THIS looks like the most promising NES clone system yet!

[MaximRecoil]

All I can say is, forget about the Top Loader NES. I'm glad that someone got me one as a birthday gift back in May, because it has the worst RF output that I've ever seen, aside from the Jaguar. It works as well as everyone says it does, but the lines look awfull, and they are very visible, other then the parts of NES games where the screen is black. I honestly would have felt ripped off if I had spent $50.00 on a Top-Loader back when they were being sold new in game stores.

 

The top-loader's vertical lines do suck, and being limited to RF-only sucks as well. However, had you bought one new for $50, if you called Nintendo back then and complained about the lines they would have had you send it in and they would have sent you one back with an AV multiport like the AV Famicom, SNES, N64, etc. has, like so:

 

 

And then it would be $50 well-spent.

[CatPix]

Those must be must-have US collectors items

[MaximRecoil]

Those must be must-have US collectors items

 

Not many are known to exist. In fact, if I remember right, many people considered them to be an urban legend for a long time, until solid proof of at least one of them surfaced several years ago. I think they're interesting, but from my perspective, they have no advantage over my common-as-dirt front-loader NES (which works perfectly, first time, every time, because I've properly cleaned the relevant contacts). Plus, I think the top loader is ugly, and its diminutive size makes it look ridiculous with a giant NES cartridge sticking out of the top. On top of that, I have no nostalgia for the top loader whatsoever. They didn't even exist until 1993 when I was 18, whereas I first played the front loader NES in 1986 when I was 11.

Edited October 17, 2015 by MaximRecoil

[CatPix]

I think it wasn't even released here in Europe so I can't tell.

I don't care either, with 4/3 PAL Frenhc NES, One working US NES and a Sharp Twin Famicom, I'm more than fully set up as far as NES needs goes.

[ataridave]

 

The top-loader's vertical lines do suck, and being limited to RF-only sucks as well. However, had you bought one new for $50, if you called Nintendo back then and complained about the lines they would have had you send it in and they would have sent you one back with an AV multiport like the AV Famicom, SNES, N64, etc. has, like so:

 

 

And then it would be $50 well-spent.

 

Yeah, I've read that Nintendo did that for customers. I could have mine AV modded, but (AFIK) it would cost about $80.00 The system that I'm using now is the Retro Duo, and the colors in NES games look fantastic! And it works with games from both the NES and SNES that don't work on other clone systems. I wish Nintendo would make another NES-make it a top-loader, and put all kinds of video outputs in it. But they probably figure that the market is too saturated with clones to bother. Mark, from Classic Game Room on YouTube, did a very favorable review of the FC Twin. And, given that he's worked on documentaries, I was happy to hear that he liked the FC Twin. However, they are a lot harder to find then Retro Duos.

[CatPix]

Nintendo won't remake a NES of any kind because it would cost them too much for no profit.

 

Because this would mean advertizing it, released games on carts, etc... and customer service, along with other things.

If Nintendo make such a thing, unlike clones, it will ahve to be of better quality, to comply with many toy and products norms, etc. So we're talking about a system that would cost about 150/200$ to make, with carts sold for 40/50$.

 

And it would be a NICHE market.

Nintendo sold about 8 millions of Wii U, and according tho them, it's a dissapointing result.

A Nes might sold for... 100 000 units at best? For Nintendo, it's way too small to even bother. And let's not forget that Japanese will want a 60 pins connector, and European/american will want a 72 pins model, dividing the small production and raising costs.

 

Plus, like mmost other companies, they wanna move to digital content. First because it's awfully cheap - 1) nothing to make 2) no shipping to handle 3) no reseller network to feed 4)??? 5)profit!

Second because they will be able to make you buy it again - with weak excuses like " emulations of the NES Wii games can't be carried on the Wii Wii 2, please buy again" this or making tricky transfers to make people lose their data, or simply, as Nintendo did, moving your account from a Wii to a Wii U leave your Wii blank - and as a result, if you got ride of your Wii, well your physical GameCube games can't be played and Nintendo will offer them to you on the Virtual console... for a price.

[mbd30]

I'm getting a top loader. My Genesis model 2 also has jailbars so I'm used to them.

[ataridave]

Nintendo won't remake a NES of any kind because it would cost them too much for no profit.

 

Because this would mean advertizing it, released games on carts, etc... and customer service, along with other things.

If Nintendo make such a thing, unlike clones, it will ahve to be of better quality, to comply with many toy and products norms, etc. So we're talking about a system that would cost about 150/200$ to make, with carts sold for 40/50$.

