HAPPY 40th ANNIVERSARY/BIRTHDAY BIG SEXY!!! The Atari 5200 SuperSystem turns 40 years young this past month!!!

[Henry Lee]

1 hour ago, Crazy Climber said:

Side Note - Super Breakout was an awful choice for a system that already had questionable controller issues.

 

Super Breakout is one of my favorite games of the 5200. By all means, besides the home made 5200 paddles, Super Breakout is best played with a (working) CX52 controller, even more so than the 5200 track-ball. There were no controller issues with games that make good use of the analog controllers when the 5200 was launched.

 

Edited February 1, 2023 by Henry Lee

[Flyindrew]

14 minutes ago, Henry Lee said:

 

Super Breakout is one of my favorite games of the 5200. By all means, besides the home made 5200 paddles, Super Breakout is best played with a (working) CX52 controller, even more so than the 5200 track-ball. There were no controller issues with games that make good use of the analog controllers when the 5200 was launched.

 

Im 100 percent with you on this. 5200 Super Breakout (with the original controllers) is tied with Neo Breakout (Atari 50) as far as favorite version goes. I find the double paddle selection on the 5200 the most fun version to play with the original controller.

[Crazy Climber]

1 hour ago, Henry Lee said:

 

Super Breakout is one of my favorite games of the 5200. By all means, besides the home made 5200 paddles, Super Breakout is best played with a (working) CX52 controller, even more so than the 5200 track-ball. There were no controller issues with games that make good use of the analog controllers when the 5200 was launched.

 

 

1 hour ago, Flyindrew said:

Im 100 percent with you on this. 5200 Super Breakout (with the original controllers) is tied with Neo Breakout (Atari 50) as far as favorite version goes. I find the double paddle selection on the 5200 the most fun version to play with the original controller.

 

Yeah, maybe you two like it but I would say you are in the minority....maybe not here on atariage but for the average 1983 living room Super Breakout was an awful pack in choice (in my opinion)

 

Lets be real here....

 

Breakout in any form was meant to be played with paddles.

 

The 5200 controller is not a paddle

 

Packing in a game (that should be played with paddles) for a system that has a controller that many people (myself included) found "awkward" to say the least, was a terrible, terrible idea.

 

Yes, it should have been Pac Man.

 

 

[Henry Lee]

1 hour ago, Crazy Climber said:

 

Yeah, maybe you two like it but I would say you are in the minority....maybe not here on atariage but for the average 1983 living room Super Breakout was an awful pack in choice (in my opinion)

 

 

In late 1982, we were early adopters  of the 5200. We even bought two extra controllers as soon as it was available and we played Super Breakout for endless hours with the family altogether. Imagine for a second how exciting it could have been, the score numbers rolled fast with that high pitched whistling sound and you are competing with three other members of your family.  Those years were about momentum and family fun. I think Atari got it right.

 

[+sramirez2008]

2 hours ago, Crazy Climber said:

it should have been Pac Man.

I'm with you. This was the Pac-Man we all wanted from Atari. They should have learned from ColecoVision's DK pack-in and gone with Pac-Man. Btw, I had one friend...one, that had a 5200. He had Pac-Man and we played the heck out of it.  The controllers never stopped us BITD.  

[Flyindrew]

19 hours ago, Crazy Climber said:

 

 

Yeah, maybe you two like it but I would say you are in the minority....maybe not here on atariage but for the average 1983 living room Super Breakout was an awful pack in choice (in my opinion)

 

Lets be real here....

 

Breakout in any form was meant to be played with paddles.

 

The 5200 controller is not a paddle

 

Packing in a game (that should be played with paddles) for a system that has a controller that many people (myself included) found "awkward" to say the least, was a terrible, terrible idea.

 

Yes, it should have been Pac Man.

 

 

I agree with you that Pac Man should have been the pack in game for the 5200. I think it represents itself even better to its arcade port than CV Donkey Kong.

 

I was just saying that while I love playing 5200 Super Breakout, I never said it should have been the pack in game.

[+MrFish]

On 1/4/2023 at 7:32 PM, Stephen said:

Super Breakout.

