Intellivision - Help me stop hating it so much!

[jaybird3rd]

I gave up on Vectron. It's too complicated. The instructions made my eyes bleed. I need pictures. I had no idea what they were talking about. I felt like I did back in College when I was tryng to play AD&D and had to figure out THAC0.

Ah, I had forgotten that the manuals on the Intellivision Lives! site are text-only. Try the Vectron manual scan on this page:

 

http://kentrepairs.com/General/Intellivision.asp

 

(An Intellivision commercial plays in the background on that page, so be sure to have your speakers turned down.)

[Lendorien]

Well, Vectron made my head hurt. I really wish I could find some of the games mentioned int his thread for cheap. I'm not willing to invest a lot of money into the system.

 

Yesterday I picked up Centipede at Goodwill (Why can't I ever get there when all the good games are still there? Centipede is hands down my favorite arcade game. I don't know why. It just is.

 

Now, I don't have the 2600 version, but I do have the 5200 and 7800 versions. I really like the 7800 version. The 5200 version is ok. The Intellivision version isn't great. Sounds are better than I expected but the centipede movement is awful and rather distracting. Still, after I got used to the disc controller, I actually had a little fun.

 

Seriously though, the 5200 gets all this guff for being the worst controller ever... How the hell did they miss the intellvision controller?

 

It's really awkward to hold, the disc is really awkward to use, the cable is WAY too short... I don't know.

 

Regardless, centipede has made me forgive the system a little bit. I still hate it, but just a tiny bit less. Hm.

[+save2600]

Seriously though, the 5200 gets all this guff for being the worst controller ever... How the hell did they miss the intellvision controller?

Because you can still game on with Intellivision long after the 5200 controller poops out.

 

IMO - the most serious flaw with the design of the Intellivision, Colecovision, 5200 & 7800 controllers were not the discs, or sticks. It was where they placed the firing buttons. No way in hell can you expect as good of rapid fire succession, let alone long playing sessions with such an idiotic setup. Well, at least some games had you firing from the keypad. That scheme helped out a bit.

Edited December 12, 2010 by save2600

[Almost Rice]

Because you can still game on with Intellivision long after the 5200 controller poops out.

 

IMO - the most serious flaw with the design of the Intellivision, Colecovision, 5200 & 7800 controllers were not the discs, or sticks. It was where they placed the firing buttons. No way in hell can you expect as good of rapid fire succession, let alone long playing sessions with such an idiotic setup. Well, at least some games had you firing from the keypad. That scheme helped out a bit.

 

How about the pain from pressing the fire buttons in the Intv2. My thumbs and index fingers were always numb.

[Lendorien]

Picked up an Inty Voice module at goodwill yesterday along with two voice compatible games. Haven't had time to try them out yet; B-17 and Bomb Squad. I have to read the instructions for Bomb Squad as it's not obvious what to do. Also got AD&D for the system, which actually looks like it might be fun to play. And also Astrosmash, which is Astroblast but way slower and with crappier graphics, if that's even possible.

 

And I agree, the button placement on those controllers are awful. At least on the 5200 they're somewhat more ergonomic.

Edited December 14, 2010 by Lendorien

[+save2600]

How about the pain from pressing the fire buttons in the Intv2. My thumbs and index fingers were always numb.

On my Intv II, the buttons are almost too sensitive. Seriously... you barely have to touch 'em in order for them to work It's a weird sensation though since the buttons are so damn hard. Not hard to press, but the plastic just has no give. I prefer the slightly mushier feel of the original controllers.

[SlowCoder]

How about the pain from pressing the fire buttons in the Intv2. My thumbs and index fingers were always numb.

On my Intv II, the buttons are almost too sensitive. Seriously... you barely have to touch 'em in order for them to work It's a weird sensation though since the buttons are so damn hard. Not hard to press, but the plastic just has no give. I prefer the slightly mushier feel of the original controllers.

 

I'm not knocking the IntV, but I think you have to do some finger-ups in preparation to use the controllers. The side buttons on my controllers are stiff, and you have to apply good pressure to get response. I'm sure over prolonged play indents, then calluses would build up. The fact that there are 4 side buttons, 3 of which have different functions, also makes it a little more confusing. This doesn't make it a bad system. Just something to adapt to.