 

And it would be a NICHE market.

Nintendo sold about 8 millions of Wii U, and according tho them, it's a dissapointing result.

A Nes might sold for... 100 000 units at best? For Nintendo, it's way too small to even bother. And let's not forget that Japanese will want a 60 pins connector, and European/american will want a 72 pins model, dividing the small production and raising costs.

 

Plus, like mmost other companies, they wanna move to digital content. First because it's awfully cheap - 1) nothing to make 2) no shipping to handle 3) no reseller network to feed 4)??? 5)profit!

Second because they will be able to make you buy it again - with weak excuses like " emulations of the NES Wii games can't be carried on the Wii Wii 2, please buy again" this or making tricky transfers to make people lose their data, or simply, as Nintendo did, moving your account from a Wii to a Wii U leave your Wii blank - and as a result, if you got ride of your Wii, well your physical GameCube games can't be played and Nintendo will offer them to you on the Virtual console... for a price.

 

True; good points. As a kid, I had my NES front-loader hooked up via RF, and there were no jailbars. Same with the Genesis Model 1 that I got for Christmas of 1991. Some gamers on another forum mentioned the Famicom Titler, but those go for well over $1000.00 on eBay.

Edited October 18, 2015 by ataridave

[The Usotsuki]

I would kill for an AV Toploader.

[CatPix]

 

True; good points. As a kid, I had my NES front-loader hooked up via RF, and there were no jailbars. Same with the Genesis Model 1 that I got for Christmas of 1991. Some gamers on another forum mentioned the Famicom Titler, but those go for well over $1000.00 on eBay.

 

The Titler is only really for if you wanted a ready to use system with RVB out.

 

With the NESRGB chip by Tim that cost about 75 us$, there is no longer an urging need for a Titler.

Depending on what you like, you might go for a Top Loader, a Toaster, or a Famicom, or a Sharp Twin (if you wanna play the Disk games) and RGB mod it.

It's important to know that the NESRGB mod also produce S-video and composite from the RGB video, rather than re-using the original NES board, so even if what you want the most is S-Video, it's a worthy investment, especially if you make the RVB out avalaible - you will be able to sell it later for a reasonable price for people that doesn't want/know how to install this mod themselves.

 

And Tim made it so that you can at any moment disable the NESRGB board, and it will output the original composite video.

 

And if you just want a reliable system, there is a mod on Kickstarter, that was funded but apprently shipping was delayed, that replace the original ZIF connector with a standard 72 pins one, and the NES tray is locked in the upper position; this mod turn the Toaster into a traditionnal "push and pull" cart system, only with a slanted cart port; thanksfully those old gray boxes offer a good grip, maybe because Nnitendo didn't know what system to adopt first...

Edited October 18, 2015 by CatPix

[ataridave]

 

The Titler is only really for if you wanted a ready to use system with RVB out.

 

With the NESRGB chip by Tim that cost about 75 us$, there is no longer an urging need for a Titler.

Depending on what you like, you might go for a Top Loader, a Toaster, or a Famicom, or a Sharp Twin (if you wanna play the Disk games) and RGB mod it.

It's important to know that the NESRGB mod also produce S-video and composite from the RGB video, rather than re-using the original NES board, so even if what you want the most is S-Video, it's a worthy investment, especially if you make the RVB out avalaible - you will be able to sell it later for a reasonable price for people that doesn't want/know how to install this mod themselves.

 

And Tim made it so that you can at any moment disable the NESRGB board, and it will output the original composite video.

 

And if you just want a reliable system, there is a mod on Kickstarter, that was funded but apprently shipping was delayed, that replace the original ZIF connector with a standard 72 pins one, and the NES tray is locked in the upper position; this mod turn the Toaster into a traditionnal "push and pull" cart system, only with a slanted cart port; thanksfully those old gray boxes offer a good grip, maybe because Nnitendo didn't know what system to adopt first...

 

All I care about is a console that plays NES games that has good composite video out. I've seen ArcadeUSA (Willie) install that Kickstarter funded connector. Right now, the Retro Duo is working great for me; it's just really hard to get rapid fire with NES games, unless you have that huge Capcom SNES joystick. I prefer using a d-pad, and I don't have room for that joystick anyway.

[MaximRecoil]

All I care about is a console that plays NES games that has good composite video out.

