levels in the past few years. I'll assume there are commercial publishers of new Atari 8-bit games too, for developers to have something to strive towards.

 

The homebrew versus commercial release thing is a tough one. Certainly on the C-64 side, the past 5 years of homebrew releases have plenty of games that easily match the top commercial releases in the system's heyday. There are definitely some of those on the Atari side as well, but certainly fewer that hit the same high notes.

 

It may very well come down to not having equivalents like Protovision on the Atari side. I'm constantly impressed by the standards that Protovision holds their releases to and the many formats they make things available on. They've clearly hit on a workable economic model, despite some challenges here and there.

 

Of course, it may also come down to simple numbers. There are probably far more C-64 system users out there than Atari 8-bit system users out there, just like it was back in the day. Either way, both are fantastic platforms for modern development, and put most other vintage computing platforms to shame when it comes to modern game creations. Others right up there obviously include platforms like the ZX Spectrum.

[www.atarimania.com]

Let's not kid ourselves and be perfectly honest... I really love Crownland on a technical level but, in terms of gameplay, it's similar to a standard Commodore 64 budget game from the early nineties such as Turbo the Tortoise or the like: quite linear and too short. I'd be perfectly happy with something like Terry's Big Adventure to begin with... and that's coming from a diehard Atari fan! In terms of gameplay, personality, depth, Sam's Journey is in another league (and so is the 25-year old Mayhem in Monsterland for that matter).

 

--

Atari Frog

http://www.atarimania.com

[Gunstar]

Are any of you guys aware of the fantastic scrolling platformer from 1993 by L.K. Avalon? I think it's going to be or is already, part of Duddie's classic re-releases.

It's called Wloczykij , and I found this little gem a few months ago. I'm not suggesting any comparisons to the above games, but it's sort of a Dizzy clone I guess, but really well done. I've been playing it a lot lately. The only thing I don't like is that if you die, you have to start the level over and everything is reset, so even though you have like 5 lives, a strategy I already use is to just keep restarting the game, at least until I get past level one (memorization and practice), that way I have more restarts on level 2 and beyond.

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by Gunstar

[Bill Loguidice]

Are any of you guys aware of the fantastic scrolling platformer from 1993 by L.K. Avalon? I think it's going to be or is already, part of Duddie's classic re-releases.

It's called Wloczykij , and I found this little gem a few months ago. I'm not suggesting any comparisons to the above games, but it's sort of a Dizzy clone I guess, but really well done. I've been playing it a lot lately. The only thing I don't like is that if you die, you have to start the level over and everything is reset, so even though you have like 5 lives, a strategy I already use is to just keep restarting the game, at least until I get past level one (memorization and practice), that way I have more restarts on level 2 and beyond.

 

 

It looks pretty good (aside from that cover art -- wow!), although the lack of sound effects is kind of jarring for this type of game (although the music is excellent).

[www.atarimania.com]

I think it's a terribly rigid game with very few original elements and bad gameplay. BTW, the graphics are ripped from a number of Commodore 64 programs.

 

--

Atari Frog

http://www.atarimania.com

[emkay]

I think it's a terribly rigid game with very few original elements and bad gameplay. BTW, the graphics are ripped from a number of Commodore 64 programs.

 

--

Atari Frog

http://www.atarimania.com

"Wochiky" is a interesting part of Atari history when you look at the availability of the 8 bits in Poland and the year when it arrived.

The music went to a better level there, and particular Thomasz Liebich did better music than all of those "musicians" from the 80s on the Atari.

But, instead of "yeah, the next game will be the hit" .... nothing happens, or even things turned bad ....

The game is followed by a lot of games where the protagonist is build on "move a dot and do a dot" .... no progress in Atari developed games.

[Mclaneinc]

Can't say I liked that game much, just feels wrong...

 

I had another play of Sams J and I'd be stunned if it could be done on the Atari, something a bit like it yes but to that quality, no. ANd this is where Emkay says that it could be done and even better, when it was announced on the C64 no one believed it was a real game, they said the screens were mock ups. When they said it scrolled all over the place it was again mocked as a lie but when the video's started coming people were saying WOW, how do they do that. Since its release its still amazing people and I love it but then again I don't tie myself to one system, I go where the goodness is.

 

So, no I don't think Sams could happen on the Atari but I'm too busy enjoying what IS on the Atari, there's stuff that still knocks my socks off like Space Harrier, Stunt Car Racer, RGB and a suitcase load of others.

[Gunstar]

 

It looks pretty good (aside from that cover art -- wow!), although the lack of sound effects is kind of jarring for this type of game (although the music is excellent).

As usual, there are sound effects if you turn off the music. Usual select/option.

 

I do think the graphics get better after level one, a better use of color anyway, and there is variety. In level 2 or 3, I forget ATM, you are going threw a town/village which is quite nice looking. Once you get used to how your character moves and what to avoid, and what you can jump on top of to kill, and what not, I find it very fun, if frustrating, I do make progress and I'm getting better and it's less and less frustrating.

 

But for a scrolling platformer on the A8 from 1993, I think it's very impressive and very playable,if you give it a chance. Of course I still prefer, Crownland and Treasure Island Dizzy.

Edited March 16, 2018 by Gunstar

[emkay]

Can't say I liked that game much, just feels wrong...

 

I had another play of Sams J and I'd be stunned if it could be done on the Atari, something a bit like it yes but to that quality, no. ANd this is where Emkay says that it could be done and even better,

into the Atari direction...

 

when it was announced on the C64 no one believed it was a real game, they said the screens were mock ups.

I don't see anything new on the C64. It's just the combination of levels and features that have been in other games before, just put into one game. The gameplay reminds a lot of Giana Sisters.

So where's the miracle?

The difference to prior C64 releases is that TV Sets didn't handle the hires colors right. Then the games use the easiest to program parts of the C64. There is also a lot of real useful tools to develop graphics for games and music. On the PC it is a piece of cake to create "Data" for such scrolling games with sprites.