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List of New Features you would like to see in Atari800WinPlus


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I only have a few. For me the emulator is quite feature-full.

 

- Better 5200 joystick support using keyboard (I know it's probably difficult but it'd be nice)

- Cmd line argument for 5200 cart type so I don't have to dismiss dlg. Only a big deal because I run A800Win+ on an aopen mini pc in my living room w/ no keyboard and a wireless gamepad. This probably is an Atari800 emulator thing, not A800Win+.

 

~telengard

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- Config files (like WinUAE), and ability to run with command switches.

 

The emulator takes command line arguments if that is what you mean. I use them on my emu set top box. Not everything is exposed though that is through the menus.

 

- fix the way the keyboard is emulated. The Atari has one of the worst keyboard scanning mechanisms of any computer (due to one key at a time policy) - there is a better way.

 

Always wondered why it did that. I type really fast and it seems to miss key strikes, this explains it. :)

 

~telengard

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Is there a non-programmer who is interested in helping by maintaining a Wishlist?

What's wrong with programmers? ;)

 

001. A direct RAM transfer method, suitable for data-burst to an external application

I don't understand it.

002. The HI-RES SUPER 1020 graphics terminal interface

If you mean the 1020 printer, it was quite rare and few Atari programs supported it.

003. CUT/COPY/PASTE to/from windows & the emulator

We thought about it many years ago and it turned out more complicated than useful.

004. User declaration of the file ext of the temp .txt file that gets output by a print command.

You can define the print command.

005. Starkit: generate Win32 executable directly from emulator: no menus, no settings, just

an executable file which would be generated from settings you make in emulator

(machine type, artifacting, joystick, keyboard, etc.).

This is a very bad idea because it would allow people to make tons of .exe files and then request

for converters when a new version of the emulator appears.

006. Config files (like WinUAE), and ability to run with command switches.

Atari800Win PLus does support command-line switches.

Atari800Win PLus stores the configuration in the Windows registry and you can export/import the registry branch if you like.

007. Ability to load .XEX without having a coldstart

+ load .XEX without INIT/RUN (currently hangs?)

I don't think this makes sense, but maybe I don't understand it.

008. Better debugger using Win32 interface. Sprite/chset/graphics ripping ability (maybe best

done with a seperate program using savestate files)

Click-and-rip interface for dummies? ;)

009. DirectX stretch mode (like Gens emulator)

010. option to run in turbo/slow but keep chipset timings (like WinUAE).

I don't understand these two.

011. full r/w emulation of flash-cartridges (ie AtariMax)

Can you provide technical details?

012. redirection of specific Dn: devices to Hn: (for software that insists on using the D: device)

That's an old idea, but it's good.

013. fix wildcards for H: device (currently only works with directory)

H: devices are significantly better in Atari 2.0.0 than in older versions. I guess the wildcard problems are gone.

014. fix the way the keyboard is emulated.

It's on my TODO list.

The Atari has one of the worst keyboard scanning

mechanisms of any computer (due to one key at a time policy) - there is a better way.

I disagree. Nearly all computers have limitations on simultaneous keypresses and side-effects worse than Atari: no key is reported at all, or reported are keys which you didn't press.

015. ability to load BASIC files directly without having to use the tape player trick or the

LOAD"H:XXXXXXXX.BAS option

Done in Atari800 2.0.0.

016. 100% cycle-exact ANTIC / GTIA / CPU timing.

It's already very very close. You'll probably never get 100% in an emulator.

017. cycle-exact POKEY Timers (currently scanline exact).

It's on my TODO list.

018. full r/w emulation of flash-cartridges (ie AtariMax)

Hmm... seen this already.

019. windowed mode allows for stretching or reduction of window size

My personal opinion is that it's not worth trouble.

020. a proper PAL emulator mode, like in VICE emu

It's on Atari800's TODO list.

021. Emulation of the Black box

I've heard something about Black box, but forgot what it is.

022. proper emulation of the diamond GOS cart

What's wrong?

023. Emulation of other misc 1050 roms (like happy, lazer, speedy, SA2 etc)

Can you explain why it would be useful?