 

 

 

[+MrFish]

According to Wikipedia, these were the games Atari released in 1982. Almost any one of these would have been more of a draw to help sell systems than Super Breakout.

 

Prime choices would have been Pac-Man, Star Raiders, and maybe Centipede or Defender after that.

 

Along with Breakout, I'd say Space Invaders would be second on the list to NOT include as a pack-in; mainly because it was becoming irrelevant by 1982 -- which is exactly why a Breakout game made no sense. Neither would be much help in selling systems.

 

Centipede           1982    Atari, Inc.
Countermeasure      1982    Atari, Inc.
Defender            1982    Atari, Inc.
Galaxian            1982    Atari, Inc.
Missile Command     1982    Atari, Inc.
Pac-Man             1982    Atari, Inc.
Qix                 1982    Atari, Inc.
Space Invaders      1982    Atari, Inc.
Star Raiders        1982    Atari, Inc.
Super Breakout      1982    Atari, Inc.

 

I suppose they were counting on interest in the system itself to be the selling point. I mean, it was Atari's followup to the hugely successful 2600, right? The 2600 came with a great pack-in, that was amazing in it's time, though: Combat. Super Breakout wasn't so amazing -- at least in 1982...

 

[+MrFish]

Here's a more complete list from Atarimania, for 1982.

 

I suppose the 5200 version of Asteroids would fall somewhat in the becoming-irrelevant category in 1982 as well. It wasn't such a great version of Asteroids anyway; although it is praised as a fun simultaneous multi-player game -- graphics aside.

 

The RealSports games were alright; but probably not system sellers either. The later Baseball and Tennis were better.

 

Asteroids                Atari    1982
Centipede                Atari    1982
Countermeasure           Atari    1982
Defender                 Atari    1982
Galaxian                 Atari    1982
Missile Command          Atari    1982
Pac-Man                  Atari    1982
Qix                      Atari    1982
RealSports Basketball    Atari    1982
RealSports Football      Atari    1982
RealSports Soccer        Atari    1982
Space Invaders           Atari    1982
Star Raiders             Atari    1982
Super Breakout           Atari    1982
 

[BIGHMW]

2 hours ago, MrFish said:

Here's a more complete list from Atarimania, for 1982.

 

I suppose the 5200 version of Asteroids would fall somewhat in the becoming-irrelevant category in 1982 as well. It wasn't such a great version of Asteroids anyway; although it is praised as a fun simultaneous multi-player game -- graphics aside.

 

The RealSports games were alright; but probably not system sellers either. The later Baseball and Tennis were better.

 

Asteroids                Atari    1982
Centipede                Atari    1982
Countermeasure           Atari    1982
Defender                 Atari    1982
Galaxian                 Atari    1982
Missile Command          Atari    1982
Pac-Man                  Atari    1982
Qix                      Atari    1982
RealSports Basketball    Atari    1982
RealSports Football      Atari    1982
RealSports Soccer        Atari    1982
Space Invaders           Atari    1982
Star Raiders             Atari    1982
Super Breakout           Atari    1982
 

 

....and thanks to Paul Lay @playsoft we now have 2 fully working versions of Asteroids for the 5200, and while we all agree that it may not the best ever version at least graphically, she's still worthy of being in your gaming library for her ability to accommodate for up to 4 players at once, yes, even on the 5200. Whether you combine forces or compete against each other is up to you. Perfect for those who own 4-port units.

 

.....and, BTW, I happen to have it in heavy rotation on my Atarimax cart, I can just clear wave after wave of space debris at will, she's certainly easier to play than later ports like Meteorites or Rasteroids are. Love it or hate it, she still deserves a chance to earn a spot in your rotation on your Atarimax, and who knows, maybe @Albert can one of these days take Paul's new re-port and put it in cartridge format, same label (or better yet how about the OG 1982 label), just with his fully-functional A8 conversion instead of the unfinished 5200 one.

