Tempest Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Seeing as how I own an Atari STE, an Apple IIgs, and a IBM PC Jr (basically a 286), I thought it would be nice to get my hands on the last 80's computer system I don't own: The Amiga. From the looks of it, the Amiga not only has all the Apple IIgs and Atari ST games I want to play, but it also have many of my early PC favs too (with much better graphics). However not being an Amiga buff, I'm completely confused on what the best model is for gaming. I know there are at least three different graphic chip sets, OCS (Original Chip Set) which is the oldest one, ECS (Enhanced Chip Set) which in the next advancement over the OCS, and AGA (Advanced Graphics Architecture) which was the last one and only on the high end Amigas. I assume the graphic chip sets are backwards compatible (ECS can do OCS modes), but were there any games that needed the AGA set? I really didn't pay attention to Amiga stuff when it was out, but I know there were at least a few ECS games… So I guess my question is, if I want to just play games on my Amiga, which model is best? I know the Amiga 500 was one of the most popular, but will it play the most games? Ideally I want the latest Amiga that has the most game compatibility (something akin to the 1040ST) In my basement I currently have an Amiga 2000 that I may or may not be able to get working (technically it's part of a Lynx development system). I think this may get me started, but I'm not sure if it can be used for gaming or not. Speaking of the ST, can someone give me a rough Atari ST to Amiga model chart that can use for my frame of reference? Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 (edited) I'm far from an Amiga expert myself, but from what I understand, the Amigas that had the AGA also had newer versions of Kickstart (the "BIOS") that made them incompatible with some Amiga 500 games; I believe Marble Madness is one example. For these systems, it is necessary to use a software solution called a "degrader" that allows you to use an earlier Kickstart for games that need it; kind of like the translator for the XL/XE series of 8-bit Atari computers. I've been told by other Amiga users that the Amiga 1200 (an AGA machine) is the best overall for games, presumably because it's one of the lower-cost AGA systems around. You'll need AGA for some of the later releases for the Amiga, as well as for CD32 games (the CD32 was the XEGS of the Amiga line; an Amiga computer repackaged as a game console). The A2000 you have probably uses an OCS chipset unless it's a later model; I think the 2000C had ECS. Edited January 18, 2006 by jaybird3rd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted January 18, 2006 Author Share Posted January 18, 2006 Seems like the Amiga 500 is like the Atari 520ST and the 1200 is like the 520STE. Are there really enough AGA games to bother with a 1200? Seems like most games were OCS or ECS except some modern demos and 1st person shooters (which I don't care about). I'm mostly interested in arcade ports, adventure games, action games, and RPG's. Looks like I'll either need an upgraded 500 (for ECS), a 3000, or a 600. Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 (edited) Only one answer (OK maybe two ) for an Amiga game machine - Amiga 1200 w/HD and WHDload. Run nearly all of your favorite games from the HD, and no floppy nonsense. Simply awesome! The other being the best Amiga game machine package - a CD32 with a SX32 MK2 w/HD. But that's a quite a bit more costly As far as comparisons it's more like: Amiga 500=Atari 520ST Amiga 1200=Falcon (except in this case the 1200 is actually very backwards compatible) Yes, I know that's not a perfect comparison, but it is much, much closer than Amiga 1200=520STE Also know that WHDload takes care of all backwards compatibility issues between AGA-OCS-ECS and all Kickstart compatibility issues. But you need a 1200 or better for the grunt for the extra overhead. Edited January 18, 2006 by remowilliams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaDDuck Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Seeing as how I own an Atari STE, an Apple IIgs, and a IBM PC Jr (basically a 286), I thought it would be nice to get my hands on the last 80's computer system I don't own: The Amiga. From the looks of it, the Amiga not only has all the Apple IIgs and Atari ST games I want to play, but it also have many of my early PC favs too (with much better graphics). However not being an Amiga buff, I'm completely confused on what the best model is for gaming. Tempest 1002480[/snapback] You are on the threshold of a brave new world!! They all have their ups and downs. But just for general gaming, how about a CD32?? It will do CD32 only title, with a FMV module it will do VCDs, and with the correct software, MP3's. I have a TON of CD32 games all burned onto CD that boot up and give menus. The degrader SW, PAL booter as well as most trainers, are in-built. If you go A1200/A4000 route, you can get HW that gives an impressive VGA picture. Otherwise here are your limitations: A500 - monochrome composite (plentiful and cheap!) A600 - Color composite (kinda hard to find in 110V NTSC) A1000 - Color composite & RF (lower picture qualtiy A1200 - Color composite and RF A2000 - B&W composite ACD32 - Color composite, RF, SVHS ACDTV - AVOID!!!! A3000 - Color composite (I think!) and VGA BUILT IN!!! Most models above also have Amiga specific RGB output. I've got a CD32, FMV, 30 'good' CDs with 20+ games per CD, A4000T (AT version) Just watch out for yellowing on A1200/A4000/A3000T models they used cheap plastic that yellows VERY easily! Hope this helps! