Jaki Crush and other SNES pinball games

[Wayler]

I have never been an actual pinball table aficionado but I have always appreciated a well made virtual pinball game. I prefer pinball to be played on a keyboard, as the tactile feel of the long shift-keys serve as a perfect companion to the paddles. But a console controller with shoulder pads works as well, like in case of the SNES.

 

So some time ago I managed to get Jaki Crush as a SFC cart and have been playing it quite a bit. It is so wonderfully weird and well crafted game.

Looks like it's the third installment of a "Crush"-series, but I have not had experience with the previous titles.

 

I feel like a good virtual pinball should do things that can't be made on an actual table and boy, does Jaki Crush deliver on this department.

The depiction of ancient hell as a theme feels perfect and all the critters and demons roaming the board are fascinating.

The inclusion of boss battles is just the thing that sets it apart from most pinball games and adds a welcome goal to the game, so it's not just a hunt for a high score.

I also really like the music in this game and fits the theme.

The hit detection and table outlines might seems a little suspect at times but that hasn't bothered me as the scrolling is smooth and most importantly, I haven't detected any slowdown.

Overall, Jaki Crush has creeped it's way to my all-time top 3 list for pinball games.

 

 

Now, having this encouraging experience, I started researching what other games the SNES has to offer.

And it's slim pickings on that department. Gamefaqs lists these titles in the pinball category:

Battle Pinball

Jaki Crush

Pinball Dreams

Pinball Fantasies

Super Pinball: Behind the Mask

Super Pinball II: The Amazing Odyssey

(Although not a traditional pinball, I would also list American Battle Dome in this category. It's a weird 4-player paddle mayhem)

 

Pinball Dreams and Fantasies have been ported to every machine imaginable and by the looks of them, the SNES-versions don't offer the best experience.

(I really enjoyed Fantasies on PC/DOS back in the day, haven't played Dreams).

The Super Pinball games don't look interesting to me, as they try to emulate a real experience and look quite boring.

So that leaves Battle Pinball and I'm glad at least that looks like incredibly fun, with multiple boards and a similar approach to pinball like Jaki, with boss battles and a sense of progression.

But looking at gameplay videos, there seems to be a lot of slowdown with multiball on play. That will always be a bummer in pinball games.

I'm keen on getting it as a cart, but unfortunately it seems to be an expensive one, so probably will have to go with the emulation route for this one.

 

So what's your take on the SNES pinball scene: great? couldn't care less? Virtual pinball??? only real men play real pinball in a real arcade while being kicked out because you got enraged to a machine with blinking lights that unfairly drained your coins?

 

[Kirk_Johnston]

I think there a couple of decent pinball games on SNES, but I really wish it had seen a port of Devil's Crash/Crush too. I think that's probably the best home console pinball game of that era.

[Tanooki]

It looks like the third Crush game because it is basically, same team, same design concept.

 

I've tried it on the sd2snes, never did get around to grabbing it for some reason, which is strange as it's cheap.

 

You do seem to have a pretty right on more traditional-ish pinball list of titles for the east & west there.  And yes PB Dreams and Fantasies aren't great, average at best on SNES.  The DOS/Amiga and also GBA (Pinball Challenge Deluxe) are excellent versions, later then the digital only that mobile and PSMinis got.

 

Digital Pinball wasn't a huge thing on SNES, nor NES really either.  There are some, just not a lot.  Handheld seemed to get it a bit more but not by some huge margin either.

 

The Super Pinball game pair are boring, they do try and don't do well to immerse you so they're boring and flat failing despite looking like they shouldn't at acting like a table should.

 

Alien Crush/Devils Crash was peak digital pinball of the 8/16bit era on the console side of things, Pinball Dreams/Fantasies were on the best side on the various computers where the ports didn't cut it until after 2000.  GENESIS annoyingly got Devil's Crash as Dragon's Fury with some small bits of censoring, and it got a weird sequel people either love or hate called Dragon's Revenge Tengen did on their own.

 

 

I'm sad (I guess) I never realized Battle Pinball exists, but I never really dug as I didn't think Japan had much outside of Jaki and the 2nd Super Pinball.  That game is SD awesome from Banpresto which means SD Gundam, Ultraman and Kamen Rider (love the first two)  sweeeet...must check into this.  And having watched pieces of a longplay in good chunks of each table that is insane, probably the best table on the system outside of maybe Jaki Crush... US got screwed.