 

I'm glad that Paul was gracious enough to not only port over the A8 version and map it to the 5200 keypad as the original 5200 version was never finished, but also he stabilized the iffy controls on that unfinished prototype to where we had a very playable port of it, so for those who may not have either of these two here they are:

 

 

Asteroids.bin Asteroids_hack_8K.bin

Edited February 8, 2023 by BIGHMW

[phuzaxeman]

On 2/1/2023 at 2:27 PM, Crazy Climber said:

 

 

Yeah, maybe you two like it but I would say you are in the minority....maybe not here on atariage but for the average 1983 living room Super Breakout was an awful pack in choice (in my opinion)

 

Lets be real here....

 

Breakout in any form was meant to be played with paddles.

 

The 5200 controller is not a paddle

 

Packing in a game (that should be played with paddles) for a system that has a controller that many people (myself included) found "awkward" to say the least, was a terrible, terrible idea.

 

Yes, it should have been Pac Man.

 

 

5200 Super Breakout was meant to play on the 5200 analog sticks. It was amazing in 1982.  It IMHO is the best version of breakout of all time.

 

Was it the right game to sell the console? No, PacMan should have been since day 1. But Super Breakout is an amazing game. Definitely my top 5 5200 title for me.

[phuzaxeman]

4 hours ago, MrFish said:

According to Wikipedia, these were the games Atari released in 1982. Almost any one of these would have been more of a draw to help sell systems than Super Breakout.

 

Prime choices would have been Pac-Man, Star Raiders, and maybe Centipede or Defender after that.

 

Along with Breakout, I'd say Space Invaders would be second on the list to NOT include as a pack-in; mainly because it was becoming irrelevant by 1982 -- which is exactly why a Breakout game made no sense. Neither would be much help in selling systems.

 

Centipede           1982    Atari, Inc.
Countermeasure      1982    Atari, Inc.
Defender            1982    Atari, Inc.
Galaxian            1982    Atari, Inc.
Missile Command     1982    Atari, Inc.
Pac-Man             1982    Atari, Inc.
Qix                 1982    Atari, Inc.
Space Invaders      1982    Atari, Inc.
Star Raiders        1982    Atari, Inc.
Super Breakout      1982    Atari, Inc.

 

I suppose they were counting on interest in the system itself to be the selling point. I mean, it was Atari's followup to the hugely successful 2600, right? The 2600 came with a great pack-in, that was amazing in it's time, though: Combat. Super Breakout wasn't so amazing -- at least in 1982...

 

The Super Breakout selling point was having the whole family play with four players. Other consoles couldn't do four players.

 

Obviously Atari didn't follow through and the concept flopped.

 

A lot of innovation ideas

 on the 5200 (analog sticks, four players, pause and reset on controllers, dual coupler, advanced track ball). Unfortunately, things didn't work out. It's still my favorite console of all time.

Edited February 8, 2023 by phuzaxeman

[+Stephen]

49 minutes ago, phuzaxeman said:

5200 Super Breakout was meant to play on the 5200 analog sticks. It was amazing in 1982.  It IMHO is the best version of breakout of all time.

 

Was it the right game to sell the console? No, PacMan should have been since day 1. But Super Breakout is an amazing game. Definitely my top 5 5200 title for me.

Sorry, but Breakout was meant to be played on paddles, not an analog "thumb stick", so I posit that the 400/800 version (and 2600 even) using paddles played better.  Still analog control, more precise, and the shape of the arcade controls.  It's the difference between playing Tempest with a proper sinner vs. a mouse.

[AtariBrian]

54 minutes ago, phuzaxeman said:

5200 Super Breakout was meant to play on the 5200 analog sticks. 

 

 

Said nobody, ever!!!!!!!!

[phuzaxeman]

15 minutes ago, AtariBrian said:

Said nobody, ever!!!!!!!!

Said the people that grew up on the system. I've got the scores to back it up too.

[phuzaxeman]

23 minutes ago, Stephen said:

Sorry, but Breakout was meant to be played on paddles, not an analog "thumb stick", so I posit that the 400/800 version (and 2600 even) using paddles played better.  Still analog control, more precise, and the shape of the arcade controls.  It's the difference between playing Tempest with a proper sinner vs. a mouse.