 

The run-of-the-mill front-loader has the best composite video output I've ever seen from a game console (the SNES's composite video is about as good). The composite video from my Sega Genesis, Sega Dreamcast, and Sony Playstation isn't nearly as good. This person, who designed an S-video modification for the Atari 7800, agrees (though he qualifies his statement with "8-bit"; I make no such qualification, as I've seen nothing better, regardless of "bitness"):

 

Its a pity atari didnt build in a decent output for either S-video or Composite at least, as they missed a trick - especially where Nintendo's NES has the best built in Composite ive seen on any 8-bit machine. Users familiar with the atari 8-bit computers will know how Atari mucked-up on the XL/XE range on composite/s-video to the monitor/rca ports and only on the earlier(!) 800 did they get this right.

 

I doubt highly that the Retro Duo or any other clone has composite video as good as the front-loader NES.

Edited October 18, 2015 by MaximRecoil

[0078265317]

 

Not many are known to exist. In fact, if I remember right, many people considered them to be an urban legend for a long time, until solid proof of at least one of them surfaced several years ago. I think they're interesting, but from my perspective, they have no advantage over my common-as-dirt front-loader NES (which works perfectly, first time, every time, because I've properly cleaned the relevant contacts). Plus, I think the top loader is ugly, and its diminutive size makes it look ridiculous with a giant NES cartridge sticking out of the top. On top of that, I have no nostalgia for the top loader whatsoever. They didn't even exist until 1993 when I was 18, whereas I first played the front loader NES in 1986 when I was 11.

 

Yes there was a video on youtube of this with nintendo motherboard but no proof its real.

[KeeperofLindblum]

Not to go TOO FAR off topic, but I got the 16-Bit Entertainment System in today!
It's made by the same people who did the 8-Bit Entertainment System, but it's the Super Nintendo rather than the original Nintendo. (Thus the names.)
From what I said on here, the 8-Bit really wasn't too bad for the price. It wasn't a perfect replica, but it played a decent portion of my NES titles.

 

But we come back around to... How did the 16-Bit fair?

I'd say that overall... It went pretty well! (Once again) I got it for $25 plus shipping on eBay. (Link here)
The console comes with everything you need to play except a cart. (System, power, composite cable, s-video cable, 2 controllers) The inclusion of the S-video port and cable is pretty nice though since it gives you a vastly superior picture compared to the composite.

 

Now comparing side-by-side on my fancy HDTV with Framemeister, the difference was fairly minimal. My original SNES looked better, but it was also running RGB through the Framemeister whereas I pushed the 16-bit through the S-Video port instead. When I get a chance, I'm going to push the system through a few alternate TVs to see if the results hold up. Regardless of that playthrough though, I can say for a fact that the S-Video option is clearly the best route through this thing. The color might have been a bit off, but that could easily be the RGB versus S-Video. The sound seemed just fine as well, and I couldn't really tell the difference (if there even was a big one).

 

Only tried one controller, but it really felt like a clone controller... Okay but nothing compared to the real deal. (AKA Cheap SNES controller is cheap.)

 

Of course, the thing people here will probably care about is compatibility. And this thing... actually really surprised me.
I've got around 20-30 SNES games total, and everything worked except for ONE title. There was also two items that gave me some issues. I'll list what I tried below along with the few separate problem items below that.

 

*SFC = Super Famicom = Japanese title

 

Actraiser

Breathe of Fire

Darius Twin

Donkey Kong Country

Super Donkey Kong 2 (SFC)

Earthbound

Final Fantasy Mystic Quest

Front Mission Gun Hazard

Gradius III

Illusion of Gaia

Kirby Super Star

The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past

Mega Man X

Mega Man X2

Mega Man X3

Pilotwings

Pink Goes to Hollywood

Prince of Persia 2

Rockman & Bass (SFC)

Rockman 7 (SFC)

Star Fox

Star Fox 2

Super Mario Kart

Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars

Super Mario World

Super Metroid (SFC)

 

Couple of random (and forgot their name) Japanese titles.

 

And on a great note, both my Super Everdrive (flashcart) and the Super Retro Advance (GBA adapter for SNES) worked perfectly in the system! I only tried loading the Super Everdrive and a single title on it, but it did look and load just fine. The Super Retro Advance isn't that much of a surprise since it only uses the system it's in for power and controller.

 

Now for the slight problem children...

The Legend of Mystical Ninja - Dunno what went wrong here. I cleaned it and everything. Works on my SNES, not on the clone. Might just be my copy but hard to really test that...(Guess I could try the Super Everdrive >_<)

 

Super Gameboy - This did work, but it didn't sound or look quite right. The sound alone would make me not want to use it via the system though. It's tolerable, but I still wouldn't recommend it.

