Fellow Atari Man Posted October 5, 2004 Share Posted October 5, 2004 No, I'll say first off I haven't done one--sorry--but with doing such a good job on the 2600 version as it is with only 4K, wouldn't an extra 4K ROCK?! What with it being this week's high score challenge, it's made me do a bit of thinking about it... I'm not a programmer, so maybe some of these things couldn't be implemented anyway, but possibly more than one robot at a time could shoot, there could be several more mazes, or maybe even the sprites could be smaller so you could get bigger mazes like the arcade (I know some games just flat-out can't be done, like the occasional post about why it'd be very difficult to get the first level of Donkey Kong to look more like the arcade original), rather than the smaller, somewhat claustrophobic ones you get here in this version, and/or maybe get the robots to fire diagionally. Any takers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS Posted October 6, 2004 Share Posted October 6, 2004 Honestly, except for possibly diagonal firing by the robots, I don't know what else there would be to add to the game above the excellent voice additions that Mike Mika has already done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uosipa llamxew Posted October 6, 2004 Share Posted October 6, 2004 Honestly, except for possibly diagonal firing by the robots, I don't know what else there would be to add to the game above the excellent voice additions that Mike Mika has already done. I think there was a sequel to Berzerk called Frenzy or something(?) I have never played the game myself, but perhaps an 8k edition could be hacked/expanded as the sequel. Either way, it'd take a dedicated programmer and great fan of the game to care enough to pull it off. Cheers to those great hackers/homebrewers who make my life worth living. I'd buy a round of beers, but sadly we're not all together... and I'm broke. :-P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic George 2K3 Posted October 6, 2004 Share Posted October 6, 2004 How about getting the robots to fire diagonal shots? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fellow Atari Man Posted October 6, 2004 Author Share Posted October 6, 2004 I think there was a sequel to Berzerk called Frenzy or something(?) Yes, Frenzy was an excellent sequel: mazes contained walls that would rebound bullets, others could be shot through to make your own exit! Evil Otto could be shot, too, with three hits...but then he'd come back even faster. More robots could appear as well (up to 25; think the original arcade only allowed 12 max). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nukey Shay Posted October 6, 2004 Share Posted October 6, 2004 In order to shoot out wall sections, the playfield data would need to be mapped into ram memory. i.e. unlikely to be able to hack that in. Other aspects should be possible tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert M Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 Personally, I think the programmer wimped out by not providing diagonal shots for the robots. Even the player's diagnol shots are kinda lamely implemented. the angle seems less than 30 degrees above horizontal rather than the arcade 45 degrees. There is no reason why more than 4K is needed for the robots to shoot diagonally. You simply move the missle object both vertically and horizontally rather than just one way. The program supports vertical and horizontal, so vertical + horizontal is not a big change. In fact it may be a relatively simple functional hack. I may have to take a look at that. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neotokeo2001 Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 How about making a Berzerk Adventure. An 8k version would allow alot to be added. I like games with a definite ending, so maybe have an overall goal to complete the game. Power-Ups/Pickups ---------------------- Shield Item Extra Life Rapid Fire Invisibility (Robots don't sense you) Extra Rooms --------------- a bigger variety of rooms Enemies ---------- Different types of enemy robots I can't do it, So I'm just throwing it out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 There is no reason why more than 4K is needed for the robots to shoot diagonally. AI? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nukey Shay Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 4k of extra romspace is pretty much irrelivant if the program has no way of keeping track of those additions (requiring the use of the 2600's paltry 128 bytes of ram). I never looked to see how much of that was left over, but I suppose that some could be reclaimed by using redundant routines instead of subroutines (saving 2 bytes per nest taken by the stack) and/or combining variables that do not require 8 bits to hold their values. The game also uses an "attract mode" to hold the color values, so ram might have been wasted there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nukey Shay Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 There is no reason why more than 4K is needed for the robots to shoot diagonally. AI? Wouldn't want to make them shoot -too- intelligently The arcade game only lets them shoot if the player is lined up straight or diagonally...and that is sufficient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 Wouldn't want to make them shoot -too- intelligently The arcade game only lets them shoot if the player is lined up straight or diagonally...and that is sufficient. The shooting AI is no big problem. But how will they move? Should they try to get a vertical or horizontal identical position (like now), or should they go for a diagonal position? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjk7382 Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 Isn't the playfield on the 2600 kinda small, so if the enemies did shoot diagonally wouldn't it become nearly impossible? Maybe they (atari) did try to have diagonal shooting enemies, and it didn't play well. I couldn't see them NOT trying to port the arcade faithfully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nukey Shay Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 Wouldn't want to make them shoot -too- intelligently The arcade game only lets them shoot if the player is lined up straight or diagonally...and that is sufficient. The shooting AI is no big problem. But how will they move? Should they try to get a vertical or horizontal identical position (like now), or should they go for a diagonal position? According to the arcade, they try to reach a straight position by walking...and just shoot diagonally when that opportunity presents itself (which makes sense, since they cannot walk diagonally). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 According to the arcade, they try to reach a straight position by walking...and just shoot diagonally when that opportunity presents itself (which makes sense, since they cannot walk diagonally). Ok, that makes it a lot easier now since you only have to add a simple check to the shooting AI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nukey Shay Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 The idea is just to remove the main edge that the player has over them (i.e. you are allowed diagonal shots while they are not). The moving AI would still remain the same (which is already slightly handicapped, because they are all limited to seperate scanlines). Another question would be should they opt for straight shots first...and check diagonal only when no straight shots are possible for any robot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted November 26, 2004 Share Posted November 26, 2004 Another question would be should they opt for straight shots first...and check diagonal only when no straight shots are possible for any robot? IMO that could be based on the distance to the player (with some randomness to make the game less predictable). So, if a diagonal shot is closer, then it should be chosen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEBRO Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 There is no reason why more than 4K is needed for the robots to shoot diagonally. You're right, the diagonal hack I'm working on is doing it in 4K with ROM to spare. I don't consider myself a hacker (I guess). I started disassembling the game and saw that it would be fairly simple to add the diagnonal firing so I experimented and got it working fairly quickly. Maybe they (atari) did try to have diagonal shooting enemies, and it didn't play well. I couldn't see them NOT trying to port the arcade faithfully. It does look like they originally planned to have the robots fire diagonally. The code is in there (to a certain extent). There would have to be some tweaks to the initial robot firing table. I don't know why they didn't go that route. You are right in the fact that a smaller playfield makes it a bit harder. I guess you'll just have to fire at the robots that block your path first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 It does look like they originally planned to have the robots fire diagonally. The code is in there (to a certain extent). There would have to be some tweaks to the initial robot firing table. I don't know why they didn't go that route. If I had to guess, the programmer was probably under pressure to get the game done so it could be shipped. Not unlike what happens today with game developers and publishers. ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari-Jess Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 I would kill for a 2 player co-op Berzerk. Talk about your good times! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like us on Facebook
Follow us on Twitter
AtariAge on Instagram
Watch us on YouTube
Chat on Discord
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.