024. separate emultion of the xf551, which i understand is currently only emulated thru the

sio patch when enabled

I think drive capabilities aren't dependent on the SIO patch being used or not, but I'm not sure.

025. A load point counter to supplement the disk/cassette block/sector counter (useful for

hacking into ATR's)

How do you define "load point counter" ?

026. A proper binary load/save feature instead of the memdump feature in the monitor section

There are menu options for state load/save.

027. to supplement the binary save/load feature a read from and write to sector routine using

the info gleamed from the load point/disk sector counter using upto 8 mounted ATR's

(again usefull for hacking ATR's)

Hack ATRs with a HEX editor instead. It's really better than any monitor command you could imagine.

028. Ability to section unused additional ram (for settings over 64k) if not using a ramdisk use

as cartridge ram, as so to emulation for cartridge(s) that use addit. ram (atarimax etc etc)

029. IF using over 64/128k of mem, in the atari mode, to redirect all loads to the addit. pasges

of 64k mem, usefull for hacking into programs, because the monitor will allow you to

access that page of 64k mem (only the first 64k will contain the atari mem. map) addit.

64k pages will be zero'd

I don't understand these.

030. I/O log file. Each entry could just contain the DCB parameters and return code. With

that, program loading could be traced exactly.

That's interesting.

031. Full overscan emulation - currently widescreen only, includes 42 columns.

Pick a number of colums that you think is better than 42 and I'll explain you why 42 is really better.

032. A "flicker fixer" via double buffering or blending of alternate frames from real input

sources.

That's on my TODO list. I just didn't have a good name for it. "flicker fixer" is great.

033. A screen scrollback buffer, like the one implemented in Winfrotz (The Infocom Z machine

parser for Windows).

How do you think it should work?

034. When Misc-->Preferences-->Reuse Emulator Window is selected, a new Notebook Tab

opens up, like in the windows editor, "Context", or the Win app, "Flat Assembler".

I don't understand.

035. A proper artifacting mode. The current mode just knocks the horizontal resolution in half.

Not really. But it could be done better, right.

036. support for physical floppy media and physical Atari drives.

Today it's hard to find a PC with a 3.5" floppy, let alone 5.25".

And it's hard to make an emulator work with a real Atari drive.

And there's little use for that.

037. More accurate performance for Ultra Speed (3X) SIO emulation needs to be perfected.

I agree.

038. correct the default colors. Presently, change the Color Shift (in the Pallette menu) to 55.

This matches the tint (but not the staturation level) to my real A8s. I've asked a few

people and they say 55 works well for them as well.

Palette issues need to be discussed in a separate topic, preferable on the emulator's mailing list and not a forum.

039. Ability to generate hard disk images or write directly to media that the A8's can use, like

CompactFlash or IDE, in the correct format of course, MyIDE, SmartIDE, BB (which I

understand can now use IDE drives with the help of an IDE/SCSI adapter) would be of

great benefit to HD owners.

Interesting.

040. Sector copying of large images is time consuming and file copying via an SIO2PC

connection is just plain tedious.

And?

041. 80 Column device emulation.

Could be complicated, and XEP-80 was rather unpopular.

042. Emulation of a multitude of DIY hardware. Please specify:

Yes, please specify.

043. 6502 code relocator, built into Atari800Win Plus.

There is no universal 6502 code relocator.

044. some control of the emulated hardware (e.g. I've been playing with DIY SRAM carts. It

would be nice to be able test -S4 -S5 -RD4 -RD5 -CCTRL manipulation within

Atari800Win Plus. I guess this would require emulation of some simple logic ICs.

The emulator is open-source, you can experiment with it as you like.

045.- PAL/GAL emulator

Hmm?

046. Native DOS, the ability to pick up the functionality of DOS when necessary. For example,

If I'm playing with a tape/rom/disk image in a way that doesn't allow DOS to be loaded

I would still like the ability to dump information to a DOS file.

I don't understand.

047. improved debugger. Ability to track all activity to a range of adressess. (e.g. if anything

in the $D5xx range is accessed, I want to know when and how it was accessed. I don't

necessarily want to stop execution, as with a break point. I want to monitor activity).

That's interesting.

048. a plug-in system would be good - making virtual device handler development easier and

independant of Emulator updates.

