Nintendo clearly decieved us with their starfox box art

[Cebus Capucinis]

14 minutes ago, toiletunes said:

 

Gesundheit.

[NE146]

'Course when Starfox was released you played it on a CRT and the you wouldn't see as much of the overscan area anyway. The border is there, but really not noticeable as much. Anyway it's almost 30 years later after the fact.  

 

Edited August 7, 2022 by NE146

[johannesmutlu]

On 8/5/2022 at 6:56 PM, CapitanClassic said:

Had the 32x caught on, it was a more economical way of adding an additional processor to the Genesis. Instead of buying a coprocessor for each game, you buy it once and pass on the savings to the customers. Unfortunately the high price tag of the system $160, and games $70, and likely general mismanagement and infighting between Sega USA/Japan caused its downfall.

Am glad am not owning a 32X but i do own the genesis 2 and sega nomad,to me the both the 32X & sega CD. are obsolete because many games of them are also on the genesis,and while those games do have slight enhancements such as fmv,CD oudio or having more content etc,,, but they hardly justified the purchase of the sega CD and 32X,now if sega did made 3D 32X CD gamea and did came with the neptune with a sega CD expansion ,that would,ve been great,

BUT at the otherhand i still wish sega just came with the spv expansion or with tons of svp games instead.

Edited August 7, 2022 by johannesmutlu

[johannesmutlu]

On 8/4/2022 at 12:03 AM, Flojomojo said:

Remind me never to hire you as my business manager, because market realities will almost always win out over individual personal whims and preferences. See also: “intellivision amico”

Well am curious what exactly happened with the intelevision amico,i heard vague stories about it’s cancelation but not sure if that is confirmed whether or not, BUT for what i do know and as far as i can tell is that the story about the chamelion X is much much worse.

[johannesmutlu]

On 8/4/2022 at 3:09 AM, Tanooki said:

Seriously, for a time I wondered if it was a language thing, but what is wrong with you?  There's nothing deceitful about the screen shots, they interpret the game as it should.  Obviously the black space is cropped, it would look terribly weird on a black box, like a printing mess up.  It doesn't deceive, the shots are of play in the game, the shipped game.  Quite a few in the 80s and some 90s did have beta images, removed content, etc.

You know what was deceptive?  Not having chuck e cheese level of anthropomorphic animals in real clothes flying those ships and just some like 2 frame still heads with flapping mouths.  Quick get a lawyer!

 

I'm guessing you perhaps since you deviated into ripping on the FX1 for not being good enough, don't really have a clue what it does and why it was used?  The SA1 and FX have little in common other than I believe a bit of a memory footprint, and the fact it's an expansion chip.  Flojo is right, you're nuts, and so is beefy there because wow why are you not losing your mind about Phalanx??  Guess what, it's not a hillbilly simulator.

I have never ever heard about that snes.game phalanx ,but i sure will take a look at it.

[CapitanClassic]

2 hours ago, johannesmutlu said:

Am glad am not owning a 32X but i do own the genesis 2 and sega nomad,to me the both the 32X & sega CD. are obsolete because many games of them are also on the genesis,and while those games do have slight enhancements such as fmv,CD oudio or having more content etc,,, but they hardly justified the purchase of the sega CD and 32X,now if sega did made 3D 32X CD gamea and did came with the neptune with a sega CD expansion ,that would,ve been great,

BUT at the otherhand i still wish sega just came with the spv expansion or with tons of svp games instead.

