What have you been up to lately with your SNES/SFC?

[Austin]

On 11/29/2023 at 2:47 PM, Austin said:

I wouldn't call the story telling great. At least, it's not particularly involved. Character conversations tend to be pretty cut and dry. However, I think there's a lot of charm. Just when you think a situation is going to be wholly cookie-cutter, they throw you a curve ball that just oozes with charm or humor. An early one is when you walk into your house and your character is like, "Uh... why is there a pig in my house?". Later on (and one of my favorites so far) is when you reach your grandmother, whom you thought had been killed by a mercenary. She tells you she fed the killer a pie, which in turn gave him indigestion, giving her enough time to escape. I was like.. "WHAT", and laughed for a couple of minutes, haha. It's not like she rushed out the door by the skin of her teeth, or climbed out a window. She gave him a stomache ache, haha! It's just creative and the game has a bunch of moments like that. The story execution is not going to win any awards, but it's at least enough to keep me engaged in the slower parts of the game.

 

I think the story overall makes sense as well. You do things for reasons, and those reasons are explained pretty well in the game. It all sort of makes sense to me at least. Though, if you have a tendency to quickly scroll through text boxes, then it is easy to miss key points.

I forgot to follow up on this. I ended up finishing the game, then went and did a second playthrough on stream. 

 

The story does fall apart a bit near the end of the game. Characters kind of rush from one plot beat to another, then before you know it you're in a totally different town, yada yada. But I'd still say the first half of the game makes logical sense.

 

The gameplay was fun for most of the game. A couple of late game dungeons began to look very samey. And the final boss rush was a little abrupt, given that immediately prior you had fought a boss, so fighting it again back to back felt weird. The final boss however is pretty cool and posed an actual challenge.

 

Supposedly if you get all the red jewels, you'll unlock a secret final boss (which is actually the first boss of Soul Blazer). Pretty cool! I don't have the time to figure stuff like that out, but it's neat to know of a hidden boss like that.

 

I definitely recommend this game in this day and age. It holds up great in the visuals and sound department, and the gameplay is fun and fair.

 

I'm not sure if I'm ready for Terranigma, as what I am seeing in videos makes it look like a much more grand adventure with its gameplay systems looking a lot more like Secret of Mana. But one day, perhaps. I'm thinking about going backwards and trying Soul Blazer. That looks really fun and it seems some of the combat can get a bit chaotic, which is right up my alley. Then maybe after I will go back and do Actraiser again.

Edited December 20, 2023 by Austin

[newtmonkey]

19 minutes ago, Austin said:

I'm thinking about going backwards and trying Soul Blazer. That looks really fun and it seems some of the combat can get a bit chaotic, which is right up my alley. Then maybe after I will go back and do Actraiser again.

Congratulations!  I definitely recommend giving Soul Blazer a shot.  The combat is actually not that impressive (it's very simple), but it's fine... and restoring the settlements is a cool mechanic and becomes very addictive.  It's also weirdly touching just like Illusion of Gaia.

Edited December 20, 2023 by newtmonkey

[Wayler]

1 hour ago, jeffythedragonslayer said:

Another person unhappy with the save points in that game: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/554041-final-fantasy-iii/74739939

But even that guy knows the blue thing is a save point, he just clearly skipped the tutorial on how other form of saving works.

 

3 hours ago, jeffythedragonslayer said:

The blue sparkley thing tells you what save points do, but it fails to tell you that it is, in fact, one of those save points.

Your nitpick felt so weird that I had to go back and see how the game does it.

 

This guy stares at it, all day every day as it is his job apparently.

 

And then when you talk to him:

Yea, this is pretty fucking cryptic. What is this world map? I thought I was playing a video game. 

 

 

Tell me, what is your secret? Does obtuseness run in your family or have you become a master of it all by yourself with sheer hard practice?

[jeffythedragonslayer]

That's not the save point I'm complaining about.

[Austin]

If you ever have questions about where you can/cannot save, bring up your menu. If it lets you save, then you’re on a save spot. What’s so difficult about that? Show some agency, people.

[Wayler]

26 minutes ago, jeffythedragonslayer said:

That's not the save point I'm complaining about.

Practice seems to be the correct diagnosis. 