What plugins you mean?

049. emulate the function of the AMY sound chip

It's on the TODO list

050. cut-down DUP which provides the stuff that the H: patch doesn't provide (binary l

oad/save), and a command-line interface or menu for the rest (instead of having to use

XIOs). Such a program would be native 6502 code, with no modification needed to the

emulator - and would use a fraction of the memory of conventional DOS.

H: does support binary load.

For file operations on ATRs use something like AtrUtil.

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I'm responding to comments to only my own requests...

 

012. redirection of specific Dn: devices to Hn: (for software that insists on using the D: device)

 

That's an old idea, but it's good.

Thanks.
036. support for physical floppy media and physical Atari drives.

 

Today it's hard to find a PC with a 3.5" floppy, let alone 5.25".

And it's hard to make an emulator work with a real Atari drive.

And there's little use for that.

Very low priority, granted. Just a nicety. Atari++ has 1050-2-PC/Pro cable support for real Atari drives.
037. More accurate performance for Ultra Speed (3X) SIO emulation needs to be perfected.

 

I agree

Thanks again!
039. Ability to generate hard disk images or write directly to media that the A8's can use, like

CompactFlash or IDE, in the correct format of course, MyIDE, SmartIDE, BB (which I

understand can now use IDE drives with the help of an IDE/SCSI adapter) would be of

great benefit to HD owners.

 

Interesting.

I thought so.

 

040. Sector copying of large images is time consuming and file copying via an SIO2PC

connection is just plain tedious.

 

And?

This is part of item #39. Just to put emphasis on the usefulness of the request.
041. 80 Column device emulation.

 

Could be complicated, and XEP-80 was rather unpopular.

Someone started work for this Atari800win Plus addition but didn't have the time to complete it.

 

Any 80 column support would be appreciated. 80 columns was one of the early Holy Grails for 800 users. There were two or three 80 column options but all were expensive.

 

It would be quite nostalgic to see, even in emulation form :)

042. Emulation of a multitude of DIY hardware. Please specify:

Yes, please specify.

 

Hmm, what were some rare mods that were would be interesting to see in emulation form?

Midi interface (I forget the name), 80 columns (already mentioned), Computer Eyes (is possible via Webcam?)

043. 6502 code relocator, built into Atari800Win Plus.

There is no universal 6502 code relocator.

This has already been pointed out to me. Request retracted.
044. some control of the emulated hardware (e.g. I've been playing with DIY SRAM carts. It

would be nice to be able test -S4 -S5 -RD4 -RD5 -CCTRL manipulation within

Atari800Win Plus. I guess this would require emulation of some simple logic ICs.

The emulator is open-source, you can experiment with it as you like.

 

If my programming skill level was high enough I would try. C/C++ is incomprehensible to me! LOL!

045.- PAL/GAL emulator

 

Hmm?

Emulating programmable logic devices. Goes with Item 44.
046. Native DOS, the ability to pick up the functionality of DOS when necessary. For example,

If I'm playing with a tape/rom/disk image in a way that doesn't allow DOS to be loaded

I would still like the ability to dump information to a DOS file.

Retracted. Basically, I wanted to do a Memdump to an Atari file vs a PC file.
047. improved debugger. Ability to track all activity to a range of adressess. (e.g. if anything

in the $D5xx range is accessed, I want to know when and how it was accessed. I don't

necessarily want to stop execution, as with a break point. I want to monitor activity).

 

That's interesting.

Thanks again.

 

I believe an emulator has the possibility to monitor Atari program execution in ways that no real hardware can.

050. cut-down DUP which provides the stuff that the H: patch doesn't provide (binary l

oad/save), and a command-line interface or menu for the rest (instead of having to use

XIOs). Such a program would be native 6502 code, with no modification needed to the

emulator - and would use a fraction of the memory of conventional DOS.

 

H: does support binary load.

I'm retracting this request now!

 

I was refering to the L command (from command line) in MyDOS 4.53 which didn't work with with H: drive but I just discovered that this doesn't work with Atari++ either. Must be a problem with MyDOS itself.

 

Thanks for your replies, Fox!