Enhancements like FMV, CD quality audio, and more content are the prime selling points of the CD-ROM. It would be like arguing against 64-bit OS systems by saying, “other than being able to address more than 4GB of RAM, what is the point?” (it is the point)

I don’t think the SegaCD price point is unreasonable, and neither was the 32x. This is especially true after their price drops a year after release. The Genesis dropped to $99 in 1992 (from $200, Aug 1989), and the 32x price dropped to $99 in 1995 (from $160, Nov ‘94). The Sega Neptune was rumored to be released for $149 in late 1995, but Sega was right, this likely would interfere with their Saturn system sales ($399, May 1995). A $50 price difference between buying a 32x for previous Genesis owners, and people buying a Neptune combo system isn’t going to make much of a difference. I have never heard rumors of a Neptune with Sega CD expansion, but they did release a Genesis&CD combo, CDX/Multi-Mega (Apr 1994) but the price was $399. The sega CD was launched 

Oct 1992 ($299) and hadn’t dropped much in price by Christmas ‘94 ($229). It wasn’t until Christmas ‘95 that it dropped to $99, but that was a year after the Saturns release and the Saturn had dropped to $299.

 

I just don’t see a Neptune+CD combo being a viable system in 1995. The price tag would have to be $220-$249, and even then Sega would be barely making a profit. Most people were looking forward towards the new 32-but systems, and the market dip in 1995 indicates they were holding off on buying any of the new systems until one emerged victorious. (PSX, N64, Saturn, PC CD-rom, 3DO, Jaguar, etc.)

 

As for for Sega releasing SVP (Sega Virtua Processor) games or expansion, that is basically what the 32x was. The 32x is an expansion to the Genesis adding an additional co-processor to the Genesis so that it could provide enhanced graphics (due to the calculations being moved off to the 32x chip). A SVP expansion cart would be very similar, would likely require its own power supply, etc. 

 

As for putting an SVP chip in the games themselves, the cost of Virtua Racing ($99) should disqualify that idea. The 32x games were able to sell for $70 instead of $100 because the hardware is moved into the 32x add-on. Additionally, the co-processors you put in cartridges need to run off the original systems power (unless they get their own power brick, like the 32x), so they can only be so powerful before they start causing brown-outs on the system.

 

[johannesmutlu]

On 8/3/2022 at 10:42 PM, MrBeefy said:

I hope he hasn't seen the cover of Phalanx. THERE'S NOT ONE BANJO IN THAT GAME!

 

 

Well i have seen the coverart of phlanx for the snes at it is indeed very misleading as banjo is nowhere to be found in the game and it’s just another space shooting game,likely they did rectifie that in the GBA version of it so that’s a thing,

BTW it reminds me a bit of donkeykongland 3 wich does not show donkeykong on the coverart and not in the game itself wich also feels misleading hence the title donkeykong land 3,yes it’s part of the series but still,it makes me wonder why you would only search in time for the lost world and not also rescueing donkey & diddy kong(like in donkeykong country 3,or better yet why not having an option to play as donkey or diddy kong as well,

while in wario land theres no mario on the coverart despite the title does say aside from warioland also ‘supermarioland 3’ to remind you that it became part of the supermarioland series,

BUT mario can be atleast seen at the end to grab the princess with his helecopter,(after wario grabbed all treasures just in time before everybody else) alltrough i still do wish that you did had an option to play as mario or wario in supermarioland 3 because then it would,ve completely justifie the title,

or how about this,

supermarioworld was originally supposed to be supermariobros 4 for the nes but it was later decided to became a launch title for the snes under the name supermarioworld to remind us that it is a new start from mario,BUT the japanese coverart and demo of that game still does say supermariobros 4 and supermarioworld,as if the developers just couldn’t decide wich name to use,haha but it’s still something interesting,

 

 

[johannesmutlu]

I watched today a video on youtube and somebody who showed an improved version of starfox ,because not only is the super fx chip overclocked but it also uses hirom rather then that sluggish & slooow cheapass lorom,and now the game runs incredibly faster and smoother then ever before( let’s hope that those awesome cutscenes don’t run too fast and that they are still in sybch with the music),now that’s what am talking about,this is what nintendo should,ve done in the first place rather then trying making such lag acceptible,

it’s still not in full screen but hey you can use the zoom in feature of modern tv’s to get around that,

now let’s hope that stunt race fx,dirt racer,dirt trax,vortex among other polygon fx games will get the same treatments like starfox sothat also those games will run smoother,

and steel talons should need a SA1 treatment to run smoother,

and all lorom games should need a hirom treatment to come closer in speed to the sega genesis, in order to restore the bad reputation of the snes being so slooow

and the demo version of sonic for the snes proves this?

