mickcris Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) The bottom of the box was open though. More than enough slack in the cables to move the box out of the way. I'm sure piko saw would have seen this when they popped in his cart so I doubt the controllers were disconnected to do it. Edit: Actually if they wouldn't fit surely they hadn't soldered them to the board with that clear box on it. So yeah, more evidence of them not being hard wired if they are too big to fit through the hole Edited February 17, 2016 by mickcris 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galax Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Just a thought, if these guys were really smart, why didn't they license the ATARI brand instead of the Coleco brand... duh! Seems like a Jag2 would have been much more popular around here. So the Toy Fair prototype would have been a Jag in a Jag case with Jag controllers and a Jag PSU? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) They had to fit through the holes then. No way he would have risked someone seeing what was inside the jag. He is pretty sneaky though so maybe he opened it without anyone seeing. Edit Sorry I had missed your post earlier where you said the same as above Edited February 17, 2016 by mickcris 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PikoInteractive Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) To debunk all these comments. I noticed the controllers were plugged in into an extension that would go into the clear case and into the console (hardwired into the board?). The snes connection I think would have easily pass through the clear case holes (from inside to the outside) to connect to the snes third party controllers. Edited February 17, 2016 by PikoInteractive 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galax Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The benefit of actually being there! Well if you saw a SNES connector on the extension cable then at least we know they were actual SNES connector controllers, not USB SNES-style controllers. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 So then technically the controllers could not have been hard wired if they were attached to extension cables. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmer Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) An the note of FPGA, I was looking at Terasic DE0-Nano-SoC: Altera chip 5CSEMA4U23C6N: dual core ARM A9 at 925Mhz + 40K LE FPGA (plus "Arduino header"). I can see it as a sweet spot to play with hybrid ARM SW emu + FPGA based simulation. It does lack a proper modern GPU (no Mali or PowerVR cores here), but for the retro freak in me it seems at 100US$ it is a steal (on paper better than MiST and MCC216). [note it does not have a proper video out as it is or joystick connectors] I find this board a heck-of-a-lot more interesting, since it's plug-and-play out of the box with HDMI, and has a huge memory bandwidth to the FPGA ... http://www.terasic.com.tw/cgi-bin/page/archive.pl?Language=English&CategoryNo=167&No=830&PartNo=1 No ARM on-board, but why-on-earth would I want a ARM on board when I can just buy a $35 Raspberry-PI2 if I want a cheap quad-core software-emulation machine? Edited February 17, 2016 by elmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xiaNaix Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The oddest thing is that he is claiming to have a SNES FPGA built within 5 month time-frame and its supposedly Emulates the SNES to around 100% Why hasn't he given 3rd parties that do tech reviews copies, to prove such a claim??? FPGA is Emulation and isn't a magic bullet Personally I would be more amazed if he did Sega Saturn or another system that doesn't have Strong Software Emulation available I also believe that the Toy Fair so called CC was a mock-up with a Mini SNES and was Not a Prototype. Starting to sound like a project Red Green would make on Handyman Corner. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkk-sOo8Hqw Did he actually say the words "FPGA core" though or just "core?" Libretro/RetroArch uses emulator cores for each system. They have a working "core" for pretty much every system up to the PS2. No offense, but does he even have the technical knowledge to know the difference between an FPGA hardware core and systems being emulated by an ARM-based Libretro core? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PikoInteractive Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) So then technically the controllers could not have been hard wired if they were attached to extension cables. No you could just unplug them and plug them to the extension once the console was inside the case, and the extensions through the clear case. Edited February 17, 2016 by PikoInteractive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galax Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Did he actually say the words "FPGA core" though or just "core?" Yes: "We are running his games through our custom written SNES FPGA Core." https://www.facebook.com/RETROVGS/posts/947612635308007 No offense, but does he even have the technical knowledge to know the difference between an FPGA hardware core and systems being emulated by an ARM-based Libretro core? Possibly not at a technical level, but he's been using the terms FPGA and ARM for at least a year now, and he claims to have had a custom written core developed, so he should know what they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 No you could just unplug them and plug them to the extension once the console was inside the case, and the extensions through the clear case. It was stated that the controllers were hard wired to the board by Mike so I was just making a light joke. I guess the extensions could maybe have been but I think we all know the likelihood of that being the case is pretty much 0% 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Yes: "We are running his games through our custom written SNES FPGA Core." https://www.facebook.com/RETROVGS/posts/947612635308007He just keeps giving himself more and more rope to hang himself with, doesn't he? Now he can't even back out later and say "Why no, I was referring to the FPGA in the multicart; I never claimed there was an FPGA in the console!" or "The FPGA in the console is doing other tasks; I never said it was actually running the games!", as some of us predicted that he might. No offense, but does he even have the technical knowledge to know the difference between an FPGA hardware core and systems being emulated by an ARM-based Libretro core?Probably not, but there's no excuse for that, either. He's reportedly been working on this project since 2012. That's almost enough time to have earned a degree in electrical engineering, and certainly enough time to have at least taken a few training courses. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xiaNaix Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) Yes: "We are running his games through our custom written SNES FPGA Core." https://www.facebook.com/RETROVGS/posts/947612635308007 Possibly not, but he's been throwing around the terms FPGA and ARM for at least a year now, and he claims to have had a custom written core developed, so he should have a vague idea. That's all fine and dandy but, like I said previously, other consoles like the Retron5 and RetroArch are also ARM-based, have an FPGA, and still run off a hacked (and unauthorized) version of Libretro/RetroArch. I see no evidence whatsoever that this guy has developed anything different. I believe the FPGA in those consoles only handles stuff like reading the cartridge data into memory. The rom is then emulated by Libretro running on ARM so, technically, he would be correct that his games are running through a "custom written SNES FPGA core." The FPGA is getting the rom data from the cartridge at least. lol Edited February 17, 2016 by xiaNaix 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toiletunes Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The only reason to use a SNES in a Jag shell would be if the real thing wasn't finished. I wonder if the real thing was even started- have they announced any hardware people on the team, or are they planning to outsource it with KS proceeds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The only reason to use a SNES in a Jag shell would be if the real thing wasn't finished. I wonder if the real thing was even started- have they announced any hardware people on the team, or are they planning to outsource it with KS proceeds? I doubt they've done anything more than what we saw at the show (and if they have, they certainly should have showed it). As I said earlier, I suspect that the "prototype" at Toy Fair was just a stepping stone to get them in the door at Kickstarter, and that they'll wait until after the crowdfunding campaign is over to figure out how to build the real hardware. Why risk their own money when they can bamboozle the backers and risk their money instead? 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toiletunes Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 If that's the plan, it's very deceptive. The only other option is the prototype wasn't quite ready so they did a last minute switch, which is also very deceptive- but slightly more understandable (act of panicked desperation vs intentional planned fraud). Either way, ugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galax Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The only reason to use a SNES in a Jag shell would be if the real thing wasn't finished. I wonder if the real thing was even started- have they announced any hardware people on the team, or are they planning to outsource it with KS proceeds? Perhaps it has been started but just doesn't work well enough to demo yet. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Hopefully not. they were most likely not planning on getting caught though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) To debunk all these comments. I noticed the controllers were plugged in into an extension that would go into the clear case and into the console (hardwired into the board?). The snes connection I think would have easily pass through the clear case holes (from inside to the outside) to connect to the snes third party controllers. Are you sure you saw a SNES connector binding the ctrls and the extension cables? If so then here we have a "proto" that uses third party SNES controllers (down to the connector), SNES AV cable, SNES compatible power brick, SNES cart connectors and runs perfectly SNES carts. Why would anyone develop anything new using so many SNES parts? All at once? While trying to sell it as "NOT a SNES"? To the detectives around, can anyone look at the footage and see if he/she can spot the extension cable connections? [if they were USB though there would hardly be the need for extensions unless the cords were too short .... which is possible] Needless to say if instead the cord extension is USB at least there's a non SNES part involved (beside the Jag case I mean and tape) Edited February 17, 2016 by phoenixdownita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmer Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The only other option is the prototype wasn't quite ready so they did a last minute switch, which is also very deceptive- but slightly more understandable (act of panicked desperation vs intentional planned fraud). This is my guess ... but I could easily be wrong. See Heinlein’s Razor ... Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity, but don’t rule out malice. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Are you sure you saw a SNES connector binding the ctrls and the extension cables? If so then here we have a "proto" that uses third party SNES controllers (down to the connector), SNES AV cable, SNES compatible power brick, SNES cart connectors and runs perfectly SNES carts. Why would anyone develop anything new using so many SNES parts? All at once? While trying to sell it as "NOT a SNES"? To the detectives around, can anyone look at the footage and see if he/she can spot the extension cable connections? [if they were USB though there would hardly be the need for extensions unless the cords were too short .... which is possible] Needless to say if instead the cord extension is USB at least there's a non SNES part involved (beside the Jag case I mean | and tape) I put on my detective cap one more time its not definitive though but looks like it possibly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bretthorror Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 From what I looked up on Kickstarter, you need a prototype likely because you are able to crowd fund your prototype on there as well. So, if Mike doesn't have one, he should by their own rules, first crowdfund the prototype, then crowdfund his project for real based on that prototype. https://www.kickstarter.com/rules/prototypes I dunno how much it costs to make a working proto, but I don't see why he can't go this route and pay someone x amount of dollars to make the damn thing run Chameleon carts and then all that he has to do is put the shit in a shell with some fine tuning and surely his project would succeed. This way those interested can pledge a small amount for him to prove he can get it done and if he can't, those interested only lose a 5 or a 10 spot or whatever. The final product at an affordable price would likely be a shoe-in. His greedy, scamming ass can still get a free prototype. Putting the cart before the horse is Mike's specialty, though. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Are the people at Kickstarter really that stupid/negligent? Can I cover my old Honda in duct tape and use that as the 'prototype' for a car Kickstarter? Dumber'na box of rocks.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 when the console is in the clear box, the extra slack on the cable is under the console so its hard to see anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) when the console is in the clear box, the extra slack on the cable is under the console so its hard to see anything Don't worry, Piko was there and he has no particular reason to say one thing or another, so if he confirms the SNES connections in the extension cables I can take his memory at face value. [uSB extension cords have relatively small connectors the first hint you spotted seems to be already evidence of SNES given the wide size but again let's apply caution] Edited February 17, 2016 by phoenixdownita 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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