How rare are PAL 'heavy sixers'?

[Pipster]

None of my PAL sixers have switches but all have holes.

[Spirantho]

I don't know about woodies but in Europe you can tell a PAL-I Vader/Junior from a PAL-B Vader/Junior by the channel switch - PAL-B machines (France, Germany etc.) have a 3-4 channel switch, PAL-I machines are always tuned to channel 36, no matter what (like all other home computers/consoles in the UK).

[Clock]

 

I always thought that there were no PAL heavy sixers made by Atari. I think you will find that they are all transplants, but still a cool thing to own.

 

Even NTSC heavy sixers are fairly hard to find this side of the pond.

[Pipster]

It certainly looks better and feels a lot more solid than a normal sixer so it's now my main 2600 and is sitting next to the telly in the living room, not that any of my friends know the difference mind you.

[theretrodogg]

Hello all,

 

You call your self Atari collectors look at this ebay item :

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...me=STRK:MEWN:IT

 

look real hard you will see its a true boxed PAL heavy sixer ( the second boxed one I have ) the other only cost £40 on buy now. Most people who still have these in UK dont know the difference between a Jr and a woody let alone heavy and lighter sixers.

 

To pipster - When I opened the console you brought I did notice the boards are identical but I assure you all I changed was the aireal lead as I did not have a spare TV Game box thingy.

[theretrodogg]

 

 

I always thought that there were no PAL heavy sixers made by Atari. I think you will find that they are all transplants, but still a cool thing to own.

 

Even NTSC heavy sixers are fairly hard to find this side of the pond.

 

Sorry but this is not at all true, The Atari 2600 was first released in UK about the same time as the USA - there are PAL heavy sixers and you can buy one boxed from me for £200 if you like

[theretrodogg]

WOW I only just read all these posts.... I must say you are all taking the p

p___ out of me or what......

 

I HAVE 2 TRUE BOXED HEAVY - PAL - SIXERS NOW AND THEY ARE NOT FAKE AND NEVER BEEN CHANGED....... I BROUGHT THEM OFF PEOPLE WHO DID NOT ADVERTISE THEY WHERE HEAVY SO WHY FAKE IT AND THEN SELL AS A NORMAL WOODY (not even clear in photo)

 

I look at every auction on ebay UK and so far I have found 3 ( 2 mine 1 now pipsters ) and the date is currect as it would be one of the last made before they changed the look.

 

Glad I looked at this forum as you would all have me down for a scamming ebayer if I did not have my say.

 

A RYME!!!!!!

 

LOOK HARDER YOU WILL FIND.

PAL HEAVIES UNLESS YOUR BLIND.

IT IS REAL AND NOT FAKE.

IN UK HEAVIES THEY DID MAKE.

 

CHEERS!!!!

[Pipster]

I had no reason to doubt you.

[deathtrappomegranate]

Hi dogg! Nice to see you here.

 

There's no doubt that PAL heavy sixers exist. The question is, "did Atari make them that way?"

 

If you have a couple, could you open them up to see what information is on them (serial numbers, date stamps, etc) ?

 

It seems likely that some are machines with transplanted boards (the people who sold them to you may not have known, since it might have been done a while ago), but I suspect that some of them are original Atari products, because they notoriously mixed and matched their components.

 

I'll need to open mine again to check with the info that VGA posted earlier.

[Spirantho]

Hi dogg....

 

Hello all,

 

You call your self Atari collectors look at this ebay item :

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...me=STRK:MEWN:IT

 

look real hard you will see its a true boxed PAL heavy sixer ( the second boxed one I have ) the other only cost £40 on buy now.  Most people who still have these in UK dont know the difference between a Jr and a woody let alone heavy and lighter sixers.

 

No, what you have there is a standard PAL Atari box with a PAL Atari motherboard in a Heavy case. The box didn't change between heavies and lights AFAIK - certainly the light 6ers have pictures of heavy 6ers on them.

 

The problem is that AFAIK there is no way to prove that the motherboard belongs to the case, so until we find a sealed original PAL Heavy I don't think we'll know for sure.

 

As a matter of interest,there is a clue to if it's a transplant or not - what connector is on the end of the aerial cable? Is it a phono cable like the US Ataris or is it a CoAx cable like a UK Atari?