[Tanooki]

Those were the pre-internet days, and if you didn't get a magazine or glossed over it, and you bought as people did largely in the day from word of mouth or trust in the brand, yes Nintendo was disgustingly deceptive with a couple heavy to be hitters of theirs both on SNES and Gameboy.  Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island -- there is nothing Mario world about it, they lied.  Super Mario Land 3 was subtitled Wario Land, yet there was no mario land anywhere, they again package lied to get people off name brand to buy something new.  I annoyingly fell for those 2 lies, and while I have years ago finished Wario Land in the day, Yoshi given the $50 price tag and year it came out pissed me off, I've still never had the care to finish it,  yet I still own it.  Nothing persay wrong with the game, other than the screeching brat, but I've always had a middle finger attitude to lying in marketing to sell stuff, just be honest.

 

Stop dumping on star fox, your entitlement does you no favors here, you're coming off again as another spam post.  They did what they could for the cost with the tech at the time.  Just because someone with no budget constraints could use their free time to hack the cart 20 years after the fact is utterly irrelevant to the realities of earlier 90s game development. I'm finding your shoulds, coulds, and the rest are getting old fast.  Bad reputation?  Hah.  You're trolling, if you want clickbait setup a youtube channel or something and get more like minded trolls to feed your account.

[MrBeefy]

I remember their special chip doing quite well in this game.

 

Sorry for the game title being partially blocked out. Felt like it might ne less stress inducing that way.

[Tanooki]

Yeah for better or worse, Yoshi's Island standing on its own was a nice technical achievement on the SNES doing some pretty unique stuff due to the FX2 chip going on inside there.  Oddly even they didn't choose to puff up the use of it with the FX art on that one, I think they should have but whatever.  It never was only about polygons but added opportunity.  This one really did it with all the sprite scaling and rotation, the famous stage with the warping effect from the fuzzies, etc.  It like even Doom going all in on the faux 3D design of that one really pulled what it could from that chip.

[johannesmutlu]

Well for those ones who complaining about that i should have to stop trolling and start a youtube channel instead to get more minded trolls or whatever audiences ,well i do got some youtube channels but it’s more like showing stuff  from nintendo,sega and atari wich i do possess,not to criticize them or to spread hatrics about them NO,

but i can’t denie to like post sruff at what’s on my mind,BUT i only wisg that i could EDIT my subjects whenever i want it and NOT within only 30 minutes,i also would like to have an option to change my username in case just i want to use a different name because then my live will be complete here,

 

now about yoshi’s island,i was first very very sceptic and critical about that game to not feel like an actual mario game,BUT i slowly started to like it more and more,BUT i do now conclude that it still misses most of those fun elements from supermarioworld,such as multiple exists,no star roud or special,no 2 player mode etc,,,, but other then that it’s a new good original concept,but it’s strange that that yoshi’s island game does has the subtitel name supermarioworld 2 ,since it doesn’t feel to be become part of it’s previous game except for yoshi and his island,but other then that they could,ve call it ‘supermariobros -0’ instead (haha) since the event play’s before mario was even an adult,but oh well who cares just a few minor complains for wich  i don’t really care about,HOWEVER if nintendo only lowered down the volume of mario’s cry alooot, i could,ve accepted his cry to hear once in a while, another thing i really don’t get is that yoshi’s story just became accordingly a sequaly to yoshi’s island because there was no mario and everything was just really kindergardenized in everyway and it was not on snes either,

BUT i do remember that rumers did spread around in that there would be a sequel to it called ‘supermarioworld 3 yoshi’s island’ on snes in wich mario will be in puberty,hahaha that would,ve been interesting if that was the case😁

[MrMaddog]

So you're mad about about screen shots being cropped & scaled on a box?

 

Here's a miracle for ya...