 

 

- Steve Sheppard

Edited by a8isa1
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040. Sector copying of large images is time consuming and file copying via an SIO2PC

connection is just plain tedious.

 

This is part of item #39. Just to put emphasis on the usefulness of the request.

 

I'm not sure, but maybe this can help you: ftp://ftp.pigwa.net/upload/k2a.zip

 

041. 80 Column device emulation.
I just noticed Perry added it to the long TODO list of Atari800.

 

042. Emulation of a multitude of DIY hardware. Please specify:

Yes, please specify.

 

Hmm, what were some rare mods that were would be interesting to see in emulation form?

 

Midi interface (I forget the name),

 

I think there were at least two different MIDI interfaces for the 8-bit Atari: one was connected to the serial port and the other probably to the joystick port. This could be a nice feature and maybe even easy to implement.

 

Computer Eyes (is possible via Webcam?)
You mean there was a webcam for 8-bit Atari? Wow.

I was only aware of Video Interface which was a Polish video capture and mix interface. There were probably just a few units of it.

 

I was refering to the L command (from command line) in MyDOS 4.53 which didn't work with with H: drive but I just discovered that this doesn't work with Atari++ either. Must be a problem with MyDOS itself.

 

No, it was a problem with old H: routines. I corrected it in Atari800 2.0.0 and MyDOS L command works now.

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002. The HI-RES SUPER 1020 graphics terminal interface

If you mean the 1020 printer, it was quite rare and few Atari programs supported it.

041. 80 Column device emulation.

Could be complicated, and XEP-80 was rather unpopular.

049. emulate the function of the AMY sound chip

It's on the TODO list

 

Interesting. I didn't know that AMY was popular and supported :D

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041. 80 Column device emulation.

 

I just noticed Perry added it to the long TODO list of Atari800.

Cool.

 

042. Emulation of a multitude of DIY hardware. Please specify:

Yes, please specify.

 

Hmm, what were some rare mods that were would be interesting to see in emulation form?

 

Midi interface (I forget the name)

 

I think there were at least two different MIDI interfaces for the 8-bit Atari: one was connected to the serial port and the other probably to the joystick port. This could be a nice feature and maybe even easy to implement.

Very Cool! :cool:
Computer Eyes (is possible via Webcam?)

 

You mean there was a webcam for 8-bit Atari? Wow.

 

I was only aware of Video Interface which was a Polish video capture and mix interface. There were probably just a few units of it.

Sorry, "Computereyes" (corrected spelling) was an image capture system for the A8 (earlier versions available for Apple II and others). Though it used a video camera to capture the images it was not a "Webcam" as it was not capable of motion video and it predated the World Wide Web. I was just suggesting that it might be emulated using a modern Webcam.

 

Computereyes connected to joystick ports 1 & 2. The interface was available with or without a video camera included.

 

I was refering to the L command (from command line) in MyDOS 4.53 which didn't work with with H: drive but I just discovered that this doesn't work with Atari++ either. Must be a problem with MyDOS itself.

 

No, it was a problem with old H: routines. I corrected it in Atari800 2.0.0 and MyDOS L command works now.

Oops, I missed the mention of Atari800 2.0.0.

 

I'm using Atari800win Plus 4.0 Final. Does this use an older Atari800 engine?

 

- Steve Sheppard

Edited by a8isa1
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Ok, maybe Jaskier won't kill me for it... ;)

 

Here's 4.1(pre-alpha) version of PLus - compiled on a800 2.0.1 kernel (binary file only).

 

Warning! - it doesn't save any changes and may have some issues with sound.

But you can test if above features work (or not).

 

The build is dated 28.02.2006.

 

Happy testing and feel free to report bugs! :)

 

OK - attachment is in place

Atari800Win.zip

Edited by miker
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Is there a non-programmer who is interested in helping by maintaining a Wishlist?

 

What's wrong with programmers? ;)

 

This was just stated to free up the programmers' time for programming, and to give non-techies something that they could do to help out.

 

Something seems a little weird on the display of that message, could you edit it, if you have some time, so it displays properly?

 

The 1020 reference goes to the post about the new graphics terminal idea & associated graphics mode, mentioned here.