 

Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island - This loaded and seemed to be working, but there was a really loud buzzing noise that I couldn't handle listening to.

 

 

So overall, the compatibility is pretty great. The repro carts I have worked, and the flash cart worked as well. You could easily invest in a Super Everdrive plus this system and be fairly well off. It's not perfect, but I don't feel like anybody who wants "perfection" is going to settle for a cheap clone anyways.

 

I will make one big note before the final bit near the end of my post though. This will probably be the nail in the coffin for anybody here interested, so I might as well get it out there.

Remember how the 8-Bit had like a super death grip on carts? Well... the 16-Bit kinda has this as well unfortunately. I kinda get the idea of the slot having a grip for NES games (since that's how the front loader NES did it), but the SNES didn't do that. Did it? Hard to notice though since the SNES has an eject button whereas the 16-Bit does not. There were a few times I was scared that my carts would get damaged somehow. Everything seems to have come out okay, but I figured to throw that out there.

 

Time to wrap this all up with a Pros and Cons.

 

Pros

-High compatibility (97% according to their eBay page)

-Looks (thru S-Video) and sounds good

-Highly affordable

-Works with Super Everdrive

 

Cons

-Video and sound aren't absolutely perfect

-Random issues with a few games (might just be me)

-Weird death grip

-Feels cheap

-Cheap SNES controllers are cheap

 

So if you aren't just hankering for the "real deal" or you want an affordable clone to lug around, I'd highly recommend it. You can't beat a (nearly) fully working SNES for $25! Comes with two controllers even! You're lucky to find that for like $40-50 on eBay, and even then, the shell itself probably looks pretty pitiful.

 

Sorry to randomly interrupt the thread, but I figured I'd throw this up here.

Edited October 22, 2015 by KeeperofLindblum

[mbd30]

I've been playing my new top loader. I enjoy playing it, but the jail bars are annoying to look at. I'll be sending it to Retro Fixes to get modded. I think he cuts pin 21 on the PPU which is supposed to heavily reduce the effect of the jail bars. The basic AV mod is only $55, but I'll pay a little more for TRRS mod and LED power light.

[thecrypticodor]

Of course, the thing people here will probably care about is compatibility. And this thing... actually really surprised me.

I've got around 20-30 SNES games total, and everything worked except for ONE title. There was also two items that gave me some issues. I'll list what I tried below along with the few separate problem items below that.

 

*SFC = Super Famicom = Japanese title

 

Actraiser

Breathe of Fire

Darius Twin

Donkey Kong Country

Super Donkey Kong 2 (SFC)

Earthbound

Final Fantasy Mystic Quest

Front Mission Gun Hazard

Gradius III

Illusion of Gaia

Kirby Super Star

The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past

Mega Man X

Mega Man X2

Mega Man X3

Pilotwings

Pink Goes to Hollywood

Prince of Persia 2

Rockman & Bass (SFC)

Rockman 7 (SFC)

Star Fox

Star Fox 2

Super Mario Kart

Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars

Super Mario World

Super Metroid (SFC)

Did playing Earthbound in that clone trigger any of the Earthbound's anti piracy measures? http://starmen.net/mother2/gameinfo/antipiracy/

I've heard that it activates when played in a Retro Duo.

[KeeperofLindblum]

Did playing Earthbound in that clone trigger any of the Earthbound's anti piracy measures? http://starmen.net/mother2/gameinfo/antipiracy/

I've heard that it activates when played in a Retro Duo.

 

Did not know this was a thing. Let me give it a try and then I'll edit this post

[KeeperofLindblum]

*SNIP*

 

Time to wrap this all up with a Pros and Cons. EDITED!

 

Pros

-High compatibility (97% according to their eBay page)

-Video and sound are decent

-Highly affordable

-Works with Super Everdrive

 

Cons

-Video and sound aren't absolutely perfect

-Random issues with a few games (might just be me)

-Weird death grip

-Feels cheap

-Cheap SNES controllers are cheap

-Major case of the jail-bars*

 

 

Aaand now I have a bit of sad news to report. I think the Framemeister was helping the 16-Bit Entertainment System more than I thought. I still have to test it on a couple other TVs... but there's something I didn't notice before.

Hopefully nobody has looked into acquiring their own yet, because it's got a major case of jail bars.

 

I didn't notice them too much on my big HDTV with the Framemeister hooking it up, but when I hooked it to an LCD monitor I have with S-Video... the bars became insanely visible. I went ahead and tested it on two more TVs (older HDTV and a CRT).

The jail-bars aren't too obvious until the screen brightens up... then they're immediately there.

