Bivotar Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 Attached are 10 out of 14. They run fine in MESS. (To prevent any further bashing of me - "MESS" is only the name of the emulator. And the binaries are available for free download from Daniels homepage.) Downloading and trying these games out was very interesting. Very nice intro screen! The games themselves are extremely simplistic. And while the CV isn't an overly complex system, it is capable of much more than what these games are. Each game by itself would not stand up very well, but as a "game pack", it's not too bad. A couple of the games are almost too simple though. The programmer obviously knows what he's doing though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaManFan Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 In other words, it's WarioWare for the ColecoVision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 I think the problem is the german mentality to see things negative.For example, the Eurocon in Karlsruhe/Germany is limited to 30 people because "more people would probably break the spirit" (look at International board) Most Americans would say that everybody is invited to join a classic gaming con, because we all like the classic games. Mister VCS Hm, how to say this diplomatically... that is utter BOLLOCKS! I've been to all EuroCons so far, and the cosy atmosphere really is what made these gatherings so special. I think some of the early collectors will always remember one of the first classic gaming cons, in Dayton. There too, it was just a small crowd of people. A big hit also. I've also been to CGE in Vegas, which was a great experience also. But a completely different experience. At EuroCon you will know every participant within the first hour of the con. That's impossible at the big cons. One isn't better than the other, they're just two different approaches. Cheers, Marco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phosphor Dot Fossils Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 In other words, it's WarioWare for the ColecoVision. Yes! Yes, that's an excellent way to look at it. Thanks MMF, I think you've just found the justification for the whole thing...as if any was needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sku_u Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 All I'll say on this topic is that Cybergoth is a mod here and an established member of the community. When one acts as a moderator, a certain level of tact is expected in their posts. If he feels tact is bollocks and prefers blunt honesty, then maybe he should step down as a moderator. EDIT: If the lack of tact is due to a language barrier then disregard everything I just said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snider-man Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 All I'll say on this topic is that Cybergoth is a mod here and an established member of the community. When one acts as a moderator, a certain level of tact is expected in their posts. If he feels tact is bollocks and prefers blunt honesty, then maybe he should step down as a moderator.Errr, I've been the most vocal concerning what he said, but even *I* think that's out of line. He's most definately entitled to his opinion - mod or not. But that's not gonna stop me from screaming when he - or anyone else - says something semingly out of line. But to remove his mod-ship? No way. Nuh-uh. It's not THAT big a deal. Besides, I'm a mod over at DP, and I can be quite the jerk as well. Ask anybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Jaye Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 Hmm, I have to clarify one thing, here: Dan is from Quebec, Canada, NOT France. I do have a pre-release copy of the game (released by Dan himself instead of GoodWillGames), which I got because I translated the instructions manual from French to English (translation is my field of work). I haven't tried the games yet (when I got the cart, I didn't have a CV, now that I do, I don't really have time to play much videogames). However, I find the principle behind that game collection in the same mindframe as the various Game and Watch Galleries on the GBC and GBA, minus the modernized remakes. And yes, I do like the G&W Galleries as well as Wario Ware. I think that calling this a collection of crap is bringing it too far. This is not, in any way, constructive criticism. Regardless of what you think of the game collection, a lot of hard work went into this. And even if you think that there are flaws in the collection, you could say so without being such an a-hole about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsoper Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 My point of view: If it's a good cart, it'll be a rush because I'll feel like it's 1982 again. If it's a bad cart, it'll be a rush because I'll feel like it's the end of 1983 again. Either way it's a lot better than taking someone to a lousy movie, spending 19+ bucks, and having nothing to show for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcostin Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 I was also surprised to see Manuel write what he did, but I'm not particularly upset by his post. I must admit that I am also underwhelmed by those screenshots. (And if the screenshots are messed up, then it's GDG that deserves a good talking to.) I agree that Manuel should have been more tactful in expressing his opinion, but he raises a legitimate point. Hardly a week goes by that we don't see 10 threads about how much some game does/doesn't suck. Sure, most of those games are old titles rather than homebrews, but why should homebrews get special treatment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 eek -- these games look (and play) a bit like type ins for the Pet from Computer and Video games magazine circa 1981... I'd not call them CR*P whatever, Daniel has done a lotta work here sTeVE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Slocum Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Dude, Manuel, what are you doing? I'm all for constructive criticism, but that's just wrong. Nobody talks like that on the Stella list. My first games were just like that -- using redefined chars on the C64. What were yours like? Sure, he should start using sprite graphics to make the movement less jerky and improve the graphics, but there's no reason to call his efforts crap! We're all learning. Sure, homebrews *should* be discussed differently than old skool games. There's a big difference between games programmers made 20 years ago for a job, and hobbyist who do it today for fun in their spare time. -paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phosphor Dot Fossils Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 This sort of thing makes me think twice about ever finishing that all-text Apple II game I have leftover from the early 90s and putting it out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cybergoth Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Hi Paul! Dude, Manuel, what are you doing? I'm all for constructive criticism, but that's just wrong. Nobody talks like that on the Stella list. My first games were just like that -- using redefined chars on the C64. What were yours like? Sure, he should start using sprite graphics to make the movement less jerky and improve the graphics, but there's no reason to call his efforts crap! We're all learning. Uhm... now, we're not talking about someone doing his first ever "Hello World" game effort, but someone who won the title "Homebrew of the Year" over at DP last year. And that most of these games are what they are is not even his fault, if you carefully read the Credits screen on the ROMs I've posted, you'll realize that these games are in fact type-in games from a '84 programming book. Since he is using a C-Compiler for his Coleco programming, you can assume how much effort this is. Now, I'm not even critisizing someone producing that, I'm critisizing selling it and advertising it with "MASTER COLECOVISION PROGRAMMER DANIEL BIENVENU PRESENTS". I assume if you'd do that and I'd call that a crap release, you'd already know it. Greetings, Manuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 This sort of thing makes me think twice about ever finishing that all-text Apple II game I have leftover from the early 90s and putting it out there. Don't worry too much. Just ask for some feedback before the final release, this will usually help improving the gameplay quite a lot. And if the game is fun to play and doesn't require complex graphics nobody should complain. Just don't call it "The Greatest Game Ever!". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 And that most of these games are what they are is not even his fault, if you carefully read the Credits screen on the ROMs I've posted, you'll realize that these games are in fact type-in games from a '84 programming book. Really? Now that is quite audacious (thank you LEO ), isn't it? Does he have the legal rights to make money with them? How about morality? And IMO most important: Is that mentioned somewhere so that everybody buying the collection knows before doing so Since he is using a C-Compiler for his Coleco programming, you can assume how much effort this is. Hm, did he have to type them in? Or was that stuff already available on disc? Too bad, that there a no type-in games for the 2600. That would be a nice "XYPE-Collection", wouldn' it? Sorry for getting cynical here, but IMO this is "no good" for classic gaming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moycon Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Define "no good" Will the huge market of homebrews be dead after this release?? I dont understand. Classic gamers are willing to purchase unplayable versions of game that arent even complete. I'd be willing to bet some folks would even buy your Turbo joke if it came with a nice lable and a box... So what. We're a handfull of collectors, most of which frequent the same message boards on the net. The news gets spread about game from board to board... People know whats up ahead of time, They know if a games unfinished or unplayable, often they have a chance to try out a game weeks or months before its even for sale. How the heck can a game you dont think is up to some standards only you know about... be "bad" for classic gaming???? Man you need to read what SniderMan is writing and take a step back. The consumer will purchase a game if it interests them. Its not like we have 20 games coming out a month for the 2600 nor will that ever happen. We know what the game is ahead of time, no one needs you to check out a game for the rest of us. And I dont see how someone releasing an effort you "think" is "crap" or even you think might be crap effects you directly either. Oh.... like maybe the folks buying all these 100's of thousands of homebrews a month wont know the difference between you and your work and someone elses??? They'll buy a game thats sub-par and then wont buy another game again EVER??? Oh You are talking about 100,000's of games right??? Not like a few 100?? Surely there an outrageous market for these games that your trying to preserve. By the way didnt the Starfire use music from a bunch of other Atari games?? Or was that just a demo and not in the final release? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cybergoth Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Hi there! By the way didnt the Starfire use music from a bunch of other Atari games?? Or was that just a demo and not in the final release? Try again. Greetings, Manuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Define "no good" IMO "no good" for our hobby is (and am not directly refering to the CV collection!): - doing things for money only - doing things for public response only - using someone elses work for that - trying to cheat the customer - ... - and last not least: destroying the spirit of the old games Classic gamers are willing to purchase unplayable versions of game that arent even complete. I'd be willing to bet some folks would even buy your Turbo joke if it came with a nice lable and a box... I won't bet against that. But this is not going to happen! So what If you continue this, one day you will going to buy boxed and labeled air. And then nobody will care about what classic games were meant to be: PLAYING! IMO preserving history is far more than conserving dead physical material but also to preserve the spirit. So collecting is 100% necessary but not sufficient. I know maybe you will feel like I am indirectly critisizing collectors here. And yes, somehow I am. AFAIK many collectors are only concentrating on the physical material. There is nothing wrong with that as long as this doesn't harm the original spirit. But when some collectors start buying each and everything no matter what, there is IMO a