Not for me. The 5200 isn't a thumb stick for me either.

 

5200 super breakout blows the 8bit and 2600 paddle versions.

 

Same thing for the analog sticks on 5200 galaxian and centipede.

I'll take anyone using trackballs or digital sticks those games.

 

I have the scores to prove it. Some people know how to use the 5200 sticks.

 

And I am an avid 8bit user since the 800xl released.

[+MrFish]

4 hours ago, phuzaxeman said:

The Super Breakout selling point was having the whole family play with four players.

For what, helping them get ready to fall sleep?

 

4 hours ago, phuzaxeman said:

Other consoles couldn't do four players.

 

Obviously Atari didn't follow through and the concept flopped.

 

A lot of innovation ideas on the 5200 (analog sticks, four players, pause and reset on controllers, dual coupler, advanced track ball). Unfortunately, things didn't work out. It's still my favorite console of all time.

I wasn't disparaging the 5200 as a system; didn't say anything about it. I was talking about games, and particularly Super Breakout as a pack-in choice.

 

[Crazy Climber]

8 hours ago, Stephen said:

Sorry, but Breakout was meant to be played on paddles, not an analog "thumb stick", so I posit that the 400/800 version (and 2600 even) using paddles played better.  Still analog control, more precise, and the shape of the arcade controls.  It's the difference between playing Tempest with a proper sinner vs. a mouse.

 

8 hours ago, AtariBrian said:

Said nobody, ever!!!!!!!!

 

4 hours ago, MrFish said:

For what, helping them get ready to fall sleep?

 

I wasn't disparaging the 5200 as a system; didn't say anything about it. I was talking about games, and particularly Super Breakout as a pack-in choice.

 

I'm glad some people get what I've been saying, was starting to think the world had gone mad 😄 

[Flyindrew]

9 hours ago, Stephen said:

Sorry, but Breakout was meant to be played on paddles, not an analog "thumb stick", so I posit that the 400/800 version (and 2600 even) using paddles played better.  Still analog control, more precise, and the shape of the arcade controls.  It's the difference between playing Tempest with a proper sinner vs. a mouse.

Im totally with you on that. I have Super Breakout on the 400/800 (with paddle controller) as well as 5200. While the 5200 controller does enhance games some games, Super Breakout plays much better with the paddle controller.

[zzip]

14 hours ago, MrFish said:

Centipede           1982    Atari, Inc.
Countermeasure      1982    Atari, Inc.
Defender            1982    Atari, Inc.
Galaxian            1982    Atari, Inc.
Missile Command     1982    Atari, Inc.
Pac-Man             1982    Atari, Inc.
Qix                 1982    Atari, Inc.
Space Invaders      1982    Atari, Inc.
Star Raiders        1982    Atari, Inc.
Super Breakout      1982    Atari, Inc.

 

I suppose they were counting on interest in the system itself to be the selling point. I mean, it was Atari's followup to the hugely successful 2600, right? The 2600 came with a great pack-in, that was amazing in it's time, though: Combat. Super Breakout wasn't so amazing -- at least in 1982...

The conventional wisdom was you don't give away your best game as a pack-in,  the pack-in game is just a starter to give you something to do with the system.   People will pay for the good titles. 

 

2600 had Combat,  Intellivision had Las Vegas Poker and Blackjack-  games that could be fun for awhile but certainly not the games you bought the system for.

 

So I can understand why they went with Super Breakout.  Shipping with Pac-man would be heresy!  That was a game every 5200 buyer was likely to pay extra for!

 

But Coleco turned that conventional wisdom on its head by including Donkey Kong and changed the rules.

 

 

Edited February 8, 2023 by zzip

[Flyindrew]

1 hour ago, zzip said:

The conventional wisdom was you don't give away your best game as a pack-in,  the pack-in game is just a starter to give you something to do with the system.   People will pay for the good titles. 

 

2600 had Combat,  Intellivision had Las Vegas Poker and Blackjack-  games that could be fun for awhile but certainly not the games you bought the system for.

