Falcon Compatibility

[Tempest]

Ok another one of those random "just out of curiosity" questions. What make the Falcon incompatible with much of the ST software library? I assume if it was a hardware issue it would be 100% incompatible, but there's just enough software that still runs to make me wonder.

 

Tempest

[Clint Thompson]

I'm not 100% Certain on this... but I think the following factors play a role:

 

Blitter

(Some sort of CACHE)

TOS Versions

 

 

I think that's what Backward III does or something similar, is enable

and disable these specific parts of the Falcon and it allows the older ST games to run (although I haven't used/tried it yet)

 

You got or getting you a Falcon ?

[Tempest]

You got or getting you a Falcon ?

 

I'm trying, but I just can't get myself to spend $250+ on such an old system. I will someday I suppose. I do have a TT030, but that's even less compatible with games.

 

Tempest

[Thelen]

some time ago I bought a falcon...it's a really great machine...but sooo incompatible ! And lot's of games require RGB or tv instead of a vga monitor.

 

I tried backward 3, some more (tos) games/applications work, but i can't get the addams family to work on it (my favorite)..sad.

 

I don't understand why atari made such a incomptatible machine, with so many great st games.

 

Thelen

[Ayreon]

I don't think the blitter is much of a factor. I think most incompatibilty problems are caused by the software. When programmed properly and by the "rules" there shouldn't be much problems. But then again, to get the most out of the ST they're using undocumented or illegal code, adresses and whatever. Time depanding code for tricks like syncscrolling. etc.

 

Since the YM chip, CPU, memory layout, TOS, the video chip and whatever aren't exactly the same, things like that can cause lots of problems when you don't stick to the "rules". Ofcourse, i'm sure, Atari themselfs made a few mistakes that aren't too good for the compatibilty even when software is programmed properly.

 

It's kinda logical that old games need RGB or TV as they run on 50 or 60 HZ. VGA's don't support those low refresh rates. Ofcourse they could have forced the software to run in "vga" mode, but then most would be unplayable anyhow. Multi sync monitors can be a solution, but i'm not sure if the Falcon does recognize as a multisync or plain vga monitor and still refuses to run RGB games.

[+Sauron]

Just to throw this in there, the Falcon's compatibility isn't quite as dire as it may sound. I've had pretty good luck so far with running many of my old ST games, and I haven't even tried using Backwards yet. Ayreon is definitley correct on the technical issues, though. The ST games that don't run (and I have come across a few) are generally ones that "cheat" in order to get maximum performance. I think your best bet would be to just find a stock 1040ST if you're mainly interested in running ST games. However, I wouldn't dismiss the Falcon regardless. It's a pretty impressive machine, especially where it's audio capabilities are concerned. If you can actually find one for $250, I say grab it without giving it a second thought.

[Tempest]

A little off topic (but hey it's my thread so I can go off topic if I want). I've noticed that Falcon's show up on German ebay much more than in the US. Are German Falcon's different than US Falcons? Is there a power supply difference or some kind of strange German keyboard issue?

 

Tempest

[+Sauron]

The only thing I can think of that would be different is the power supply. I imagine you would need a EU to US AC converter. I don't think the keyboard is any different, but I could be wrong. Oh yeah, I think TOS is in German on those too, but I'm sure you could fit some US ROMs in one if that's a problem.

[+Sauron]

Forgot to add, there is a US one on eBay right now. I imagine it'll end up going for a bit higher than what it's at right now, but that should give you an idea of how much you'll end up having to pay for one, unless you get the hook-up like I did.

[krupkaj]

The only thing I can think of that would be different is the power supply. I imagine you would need a EU to US AC converter. I don't think the keyboard is any different, but I could be wrong. Oh yeah, I think TOS is in German on those too, but I'm sure you could fit some US ROMs in one if that's a problem.

 

Falcon TOS has 4 or 5 buildin languages (it is possible to choose and save selection to NVRAM)

 

And btw the German keyboard is not so strange, the French one is stranger

[Clint Thompson]

For sure.... if you can get one for $250 hop on it!

 

I got lucky and won mine BIN for $300 on eBay quite some time ago.

Most usually hit $400 and above easily.

 

It's a fun system to mess around with and check out the demos and such.

DSP stuff is great too (since I'm into music myself!)

 

As far as German Falcons, you can switch the language as

krupkaj suggested... but you would have to get a power converter of some sort (like $30 at radio shack)

[Tempest]

And btw the German keyboard is not so strange, the French one is strange

 

Yeah that was a poor choice of words on my part. The German keyboard is "unfamiliar" to me.

 

Tempest

[[ProToS]]

And btw the German keyboard is not so strange, the French one is stranger

 

hummm not stranger for a french user

 

 

Yeah that was a poor choice of words on my part.  The German keyboard is "unfamiliar" to me.

 

if you don't like it take a US stf/e keyboard, they are the same only the color change

I use un stf keyboard on a Freekeys case for my tower F030/CT060

[tjlazah]

Ok I also have a Falcon030! (Along with several ST's including 520ST, 1040STf, 4160STe, and TT030!)

 

It seems to me that about the same games that do not run on my TT also do not run on the Falcon! I think the TT *may* be a tad more compatible, but not much. I think it is the TOS and Faster CPU that is causing these games to fail.

 

Again boot with ALT or CTRL to boot to disk and run the games from there.

[tjlazah]

I'm not 100% Certain on this... but I think the following factors play a role:

 

Blitter

(Some sort of CACHE)

TOS Versions

 

 

I think that's what Backward III does or something similar, is enable

and disable these specific parts of the Falcon and it allows the older ST games to run (although I haven't used/tried it yet)

 

You got or getting you a Falcon ?

 

OK I have a silly question. How does one use Backward III???? I tried and got frustrated on how I was not able to get it to work! It seemed like it needed to set up a database of the game. It was too complicated so I gave up. I used a great tool for the AMIGA called "degrader" and I liked how that was set up. Any info on this would be great!

[Clint Thompson]

Backward is actually simple.

 

There is a database of games you can just click on for instant compatibility... you load it and then run the program from disk or whatever.... OR... if the game isn't in the list you can go into the settings

and disable cpu cache, other misc. things that make the game unhappy because of the Falcon (STe modes I'm sure) and other things.

 

Sometimes you have to mess around with it, but most should work from what I've seen... so far the last 2 ST games I loaded with Backward worked just fine....

 

Just gotta mess around with it really

[Tempest]

Ok I think I've just found out more than I ever wanted to know about STE/TT/Falcon compatibility:

 

http://www.uni-mainz.de/~heuno000/projects...ari/ste_faq.zip

 

 

Tempest

[jens]

For sure.... if you can get one for $250 hop on it!

I got lucky and won mine BIN for $300 on eBay quite some time ago.

Most usually hit $400 and above easily.

I got the one below mentioned ( ) for 400 German Marks some years ago. Well, it still had the original hard drive with just 80 megs which I replaced, but else I had nothing changed. Ok, bought the scanner and MagiC. But that was it.

I'm running the Falcon at 800x608 in 256 colors without an extra graphics card.