Feel bad for not testing it a bit further before I put forth my review. Sorry people. -___-

 

 

 

As for the Earthbound thing, I didn't get the initial anti-piracy bit when you start up. I loaded up an old game and didn't get any interruptions there. Just need to try doing a new game... Otherwise it didn't seem to trip anything.

[Andromeda Stardust]

Nintendo won't remake a NES of any kind because it would cost them too much for no profit.

 

Because this would mean advertizing it, released games on carts, etc... and customer service, along with other things.

If Nintendo make such a thing, unlike clones, it will ahve to be of better quality, to comply with many toy and products norms, etc. So we're talking about a system that would cost about 150/200$ to make, with carts sold for 40/50$.

 

And it would be a NICHE market.

RetroUSB has got you covered. They are soon releasing the AVS system. It's an FPGA NES/Famicom with 720p integer scaled output. Built in four player controller ports with players 3 and 4 that can work either in Four Score or Famicom expansion mode. Game Genie, faux scanlines, and 3 integer aspect settings. AVS is ready to ship but Brian is waiting on the wireless microswitch controllers which will bundle with it. Presumably the price for system + controller will be < $200 with additional controllers extra. He demoed the AVS at PRGE. Takes retro carts and new homebrew NES games. These games sell for average between $30-$60 a pop at RetroUSB and elsewhere.

 

Somehow I doubt Nintendo could do better. Let them sink or swim with the NX. Probably the last new mainstream console I'll ever buy.

Edited October 23, 2015 by stardust4ever

[CatPix]

I don't know either. But the difference is that RetroUSB is a small business that relies on mouth-to-ear (is that right? ) marketing and the retrogaming community. They have a probably even better knowledge of the retrogaming market that Nintendo can even grasp.

They can produce a console that will have little quicks and issues that would be deemed forgiveable, or adding functionalities (such a dumping the carts SRAM to an internal memory) that Nintendo would never have though about.

Retrogaming is better suited for small, enthousiast businesses and people than big-name-companies.

 

I hope the RetroUSB NES will allow for real controllers to be plugged in tho.

 

I never understood the need for wireless controllers, except for the Wii Remotes. But heh that's just me.

[leods]

 

Retrogaming is better suited for small, enthousiast businesses and people than big-name-companies.

 

I hope the RetroUSB NES will allow for real controllers to be plugged in tho.

 

I never understood the need for wireless controllers, except for the Wii Remotes. But heh that's just me.

 

Corrected. Big companies run on Money. Well suited for tech development, unsuited for any Kind of art Expression.

 

And me personally, either companies deliver a really good Controller, or they should not deliver anything at all. Such a wayte to ship Controllers just to stay in the box...

[ataridave]

I'm really impressed with the Retrousb AVS!: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKZIoq7pp34 I wonder when it will be released, and how much it will cost? Since it can't play all of the different games that the Retron 5 can, I hope it's cheaper.

[CatPix]

 

Corrected. Big companies run on Money. Well suited for tech development, unsuited for any Kind of art Expression.

 

And me personally, either companies deliver a really good Controller, or they should not deliver anything at all. Such a wayte to ship Controllers just to stay in the box...

That's another story. Sony released Shadow of the Colossus and Ico.

 

Ubisoft released Beyond Good and Evil. Capcom released Okami. And all of those titles aside from Okami are in-house titles.

 

It depends on what the developers are asked to focus on.

Ubisoft stated that they used the easy success of Assassin's Creed for fund projects that mgiht not receiev the same success, and might even be flops.

 

Of course it's not a common thing to see but it happen.

[leods]

That's another story. Sony released Shadow of the Colossus and Ico.

 

Ubisoft released Beyond Good and Evil. Capcom released Okami. And all of those titles aside from Okami are in-house titles.

 

How many years ago? What since then? Just asking...

 

Jeah, they made TLoU. An artistic game where you mash Buttons to open doors. Seriously. Any game desinger should be ashamed of such a game even if it cured cancer.

 

But I'll give it to you. Many amazing games came out of big Budget Projects developed and published by huge companies. But almost all These games have some clear concessions, die after one or two iterations, or worse of all: Just go worse and worse with each Iteration.

[ataridave]

I know about the blinking light fix that was Kickstarter funded, but every NES repair service that I know of still uses the 72-pin connector. I wonder if there are any that use the blinking light fix? Becasuse I do have an original front-loader/toaster NES,. and I would totally shell out the money to send it it in to someone who would give it a good cleaning, and install the blinking light fix. That would rock!