potentional danger for exactly that going to happen. When more and more money gets involved and spent quite critiqueless you will attract people who are trying to make easy money by feeding the market with new products that are attractive to collectors only (boxed "air"). I am afraid, that in the end you will create large antique games museums without any life inside. And after some years nobody will remember how great it was to play a game of e.g. Warlords with a few friends. Then this will become another dead hobby like collecting stamps or coins. How the heck can a game you dont think is up to some standards only you know about... be "bad" for classic gaming???? See my point above. And it's not "my" standard, its the standard we all(?) love from the old games. Those who didn't cause the crash. Surely there an outrageous market for these games that your trying to preserve. I hope I made myself clear enough above. It is not the "market" I am trying to preserve. So I think we are maybe approaching the same hobby from two completely different directions. Both are IMO equally good. Just don't let us forget that we need both sides if we want to preserve the whole era of classic gaming. By the way didnt the Starfire use music from a bunch of other Atari games?? Or was that just a demo and not in the final release? Yup, that was just a demo. Just for fun. The binary is available at various sources and the new music from Paul is just great! Just like the game. And BTW: Everybody who is interested in playing should know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mendon Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 If you continue this, one day you will going to buy boxed and labeled air Are instructions included also? If you give me your PayPal address I'll get you payment right away; I've been looking all over eBay for this!!! Mendon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snider-man Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Damn, is this swerving into dark, dark territory. There'd better be some "mea culpa"s in the near future. Constantly defending a *horrible* choice of phrase does nothing to soothe over hurt feelings. And, please again notice that there really isn't anyone who agrees with either of you that this was an appropriate thing to say. C'mon guys! Are you so blind as not to realize that - apparently - you guys are in a minority here? Criminy! This is really becoming bad for homebrewers and the buying public - the very situation you claim to want to avoid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cybergoth Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Hi there! Damn, is this swerving into dark, dark territory. There'd better be some "mea culpa"s in the near future. Constantly defending a *horrible* choice of phrase does nothing to soothe over hurt feelings. And, please again notice that there really isn't anyone who agrees with either of you that this was an appropriate thing to say. Hm... I'm really getting lost. Assuming for the moment, these games are crap, without any questioning. Now I come and say "these games are crap". Would this be a problem for you? What's the difference to Assuming for the moment, these games are excellent, without any questioning. Now I come and say "these games are excellent". ? I don't see any. Maybe the guy assuming "cultural differences" was right after all... Are you so blind as not to realize that - apparently - you guys are in a minority here? A minority of... what? Greetings, Manuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snider-man Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 I'm done with this. You are obviously a rude person with nothing better to do that insult the efforts of others without an inkling of why what you've said is so hurtful. I'm tempted to begin hurling similar insults at your own works out of spite (and "my points are valid" as I've heard over and over again in this thread), but that would be no better than what you yourself are doing. So, I leave you and your misguided opinions to languish here. Perhaps somebody else can get you to understand what's wrong here. I'm outta here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moycon Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 You're talking about your opinion only Thomas like you're speaking for the masses, at best you have a couple folk (minority) that see it this way. I guess what your saying is it bothers you that people might buy a game and not play it?? So your gonna make REALLY good games that will change their mind so this doesn’t happen, also your going to condone insulting someone else work if you think its a game people wont play because it's "crap" that will just speed this process that you are sure is going to happen. Going so far as to contact people ahead of a games release and offer to help them with their work. I really think you over stepping bounds, especially over something that isn't even fact...It's just something you think could happen. You might take a poll and see how many people play classic video games here...Even games like Skeet Shoot or ET (One of my favs) that others, maybe even yourself consider crap. I think it's terrible you think it's OK to be rude to people that in your mind might be destroying classic video gaming as we know it. Calling someone else’s hard work crap is rude. And on top of that Joe came over and let a lot of people who might be interested in a game like this know what was up and its OK he gets insulted. Right??? Damn that’s cold. As far as this game goes... The Nintendo Wach/Clock Games sold so well they released multiple volumes.. And I know Gameboy owners wern't buying the games to collect. So someone, somewhere likes these simplistic games. I'll wait for the finished product as far a StarFire goes. Honestly Thomas I do play games I own... but at the same time ...playing unfinshed games isn't at the top of my list on any given day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cybergoth Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 Hi there! I'm outta here. I'm waiting for you to defend Tod Frye next time I read "Pac-Man is crap" on a board here. Greetings, Manuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSmirk Posted June 20, 2003 Share Posted June 20, 2003 I got just what this thread needs...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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