 

Contrary to comments about the CV controller; while similar in design, I find them rather ergonomic. The side buttons are easy to press. My only complaint is the joystick, but in my opinion it's perfectly playable.

[BassGuitari]

You need:

 

Pac-Man

River Raid

Astrosmash

Beamrider

Centipede

Advanced Dungeons & Dragons

Demon Attack

Triple Action (for "Biplanes") and a friend to play it with

Night Stalker

Nova Blast

Commando

Zaxxon (if you're a Zaxxon purist, you'll be tempted to hate it, but it's actually decent in and of itself)

Shark! Shark!

Thunder Castle

Diner

Atlantis

 

Notice that a good chunk of these are 3rd party games and INTV releases.

 

You can't go wrong with Activision games. Pitfall and Stampede are pretty much direct ports of the Atari versions, which at least means that they can't be anything less than great. But Beamrider, River Raid, and Dreadnaught Factor really kick things up a notch. Happy Trails is kinda "meh" for me, but other people seem to enjoy it. Never played Worm Whomper.

 

I also heartily recommend the three Atarisoft games, Pac-Man, Centipede, and Defender. I personally really like Defender, but it's a bit different from just about every other version of the game, and the controls do require some practice, so that one I wouldn't recommend as much as the other two. But if you find it cheap enough, definitely give it a shot (it looks good in a collection, anyway!).

 

I'm not a huge fan of Parker Bros. games generally. Although the occasional round of Frogger or Empire Strikes Back is a good time, neither game is as good as its Atari version; they play more "roughly," if that makes any sense. If you're a Q*Bert fan (I'm not), you might enjoy the Intellivision version (I don't); my personal tastes aside, it's a well-done port. Popeye, I couldn't give two cans of spinach about, for any platform.

 

Imagic titles, as one would expect, are high quality. The Intellivision had a number of exclusive releases from Imagic, in fact. Demon Attack and Atlantis are required material in this chapter, and Beauty & The Beast, Microsurgeon, Nova Blast, Tropical Trouble, and Dracula are definitely worth a look, too. Truckin' (a long-distance semi truck driving simulation) is exactly as much fun as it sounds, and Ice Trek -while very good-looking and worth playing through at least once- will probably make you go insane with rage at the ice-bridge stage after you've cleared the game once or twice.

 

Except for Zaxxon, Venture, and possibly Lady Bug -which I actually haven't played yet, so I can't comment- you don't really need to bother with the Coleco games at all. Honestly, unless you're building a collection, you're not missing much...ditto for the Interphase games. I actually like Turbo a lot, myself...but the general consensus is that it's terrible, so chances are you'll fall into that camp, too. So...play at your own risk, I guess.

 

The INTV games are some of the best for the system. Thin Ice, Diner, Tower of Doom, Thunder Castle, Commando...these don't get as much attention since they weren't released until after the NES had erased any memory of the Intellivision from gamers' minds, and it's a shame. Diner is interesting because (A:) it was an Intellivision exclusive, (B:) it is the only known sequel to Burgertime to my knowledge, and (C:) it's actually a fun and unique game that I can't say I've played anything else quite like. The graphics of Thin Ice and Thunder Castle are nothing short of impressive (especially TC's splash screens!), and the gameplay ably backs it up. Commando is possibly my favorite of the INTV games. It's not the prettiest game, but its simple-ish graphics and 16-direction control (finally, a game that puts the control disc to proper use!) serve Commando well; it plays smoothly, and it's challenging but not frustrating. You'd do well to check out these "forgotten" games.

 

(Additionally, for what it's worth, I think Pole Position is kind of neat, but, as with Turbo, I'm in the underwhelming minority here. And understandably so. And as with the Coleco games, unless you're collecting, I wouldn't advise that you go out of your way to get it. It's kind of cool for what it is, but if you expect anything like the PP arcade, or even 2600/5200/TI99/4a/Commodore/etc. versions, you'll be sorely let down.)

 

One more thing regarding Intellivision II controllers: the fire buttons aren't really buttons. They're more like sensor points or something, and they give little, if any tactile feedback. But, they are fairly sensitive, responsive, and they work well. Coming from a world where buttons universally act like buttons (they move, they click, they give some physical and/or aural indication that they've been pressed), this seems alien, but it's not that bad. So, you don't need to press down on them really hard and hurt your thumb for no reason.

