Voxel Flight POC

[42bs]

9 hours ago, philipj said:

I just made a couple of simple statements and it got thrown all out of proportion for basically no good reason.

But "why" make statements about "nurbs" and "splines" if you do not have the slightest idea a) what it is and b) what the Jaguar can do.

[Zerosquare]

Because self-delusion is an addictive drug.

Edited September 7, 2022 by Zerosquare

[42bs]

Yepp, reality-distortion fields are wide-spread. Only in rare case something good results from it (Jobs, Musk).

[philipj]

I took a whole course in CAD using both AutoCAD and Rhino 3D (a spline and nurb based program )... most of 3D modeling in the very early 80s were mostly spline and nurb based due to their simplicity of rendering on limited technology, most of them using Motorola 68000 based graphic workstations controlling non-DSP... not delusional, but if any of you still want to put more attention on my two little original, go right ahead.

[+CyranoJ]

[Cebus Capucinis]

She must be calculating the spline to nurb ratio.

[+Stephen]

24 minutes ago, Cebus Capucinis said:

She must be calculating the spline to nurb ratio.

Or the complex numberwang of cycle counting to determine the ultimate FPS that the never coming code won't produce but should because you know, ideas.

[Cebus Capucinis]

1 minute ago, Stephen said:

Or the complex numberwang of cycle counting to determine the ultimate FPS that the never coming code won't produce but should because you know, ideas.

Everyone knows the spline-to-nurb ratio is directly related to FPS numberwang.

 

THAT'S NUMBERWANG!

[+cubanismo]

This poor thread. The actual code here is so cool.

[philipj]

30 minutes ago, cubanismo said:

This poor thread. The actual code here is so cool.

I only made two post originally... TWO... it turned into all of this... go figure. I never intended for things to skew like this.

Edited September 8, 2022 by philipj

[Austin]

11 hours ago, philipj said:

I took a whole course in CAD using both AutoCAD and Rhino 3D (a spline and nurb based program )... most of 3D modeling in the very early 80s were mostly spline and nurb based due to their simplicity of rendering on limited technology, most of them using Motorola 68000 based graphic workstations controlling non-DSP... not delusional, but if any of you still want to put more attention on my two little original, go right ahead.

Pointing and clicking is also NOT programming.

6 hours ago, philipj said:

I only made two post originally... TWO... it turned into all of this... go figure. I never intended for things to skew like this.

You make these posts EVERY thread where there's any chance to toss around any kind of theory. People aren't annoyed because of two posts in this thread, they are annoyed that the majority of your 900+ posts here over the years have been nonsensical dribble with zero experience to back it up.

[42bs]

13 hours ago, philipj said:

I took a whole course in CAD using both AutoCAD and Rhino 3D (a spline and nurb based program )... most of 3D modeling in the very early 80s were mostly spline and nurb based due to their simplicity of rendering on limited technology, most of them using Motorola 68000 based graphic workstations controlling non-DSP... not delusional, but if any of you still want to put more attention on my two little original, go right ahead.

This thread is way beyond its topic,so w.t.h.: Using a technique is not knowing about its internals nor does it mean you can program it.

The graphics workstations were specialized HW which cannot be compared in any way with the Jaguar.

And: Rendering was not done in realtime let alone 20 or more FPS.

 

 

[philipj]

4 hours ago, Austin said:

Pointing and clicking is also NOT programming.

You make these posts EVERY thread where there's any chance to toss around any kind of theory. People aren't annoyed because of two posts in this thread, they are annoyed that the majority of your 900+ posts here over the years have been nonsensical dribble with zero experience to back it up.

True on most of what you've said except for the 900+ part... tried bare some consistency on most my post... you can at least give me some credit for that. 🙂

 

1 hour ago, 42bs said:

This thread is way beyond its topic,so w.t.h.: Using a technique is not knowing about its internals nor does it mean you can program it.

The graphics workstations were specialized HW which cannot be compared in any way with the Jaguar.

And: Rendering was not done in realtime let alone 20 or more FPS.

 

 

Well... that's why I mentioned experimenting with voxels in response Saron's post... it's also why I mentioned looking at things differently so that my ideas doesn't get lost in the thick of all of this information I run into that tends to throw things off like this topic for example. And you're right most of those old workstations only 20fps if that... on the flip side I've considered the as a 2D monster that handles 2D exceptionally well thus I believe is what will carry the day in faking 3D using 2D methods to achieve that... hopefully something different than what Sega did for the Saturn; something custom to the Atari Jaguar's strengths.

 

Was thinking about what Saron said about blabbing my ideas and keeping it to myself and he's probably right; the only is I've already done and this topic I made a couple of post not thinking it would skew like it did, but knowing CJ and guess I should expect nothing less... he's also have been very consistent.

[+remowilliams]

Random word salad - even using actual words that mean something in the general context of 3D, or gaming, or the Jaguar - is still random nonsense.  IT IS NOT 'ideas' or 'projects' or 'thoughts' or 'information'

 

You have zero experience and zero actual working knowledge of the topics you're commenting on and you're attempting (very badly and very repeatedly over a huge swath of time) to speak in a manner to show that you do.