 

 

 

 

[MrBeefy]

On 8/11/2022 at 4:11 PM, MrMaddog said:

So you're mad about about screen shots being cropped & scaled on a box?

 

Here's a miracle for ya...

 

 

 

 

You cropped some of Jericho out of the picture. Your meme is misleading.

[Tanooki]

2 hours ago, MrBeefy said:

You cropped some of Jericho out of the picture. Your meme is misleading.

By his own logic, he must therefore add himself to his ignore list, but this could either cause a paradox, or him to just pop out of existence all together.

[+frankodragon]

Even if it's not an SNES game, this one is based on a chicken.

 

 

And you thought in your dirty mind it was something else. 

[johannesmutlu]

On 8/11/2022 at 11:11 PM, MrMaddog said:

So you're mad about about screen shots being cropped & scaled on a box?

 

Here's a miracle for ya...

 

 

 

 

Well since i have discovered recently that the snes is sadly NOT capable of streaming video trough it’s DMA at 256x240 resolution at 60fps(heck it can’t even stream audio at the same time with streamed video, only during vblanks resulting in poor audio),i can’t help that i feel me misleaded somewhat by those zoomed in screen shots on the back of the box,heck even those screen shots of starfox were zoomed in at huge sizes in magazines wich would make unknown people do think that starfox was at full screen size,damn if starfox among all those other polygonal snes games were just in full screen, then those games would,ve look more presentible,

heck even the 8bit nes could do stream 13 color ditchered video at 60fps

while the 16bit snes couldn’t stream 13 color dithered vodeo at 256x240 pixels at 60 fps oh no,wich i consider to be a shame (hence the snes was made with upgradibility in mind) so it was fair to expect that,but it only could stream video at 200x160 pixels at 30fps,damn it makes me wish that nintendo just added more ram for higher bandwide,

BUT is this the end of the world?

NO i still love my snes and am still a huge fan of it and starfox was admittedly revolutionary for it’s time being possibly the first polygonal space shooter along being the first fx game,

also the cut scenes and music tunes are awesome to watch,

 

BUT i still can’t let go that i do feel myself somewhat misleaded by nintendo in their tech specs campaign by for instance saying “the snes can do 512x480 pixels,it can do mode 7,it can view a high amount of dizzling colors,it can multi scrolling background has 8 modes of features, it can do crystall clear audio etc,,,”

and later saying “the super fx chip is super fast”

 

but they didn’t told us that due it’s limited power and ram it can only do one or the other thing but sadly not all atonce,so if you want 4 layers of backgrounds well you hade to sacrfie lots of colors,in mode 7 you have to sacrifie all 3 backgrounds and high resolution,if you wanted the highest resolution well yeah but at the cost of high color fidelity and all 3 other backgrounds etc,,,

they didn’t told us that most snes games uses those laggy lorom chips and that most fx games just uses lorom and slowram as well etc,,,😒😒

and yes the snes can do crystall clear audio but at the cost of running a game while otherwise you had to deal in many cases with dry audio from most snes games,

 

thing is i remember when i tout back then that all snes games were in 512x480 pixels at 256 colors at full CD quality audio etc,,, once i readed those articles,BUT once i discovered that most snes games were only half that resolution  at only 90 colors along with many dry audio samples etc,,and that the snes also has no sprite scaling builtin among other things, i realized that my supernintendo was not so super as i first did tout,BUT I still do like those snes games and i still do have fond memories of it and that’s eventually really all about😁

[Tanooki]

If this site for the icons you can hit a post allowed for an eye roll, THAT post deserves it.

 

You seem to live in this strange parallel world where you're entitled to things that are utterly unreasonable, and if ...no when, they don't work as you wish, you get your panties in a twist over it.  No one was ever once mislead by the FX chip games in how they were popped into box art, magazines, or the rest.  What you're seeing is 100% of what is on screen, nothing more, nothing less for what a still image can give you.  Wasting space on a black border goes against basic rules of publishing any media because it would cause a reader/viewer to think it was a printing error.  This keeps seemingly escaping you, and just you.