 

Incidentally - we're not calling you a liar or anything like that, we're just not sure of where you got your information from! True, you got the PAL 'heavy' in good faith, but there's probably been about 5 owners in the last 27 years...

 

Keep up the good work though.... the more honest and reliable sellers like yourself the better!

[Clock]

I don't know the answers to these questions - but maybe they will help if someone knows.

 

When did Atari stop making the Heavy Sixer?

 

When did the UK start selling Pal consoles?

 

I always thought we had our first consoles in time for Xmas 1978 which is a year after America. Did they still make Heavy Sixers then? Am I completely wrong? I admit my memory is very cloudy on this.

[Spirantho]

When did Atari stop making the Heavy Sixer?

 

When did the UK start selling Pal consoles?

 

I always thought we had our first consoles in time for Xmas 1978 which is a year after America. Did they still make Heavy Sixers then? Am I completely wrong? I admit my memory is very cloudy on this.

 

My impression is that the Heavy 6er was stopped being made at the very end of 1977, or early 1978, and the PAL Ataris appeared around the summer/autumn of 1978, but that is just my impression.

 

Certainly it has been established, I think, that Heavy 6ers always came with the Gatefold edition of Combat.. yet no PAL gatefold games exist (I do have a 61 Basic Math but the top label is not correct for a 61 Basic Math - kind of like my Silver Asteroids with a black end label or Red Millipede with a silver end label).

 

I will take a lot of convincing before I believe PAL Heavy 6ers exist unless we include reconditioned units, when they may exist.

[Clock]

 

 

As a matter of interest,there is a clue to if it's a transplant or not - what connector is on the end of the aerial cable? Is it a phono cable like the US Ataris or is it a CoAx cable like a UK Atari?  

 

That won't help because if the board has been swapped then so has the cable with it.

 

 

 

I can also confirm that my PAL Light Sixer box has a heavy sixer on the cover.

 

I'm still sure there are no genuine PAL Heavy Sixers - but I would like to be proved wrong.

[Spirantho]

That won't help because if the board has been swapped then so has the cable with it.

 

That's exactly why it will help!

I know what the answer the should be (in my theory) but I want to see what the answer really is.

 

If the cable has already been switched then that adds massively to the likelihood of a transplant, as it shows it's not an original console.

[theretrodogg]

My second PAL heavy arrived today and the heavy box has a few different pictures on from the lighter six box.

 

see again the one I won the other day ( it arrived today and its true heavy and with the true UK psu that is even rarer and made by cherry leasure but branded Atari )

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...me=STRK:MEWN:IT

 

4 games that are poctured on the box differ from the lighter six switch.

 

Can you spot them ??

 

1 is a chess piece instead of Homerun

2 a O & X`s board not Concerntration

3 a roulett wheel instead of code breaker.

4 the tennis player instead of Breakout.

 

Combat game that was included is like the one on the box ( not 11 cart but still the old style big font )

 

it also had a PAL number 11 (indy cart) in a standard type box with this lot, its right to say Pal had no gatefolds ( this I have on auction now 8143893716 ) I have no reason to think this cart was not original for the box and its in PAL format.

 

The last thing with the heavy I got today it has true UK heavy instructions the only ones I have ever seen.

 

I think they sold Heavy consoles till mid 1978 ( remember there would have been a few thousand in the factory after they started to make lighter consoles )

 

I have every type of boxed woodies and I can gaurantee there are heavy PAL`s

[deathtrappomegranate]

That won't help because if the board has been swapped then so has the cable with it.

 

That's exactly why it will help!

I know what the answer the should be (in my theory) but I want to see what the answer really is.

 

If the cable has already been switched then that adds massively to the likelihood of a transplant, as it shows it's not an original console.

 

Mine has an RCA plug.

[theretrodogg]

The heavy in UK did come with the US style TV plug and a switch box yes.

 

Another word on this is that it looks like the Atari was sold by a company called Cherry Leisure hense there sticker on the end of the box, they have also have there name on the Atari branded powerpack. Must have been a UK disrtributer like CGL.

 

Well think that proves its original pal and I am looking for more info on Cheery leisure at the moment.

 

Cheers!!

[deathtrappomegranate]

Bump...

 

Does anyone have any more info about the tag on the underside...especially the presence or absence of FCC information ?

 

Thanks all.