[Wayler]

Damn the first message looks ugly on the phone, really should add extra spaces next time.

 

Anyway,

4 hours ago, Tanooki said:

I've tried it on the sd2snes, never did get around to grabbing it for some reason, which is strange as it's cheap.

I wouldn't consider Jaki Crush cheap anymore, affordable perhaps. I lucked out and got a CIB for around $35 (including shipping and taxes) on a proxy service but the price on Ebay is double that.

 

 

One thing that I forgot to add. Jaki has a password system, so you can save your progress. That is a very strange concept for a pinball game, but then again, it is a very strange game. I didn't even realize this mechanic until now, just paddled away until game over in one sitting. I also like the fact that you have an option to hide away the scorebar with a press of the Y-button.

 

 

There are a lot of comments in Youtube videos where people remember this game fondly from their childhood. I guess the import market worked on this one (that, or then the emulation scene started so long ago, that many were kids back then still, ugh now I feel old). And it's a bit odd this didn't get localized, there's only some japanese text in the end credits I believe. Or maybe Naxat thought it didn't stand a change against the hammer of censorship from Nintendo of America.

 

 

4 hours ago, Tanooki said:

I'm sad (I guess) I never realized Battle Pinball exists, but I never really dug as I didn't think Japan had much outside of Jaki and the 2nd Super Pinball.  That game is SD awesome from Banpresto which means SD Gundam, Ultraman and Kamen Rider (love the first two)  sweeeet...must check into this.  And having watched pieces of a longplay in good chunks of each table that is insane, probably the best table on the system outside of maybe Jaki Crush... US got screwed.

Yes, it does look really fun. There are lots of titles in SD Battle series from various genres, none of which were released in the west. I had The Great Battle III for a while, but blocky brawlers aren't my thing, so I sold it forward. IV and V look to be more in an action/shooter/platform style which look more interesting to me. But again the prices on these ones, yipes.

 

Gamefaqs has a list of all the games in this franchise: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/games/franchise/1672-the-great-battle-compati-heros

[CaptainBreakout]

This... Kind of... Counts...

 

I love me some digital pinball games.  Seriously... Big fan right here.

 

Sooooo... Honestly one of my favorites is Revenge of the Gator. On gameboy. My sister and I would compete for the high score growing up at the family cabin in the summer, where TV was forbidden (thanks gameboy).

 

Why does this count?  The Super Gameboy SNES adapter of course!  You can get Revenge of the Gator super cheap too.  Might not be Jaki Crush, but it's fun as hell.

[Tanooki]

@Wayler The emulation market I guess if you call it that, it would have had given people access to this game in a playable format in windows starting in 1996/97 with SNES96, 96Sound, 97, that merged into the still living SNES9X.  We're looking at that looking back 25 years, and I'd figure most online in the mid 90s were minimally high school or college, it wasn't really kid ready/friendly yet so that would fit having memories of it.  I recall it from the 90s but never really dug into it then forgot about it for ages.

 

I'm guessing but 99% on the certainty of this, it was censorship.  Nintendo even post MK2 had a bug in their ass for a few more years yet about stuff, and even if they did relax, they were a little less(not by much) relaxed than Sega.  Sega slashed up anything slightly demonic, evil, and symbols of evil on the Devils Crash conversion Dragon's Fury. They likely just didn't want to have their work mutilated into something entirely different as it would need far more manipulation than the older title.

 

 

Those banpresto titles I'm familiar with, haven't meddled with many because I utterly hate tactical/strategy RPG stuff which a number are so I'd avoid that.  Some of them are action titles, spinoffs of those with the separate characters like Ultraman Club/Ball and Gundam ranging from a side scroller to Wing(the fighting game) and more.

 

 

Also a suggestion that wouldn't hit the faqs list, Firestriker.  It's pinball/adventure in a hybrid format, rarely done, Odama I guess would be kind of comparable on Gamecube or Devliish on gamegear.

[Wayler]

On 1/14/2023 at 4:31 AM, Tanooki said:

Also a suggestion that wouldn't hit the faqs list, Firestriker.  It's pinball/adventure in a hybrid format, rarely done, Odama I guess would be kind of comparable on Gamecube or Devliish on gamegear.