 

So I can understand why they went with Super Breakout.  Shipping with Pac-man would be heresy!  That was a game every 5200 buyer was likely to pay extra for!

 

But Coleco turned that conventional wisdom on its head by including Donkey Kong and changed the rules.

 

 

I hear what your saying. However, I think by 1982/83 Super Breakout was passe in the mind of the video game consumer and went too far in the other direction. Maybe a title like Galaxian would have been a better choice if one were to subscribe to this mindset.

[+MrFish]

6 hours ago, zzip said:

The conventional wisdom was you don't give away your best game as a pack-in,  the pack-in game is just a starter to give you something to do with the system.   People will pay for the good titles. 

 

2600 had Combat,  Intellivision had Las Vegas Poker and Blackjack-  games that could be fun for awhile but certainly not the games you bought the system for.

 

So I can understand why they went with Super Breakout.  Shipping with Pac-man would be heresy!  That was a game every 5200 buyer was likely to pay extra for!

 

But Coleco turned that conventional wisdom on its head by including Donkey Kong and changed the rules.

Combat WAS the best game Atari had at the 2600's launch, and it sold systems. You could buy a 2600 and live off of Combat for a long time before feeling the need to buy other titles. It was and still is a defining title on the system, and a blast to play. I remember playing countless hours blasting friends and family to bits with it. Killer launch title.

 

So, releasing a weak title like Super Breakout with the 5200 WASN'T following suit with their release of Combat for the 2600 at all; it was a change in strategy, which surely affected sales.

 

[zzip]

19 minutes ago, MrFish said:

Combat WAS the best game Atari had at the 2600's launch, and it sold systems. You could buy a 2600 and live off of Combat for a long time before feeling the need to buy other titles. It was and still is a defining title on the system, and a blast to play. I remember playing countless hours blasting friends and family to bits with it. Killer launch title.

 

Saying it was the best of the initial launch games is subjective, I'd rather play some of the other ones personally.  It wasn't a hot name imported from the arcades like Pac Man, Donkey Kong or Space Invaders  (yeah there was a similar game called Tank, but it's not one of the arcade classics, is it?)   At any rate the 2600 didn't sell in huge numbers until Space Invaders release,

 

So I wouldn't say Combat had anywhere close to the impact of the other games I'm talking about.

[+MrFish]

1 hour ago, zzip said:

Saying it was the best of the initial launch games is subjective, I'd rather play some of the other ones personally.

 

Alright, here are the 2600 launch titles. Name the other ones you'd rather play; and then we can start a poll on the 2600 forum and see how subjective "Combat was the best title Atari had at the 2600's launch" is.

 

Air-Sea Battle    [Sears: Target Fun]    CX-2602 (Larry Kaplan)
Basic Math        [Sears: Math]          CX-2661 (Gary Palmer)
Blackjack         [Sears: Blackjack]     CX-2651 (Bob Whitehead)
Combat            [Sears: Tank Plus]     CX-2601 (Larry Wagner)
Indy 500          [Sears: Race]          CX-2611 (Ed Riddle)
Star Ship         [Sears: Outer Space]   CX-2603 (Bob Whitehead)
Street Racer      [Sears: Speedway II]   CX-2612 (Larry Kaplan)
Surround          [Sears: Chase]         CX-2641 (Alan Miller)
Video Olympics    [Sears: Pong Sports]   CX-2621 (Joe Decuir)

 

 

1 hour ago, zzip said:

It wasn't a hot name imported from the arcades like Pac Man, Donkey Kong or Space Invaders.

 

It doesn't matter. At the time, Combat was a hot enough title on its own, and held the system up with the buyer's initial purchase. Buy a 2600 and you were set with the pack-in game for a good while.

 

[+MrFish]

On 2/8/2023 at 5:08 PM, MrFish said:

Alright, here are the 2600 launch titles. Name the other ones you'd rather play; and then we can start a poll on the 2600 forum and see how subjective "Combat was the best title Atari had at 2600's launch" is.

 

Poll started here: Best VCS / 2600 Launch Title