 

You weren't misled.  IF anyone ever could have been, if Nintendo had the courtesy of the internet and streaming video 10 years sooner, and they only showed Starfox in motion without the border, then I'd happily agree it would be a crooked stunt.  That's just not the case.  You're making an argument to get attention, this is attention whoring 101, and as you said you have a youtube channel to get clicks, click bait, subs, whatever.  That isn't going to fly here.

 

That whole bit about resolution, mode 7, etc that's entirely true, and you can find games that do these features so what are you whining about?  The FX chip, in perspective of the year (1993 release), and what it allowed the system to do as a co-processor was in fact, and nothing was a lie about it.  In 1993 an this was developed in likely 1992, maybe later 1991 the 386 PC was wide spread and 486 coming on the market.  486 and select 386 had a co-processor so it was fairly new to the mass market.

 

The Starfox version of it, the test bed chip was speed limited as it was I guess like a 1.0 version, the MARIO chip as it was, and ran at 1/2 speed, 10.5mhz due to an internal clock divider.  Later pressings of the game and everything since was just the FX chip, that's it, it would be capable of starting at that rate but could be clocked upwards to 21.4mhz.  And then 3 FX2 chipped games came out, same higher speed but allowed for a 16mbit cart instead of 8 giving more room for more game.  The co-processor promised to render 3D polygons and/or be used for added 2D capabilities such as sprite stretching and rotation seen in Yoshi's Island.

 

Nintendo NEVER touted all SNES games ran in high res, are you mad?  I know I'm taking the bait and already regret it, but I think since you can't let this weird fantasy go, it may be best we all just ignore you to teach a lesson.

[johannesmutlu]

16 hours ago, Tanooki said:

If this site for the icons you can hit a post allowed for an eye roll, THAT post deserves it.

 

You seem to live in this strange parallel world where you're entitled to things that are utterly unreasonable, and if ...no when, they don't work as you wish, you get your panties in a twist over it.  No one was ever once mislead by the FX chip games in how they were popped into box art, magazines, or the rest.  What you're seeing is 100% of what is on screen, nothing more, nothing less for what a still image can give you.  Wasting space on a black border goes against basic rules of publishing any media because it would cause a reader/viewer to think it was a printing error.  This keeps seemingly escaping you, and just you.

 

You weren't misled.  IF anyone ever could have been, if Nintendo had the courtesy of the internet and streaming video 10 years sooner, and they only showed Starfox in motion without the border, then I'd happily agree it would be a crooked stunt.  That's just not the case.  You're making an argument to get attention, this is attention whoring 101, and as you said you have a youtube channel to get clicks, click bait, subs, whatever.  That isn't going to fly here.

 

That whole bit about resolution, mode 7, etc that's entirely true, and you can find games that do these features so what are you whining about?  The FX chip, in perspective of the year (1993 release), and what it allowed the system to do as a co-processor was in fact, and nothing was a lie about it.  In 1993 an this was developed in likely 1992, maybe later 1991 the 386 PC was wide spread and 486 coming on the market.  486 and select 386 had a co-processor so it was fairly new to the mass market.

 

The Starfox version of it, the test bed chip was speed limited as it was I guess like a 1.0 version, the MARIO chip as it was, and ran at 1/2 speed, 10.5mhz due to an internal clock divider.  Later pressings of the game and everything since was just the FX chip, that's it, it would be capable of starting at that rate but could be clocked upwards to 21.4mhz.  And then 3 FX2 chipped games came out, same higher speed but allowed for a 16mbit cart instead of 8 giving more room for more game.  The co-processor promised to render 3D polygons and/or be used for added 2D capabilities such as sprite stretching and rotation seen in Yoshi's Island.

 

Nintendo NEVER touted all SNES games ran in high res, are you mad?  I know I'm taking the bait and already regret it, but I think since you can't let this weird fantasy go, it may be best we all just ignore you to teach a lesson.

