What relatively underserved game genre would you like to see new development for on the TI-99?

[digdugnate]

On 9/22/2022 at 6:52 PM, OLD CS1 said:

 

Anything else we can require to make it more niche?

Pascal or MBX required.

[pixelpedant]

Perhaps F18A video, ForTI music, and MBX synth, just for good measure.

[BillG]

On 9/23/2022 at 3:54 PM, PeteE said:

What would it take to get more people interested in programming in assembly on the TI-99/4a?

I second much of what Airshack said here:

 

Unlike many other platforms, the 99/4A woefully lacks a simple way to read and write a character.

 

One of my many projects is Space Voyage Everywhere.  I start with the Space Voyage game for the SWTPC 6800 and paraphrase it to run on other processors.  Phase one is just getting it to work and a future phase two will be making it use the strengths of the host platform.

 

So far, I have it working on the following processors:

 

6800

6809

6502

8080

AVR

68000

 

The 9900 implementation has stalled here:

 

https://talk.dallasmakerspace.org/t/project-log-python-on-the-6502-c64-8080-6800-6809-and-avr/18852/282

 

[+Ksarul]

On 9/22/2022 at 8:44 AM, Vorticon said:

the Chicago TI Faire in October.

So do we know the date yet, as October is right around the corner. Turtles and I must make plans. . .

[+DuaneAL]

The Chicago user's group page says the 29th.  Hope to see you there!

[jetset]

Not sure if "Graphic Adventure" is meaning a text game w/graphics, like Return to Pirates Isle, or just a generic adventure game, but I'd LOVE more text-adventure games with graphics. Just a plain screen with a few items...I have no idea why but I've become beyond hooked on text games.

[pixelpedant]

Likewise, and there's a lot of potential to develop that sort of thing pretty easily these days.  Particularly given senior_falcon's TML Graphic Adventure Extended BASIC toolset.  Which dedicates the upper portion of the screen to full bitmap graphics, and the bottom of the screen to bitmap text.  With compiling such programmings being an option.  As shown at the timecode linked here:

 

 

[+Schmitzi]

 

Any of the above, but with the TIPI-option to play online, save online, and this stuff 🥰

 

[jrhodes]

Actually a thought just crossed my mind. I would kind of like to see a "rhythm game" where streams of letters (good use for sprites?) run down the screen (each stream potentially moving at a different rate) and the player needs to hit the correct key/letter when it is about to cross a hotline on the screen. Think Guitar Hero only keyboard based.

[matthew180]

On 9/25/2022 at 8:20 AM, BillG said:

Unlike many other platforms, the 99/4A woefully lacks a simple way to read and write a character.

 

Please provide context for this.  If I assume assembly and direct VDP access, then it is not more complicated than any other platform that uses the 9918A-family of VDP, i.e. ColecoVision, MSX1, etc..  The VRAM is not memory-mapped, but reading/writing data to/from the VDP is not terribly complicated.  And, the 9918A offers a lot of flexibility that many other platforms of the era did not, like being able to redefine a tile's pattern, since patterns are in VRAM rather than a ROM.

 

On 9/25/2022 at 8:20 AM, BillG said:

The 9900 implementation has stalled here:

 

It is not clear to me from the included post what caused a stall?

 

This post is off-topic, but the 9900 assembly questions further down on that page would make good questions for this forum.  If you start a thread specific to that project, or specifically about the assembly questions (like the JH and JLE questions), I'm sure you will get a lot of good responses and discussion.

[GDMike]

I was thinking about a game, (starter program), called "UN-CLOAK".

Basically a random ship that's hidden that flies around and you try hitting it until it's completely un-cloaked and visible. 

[HOME AUTOMATION]

In some of the harder versions of this game, or it's clones. The shields would only go visible for a moment, while being shot.

..I hated that!

[GDMike]

Hehe

[BillG]

On 10/1/2022 at 3:37 PM, matthew180 said:

 

Please provide context for this.  If I assume assembly and direct VDP access, then it is not more complicated than any other platform that uses the 9918A-family of VDP, i.e. ColecoVision, MSX1, etc..  The VRAM is not memory-mapped, but reading/writing data to/from the VDP is not terribly complicated.  And, the 9918A offers a lot of flexibility that many other platforms of the era did not, like being able to redefine a tile's pattern, since patterns are in VRAM rather than a ROM.

 

 

It is not clear to me from the included post what caused a stall?

 

This post is off-topic, but the 9900 assembly questions further down on that page would make good questions for this forum.  If you start a thread specific to that project, or specifically about the assembly questions (like the JH and JLE questions), I'm sure you will get a lot of good responses and discussion.

What I intended to say and failed to make clear is that many other platforms offer simple system calls to read and write characters teletype-style.  A beginner should not have to learn the intricacies of a CRT controller or video memory access to start writing a text game with a simple user interface.

 

The whole story is that Paul (one of the original authors of Parsec) wanted me to target the 9900 with my Python compiler.  I had determined that a clone of the Space Voyage game was complex enough to get a real feel for developing using the instruction set of a platform without making a huge investment in time.  My project scheduling is akin to the ready list in a multitasking operating system; I pick one out of many which

 

1) appears interesting and challenging at the moment

2) shows potential for immediate progress, that is, no large unresolved blocking issues

3) provides some kind of lasting value

4) captures the interest of others

 

Unfortunately, Space Voyage 9900 has not been chosen in a long while, hence "stalled."

[HOME AUTOMATION]

Not sure if this foots the bill...

 

[BillG]

Thanks.

 

Are those memory-mapped I/O where just the read or write is sufficient to accomplish the operation or is something else needed to trigger an input or output?

[HOME AUTOMATION]

I don't know anything...

...I just work here.