[jeffythedragonslayer]

34 minutes ago, Austin said:

If you ever have questions about where you can/cannot save, bring up your menu. If it lets you save, then you’re on a save spot.

I know.

34 minutes ago, Austin said:

What’s so difficult about that? Show some agency, people.

Not sure what you get out of asking condescending rhetorical questions about issues I've already found the answer to on my own long before I brought up my ideas on how the game could be improved here at AA.

[WavyGravy]

I first played that game when I was 6 and never had any trouble figuring out where the save points were or how they worked, and it was my first RPG (Followed by Chrono Trigger. I really peaked early on the JRPGs now that I think of it). It's explained two different ways in-game. The Beginner's House is skippable, but even when you encounter the one in the cave, the screen flashes blue and makes a special noise. Obviously that sparkle has done something. What else would that text be explaining?

No game is immune to criticism, but I really think this is a case of PEBKAC and not poor design. The Evade stat just straight up not working, on the other hand...

[jeffythedragonslayer]

If I had designed that tutorial, I would have made it clear that the blue sparkly things are the save points and not just some telepathic information tile like another SNES game I've played.  That would be an appropriate place to mention it.  I play on a real SNES, not a computer, so PEBKAC doesn't apply.  No one outside AA has reacted to my complaint with condescension like this.  But I must really have your respect to motivate someone to go check the game for themselves.

Edited December 20, 2023 by jeffythedragonslayer

[WavyGravy]

It IS clear that they're save points, that's what we're saying. I've never even heard of anyone having this problem until now, and I follow this game. It's not unclear, if you had trouble, you just goofed and that's gotta be on you at some point. That's fine, people clue into things and learn differently, but to say something that works for 99% of people is poorly explained is ludicrous. 

 

And Jesus Christ, dude, you are really proving Wayler right with the obtuse comments. PEBCAC. How's that?

[Kirk_Johnston]

1 hour ago, jeffythedragonslayer said:

If I had designed that tutorial, I would have made it clear that the blue sparkly things are the save points and not just some telepathic information tile like another SNES game I've played.  That would be an appropriate place to mention it.  I play on a real SNES, not a computer, so PEBKAC doesn't apply.  No one outside AA has reacted to my complaint with condescension like this.  But I must really have your respect to motivate someone to go check the game for themselves.

Just went to try this to see what all the fuss is about (I mean I actually played to that point in the game to check it out), and I have to say I kinda agree with you. There's the wee blue star thing in the first cave area that flashes the screen when you walk into it and it asks if you want to know about save points. If you say yes it tells you what you can do at save points, but it doesn't specifically clarify that it itself is in fact a save point (instead it talks about "sleeping bags" and "tents").

 

And, honestly, I can totally see how some first-time players might not realise immediately that this is in fact a save point:

 

Bit like if the first frog in Mother 3 asked you if you want to know about save points and talked about making sure to "preserve your memories" but didn't actually make it clear that frogs were the save points. Thankfully, that frog does make it clear that frogs are save points:

 

Mother 3 went that one step further just to make it real clear, which means even total new starts should easily get the gist of saves right away, and I think that's the better game design of the two there personally. It even manages to make the idea of saves a bit playful and also framing them as memories fits nicely into the themes of the game and world too, which is just icing on the cake.

 

PS. You have my respect.

Edited December 20, 2023 by Kirk_Johnston

[Kirk_Johnston]

So, on topic, I guess I can say that lately I've been playing Final Fantasy III to remind myself of how the saves there work.

[Austin]

1 hour ago, jeffythedragonslayer said:

I know.

Not sure what you get out of asking condescending rhetorical questions about issues I've already found the answer to on my own long before I brought up my ideas on how the game could be improved here at AA.

I have no pity for people that complain about "bad design choices" in 30 year old games.. when they actually aren't designed all that bad. It's whining, plain and simple.

 

You want something to complain about? Go play Vortex and get back to me.

[Tanooki]

There's nothing that needs reminding.  The save mechanism is both in game explained, and very clearly, but it's also in the manual if you bought the game in the day (or with it second hand, or used it digital as you get a digital manual.)  This is stupid, basic, and quite frankly too hard to believe anyone would ever be confused by that thing.  I mean, I guess if you just utterly didn't read any help sources in game or packed with it, utterly ignored the training location on how to play the game in that house and stuff, and just went along your way...fine, maybe the blue spot might confuse you just a little at first, but otherwise how...what?  You had to figure out that X pulled the menu up, and I'm going to assume basic literacy where it has SAVE written clearly on the screen in plain view.  What's the deal here?