Well if i think about how i was thinking about the snes back in 2002 once i was overhyped about it’s techs & specs whether from those peoples on the nintendo service,old magazines and the internet etc,,, and i was believing that everything was always put to the max from whether game,

well then i can conclude that i was living in a strange parallel universe because now i know better i learned that nothing seemed what it is for what i tout back in 2002,once i had my second hand snes for 1 year,

before that i played on a friends snes and before i was overhyped about about the snes techs & specs (i still wish i never was overhyped about it’s techs) i didn’t care about it’s specs,

 

now what i found really interesting is that if it is true that magazines or box art creators weren’s allowed to take letterboxed. Screen shots of games even not if those games are show in a smaller window size,with the reason that everybody atherwise will consider those screen shots as mispeints,well then that explaines a whole lot,

also while i am aware about those fx chip revisions such as the (probably hyping gimmicky nick named) mario chip,those glob logig smaller version and the overclocked fx chip to run at twice the speed,i never knew about an official 16mhz fx chip, in such case that would be interesting as well,

now while it is true that these days i am a spec guy BUT i can imagine that if i would,ve saw starfox back in 1993 as a 11 year old kid, i probably would,ve be extra jealous on those snes owners,but back then i only did knew about supermario allstars,super mario kart & supermario world on snes,it was not utill i heard and readed about starfox back in 2001,and while i was amezed about it once i played it on an emulator but once i played it on a pal snes (wich did had a smaller screen size and slower speed then the ntsc snes and emulator) well i was still amezed but i was slightly less amezed and that wooow feeling partially dropped,BUT hey maybe i just expected too much from my pal snes so who knows,but hey it is what it is,altrough i rather play those fx games on a ntsc snes ever since.

Edited August 15, 2022 by johannesmutlu

[Lostdragon]

Sega decieved us with the Master System box art for Operation Wolf

 

 It used cover art for the sequel, "Operation Thunderbolt". Adams' partner Hardy Jones is there.. 

 

 

Sega does what Nintendon't 😂

 

[Steven Pendleton]

Pretty sure that would be Taito's doing, not Sega's.

[Lostdragon]

2 hours ago, Steven Pendleton said:

Pretty sure that would be Taito's doing, not Sega's.

It's a conspiracy, Taito, Sega, Nintendo... 

 

They are all in on it 😂

[Zoyous]

I have a buddy who always brings up Yars' Revenge as a game that he felt had deceptive box art... a totally awesome illustration, yet the game is a relatively simple two-screen affair with typical 2600 graphics. To which I always counter, uh... that's the case with just about all box art from that era. They had to create lavish illustrations to convey the atmosphere of the game because the consoles could barely display recognizable images. There's nothing particularly unusual about Yars' Revenge in that sense, plus it's generally regarded as one of the finest games on the system. Only the original series of releases from Activision had illustrations that were roughly representative of what you'd actually see on the screen.

[johannesmutlu]

While this nintendo 3D joy stick looks absolutely cool,but it clearly states on the box that it is only compatible with pc’s and not with nintendo systems( unless you want to do it the unofficial way with a DA 15 pin to N64 or snes etc,, connector plug adaptor)

but why it does show the N 64 if it has nothing to do with it?

 

heck it even shows the N64  on it’s controller,now whether this was for commercializing reasons or not,this just feels just as misleading and confusing as well,but still trough it’s a must have for nintendo fans no matter how bad it play’s🤣

 

[johannesmutlu]

Another thing i found very very misleading from nintendo is that they put a coverart of donkeykong & mario running on conveyor belt whereas there is just like all previous versions of that game no pie factory with those conveyor belts in it,so again this feels something very misleading,eventrough they did came outbwith an upgraded nes version for limited edition wii systems,wich did contain the missing pie factory level,BUT it was 27 years too late and it was not on the same hardware but even then it couldn’t hold a candle against the later C64 versions etc,,, of that game,

heck am amezed nintendo didn’t had upgraded the fds version of that game either🤨

Edited September 5, 2022 by johannesmutlu