Trouble with "Demo" carts on Lynx I???

[Atari Smeghead]

Hello,

I recently eBay'd my B&C AvP demo cart to a kid who just emailed me and said he can't get it to run in his (or his brother's) Lynx I. I used it on my Lynx II with no problems, not too long before I sent it to him via Priority Mail.

 

I was just wondering if anyone out there has ever had ANY problems running a game or a demo cart on their Lynx I. I am planning on selling a lot more of my demos and I don't want to mislead anyone. But since I've never owned (or even seen up close) a Lynx I...

 

I asked Bruce/Cathy (B&C) about it, and the response I received was (basically) that there's no difference between the machines on an internal level, but that its "a real bear" to get those demo carts out of a Lynx I. Apparently, ya have to apply pressure to the chip itself, and they must stick in there pretty good. So, it's apparently possible to damage a chip/cart by removing it?

 

Can anyone with first-hand experience help me out? It'd be most appreciated!

 

Thanks,

Smeg

[+karri]

While we were betatesting Championship Rally we found out that

the Lynx I sometimes stops updating the screen and the screen

goes blank. This does not happen as easily on the Lynx II.

 

It took a while to program around this "feature". So some demos

may actually refuse to work on a Lynx I if they are programmed

on a Lynx II only.

 

Some pins are also in a different state when you power up a Lynx I

compared to a Lynx II.

 

--

Cheers,

 

Karri

[Gunstar]

The only problem I ever encountered on my LYNX 1 is that because the homebrew PCB's are so thick, that when inserting the carts, a bit of pressure needs to be applied so the microchip just barely allows the door to be shut ( CyberVirus and Road RIOT work this way), and, in the case of ROADRIOT, I have to use a pair of needle nose plyers to pull the card back out, so I don't have to apply pressure to the chip. The Songbird title has a handle on the PCB so this isn't a problem, but it's because of the handle that the chip was place further back on the card which creates the problem i soke of above about the LYNX card door not being able to be closed do to the chip being in the way. But, I've never had any problems with games not working, though I don't have any mere "demo" cards...

[Gunstar]

The only problem I ever encountered on my LYNX 1 is that because the homebrew PCB's are so thick, that when inserting the carts, a bit of pressure needs to be applied so the microchip just barely allows the door to be shut ( CyberVirus and Road RIOT work this way), and, in the case of ROADRIOT, I have to use a pair of needle nose plyers to pull the card back out, so I don't have to apply pressure to the chip. The Songbird title has a handle on the PCB so this isn't a problem, but it's because of the handle that the chip was place further back on the card which creates the problem i soke of above about the LYNX card door not being able to be closed do to the chip being in the way. But, I've never had any problems with games not working, though I don't have any mere "demo" cards...

[sage]

While we were betatesting Championship Rally we found out that the Lynx I sometimes stops updating the screen and the screen

goes blank. This does not happen as easily on the Lynx II.

 

It took a while to program around this "feature". So some demos

may actually refuse to work on a Lynx I if they are programmed

on a Lynx II only.

 

Some pins are also in a different state when you power up a Lynx I

compared to a Lynx II.

 

Additionally:

Lynx 2 has another cpu revision... some more opcodes... which is quiet useless as you cannot use them or your stuff wont run on a Lynx 1 :-(

[Harry_Dodgson]

 

Additionally:

Lynx 2 has another cpu revision... some more opcodes... which is quiet useless as you cannot use them or your stuff wont run on a Lynx 1 :-(

 

Which opcodes are those? There is no mention of extra instructions in any of the developer's documentation or programs.

[sage]

Which opcodes are those?  There is no mention of extra instructions in any of the developer's documentation or programs.

 

Bittest and bit(re)set. At least they seem to work reliable. And yes, the Lynx 1 cpu is doing something different if it hits such an instruction.

 

PS:

I was also looking for some more "hidden opcodes", like on c64 and atari xl cpus. But I guess none of the others is working...

And anyway... as long as it is different on Lynx 1 and 2 its of no use :-(

[Atari Smeghead]

Thanks for the replies, everyone.

 

So, there is a chance that a demo cart may not work on a Lynx 1, but no one here has used a Lynx 1 with a B&C demo cart (AvP, Road Riot, Loopz, Daemon's Gate, Centipede or Marlboro Go) so I reckon I can't be certain.