[Lendorien]

Thanks Bass Guitari. I have Centipede and I will admit to being significantly underwhelmed by the graphics and gameplay. (Spoiled by the 7800 version maybe, but I can't help but think Centipede on the Inty is a really crappy port.) Same goes with Astrosmash. Astroblast for the 2600 is hands down the better version of this game, both for controllers and graphics/gameplay.

 

AD&D actually looks like fun. I played it for about 10 minutes yesterday, though I really didn't have the time to spend too much on it. It seemed to be a game that I could get into. I will probably sit down to read the manual and play it tomorrow after work. That's an accomplishment for a system I mostly despise. But I'm starting to think a lot of it is the crappy games I've played so far.

 

I've played Bi-Planes on the Intellivision Lives! compilation and it was frankly, the only game I liked on it. But it's very simple and doesn't show off the system at all.

 

I have an original Intellivision unit, not an Inty II. The power cord is way too short and the controller cables are so ridiculously short as to be laughable.

 

I played some B-17 Bomber yesterday. I was shocked at how sophisticated it was. I mean, you have psuedo 3d going on with the horizon and planes flying at you growing at you as they move closer and at differing angles. And the bombing is great (if you survive that long).

 

Currently I own:

 

Advanced Dungeons & Dragons

Armor Battle

Astrosmash

B-17 Bomber

Bomb Squad

Centipede

Las Vegas Poker & Blackjack

Major League Baseball

Space Battle

Vectron

 

Question: Does Las Vegas Poker and Blackjack cheat on Blackjack?

Edited December 15, 2010 by Lendorien

[BassGuitari]

Thanks Bass Guitari. I have Centipede and I will admit to being significantly underwhelmed by the graphics and gameplay. (Spoiled by the 7800 version maybe, but I can't help but think Centipede on the Inty is a really crappy port.) Same goes with Astrosmash. Astroblast for the 2600 is hands down the better version of this game, both for controllers and graphics/gameplay.

 

Seriously? Wow. I cannot help you, then.

 

Nah, but I do agree in some respects. Centipede's graphics are a little more low-res than one might expect, but they're more than serviceable and the Intellivision's notorious and distinct "slowness" brings the game back to a level I can manage. (BassGuitari = not good at Centipede.) So I like Intellivision Centipede in that regard, but my #1 favorite version, even though I suck at it, is probably the Atari 5200 version, preferably with the Trakball controller.

 

I actually think Astroblast is a little uglier than Astrosmash (which isn't saying much), but Astroblast's paddle control option was a very nice touch. It almost completely transforms the game. I forget if has Autofire, though...B/W or Difficulty Switch, maybe? However, you're not hardcore until you've played Astrosmash on the Aquarius!

 

One other thought, if I may: if Intellivision doesn't do it for you, then it just doesn't do it for you. There's nothing wrong with that. Instead of trying to force yourself to like a system, just play the ones you do like! You've tried Intellivision, and so far it's largely not happening for you; that's fair. I'm the same way with the Jaguar and TG16, for instance. Different strokes, and such.

[Lendorien]

Seriously? Wow. I cannot help you, then.

 

Nah, but I do agree in some respects. Centipede's graphics are a little more low-res than one might expect, but they're more than serviceable and the Intellivision's notorious and distinct "slowness" brings the game back to a level I can manage. (BassGuitari = not good at Centipede.) So I like Intellivision Centipede in that regard, but my #1 favorite version, even though I suck at it, is probably the Atari 5200 version, preferably with the Trakball controller.

 

I actually think Astroblast is a little uglier than Astrosmash (which isn't saying much), but Astroblast's paddle control option was a very nice touch. It almost completely transforms the game. I forget if has Autofire, though...B/W or Difficulty Switch, maybe? However, you're not hardcore until you've played Astrosmash on the Aquarius!

 

One other thought, if I may: if Intellivision doesn't do it for you, then it just doesn't do it for you. There's nothing wrong with that. Instead of trying to force yourself to like a system, just play the ones you do like! You've tried Intellivision, and so far it's largely not happening for you; that's fair. I'm the same way with the Jaguar and TG16, for instance. Different strokes, and such.

 

Hey, great reply!

 

Now as far as forcing myself to love Intellivision, I think it's more trying to find the things that other people love about it. Plus, it's also a recognition that my dislike of it is irrational. I'm slowly starting to see some appeal there. I think a lot has to do with the crappy games I've played on Intellivision lives. Plus, the PS2 controller just doesn't match the inty controller that well.