Firestriker is great, one of the few titles I played through when emulation was new to me. I had it on my mind when making the thread but thought it was more of a breakout variant than pinball so left it out. But hey, since we are here now, why not branch this on to other type of "keep the ball in play"-titles, if there are any. If at all feasible, a cart for this would be nice, but it's again one of those expensive ones, even in SFC (named Holy Striker). Also has a mad 4-player match mode for the multitap. Here's some gameplay:

 

 

 

On a side note, had a brief bout of Jaki Crush again during the weekend. I had a great run on the first ball, getting some extras and defeating a few bosses. It was getting late and decided to pack it in for the night. And then I remembered the password system, found out how to get one through the pause menu, took a snapshot and went to bed. Next morning decided to wake myself up with some demon ball and used the password and...error. Thanks Jaki!

 

 

[jeffythedragonslayer]

@Tanookiwas 96Sound some kind of SPC700 emulator or something?

[Tanooki]

I just didn't write SNES 96 w/sound.  There were two competing parties for SNES96 and SNES97.  96 got sound first, 97 I think had a better general core, so the authors merged them first into SNES96 w/sound, then as SNES9X.

 

 

And I used to have Firestriker within the last 7-10 years back.  I could just not get into it.  Arkanoid stuff I tend to have a love/hate thing with.  I can do fine, but never great, because it makes decades later still 100% NO SENSE how to properly aim or angle the ball, so I can sit on a screen for 5-10+min easily to get that last block which SUCKS.  That game has that same annoying mechanic so I got rid of it because it was more grating now being able to move the story along.  I don't regret getting like $20-40 for it or whatever then vs 100 whatever now.  Hell even barely able to sell for $5 a few years ago Arkanoid SNES itself is stupidly like $20 now which is insane.

 

And on that, that's one Arkanoid Revenge of Doh! one of the last 10 games~ for the SNES to release around 1997 and it falls into the ball/bat physics thing if we're widening the net here.

Edited January 16, 2023 by Tanooki

[SlidellMan]

Jaki Crush was a worthy sequel to both Alien and Devil's Crush, and Hudson Soft even made a WiiWare follow up to the series. It's sad that both companies are no more.

[Tanooki]

You mean the 3D (2.5D) Alien Crush remake?  That was a lot of fun, one of the few downloads I did pick up for the system in the day.

[Kirk_Johnston]

On 1/16/2023 at 4:24 PM, SlidellMan said:

Jaki Crush was a worthy sequel to both Alien and Devil's Crush, and Hudson Soft even made a WiiWare follow up to the series. It's sad that both companies are no more.

Yeah, I recall Hudson Soft put out some pretty good games for SNES.

[Wayler]

So, Breakout games then.

 

 

Probably everyone knows Arkanoid and the SNES had it's own version with Arkanoid: Doh It Again. It's a bizarre release in 1997, when the SNES was already going away.

But it plays as one would expect. 99 levels of block breaking action, with the occasional boss battle thrown in to mix things up. The SNES mouse support adds more precision to the controls and 2-player simultaneous co-op is fun. On the negative front it is really thin on the musical front and the 3 bosses are just repeated 3 times over, so it feels a bit padded. Also on the easy side overall. A solid game nonetheless.

 

 

I've been playing Block Kuzushi lately, which is carved from the same tree as Arkanoid. The difference here is that your ship has 2 paddles and you can flip them around as both retain their own powerups or downgrades. There's also more unique bosses and the game is harder than Arkanoid. Also has a fun versus mode for 2 players that is lacking from the previous title.

 

 

Lastly there's Supapoon DX. The name is horrible and it's also a contender for the worst box art in the SFC library. The main point here seems to be that you don't have to clear all the blocks to move forward, only the yellow balls with sunglasses. And the paddle is a living blue blob of some sorts, kinda reminds me of Lolo. Still waiting for this to arrive to give it a spin. It was dirt cheap ($10 NIB) so I'm not gonna hold my breath on this one.

 

 

 

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

On 1/16/2023 at 8:24 AM, SlidellMan said:

Jaki Crush was a worthy sequel to both Alien and Devil's Crush, and Hudson Soft even made a WiiWare follow up to the series. It's sad that both companies are no more.