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 (edited) Yeah, the video output is another good point. In all likelyhood you'll be dealing with : 1) 15Khz VGA output which you will need a suitable monitor for (Commodore 108x series, ST monitors with adapters, old NEC multisyncs, etc) 2) A scan doubler (expensive) to use the Amiga with modern VGA monitors 3) Composite out - like the STFM series. As far as multigame CD32 CDs - don't forget the ever famous 200 in one, and 444 in one Edited January 18, 2006 by remowilliams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaDDuck Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Yeah, the video output is another good point. In all likelyhood you'll be dealing with : 1) 15Khz VGA output which you will need a suitable monitor for (Commodore 108x series, ST monitors with adapters, old NEC multisyncs, etc) 2) A scan doubler (expensive) to use the Amiga with modern VGA monitors 3) Composite out - like the STFM series. As far as multigame CD32 CDs - don't forget the ever famous 200 in one, and 444 in one 1002608[/snapback] HEY!!!! I represent your implication!!! I worked hard on those!!! The Commodore encryption CD key is a BITCH. It took me FOUR MONTHS and 40 CDs to get them to boot into WB correctly, so pardon me if I swell with a little pride! BTW, one other video choice for a big-box Amiga, a $400- $500 video card with pseudo-AGA graphiocs compatibility. Picasso 4 anyone?? BUT!!!! The A1000's RF & composite SUCKED, blurry and icky. the A1200's RF & composite are leaps & bouds better!!! AND the CD32's SVHS is fairest of them all. A modemrn 13-14inch TV with SVHS and Composite input would look SOOOOO much better than a 20 YO monitor. A little birdie told me that there's a Amiga RGB to SVHS cable that can be made. It was the same little birdie that made my C-64 to SVHS cable.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seob Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I would say the 1200 is the better choice, because it's backwards compatible and also allows you to play aga games and if i'm correct with a cd-rom player you also be able to play cd32 games. You can get a harddisk so that you don't have to swap a lot of disks, because a lot of games came over multiple disks. And if you're very lucky you could get a processor upgrade board that slots into the a1200 turning it into a a4000 with extra memory. A friend of mine has that setup and it is really the fastes amiga i've seen. A turbo card like the: Blizzard 1260 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 It took me FOUR MONTHS and 40 CDs to get them to boot into WB correctly, so pardon me if I swell with a little pride! Easy now, I am a BIG fan of those disks. They are very nice pieces of work. It's just their somewhat "unlicensed status" that gets the AND the CD32's SVHS is fairest of them all. A modemrn 13-14inch TV with SVHS and Composite input would look SOOOOO much better than a 20 YO monitor. A little birdie told me that there's a Amiga RGB to SVHS cable that can be made. It was the same little birdie that made my C-64 to SVHS cable.... 1002640[/snapback] I'll agree the CD32 has the cleanest non RGB out hands down. But those 20 year old (well nearly anyway) monitors (and I've got four of 'em) still look a billion times better in RGB than any modern TV/RF/Composite solution Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin242 Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I would say the 1200 is the better choice, because it's backwards compatible and also allows you to play aga games and if i'm correct with a cd-rom player you also be able to play cd32 games. .... 1002666[/snapback] this is not really true (cd32 games on 1200) a cd rom drive does not make the 1200 cd32 compatible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocalH Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 That's correct, there's a chunky-to-planar graphics conversion chip in the CD32 that doesn't exist in the A1200 (although I do remember seeing a few products back in the day that claimed to add support for the chip). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Ragan Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Only one answer (OK maybe two ) for an Amiga game machine - Amiga 1200 w/HD and WHDload. Run nearly all of your favorite games from the HD, and no floppy nonsense. Simply awesome! 1002593[/snapback] No floppy nonsense? Whenever I used WinUAE it would almost never let me back up my disk images on a virtual hard drive. Believe me, I tried. Could I use WHDload on an emulator, and would it allow me to bypass the copy protection on old Amiga games like Mortal Kombat II and Street Fighter II? They're not great translations, but I'd like to spend fifteen minutes with them without half that time being invested in load times and virtual disk swapping. JR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocalH Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 WHDLoad They currently have 257 demos and 1795 games listed, so I'd imagine that any semi-popular game would be supported. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 I appreciate the A2000 with an SCSI Harddisk. The best is OCS/ECS and the widest spread for available games is for Kickstart 1.3 My, original in 1989 bought, A2000 has an ICD ADSCSI Controller plus 4MB Memory extension. Has a 512MB HD in. Many games are able to run from HD with a simple assign of a subdirectory to a drive, or they directly can be installed on HD. WHDLoad runs only from Kick 2.0... similar to simple packers, netware drivers and expansions... , but the games run better on Kick 1.3 Sometimes I love those intelligent solution providers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Helmet Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 dumb question probably, but will the CD32 work on an NTSC television? I'd like to get one of those, since it looks like a game system and not a computer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin242 Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 dumb question probably, but will the CD32 work on an NTSC television? I'd like to get one of those, since it looks like a game system and not a computer. 1003056[/snapback] yea, the Amiga's can go either way anyway, but the cd32 was released in the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Helmet Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 dumb question probably, but will the CD32 work on an NTSC television? I'd like to get one of those, since it looks like a game system and not a computer. 1003056[/snapback] yea, the Amiga's can go either way anyway, but the cd32 was released in the US. 1003068[/snapback] Cool, I think I'll get one. Now, where to find a couple of those multi-game cd's mentioned above Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Ragan Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Holy crap, you need an engineering degree to run this thing! Is there an easier way to use WHDLoad? JR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted January 20, 2006 Author Share Posted January 20, 2006 How hard is it to upgrade a Amiga CD32 to a 1200? If you're able to actually do it, how compatible is it? I've read places that it's 100% compatible, but I'd have a hard time believing that... Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 How hard is it to upgrade a Amiga CD32 to a 1200? If you're able to actually do it, how compatible is it? I've read places that it's 100% compatible, but I'd have a hard time believing that... Tempest 1003791[/snapback] It's very easy, just expensive. The right way to go is an SK32MK2 and a HD. And its 100% AFAIK never had anything not work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted January 20, 2006 Author Share Posted January 20, 2006 How hard is it to upgrade a Amiga CD32 to a 1200? If you're able to actually do it, how compatible is it? I've read places that it's 100% compatible, but I'd have a hard time believing that... Tempest 1003791[/snapback] It's very easy, just expensive. The right way to go is an SK32MK2 and a HD. And its 100% AFAIK never had anything not work. 1003796[/snapback] 110.60? I assume thats Pounds or Euros and not USD right? Tempest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 110.60? I assume thats Pounds or Euros and not USD right? Tempest 1003800[/snapback] Yeah, that's pounds. ~200USD. Exchange rate isn't spectacular at the moment. The CD32/SX32MK2 is the thing to have, but $$$. There's also the SX32MK1 that shows up on ebay from time to time. It sticks on the outside, looks like crap and isn't as good as the MK2 though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemesis Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 If you want to play games Go for a 500+ or a 1200,I'd say go for a 600 but they are scarce in the USA.The 1200 will play early amiga games with a kickstart disk.You should be able to pick up an Amiga 500 or 500+ for $40.00 or less an Amiga 1200 will set you back at least $100.00.Most of the ones you see on E-bay are in the UK and are very cheap and easy to find there for very little money.Don't get a CD32 and hope that the upgrade modules like The SX32 are anywhere near as good as actually buying an Amiga 1200 computer.All those modules are garbage and have terrible problems with ram failure and sytem crashes and are way to much to buy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 The SX32 are anywhere near as good as actually buying an Amiga 1200 computer.All those modules are garbage and have terrible problems with ram failure and sytem crashes and are way to much to buy. 1005591[/snapback] While the 1200 is certainly cheaper, I have had zero problems with my SX32MK2. And it gets the workout. Expensive yes, but hardly garbage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Ragan Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 Hey, what kind of video output does the Amiga 500 use? I'm noticing an RCA port marked "Mono" along with a larger port called "RGB-Audio". Does the system have native support for composite video, or will I have to buy a special cable for it first? JR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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