 

 

Thanx,

 

UNIXcoffee928

Edited by UNIXcoffee928
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<snip>

 

Something seems a little weird on the display of that message, could you edit it, if you have some time, so it displays properly?

OT:

Just a comment...

 

I noticed that this forum software doesn't like mismatched [ Quote] [ /Quote] (<---Edit). Mismatch one pair and you get nothing.

 

- Steve Sheppard

Edited by a8isa1
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Ok, maybe Jaskier won't kill me for it... ;)

 

Here's 4.1(pre-alpha) version of PLus - compiled on a800 2.0.1 kernel (binary file only).

 

Warning! - it doesn't save any changes and may have some issues with sound.

But you can test if above features work (or not).

 

The build is dated 28.02.2006.

 

Happy testing and feel free to report bugs! :)

 

OK - attachment is in place

Ooh! Pre-Alpha! I feel so privileged! :lust:

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<snip>

 

Something seems a little weird on the display of that message, could you edit it, if you have some time, so it displays properly?

OT:

Just a comment...

 

I noticed that this forum software doesn't like mismatched

[(Close )/Quote]. Mismatch one pair and you get nothing.

 

I have spent maybe 10 minutes trying to figure out what's wrong. The nice quote formatting is applied if I cut the post to use only 20 quotes. When I include 21st quote all formatting suddenly disappears. Can you find a mismatched tag pair?

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Hmm... something's wrong with my above post too.

 

I'm using Atari800win Plus 4.0 Final. Does this use an older Atari800 engine?

 

As you can read in docs and the "About" box, Atari800Win PLus 4.0 is based on Atari800 1.3.6.

 

Atari800 is currently at 2.0.2.

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The 1020 reference goes to the post about the new graphics terminal idea & associated graphics mode, mentioned here.

Did 1020 include an eraser? ;)

 

Take a look at the MacOS X version of Atari800, it has some sophisticated emulation of Atari printers.

 

As for new graphics terminal, why 1020 and not SVG, Flash or other animations? Atari can output them too.

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Fox, in reply to your earlier LOOOONG posting

 

023. Emulation of other misc 1050 roms (like happy, lazer, speedy, SA2 etc)

 

Atari++ apparently supports happy/815 emul. it would be nice to see these drives emulated on the best PC based atari emul (need i mention it)

 

 

022. proper emulation of the diamond GOS cart

 

 

On all the diamond cart images i have, they don't run at all on the insert/attach cartridge option (even if you select diamond gos as type of cartridge)

 

 

 

025. A load point counter to supplement the disk/cassette block/sector counter (useful for

hacking into ATR's)

 

Just as you have a 'sector load' counter (it shows you the present sector being accessed) you can have a sector/block load point counter to indicate where that particular sector loads into atari's memory... i.e 1/123 (S9000) that is drive one sector 123 load address/point $9000h

 

XEP 80's and Atari 1020's were sold in the UK and were available for quite a long time (i remember microdiscount claiming to have had new stock from atari back in 1991, while atari were starting to shut up shop on the A8)

 

Additionally as no one seen to know about the status of the 'AMY' or 'AMIE' chip, as i understand that their were 'legal' issues concerning this device after tramiel sold the design to a 3rd party to see if they could engineer an ST version...a better suggestion would be to emulate Atari coin op's 'Quad Pokey' as it is'nt much more of a development on from Dual Pokey/stereo pokey

 

Also, seeming as you support some of the xl/xe ram mod's how about supporting the ram mod's for the old 800 (Axlon et al)

 

How about getting Electron to assist you in emulating his 'videoboard xe' though your emu...It might encourage more A8'rs to go out and buy his upgrade

 

Anychance of emulating the 65816 upgrades thru your emu (i won't bother mentioning the 65t32 as that would be a bit of a leap so far as this emu's concerned at the present)

Edited by carmel_andrews
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Hmm... something's wrong with my above post too.

 

I'm using Atari800win Plus 4.0 Final. Does this use an older Atari800 engine?

 

As you can read in docs and the "About" box, Atari800Win PLus 4.0 is based on Atari800 1.3.6.

 

Atari800 is currently at 2.0.2.

I can find nothing wrong on your large post. Must be, as you indicated, a limit on the number of quote/unquotes.