[Vigo]

If heavy sixer were made until late 1977/early 1978, then a clear proof would be to look on the datecode of the PAL TIA, since it is a genuine component.

 

An 1977 TIA would have something like "4977" stamped on it (49th week of 1977)

[Spirantho]

The heavy in UK did come with the US style TV plug and a switch box yes.

 

Interesting... certainly I have a light sixer with a phono/switch box connection type, but it's the only one I've seen. There certainly can't have been many like it (as a point of interest, it also has a particularly strong picture signal from what I recall... I've not modded it yet. ).

 

While it may be true that there are PAL heavies, the next question is how do you authenticate one....?

[Vigo]

While it may be true that there are PAL heavies' date=' the next question is how do you authenticate one....?[/quote']

 

Like i said, by opening it and looking when the chips were made. If they were made in the same time period when the heavy sixers shipped, you can be certain that it is indeed an original PAL heavy sixer.

 

This topic is really interesting, because i never knew that the VCS was shipped so early in the UK. The oldest 6-switcher you can find in Germany are from 1979, which therefore can not be heavy sixers.

[Spirantho]

Like i said, by opening it and looking when the chips were made. If they were made in the same time period when the heavy sixers shipped, you can be certain that it is indeed an original PAL heavy sixer.

 

Not that simple, I'm afraid.

 

If we assume for a moment that PAL heavies really do exist, then we must also assume that it is quite probable (given the existance of light sixers with US-style phono/switch box arrangements) that they were concurrent with the light sixers.

 

We also know from experience that Atari made different types of Atari at different stages, even within the classification of "light sixer" (for instance, I have a Sunnyvale 4-switcher with heavy 6er-style yellow paintwork)... this would suggest to me that Atari may have been switching manufacturers quite often, though the chips will not have been switched as often.

 

It is also quite likely that chips were made a reasonable time before the entire system was assembled, and in large batches which would almost certainly straddle the heavy/light sixer boundary.

 

I will only be completely convinced that Heavy 6ers exist in PAL form when I see a sealed six-switcher box opened and there's a PAL heavy in it! Failing that, a PAL machine with a date label inside that correlates to a known time period of heavy 6er chassic manufacturing.

 

It's all very complicated, and I'm not convinced either way (I'm playing devil's advocate here, bear in mind).. but hey, isn't that what makes this hobby interesting? Apart from Warlords tournaments of course...

[deathtrappomegranate]

It's all very complicated, and I'm not convinced either way (I'm playing devil's advocate here, bear in mind).. but hey, isn't that what makes this hobby interesting? Apart from Warlords tournaments of course...

 

Absolutely agreed!

 

I can see that I'm going to have to get my screwdriver out again, but we do need to know what the story is here.

 

Unearthing a sealed PAL "big sexy" (or whatever the nom-de-jour is) would clearly be very helpful, but the chances of that are slim. I don't think that that should stop us from trying, though.

[theretrodogg]

I think the real way to tell if like me you are lucky anough to find them boxed, the boxes are slightly different and there are UK stamps on it. The powerpack is also a good way like I state before one of mine comes with a cheery leisure / Atari branded PSU and the other a rare shape Ingersol both I strongly susspect are original PAL heavy issues. I will say that it seems we never had the first year paddles as both my boxed heavies never had these ( I got a pair from USA to make it look good the one I got the other day did have original sticks.

 

I also have the lighter six with the RCA plug ( TV switch box included ) I call these the cross between the two consoles and they where short lived in 1978. There are 3 sixers in the UK and of course I have them all boxed complete like new

 

Cheers!

[deathtrappomegranate]

The problem with the boxes is that they're easily interchangeable.

 

I also have a Cherry PSU; my PAL "H6" came with that, and with an Ingersoll version. I also used to have a "light-sixer" that came with a switchbox.

 

The problem is that we don't yet know how to verify the manufacturing/retailing dates of these machines.

 

The ideal would be a sealed box, which, when opened, contained a PAL heavy 6 unit, and which was accompanied by a sales receipt with a date printed on it. Confirmation from the original owner would be good too.

 

All of this is unlikely to transpire, although you never know.

 

Failing that, someone with inside knowledge...anyone?

 

Failing that, maybe we all need to open up our machines and see what the PCBs and chips say - maybe that way we can at least eliminate some transplanted units from the equation.

 

I know that some German collectors have said that they have one of these. Help us out, guys!