 

Centipede really doesn't compare well to the 5200 or 7800. The jerky motion of the pede ruins it for me.

 

As for astrosmash, I really prefer Astroblast. The paddle really makes that game. Astrosmash is weak in comparison. I can't say anything about the Aquarius though.

 

I wanted to play some AD&D today, but have yet to get to it.

[JayWI]

I'm the same way with the Jaguar and TG16, for instance. Different strokes, and such.

 

Jaguar acolyte posts about how it's great and you're dumb for not agreeing in 5, 4, 3...

[BassGuitari]

I'm the same way with the Jaguar and TG16, for instance. Different strokes, and such.

 

Jaguar acolyte posts about how it's great and you're dumb for nor not agreeing in 5, 4, 3...

 

You said it, not me...

 

(Just, teasing, Jaguar fans!)

 

I don't *dislike* the Jaguar (I do like a few its games quite a bit); I'm just indifferent about it. Much like Intellivision is to Lendorien, the Jaguar is mostly ho-hum for me. I'm not saying it's a bad system or anything, only that most of its games just don't appeal to me. Raiden, Doom, Wolfenstein 3-D, Tempest 2000, and Highlander (on Jaguar CD) are pretty cool, though.

[JayWI]

I'm the same way with the Jaguar and TG16, for instance. Different strokes, and such.

 

Jaguar acolyte posts about how it's great and you're dumb for nor not agreeing in 5, 4, 3...

 

You said it, not me...

 

(Just, teasing, Jaguar fans!)

 

I don't *dislike* the Jaguar (I do like a few its games quite a bit); I'm just indifferent about it. Much like Intellivision is to Lendorien, the Jaguar is mostly ho-hum for me. I'm not saying it's a bad system or anything, only that most of its games just don't appeal to me. Raiden, Doom, Wolfenstein 3-D, Tempest 2000, and Highlander (on Jaguar CD) are pretty cool, though.

 

Nice save.

 

 

I want to see nerd-rage so....

 

Jaguar sucks.

[Lendorien]

I'm the same way with the Jaguar and TG16, for instance. Different strokes, and such.

 

Jaguar acolyte posts about how it's great and you're dumb for nor not agreeing in 5, 4, 3...

 

You said it, not me...

 

(Just, teasing, Jaguar fans!)

 

I don't *dislike* the Jaguar (I do like a few its games quite a bit); I'm just indifferent about it. Much like Intellivision is to Lendorien, the Jaguar is mostly ho-hum for me. I'm not saying it's a bad system or anything, only that most of its games just don't appeal to me. Raiden, Doom, Wolfenstein 3-D, Tempest 2000, and Highlander (on Jaguar CD) are pretty cool, though.

 

Nice save.

 

 

I want to see nerd-rage so....

 

Jaguar sucks.

 

Hey, stop trying to co-opt my thread about the suckage that is Intellivision, dang it!

[JayWI]

I'm the same way with the Jaguar and TG16, for instance. Different strokes, and such.

 

Jaguar acolyte posts about how it's great and you're dumb for nor not agreeing in 5, 4, 3...

 

You said it, not me...

 

(Just, teasing, Jaguar fans!)

 

I don't *dislike* the Jaguar (I do like a few its games quite a bit); I'm just indifferent about it. Much like Intellivision is to Lendorien, the Jaguar is mostly ho-hum for me. I'm not saying it's a bad system or anything, only that most of its games just don't appeal to me. Raiden, Doom, Wolfenstein 3-D, Tempest 2000, and Highlander (on Jaguar CD) are pretty cool, though.

 

Nice save.

 

 

I want to see nerd-rage so....

 

Jaguar sucks.

 

Hey, stop trying to co-opt my thread about the suckage that is Intellivision, dang it!

 

 

Please accept my most gracious apologies for the egregious offense of thread hijacking.

 

I'd add some stuff about the Intellivision because I personally like the system but like BassGuitari said it's not a system for everyone. Don't force yourself to try to like it because you'll just hate it more. If you really don't like it, can I have your stuff?

 

Do checkout Thunder Castle and Shark! Shark! though, those games are a lot of fun.