 

I mean whine all you want about obviousness.  Do you need a mid 20th century Warner Brothers animation department smartass to make it clearer?  Big ass neon sign, flashing light bulbs around it, staked into the ground where it glows SAVE and the bottom part of this rectangular sign isn't that side, but a big stupid arrow pointing right to the very spot on the ground?  Then again, sometimes even in cartoons that's not enough...so....

Edited December 21, 2023 by Tanooki

[newtmonkey]

Maybe Square was right in assuming that Americans are too fucking dumb to play RPGs, so I'd like to take back my negative comments about Final Fantasy Mystic Quest. 

Edited December 21, 2023 by newtmonkey

[jeffythedragonslayer]

41 minutes ago, Tanooki said:

I mean whine all you want about obviousness.  Do you need a mid 20th century Warner Brothers animation department smartass to make it clearer?  Big ass neon sign, flashing light bulbs around it, staked into the ground where it glows SAVE and the bottom part of this rectangular sign isn't that side, but a big stupid arrow pointing right to the very spot on the ground?  Then again, sometimes even in cartoons that's not enough...so....

Thanks for the laugh 😃 A sign like that wouldn't be square~

27 minutes ago, newtmonkey said:

I'd like to take back my negative comments about Final Fantasy Mystic Quest. 

Mission accomplished! 

[newtmonkey]

Akumajo Dracula (aka Super Castlevania IV)

Just like with Final Fantasy USA, this is game I've played and completed many times, but was in the mood for a replay and decided to play the Japanese version to compare.  Outside of minor stuff (blood and crosses that were censored in the US release), there isn't much.

 

This is a pretty easy game even for a first-time player, so I decided to start in the Hard mode you access by clearing the game once... I didn't feel like playing through on Normal, so I just found a code online.

 

So far it is, indeed, quite a bit harder.  On Normal mode, I can usually get to Block 7 before losing my first life.  On Hard, I saw the game over screen before even reaching the boss of Block 3!  Part of the reason why is unfamiliarly, as it adds more enemies especially around pits.  Another change is that enemies that take only a single shot to kill in Normal takes two hits in Hard... not a huge difference, but just enough to throw your timing off a bit.

Edited December 22, 2023 by newtmonkey

[jeffythedragonslayer]

I'm starting to think that Final Fantasy III might be poorly translated in general.  When I went to the saved games slots to save, I noticed it said "Erasing data."  That sounds like it's making the save slot empty!  It should say "Overwriting data."

[Wayler]

I think a lot of criticism has been leveled to Ted Woolsey over his translation work on games like FFVI and Secret of Mana ("way to go!" (ugh)). But Square did put him in a bad spot in general, giving the script to him in out-of-order snippets and leaving him with tight deadlines, so not sure how much proofreading was done. Also he had to make significant adjustments so that the game got through the strict content policies by Nintendo. I think a certain suicide attempt is the most egregious one at the beginning of world of ruin. 

 

Just recently watched an excellent 5 hour retrospective on the game. The translation issues (and the before mentioned scene) comes at roughly 3 hour mark. 

 

[jeffythedragonslayer]

33 minutes ago, Wayler said:

I think a lot of criticism has been leveled to Ted Woolsey over his translation work on games like FFVI and Secret of Mana ("way to go!" (ugh)). But Square did put him in a bad spot in general, giving the script to him in out-of-order snippets and leaving him with tight deadlines, so not sure how much proofreading was done. Also he had to make significant adjustments so that the game got through the strict content policies by Nintendo. I think a certain suicide attempt is the most egregious one at the beginning of world of ruin. 

 

Just recently watched an excellent 5 hour retrospective on the game. The translation issues (and the before mentioned scene) comes at roughly 3 hour mark. 

 

Cool, so I have discovered a couple Woolseyisms! 🐑 

 

And yeah, this is why I don't believe in deadlines.

