+mytek Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 I have had people ask me in the past if I'm going to put my projects on PCBway, and I've usually responded with "I don't know, maybe". Part of that hesitation had to do with a feeling in my gut that despite all the YouTube hype that they really might not be the best option. So just to be fair I decided to check out what the costs would be to get some of my larger 2-layer and 4-layer boards made by them. I know everyone has probably seen PCBway's advertising and sponsorships (Retro recipes, 8-Bit Guy, ect.) purporting them as an inexpensive PCB manufacturer. And this may very well be true when doing boards at less than 100 mm square. But how do they compare to JLCPCB for something larger? BTW, JLCPCB is priced pretty much the same as PCBway in the smaller under 100 mm footprint boards. I used for an example a board with the dimensions of 114mm x 114mm (Same size as my 576NUC+, CV-NUC+, and XEP80-II projects). So if we look at the comparative online quotes from each website below, for this sized board it'll cost you 2.8 times as much to go with PCBway vs. JLCPCB on a 2-layer board. And a 4-layer board will cost you 2 times as much with PCBway. Now I believe part of the problem with the 2-layer quote being so high from PCBway has to do with that 24 hour (1 day) build time. This appeared to be the only option offered in the online quote. However it appears for just $7.50 more JLCPCB offers a 1-2 day build service which comparatively speaking would improve PCBway's cost difference to 1.8 times as much on that 2-layer board. So for all practical purposes we can say that PCBway will cost you pretty close to twice as much, whether it be a 2-layer or 4-layer board. DHL shipping costs are virtually the same from each manufacturer. Summary In my opinion, I think the customer ends up paying for all the advertising and YouTube sponsorships that PCBway engages in. And as the old saying goes "Nothing is truly given away for free" So before pressing that BUY button in the cart, it would be wise to do a few comparisons when shopping for PCBs. Check ALLPCB while you are at it. And just so people don't think I photo-shopped the results, here are a couple of full page screenshots... And no I'm not being sponsored by JLCPCB or ALLPCB 5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foft Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 Pcbway now offer aliexpress shipping, which is slower but saves some money vs dhl. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 17, 2023 Author Share Posted March 17, 2023 5 hours ago, foft said: Pcbway now offer aliexpress shipping, which is slower but saves some money vs dhl. Yes but JLCPCB also offers a choice of 4 different shipping methods, with the cheapest taking the longest to arrive. I used that cheapest shipping method on a previous order which took about 2-1/2 weeks to get to my door step. But it only cost $12, instead of $31 for DHL, although DHL usually arrives in only 3 days. Bottom line is PCBway is going to cost you more, especially where larger boards are concerned. And the increase is significant. BTW, for those that like purple solder mask, JLCPCB now offers it for the same price as the green (at least that was the case on my last order of 10 boards 👍 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 17, 2023 Author Share Posted March 17, 2023 A friend of mine that likes using PCBway mentioned the convenience of 1-click ordering if you put your board on PCBway as a shared project. And that is nice, but the ordering process if you have a zipped folder of gerber files ready to upload is pretty simple and streamlined at JLCPCB as well. Essentially all you have to do is go to JLCPCB and click the Instant Quote button, then drag and drop that zipped file to the web page, enter how many boards you want and what color, then click save to cart to enter the order (the size of the board is already extracted from the gerbers). If you have more boards you want to order at the same time it's pretty much a process of wash-rinse-repeat. When you are ready to check out, click on view cart and enter your shipping address and select your payment method and then buy it. Just like PCBway you have options such as type of PCB material and thickness, as well as shipping method to use. JLC's options will default to 5 pieces of standard FR-4 1.6 mm thick board material, Green Solder Mask, White Silk Screen, 1 oz Copper,and DHL Shipping. So if you don't click anything after dragging and dropping the zipped file those will be the selections used when you save to cart. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foft Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) Funnily enough I placed my previous order with jlcpcb. It worked out fine, I just completely forgot about them on the orders I just placed! Edited March 17, 2023 by foft 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 17, 2023 Author Share Posted March 17, 2023 30 minutes ago, foft said: Funnily enough I placed my previous order with jlcpcb. It worked out fine, I just completely forgot about them on the orders I just placed! Welcome to my world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teapot Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 I got some 125mmx30mm boards from JLCPCB and the price went from $4 to $5.50. It looks like PCBway would charge ~$20. JLCPCB is also much better at quantity pricing. Less than half the price for 50. Although at both places it's cheaper to order 5 batches of 10 (when within the 100x100 size). I have several hundred boards from a couple dozen designs and the quality is great. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 Nice to see my latest ad stimulating a reaction. 🤣 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+-^CrossBow^- Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 I've used both and nearly all of my stuff have been done through JLCPCB and I've never had any issues. That said, there are some options that PCBWay offers that JLCPCB didn't and those are the few times I've used PCBway, but yes, it was also the most I'd paid for any PCB order was from PCBway. It is also even easier to order from JLCPCB if you have an account as I just sign in, pull up my files, click on the PCBs I want made and go from there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 17, 2023 Author Share Posted March 17, 2023 57 minutes ago, flashjazzcat said: Nice to see my latest ad stimulating a reaction. 🤣 Hi Jon Actually it wasn't you, but a guy I became friends with over on the Colecovision/Adam forums that brought up PCBway. However with that said I do indeed recall you advertising for them recently on one of your videos, and it was rather nicely done 👍 55 minutes ago, -^CrossBow^- said: It is also even easier to order from JLCPCB if you have an account as I just sign in, pull up my files, click on the PCBs I want made and go from there. Agreed. Funny thing is I rarely ever reorder anything I previously uploaded, because it's always out of date with whatever new rev I'm working on. It seems like I have to go through at least 3 prototypes to get to the final version, and by then I'm done with it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+-^CrossBow^- Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 2 minutes ago, mytek said: Agreed. Funny thing is I rarely ever reorder anything I previously uploaded, because it's always out of date with whatever new rev I'm working on. It seems like I have to go through at least 3 prototypes to get to the final version, and by then I'm done with it I've not designed anything complicated though. Mainly breakout PCBs to help with wiring up to various connectors or my mount boards I made up for 7800 UAV installs. But yes, as I only place about 10 - 20 pieces at a time, I've had to reorder a few times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+selgus Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 I've done over 100 orders with JLCPCB now, and I have been very pleased with their pricing, shipping and quality. The boards I produce are all ENIG, so there is an extra surface charge, plus I never go with green solder-mask, so the sometimes affects my build times. I've also tried out PCBWay and did a few orders with them, and they've also been more expensive for relatively the same board configurations. Also, I've had some issues with PCBWay quality (silk screening and some tolerances on traces), so I've stayed with JLCPCB. Another thing I've been doing with JLCPCB is having them panelize my boards, even when I'm not using pick-n-place machinery for assembly. They will v-score the boards and I tend to get better pricing, than if I upped the board count. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woj Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 I have little experience designing boards and I made like 6 orders in total, all of these were rather small ones, normally it was JLC (got a hint to use them from a family member), once I went PCBWay only because they were more operational during the CNY than JLC and I would not have to wait few weeks more for white boards with them. But I effectively paid 2x more, even with the promotion code. Apart from that I really could not see any practical difference, including budget shipment options and customs things sorted out by them (important where I live, deciding on not prepaying customs is costing with our local carrier a lot more than it should). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ascrnet Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 I have used pcbway to have some pcb made from shared projects from some people who release their design and give instructions on how to build it.😁 I had a multi game cartridge pcb made (4 x 16KB) and another pcb (Production Test Jig - Joystick Loop) from a user here for testing, each pcb cost me $5 for the minimum quantity which is 5. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 18, 2023 Author Share Posted March 18, 2023 2 hours ago, ascrnet said: ...each pcb cost me $5 for the minimum quantity which is 5. $2 will get you the same 5 boards from JLCPCB. Although what's a couple of dollars difference when the overall cost is so low. So for those situations (small boards), PCBway is perfectly fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 18, 2023 Author Share Posted March 18, 2023 2 hours ago, ascrnet said: I have used pcbway to have some pcb made from shared projects from some people who release their design and give instructions on how to build it.😁 Just thought I'd present an alternative...There's no reason that AtariAge can't serve as the vehicle for providing build and use instructions, as well as host the design and gerber files for a project (I do it all the time). And as I mentioned earlier once you have a zipped file folder full of gerbers, it's really not any harder to order from JLCPCB. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ascrnet Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 (edited) 10 hours ago, mytek said: $2 will get you the same 5 boards from JLCPCB. Although what's a couple of dollars difference when the overall cost is so low. So for those situations (small boards), PCBway is perfectly fine. yes it is more expensive. but pcbway donates some of the value to the creator of the project, that's my understanding. 10 hours ago, mytek said: Just thought I'd present an alternative...There's no reason that AtariAge can't serve as the vehicle for providing build and use instructions, as well as host the design and gerber files for a project (I do it all the time). And as I mentioned earlier once you have a zipped file folder full of gerbers, it's really not any harder to order from JLCPCB. totally agree, but you forget that there are people with a very basic level of electronics or nothing. instead, pcbway presents us an easy option to send us to make a pcb just with a click and with all the exact sizes, pcb parameters to get and assemble. you can also search for projects and there are many for ATARI 8bit if you want to assemble several things. 😉 Well, it all depends on the project and the person, in the end there are no good or bad options, just different ones. 😅 Edited March 18, 2023 by ascrnet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Might this not be better placed in the science and tech or hardware sub-forum, since it has a rather generic appeal outside of the scope of Atari 8-bits? 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+x=usr(1536) Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 17 hours ago, mytek said: However with that said I do indeed recall you advertising for them recently on one of your videos, and it was rather nicely done 👍 I'm concerned that FJC hasn't given a grinning thumbs-up into the camera at the end of his PCBway adverts for some time. It's the only mark of quality that potential customers can trust 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 18, 2023 Author Share Posted March 18, 2023 4 hours ago, flashjazzcat said: Might this not be better placed in the science and tech or hardware sub-forum, since it has a rather generic appeal outside of the scope of Atari 8-bits? I have no objection if a Moderator wishes to move this topic, but I fail to see an issue with leaving it here. This particular forum probably sees the most DIY projects being worked on by individuals, and where to get a PCB made cheaply does seem relevant to that cause. Besides I've seen much more irrelevant stuff being discussed in this forum now and in the past, what makes this one so special? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reifsnyderb Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 19 minutes ago, mytek said: I have no objection if a Moderator wishes to move this topic, but I fail to see an issue with leaving it here. This particular forum probably sees the most DIY projects being worked on by individuals, and where to get a PCB made cheaply does seem relevant to that cause. Besides I've seen much more irrelevant stuff being discussed in this forum now and in the past, what makes this one so special? I am fine with it being here. Quite frankly, it would be great to have a how-to or FAQ on getting boards made. Personally, it took a lot of trial and error to figure out the best, cheapest, route. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 18, 2023 Author Share Posted March 18, 2023 5 hours ago, ascrnet said: Well, it all depends on the project and the person, in the end there are no good or bad options, just different ones. 😅 I agree. And what I set out to do with creating this topic was to show that there are more options to having a PCB manufactured than only the one that we always can't help but hear about. And I do understand that some of what is being offered seems to make it easier for people to order boards, and/or to have a central location to provide the documentation on the project. Perhaps this is worth spending the extra $$$ to some. And I apologize if I have offended anyone by my persistence at hammering in the savings that are possible. I will cease to argue that point any longer, because my intention is not to put down someone else's choice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+5-11under Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 It's not a perfect website, so it's still worth investigating several options, but this is a good place to start or compare: https://pcbshopper.com/ 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted March 18, 2023 Author Share Posted March 18, 2023 47 minutes ago, 5-11under said: It's not a perfect website, so it's still worth investigating several options, but this is a good place to start or compare: https://pcbshopper.com/ I like it 👍 Well I gave it go, using my original 114.3 mm x 114.3 mm example as both a 2-Layer and a 4-Layer board, and here's one page of results for both cases. 2-Layer: 114.3 mm x 114.3 mm 10 pieces 4-Layer: 114.3 mm x 114.3 mm 10 Pieces I really want to say something, but I'm biting my tongue since I promised not to 😝 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simius Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 You can try also https://www.eecart.com 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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