[Rik]

Well if you don't like the Intellivision for whatever reason, at least you haven't thrown it in the garbage.I wish "ALL" that came across a nice Intv, CV, 2600, ETC., would realize that so many love these things and donate instead of throwing in the garbage.Think of all the more nice consoles and games there would be today if that were true! .It just depresses me thinking of all the perfectly nice games and consoles thrown out over the years.

[+save2600]

It just depresses me thinking of all the perfectly nice games and consoles thrown out over the years.

Hence the screen name I've had for over 15 years. In the early to mid 90's, I noticed that goofy phenomenon too. People chucking their vintage wares (anything electronic, but especially video games) in the garbage. Now that I've re-built my Intellivision collection and have been playing it a lot lately, I gotta say... it truly is my second favorite classic console of all time. And it's more than just a nostalgic thing too. I really do love this system. Even Donkey Kong on it

 

Which, btw... has anyone else noticed how sometimes when playing Intv DK, the screen sometimes "flips out" between stages or during gameplay? Like power is mometarily lost or something. It's super quick, like a glitch or a flash that happens randomly, but often enough to where I noticed it one night. I know it's not my Intv system as this is the only game it does it on.

 

I like how Mattel suggested later on, that you should only use Mattel branded games with their consoles. lol I wonder if this DK glitch has been lifelong and common. Just that I hadn't consciously noticed it until the other night.

 

Funny.. so far, the only games (after over 20 years of collecting this stuff), I have only run across two dead Intv carts. Both Mattel branded: Tron Deadly Discs and now NHL Hockey. Which reminds me... anyone want to make a donation I was sooooo disappointed the other night when I went to pop this in. I forget who I got it from recently (and it really is no big deal), but damn... I really wanted to play me some Hockey! lol

[+save2600]

Double-posts are bad, mmmmmaky?

Edited December 17, 2010 by save2600

[Chuck D. Head]

 

Funny.. so far, the only games (after over 20 years of collecting this stuff), I have only run across two dead Intv carts. Both Mattel branded: Tron Deadly Discs and now NHL Hockey.

 

I have only had two that I am sure are dead, both Imagic - Microsurgeon and Nova Blast. I might have an extra loose NHL you can have, I will check when I get paroled from work tonight.

[JacobZu7zu7]

I feel like my hatred for the intellivision is irrational. But I just can't stand it. I mean, I NEVER have this sort of kneejerk reaction to anything, but the intellivision has done it. Playing the Intellivision Lives games on PS2 made me think it was utter rubbish. Then I foolishly acquired one and it did nothing to convince me otherwise.

 

Intellivision LOOKS complicated; all those buttons. And the controllers have those telephone handset cords and they're just hard to use. Now, I will admit that I did play a real Atari before I played a real intellivsion, and I also have a dislike for high learning curve stuff. That could be one reason I don't care for the intellivision.

 

I did not know that the Inty sucked at arcade games, nor did I know it had a lot of good adventure and rpg style games. What sort of games are they? Like Indiana Jones and Adventure for VCS?

 

 

The assumption that Intellivision sucked at arcade games seems insane when you think about it, its got a very playable arcade library, quick more sophisticated versions of... Pac-man, Defender, Tron and a few others! If anything, if Intell, had the same quanity of arcade titles as Atari 2600 did, it would be BETTER overall in this genre. Check out the mothership in Demon Attack! I also think Beauty and the Beast is much funner to play then Donkey Kong on 2600.

 

RPG, like the two Dungeons and Dragons games which are far ahead of their time, and not complicated to play. These are surely on par with Adventure and Indiana Jones.

 

The one thing I hate about Intellivision is that it's hard to collect for. Good games are expensive and rare. That is not a flaw in the console though, just a collection dampener.

 

The controllers are strange at first, but I think its easier to hit a keypad then to switch the B/W and the difficulty switches for gameplay. I mean, try playing Star Voyager and switch guns during play... keep ur toes handy!

 

Plus, I broke about 10 Atari joysticks and counting, those cords and domes always give out. NONE so far with my Intellivision after a "year" of playing consistently.

I do have the replacement domes, but still... I consider that fixing a broken joystick.