Just had to look it up, WOW! As a fan of Alien and Devil's Crush I will definitely be checking this out using my Everdrive!

Edited January 24, 2023 by OldSchoolRetroGamer

[+GoldLeader]

JAKI CRUSH is my Favorite SNES/SFC game Ever!

 

I used to think of it as a hidden gem,  but more and more people are becoming aware of it now.

 

So for me it's Alien Crush/Devil's Crush/Jaki Crush as the Trilogy of Best Pinball games ever...And I still count Dragon's Fury as near identical to Devil's Crush,  I mean yes technically there are some differences,  but I can still remember lining them up;  One on SEGA Nomad, the other on Turbo Express and the music was perfectly in sync!

 

FWIW,  I also liked Dragon's Revenge on Genesis,  just not as well as Dragon's Fury...And Crue Ball too

 

Others I dug would be Revenge of the Gator, Plus Kirby and Pokemon Pinballs on Game Boy, Devilish on Genesis, Pinball Quest on NES (Adventure/Pinballs you'd say I guess), Midnight Magic on VCS, and all Pinball Hall of fame games on Playstations (and Flipnic on PS2)...

 

But back to SNES;  I do like one more, but mostly with a Disclaimer to explain how I (personally) like it:

 

Super Pinball:  Behind the Mask

 

I first started playing it on the FC-16GO (Portable) because on a small screen it looks far more realistic,  which I realize is not your thing.  Also IIRC the Multiball was cool but different,  as the balls pass through each other and don't hit one another.  I always found that strange.  Anyway,  much the same as a pinball game I bought on PlayStation,  something in the Long Box (may have to look it up) from the early days  (OK the PS1 game is (against all common sense) called Extreme Pinball (but it's not all that Extreme LOL))...I consider it to be an AMBIENT game of pinball!  Just a relaxing experience, where ya chill and go with the flow...I know;  It's a completely different mindset compared to most others on my list,  but maybe you (or anyone else) could try it that way and see what you think.

[Tanooki]

I've been aware of it, it's good, but maybe it's lack of attempts but it doesn't get me like Devils Crash and Alien Crush do.  It's good, quite good, and you know what else is, the modern homage Demon's Tilt on Switch, Steam, etc, very very clear it's quite kissing the ring of those two older TG/Gen (dragon's fury from devil) titles.  Maybe you should give it a shot, those pains in the ass at LRG are starting to sell the game shortly on physical Switch media soon, regular distro too I think, not one of those limited trash runs.

 

When I had to let the PCE go, Devil's Crash as Dragon's Fury was a pretty fast pickup for the Genesis as a solid very solid replacement, even if it's slightly censored the game it still there.  Dragon's Revenge though, there's an oddity not bad, but different, but Crue Ball,that one was boring as crap, I sold it, and to the big store that got it, it's still there like 6mo later.

 

I do find it interesting @GoldLeader that you like that Super Pinball game, usually gets panned for sucking for some reason or another.  Not sure if you're aware, it was a duo of titles, Japan never let the sequel escape so might be worth looking at.

 

I think it was this very area, but another pinball popped up, I think it was battle pinball, also SFC only, but it's more like your kirbys/sonic adventure style pinball but has big mecha+big rubber monster playfields for Gundam, Kamen Rider, and Ultraman.

[Wayler]

Because of the translation thread, a title caught my eye that has not been mentioned yet regarding this genre.

 

Well, okay, not a pinball per se (although some stages have pinball bumpers), but a 1v1 pong-tennis-breakout-whatever hybrid called Sanrio World Smash Ball!

Beyond the cute exterior of the Hello Kitty gang engaging in a friendly game of toss the ball around, it's actually an intense experience, especially in two player mode. It's too bad Hello Kitty herself is only a referee, I would love to have smashed...errm pick her up as a playable character. Then there's also Pop'n Smash, which is basically the same game, but with a tennis ball and interesting characters like dog, girl, salaryman, another dog and old man.

 

Being mostly action, a translation is not mandatory to enjoy these titles. Here's a quick summary for both of them:

 

[Kirk_Johnston]

Yeah, I like the look of that one with the frog visually. I wonder how satisfying the gameplay will be if there's not full control over the ball direction. Although, I expect it's much along the lines of classic breakout.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Kirk_Johnston