Edited December 23, 2023 by jeffythedragonslayer

[Kirk_Johnston]

Well, since the conversation is on Final Fantasy III/VI for a moment:

 

Merry Christmas.

[Razzie.P]

7 hours ago, jeffythedragonslayer said:

I'm starting to think that Final Fantasy III might be poorly translated in general. 

Yeah, but that's to be expected when your first game implies its the "final" one and you're now pushing past 16 and and going strong 🤣

[newtmonkey]

Kyuuyaku Megami Tensei

This is a remake of the first two games in the legendary Megami Tensei series, which were originally released on the Famicom.  I am of course starting with the first game, Megami Tensei.  It's basically the Famicom game running in the Shin Megami Tensei engine.  It's definitely more of a straight dungeon crawler than SMT (there doesn't seem to be much story or even a world map), but all the SMT stuff is here: first-person view, talking to demons to convince them to join, assigning bonus points to stats when you level up, and even the same spells.

 

It's alright so far, but it pales in comparison to one of the Wizardry or Might & Magic titles.  The dungeon is just a big maze with really nothing to find in it other than random and fixed encounters, and system used to get demons to join you is just frustrating trial and error at best, total randomness at worse.  You can try to calm a demon, lecture it, give it something, or threaten it.  The first two options seem to do absolutely nothing, while the last option is basically how you exit the conversation and start the fight.  So, it all comes down to just giving the demon whatever it wants.

 

The other annoyance is how annoying it is to combine demons.  Each time you get a new one, it's back to town and then trying to combine the new demon with every other one you've got, just to see if you get anything good.  Early on, you cannot even combine demons because the resulting demon is always of a much higher level, so it's all just a giant waste of time.

 

That means you mostly rely on your two human characters, so most battles are just you selecting Fight over and over, and maybe healing now and then, as it takes quite a while for the second character to even get her first attack spell!

 

It does have a nice automap built in, so it's pretty painless to play.  Although I complained a lot in this post, it's somewhat addictive, and I'm guessing that things will become more interesting once I've made some more progress.

[Cris1997XX]

11 hours ago, newtmonkey said:

Kyuuyaku Megami Tensei

This is a remake of the first two games in the legendary Megami Tensei series, which were originally released on the Famicom.  I am of course starting with the first game, Megami Tensei.  It's basically the Famicom game running in the Shin Megami Tensei engine.  It's definitely more of a straight dungeon crawler than SMT (there doesn't seem to be much story or even a world map), but all the SMT stuff is here: first-person view, talking to demons to convince them to join, assigning bonus points to stats when you level up, and even the same spells.

 

It's alright so far, but it pales in comparison to one of the Wizardry or Might & Magic titles.  The dungeon is just a big maze with really nothing to find in it other than random and fixed encounters, and system used to get demons to join you is just frustrating trial and error at best, total randomness at worse.  You can try to calm a demon, lecture it, give it something, or threaten it.  The first two options seem to do absolutely nothing, while the last option is basically how you exit the conversation and start the fight.  So, it all comes down to just giving the demon whatever it wants.

 

The other annoyance is how annoying it is to combine demons.  Each time you get a new one, it's back to town and then trying to combine the new demon with every other one you've got, just to see if you get anything good.  Early on, you cannot even combine demons because the resulting demon is always of a much higher level, so it's all just a giant waste of time.

 

That means you mostly rely on your two human characters, so most battles are just you selecting Fight over and over, and maybe healing now and then, as it takes quite a while for the second character to even get her first attack spell!

 

It does have a nice automap built in, so it's pretty painless to play.  Although I complained a lot in this post, it's somewhat addictive, and I'm guessing that things will become more interesting once I've made some more progress.

The original two Megami Tensei games on Famicom were really something special, a breath of fresh air amidst all those western RPGs and Dragon Quest, even if they aged kinda poorly. But this remake/compilation...eehh, it's kinda half-assed. It looks drab and with a poor choice of colors, including some lazily-made sprites, and the music pales in comparison to the original soundtrack: 

 

[jeffythedragonslayer]

Another Woolseyism:

 

https://archive.org/details/final-fantasy-iii-usa-rev-1/page/n6

 

The game's pause menu is called the "Subscreen" but they aren't talking about the color math subscreen here - you're still looking at the color math main screen when you pause.