[Serafini Lapo]

On 29/9/2022 at 01:55, jrhodes said:

In realtà un pensiero mi è appena passato per la mente. Mi piacerebbe vedere un "gioco ritmico" in cui flussi di lettere (buon uso per gli sprite?) scorrono lungo lo schermo (ogni flusso si muove potenzialmente a una velocità diversa) e il giocatore deve premere il tasto/lettera corretto quando sta per attraversare una hotline sullo schermo. Pensa a Guitar Hero solo basato sulla tastiera.

they converted guitar hero for vectrex .. it might be feasible for Ti too!

[matthew180]

On 10/10/2022 at 5:43 AM, BillG said:

What I intended to say and failed to make clear is that many other platforms offer simple system calls to read and write characters teletype-style.

 

 

I'm still not clear on the environment, but I will assume assembly language.  By "system calls" I assume you mean routines in ROM?  That being the case, the 99/4A does offer several subroutines for Keyboard and VDP operations: KSCAN (keyboard scan), VWTR (VDP Write to Register), VSBW (VDP Single Byte Write), VSBR (VDP Single Byte Read), and a few others.

 

However, reading and writing to the 9918A is not any more complicated than setting up to call these routines (or I imagine any more complicated than using systems calls on the many other platforms referred to).

 

The 9918A VDP has "video modes" and requires a little setup, but it only has 7 VDP registers and, again, is not very complicated.

 

If you are looking for an assembly routine to just set the most common Graphics Mode 1 (32x24 characters), and a routine that just writes a character to the screen in a print-style way, those would be pretty quick and easy, and I'm sure someone here would be happy to provide those routines.

 

I would be interested to see what is offered by the "many other platforms" for easily reading and writing characters.

 

On 10/10/2022 at 5:43 AM, BillG said:

A beginner should not have to learn the intricacies of a CRT controller or video memory access to start writing a text game with a simple user interface.

 

Are you referring to someone who is a beginner to programming, or someone new to the 99/4A?  A beginner to programming should probably not be starting with assembly, and anyone working in assembly language on any system should expect to need to know some details about the hardware, IMO.

 

On 10/10/2022 at 10:13 AM, HOME AUTOMATION said:

Not sure if this foots the bill...

 

15 hours ago, BillG said:

Are those memory-mapped I/O where just the read or write is sufficient to accomplish the operation or is something else needed to trigger an input or output?

 

Those are not memory-mapped I/O, they are specific memory addresses used by various ROM and GROM routines.  I'm not sure what makes use of >837D, >837E, and >837F, some GROM or other routine maybe.  The 99/4A has 256-bytes of 16-bit SRAM at >8300 to >83FF (the only actual CPU RAM in the console), and it is heavily used by various environments (BASIC, GPL, XB, ROM routines, etc.)

 

[BillG]

6 hours ago, matthew180 said:

I would be interested to see what is offered by the "many other platforms" for easily reading and writing characters.

 

Apple II and C64 have routines to call for reading and writing characters.

 

CP/M and DOS (PC, MS, ST) offer system call functions to write, read and determine whether a character is available.

[+OLD CS1]

7 hours ago, BillG said:

Apple II and C64 have routines to call for reading and writing characters.

I believe the comparable routines to CHROUT and CHRIN high-level routines will be in GPL.  The VDP write routines are for transferring raw data, which is fine, but formatted printing commands are likely only in GPL.

 

For those more in-the-know, CHROUT sends a character to any device.  When sending a character to the screen on a Commodore using this routine, the screen editor will make the appropriate interpretations for color changes, scrolling, &c.  CHRIN works similarly.

 

Quote

 

CHRIN:

CHRIN  from  the  screen  (device  3)  retrieves  characters  one 
at  a  time  from  the  current  screen  line,  ending  with  a  RETURN 
character  code  when  the  last  nonspace  character  on  the  logical 
line  is  reached.

 

 

Quote

 

CHROUT:

This  routine  (some  Commodore  references  call  it  BSOUT) 
sends  a  byte  to  the  logical  file  currently  specified  for  output. 
Except  to  send  output  to  the  screen  when  the  system  is  set  for 
default  I/O,  you  must  open  a  logical  file  to  the  desired  device 
and  specify  the  file  as  the  output  target  before  calling  this  rou- 
tine. (See  the  OPEN  and  CHKOUT  routines.) 

For  output  to  the  screen  (device  3),  the  character  is 
printed  at  the  current  cursor  position.  For  serial  devices  (device 
numbers  4  and  higher),  the  CIOUT  routine  is  called.

 

[SteveB]

On 9/23/2022 at 9:19 PM, Asmusr said:

I would just like to see more than a handful of people making new games. 🙂

 

... says the programmer that raised the watermark beyond everything we saw back in the days. 😉

[Retrospect]

On 9/23/2022 at 8:19 PM, Asmusr said:

I would just like to see more than a handful of people making new games. 🙂

Yeah me too, I see there are lots of new games coming out for other retro formats, the Spectrum for example gets new games each month.

[oddemann]

3 hours ago, Retrospect said:

Yeah me too, I see there are lots of new games coming out for other retro formats, the Spectrum for example gets new games each month.

Two thing could be done...
#1 Make a tread about ideas for games, free for all to try out ideas and make it themself. But one tread where we brainstorm and come up with ideas. Just free for all and all ideas are welcome, not critical thinking. Only for the one taking on the idea.
#2 Educate more people to be able to make games.

And maybe...
#3 work together on games?

[+OLD CS1]

4 hours ago, Retrospect said:

Yeah me too, I see there are lots of new games coming out for other retro formats, the Spectrum for example gets new games each month.

Hey, you are one of the guys releasing games for our TI, and we are thankful for that.