 

THE BIG MISTAKE INTELLIVISION MIGHT HAVE MADE, IS THE CONTROLLERS COULDA' SHOULDA' BEEN HELD "HORIZONTAL" AND NOT VERTICAL... AND HAVE 3 LESS NUMBERS TO PRESS. COULD HAVE GIVEN OUR BRAINS, AN EASIER TIME... LESS LEARNING CURVE FOR THE INTELLIGENT GAMES. WOULD HAVE BEEN LIKE THE SNES CONTROLLER! BUTTONS ALL OVER BUT HELD IN HAND MORE COMFORTABLE AND EASIER KEY PUSHING INSTINCTS.

[JacobZu7zu7]

 

Seriously though, the 5200 gets all this guff for being the worst controller ever... How the hell did they miss the intellvision controller?

 

 

Are you kidding?

 

Intellivision is constantly ripped on for it's so called AWFUL controllers.

 

My 5200 I can't play because both the controllers DON'T WORK, yet look in great condition. At least my Intellivision is a console with working controllers!

 

Atari really has nice simple joystick controllers but they always BREAK!!!

Edited December 21, 2010 by JacobZu7zu7

[JacobZu7zu7]

It just depresses me thinking of all the perfectly nice games and consoles thrown out over the years.

 

Now that I've re-built my Intellivision collection and have been playing it a lot lately, I gotta say... it truly is my second favorite classic console of all time. And it's more than just a nostalgic thing too. I really do love this system. Even Donkey Kong on it

 

Which, btw... has anyone else noticed how sometimes when playing Intv DK, the screen sometimes "flips out" between stages or during gameplay? Like power is mometarily lost or something. It's super quick, like a glitch or a flash that happens randomly, but often enough to where I noticed it one night. I know it's not my Intv system as this is the only game it does it on.

 

 

I like the Intellivision Donkey Kong too, I like it more then the 2600 version. Although I don't recommend it, unless you have some time to learn a few "tricks", like how to jump over the barrels... you have to jump before they are near you, to clear them properly. Also when snatching the hammer... you gotta sit "still" or be under a ladder... and don't walk into a barrel with the hammer or it may go through and hit you anyway.

 

And yes, I have noticed that glitch on Intell-DK, the screen flip, but only did it once I think. Atari 2600's Adventures of Tron does that FLIP too. Dunno the reasons behind this though.

 

I'm a game player not a game maker

[+save2600]

THE BIG MISTAKE INTELLIVISION MIGHT HAVE MADE, IS THE CONTROLLERS COULDA' SHOULDA' BEEN HELD "HORIZONTAL" AND NOT VERTICAL...

 

Whoa! I have never even given that a thought! Totally agree, although Baseball would have taken on a much different feel had that been the case. But overall, that's an excellent idea. Controller could basically look the same, sans a few buttons and turned. Imagine using your thumb to shoot and fire. The two side buttons could have been thumbed with a smaller keypad or slightly different config in the middle. Genius! That would have surely made Intellivision more of a serious contender back in the day. It already kinda was, but I mean - so many of these games would have truly been more playable. Such simple concepts are so often overlooked. Coleco even made the same mistake years later. Keypad was worse IMO since it's divided up by plastic borders. At least with the Intv, you can glide your thumb easily around it.

Edited December 21, 2010 by save2600

[JacobZu7zu7]

THE BIG MISTAKE INTELLIVISION MIGHT HAVE MADE, IS THE CONTROLLERS COULDA' SHOULDA' BEEN HELD "HORIZONTAL" AND NOT VERTICAL...

 

Whoa! I have never even given that a thought! Totally agree, although Baseball would have taken on a much different feel had that been the case. But overall, that's an excellent idea. Controller could basically look the same, sans a few buttons and turned. Imagine using your thumb to shoot and fire. The two side buttons could have been thumbed with a smaller keypad or slightly different config in the middle. Genius! That would have surely made Intellivision more of a serious contender back in the day. It already kinda was, but I mean - so many of these games would have truly been more playable. Such simple concepts are so often overlooked. Coleco even made the same mistake years later. Keypad was worse IMO since it's divided up by plastic borders. At least with the Intv, you can glide your thumb easily around it.

 

Yeah, I actually was playing Intellivision recently, and wondering if the directional pad, would be easier to use or more comfortable if I held the controller across and not up-down, and it just felt better or easier... lol. Of course it didn't improve my game or score just was a nice brainstorm though.

 

It is a shame about the "Vision" consoles and the 5200, Their controllers are pretty "akward". Still love 'em anyway though. It was the 80's afterall ya can't do no wrong