 

The only problem I ever encountered on my LYNX 1 is that because the homebrew PCB's are so thick, that when inserting the carts, a bit of pressure needs to be applied so the microchip just barely allows the door to be shut ( CyberVirus and Road RIOT work this way), and, in the case of ROADRIOT, I have to use a pair of needle nose plyers to pull the card back out, so I don't have to apply pressure to the chip.

 

I never knew the Lynx 1 has a door. I learned something new. Does the door have to be shut in order for the game to play? I wonder if part of the guy's problem is the thickness coupled with the size of the chip. The Road Riot I have has a large chip on it, and AvP is the same. Maybe he's not pushing it into the machine all the way, for fear the thing will get stuck.

 

At least I have something to tell him. Thanks again, everyone!

 

Smeg

[chris_lynx1989]

Thanks for the replies, everyone.  

 

So, there is a chance that a demo cart may not work on a Lynx 1,  but no one here has used a Lynx 1 with a B&C demo cart (AvP, Road Riot, Loopz, Daemon's Gate, Centipede or Marlboro Go) so I reckon I can't be certain.

 

The only problem I ever encountered on my LYNX 1 is that because the homebrew PCB's are so thick, that when inserting the carts, a bit of pressure needs to be applied so the microchip just barely allows the door to be shut ( CyberVirus and Road RIOT work this way), and, in the case of ROADRIOT, I have to use a pair of needle nose plyers to pull the card back out, so I don't have to apply pressure to the chip.

 

I never knew the Lynx 1 has a door. I learned something new. Does the door have to be shut in order for the game to play? I wonder if part of the guy's problem is the thickness coupled with the size of the chip. The Road Riot I have has a large chip on it, and AvP is the same. Maybe he's not pushing it into the machine all the way, for fear the thing will get stuck.

 

At least I have something to tell him. Thanks again, everyone!

 

Smeg

 

 

i've never had a problem using any of my demo/eprom chip on board

games on a lynx 1 unit---never have.

yes,the clearance on a lynx 1 port can be a bit tight for an eprom boarded

game! i learned back in 1995 that you had to file on each side of the card

edge (contact edge) from the edge up. you usually have to take off around

.005 thousandths of an inch a side off to give you good lynx 1 card socket

port clearance. you only have to go up a distance of a 1/2 inch per side.

once this slight modification has been done,the cards slip in and out with

very great ease!! try it,smeghead.--the lynxer

[+davidcalgary29]

Thanks for the replies, everyone.  

 

So, there is a chance that a demo cart may not work on a Lynx 1,  but no one here has used a Lynx 1 with a B&C demo cart (AvP, Road Riot, Loopz, Daemon's Gate, Centipede or Marlboro Go) so I reckon I can't be certain.

 

 

I comlynxed a Model I with a Model II in order to test out RR4WD's multiplayer option when I found myself with an extra cart six months ago; the game worked properly on both systems. I didn't have any problems removing the game from my Lynx I, either.

[bruce182]

i learned back in 1995 that you had to file on each side of the card  

edge (contact edge) from the edge up. you usually have to take off around .005 thousandths of an inch a side off to give you good lynx 1 card socket port clearance.  

 

Bloody hell, you must be good with a file!!!

I assume you mean 5/1000 of an inch rather than 0.005/1000 of an inch

[GARTH]

I,ve got a lynx 1 here and i,ve had no problems with songbird or telegames carts although ponx did have to be held toward the bottom of the machine when i inserted it or i get the insert card message also to insert these exposed eprom carts the trick is to open the door just enough to fit cart and finger through if you open it fully a lot of force is needed to close the door risking damage to door /cart or both.Hope that info is of use.

Cheers

Garth

[Atari Smeghead]

Thanks to all who've replied to this thread. It sounds like there can be the occasional issue with using the Lynx I with thicker carts, but as long as you're careful and/or handy with a file, things will work just fine.

 

Thanks again!

 

Smeg

[chris_lynx1989]

Thanks to all who've replied to this thread.  It sounds like there can be the occasional issue with using the Lynx I with thicker carts, but as long as you're careful and/or handy with a file, things will work just fine.

 

Thanks again!

 

Smeg

 

yes you have the general idea.

also,i did mean "five one thousandths of an inch" per side at the contact

edge end of the cart/card with an eprom boarded game. no,you don't have

to be really great at filing to do this when needed. just be careful to not do

a slip with your file and screw up a critical board trace you need! no big

skill is required on this at all. just a liitle patience. not all eprom boards or

lynx 1 units may need this. all my eprom carts had to have it done to them

for my 2 lynx 1s to really accept these like real production atari lynx carts

.your experiences may differ.--the lynxer