 

As for your other message, It's my fault.

 

I typed an open [ Quote] but purposely mistyped the closing [ /Quote] so that the string would pass through the parser. (Notice, this time I used leading spaces on both open /Quote and close /Quotes so as not to duplicate the problem. LOL).

[EDIT]

Your reply to my message ended up with two [ Quote]'s but only one [ /Quote].

 

I edited my orginal message to read "[ Quote][ /Quote]" (with leading spaces).

Edited by a8isa1
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036. support for physical floppy media ...

 

Today it's hard to find a PC with a 3.5" floppy, let alone 5.25".

 

This is feasible. But when you consider all the complications, problems and limitations, I doubt it is worthwhile at all.

 

In first place this can’t be done portable. Furthermore, in most platforms it will require a custom kernel driver. And then in most cases (notably Linux and Windows) it will require administrator/root privileges to install.

 

Besides the software problems, you have hardware issues. They are the same that other programs trying to access Atari disks have: Some PCs can’t read single density disks, some drives cannot access the flippy side. It is not very reliable due to the different rotation speed, etc, etc.

 

036... and physical Atari drives.

And it's hard to make an emulator work with a real Atari drive.

And there's little use for that.

Very low priority, granted. Just a nicety. Atari++ has 1050-2-PC/Pro cable support for real Atari drives.

 

This one is a bit less complicated, and I told once to Fox that I can implement this for Atari800Winplus. But again, this can’t be done portable (it isn’t in Atari++). You might get along without a kernel driver, but you will probably need one for good reliability.

 

023. Emulation of other misc 1050 roms (like happy, lazer, speedy, SA2 etc)

 

Atari++ apparently supports happy/815 emul. it would be nice to see these drives emulated on the best PC based atari emul (need i mention it)

 

It doesn’t really emulate any of those drive enhancements. It just implements some of the very minor features of them.

 

The Chip (archiver) emulation is in the works for the next VAPI version.

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Regarding my requests for support of real floppies/and disk drives:

 

Not being a serious a programmer, system privileges to access the floppy drive didn't occur to me.

 

As for a 1050-2-PC type attachment I guess there is a low percentage of people who need this for an emulator. Anyone who has an Atari disk drive probably also has a real A8 and therefore can use a standard SIO2PC cable to port their disks to ATRs.

 

I personally, would still like this feature so I'm not retracting the request. LOL!

 

Thanks for explaning this to me, ijor.

 

- Steve Sheppard

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001. A direct RAM transfer method, suitable for data-burst to an external application

 

I don't understand it.

 

...

 

003. CUT/COPY/PASTE to/from windows & the emulator

 

We thought about it many years ago and it turned out more complicated than useful.

 

Hi!

 

On 001, I mean a real-time data-dump facility, with a documented interface, which can be turned on or off, like a log-file transcript logger, but to RAM. This way, You would have a standard interface method available to those who would like to write windows programs that accept the output as input, based on address ranges for parameters. New video modes could be implemented easily in this fashion, by having virtual display terminals (in a window) with a standard interface for data (right out of atari RAM). This same facility could be used to network multiple emulation windows in a high speed fashion.

 

On 003, boy, this one would be great, even if there was just a text input box in the A8W+ pulldown, as an option for paste. Something like this would then let you at least save that buffer in an atr as an ASCII list file, without messing around having to insert it into another atr & then having to add the disk to the emu.

 

As I mentioned in my post about the drafting font, Context is a great editor, with syntax highlighting for 6502, and it can be configed as a quick Notepad replacement. From MAC/65, a LIST #P: zaps the listing out to the editor which can be syntax highlighted. It would be nice to be able to do editing there, then zap it back to the emu, with the option to save to an atr image.

 

On another note, how about a feature that would let you right click in Windows Explorer, and get a menu item to convert a file or multiple files to an atr image?.

 

 

L8R,

 

UNIXcoffee928

Edited by UNIXcoffee928
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There was an explorer shell extension for .ADF Amiga disk images. I can't remember if it did copy/paste though.

 

An explorer extension would be best added to one of the existing .ATR disk managers - especially since many people use other emulators too.

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