 

Please stop.
 

[+CyranoJ]

5 hours ago, philipj said:

but knowing CJ and guess I should expect nothing less... he's also have been very consistent.

 

There are now more posts from other people than me in this thread advising you to stop making yourself look like an idiot, including from the o.p.

[+Sauron]

6 hours ago, philipj said:

Was thinking about what Saron said about blabbing my ideas and keeping it to myself and he's probably right; the only is I've already done and this topic I made a couple of post not thinking it would skew like it did, but knowing CJ and guess I should expect nothing less... he's also have been very consistent.

First of all, check my name again, and spell it correctly. It's not that difficult, it's only 6 letters. And not sure why you're trying to pick on CJ here, he's but one of many who have been telling you the same thing.

 

[jguff]

7 hours ago, philipj said:

True on most of what you've said except for the 900+ part... tried bare some consistency on most my post... you can at least give me some credit for that. 🙂

 

Well... that's why I mentioned experimenting with voxels in response Saron's post... it's also why I mentioned looking at things differently so that my ideas doesn't get lost in the thick of all of this information I run into that tends to throw things off like this topic for example. And you're right most of those old workstations only 20fps if that... on the flip side I've considered the as a 2D monster that handles 2D exceptionally well thus I believe is what will carry the day in faking 3D using 2D methods to achieve that... hopefully something different than what Sega did for the Saturn; something custom to the Atari Jaguar's strengths.

 

Was thinking about what Saron said about blabbing my ideas and keeping it to myself and he's probably right; the only is I've already done and this topic I made a couple of post not thinking it would skew like it did, but knowing CJ and guess I should expect nothing less... he's also have been very consistent.

There are some people in this world...
who know when to stop...
and some people who don't.
Which kind are you?
(https://www.springfieldspringfield.co.uk/movie_script.php?movie=highlander-ii)

[WAVE 1 GAMES]

On 8/28/2022 at 8:44 AM, 42bs said:

Latest version:

Source on github:

https://github.com/42Bastian/JaguarDemos/tree/main/voxelFlight

 

Edit:

Smoothed landscape:

 

 

I really like what you have done here with this demo. I have always wanted to see more voxel stuff on the Jag.

 

I can't wait to see where this goes

 

great to see the gangs all still together around here

[JagChris]

How feasible would it be for something like this be used for games like Rogue Squadron or Magic Carpet in the Jag instead of polygons.

[42bs]

No chance.

[JagChris]

9 hours ago, 42bs said:

No chance.

Ah that's too bad. 

 

It just seems like use of the technique in games like Phase Zero with its speed, large mountains and even well defined paths and waterways (and also in Fallen Angels with the ability to fly in, out and over large canyons) is almost right there in terms of recreating most of what you see in games like Magic Carpet and Rogue Squadron.

 

 

Edited September 11, 2022 by JagChris

[42bs]

PZ is impressive. I wonder what horizontal rez they have?

[JagChris]

1 hour ago, 42bs said:

PZ is impressive. I wonder what horizontal rez they have?

I think Atari Owl had that figured out at one point. He seemed to really enjoy working out things like that.

[Lostdragon]

On 8/28/2022 at 7:58 PM, JagChris said:

Didn't Magic Carpet do something similar to this though to generate its landscapes?

Glenn Corpes would be the man to ask, he can be found talking about Magic Carpet on his blog:

 

http://glenncorpes.blogspot.com/2011/06/magic-carpet-re-release.html?m=1

 

 

And I put a quote from him up on Unseen64 at the time, but stupidly didn't give the source.. 

 

Sorry. 

 

 

Glenn:I wrote the 3 DDA (U, V and shade) affine texture mapper for Magic
Carpet to replace my original vertical scanning voxelish engine (never
released but there is a movie of it inside the flight simulator ride in
Theme Park if anyone is sad enough to look). It was reused for
Hi-octane, slightly upgraded for Magic Carpet II and Syndicate Wars and
rewritten with optional PPro optimisations and a few new modes for
Dungeon Keeper. At some point along the way it should have had subpixel
accuracy added (very easy to fix, and probably responsible for your
use of the word ‘wavery’). IMO the way the lack of z-buffer forced us to
use smaller polygons paid off pretty well in making Dungeon Keeper at
least look different (if out of date). Carpet 2 used an updated version
of the carpet engine, Hi-octane used an early version of the Keeper
engine but apart from that there is no common code outside the polygon
routine. Populous 3 uses another variation of the same texture mapper
but also uses D3D for anyone with a decent hardware

 

[JagChris]

20 hours ago, 42bs said:

PZ is impressive. I wonder what horizontal rez they have?

It Looks like it might be comparable to your 192 Rez.

 

It's fast, long draw distance. Has a HUD. transparencies. AI. Bitmap shots, enemies, trees etc.

 

I'm not positive looking at the video but it actually looks like the river has it's own flow and current.

 

I'll have to load it up and see for myself sometime. Unless someone beats me to it.

 

it is real impressive. I never noticed how much so before.

Edited September 12, 2022 by JagChris