Replacement cases

[Tickled_Pink]

I was just wondering. Given the number of poorly packaged units that end up getting smashed in transit, is there a market for professionally manufactured third-party cases?

Edited January 18, 2023 by Tickled_Pink
Incompete

[Fred_M]

Edit: I assumed this poll was about video game cases or hardware boxes.....

 

I think the "market" will be very small. Inlays for cassette cases and disk wallets can be made by anyone who owns a printer. For boxes I think it will be very difficult to recreate them to look like the originals. If people don't mind using boxes that does not match the originals, they can already find multiple products on the internet (universal game cases, large jewel cases, clamshell boxes). There are also a lot of tutorials available on Youtube on how you can make a video game box or (even more interesting) how to restore a smashed box.

 

As a collector I don't want a recreated box, only the original. I do not mind putting some effort into restoring a smashed box.

 

Edit: if this poll is about the plastic cases of hardware I still do not see a big market. Just buy a defect (or "untested") computer and use that case

Edited January 18, 2023 by Fred_M

[Rybags]

I went to a retro computer show last year and saw an Amiga 500 and another computer with a modern day transparent case.

Having seen pics of them on the internet I wasn't that excited but seeing it up close, I just want one now.

So, that would be my request.

 

Though that said, we'd then need some sort of replacement solution for the RF shielding which tends to rust and go ugly, not to mention hiding most of the motherboard which defeats the purpose of a transparent case (maybe partial shielding for noisy areas could be developed)

[_The Doctor__]

Sounds to me we are talking about the Atari 800 computers shell, not shipping boxes and jewel cases what have you, and certainly not the wedge machines and with the thin and sometimes rusty shielding.

Edited January 18, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[Fred_M]

Thanks for the clarification @_The Doctor__

 

=======

 

Transparent cases for the 800XL are already available. A German seller on Ebay makes them: https://www.ebay.de/itm/325141548499

Topic on AA:

 

 

 

[Beeblebrox]

This topic is very timely having received two Atari 8 bits in the last month that had cracked casings - either due poor/zero packaging or just bad luck in transit. (One was from Eygpt, another from the States).

 

Check this out, my 600XL from overseas where in their wisdom the seller sent it in..... a bag!!! (You heard right -  a bag, not a box 😲😞

https://forums.atariage.com/topic/345603-converting-ntsc-600xl-to-pal/?do=findComment&comment=5182707

 

Also in the case, (no pun intended), of the likes of the 400 and 800's plastic casing - being 40+ years old they are very brittle and very rarely can you find one without any cracks or without missing vent gratings.

 

Not saying this will ever happen but I'd like to see replacement modern casing for each model which duplicates the originals. After all the look of these is half the appeal for many.

 

For the 800 even better would be the option for a slight case mod that allowed for those who'd added a physical PBI.

 

Also, in additon I'd like to see clear perspex versions of them. (Where as above I know the 800XL has one available).

 

Just imagine a transparent "crystal" 800 casing - now that would be something.😍

 

Slightly related, (sort of), I'd also like to see 3D printer downloadable STL files for the 800's brown keycaps. There is a generic single keycap file available but not for the wider keycaps (shift keys, tab, ctrl, return, space bar, etc).

Furthermore there are a few variations of 800 keycaps which aren't cross compatible, (yellow/green plunger Hi-tek versions vs the white Hi-tek for example). 

 

Anyways, I digress.

 

All of this potential modern case production would come down to demand.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 18, 2023 by Beeblebrox

[+ZuluGula]

I imagine that XE style case would be easiest and least expensive to manufacture, but on the other hand, the XE cases seems to be quite durable (except of some yellowing).

What I would like to see is a new XE style case that still has SIO, Cart+ECI and joystick ports but replaces old connectors for power, TV and video output with USB-C and HDMI. Maybe add second Cart port on top like in XEGS and slot for SD card. This new care could be used for modern replicas and 576NUC+ style systems, EclairXL or other future FPGA Ataris.

[Tickled_Pink]

Some interesting responses there. I think you have to bear in mind that if we're talking about maintaining "look and feel", I'm not sure if a third-party could legally manufacture something with the look and feel of the original because copyright in the original design would still rest with Atari, and therefore there would likely be some license agreement required. There was a Mini-ITX Apple II case released a few years ago but I'm pretty sure that had to be licensed from Apple.

With the alternative option(s), I was thinking about this, which I'm sure most of us have seen.

[_The Doctor__]

slanted fins on the 800 access case at the top xe style would negate the whole, case is the exact some thing worry.

the molds for many of these Atari cases were sold and manufacturers used them, no one can put the genie back in the bottle that Atari let out, so it's pretty much a free for all.

 

So the look and feel, with the holes for most mods already in them, based on the common positions already laid out on the main PCB's of the Atari line and where they naturally end up on average because of the original lay out and user convenience.

Edited January 18, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[Beeblebrox]

16 minutes ago, ZuluGula said:

I imagine that XE style case would be easiest and least expensive to manufacture, but on the other hand, the XE cases seems to be quite durable (except of some yellowing).

What I would like to see is a new XE style case that still has SIO, Cart+ECI and joystick ports but replaces old connectors for power, TV and video output with USB-C and HDMI. Maybe add second Cart port on top like in XEGS and slot for SD card. This new care could be used for modern replicas and 576NUC+ style systems, EclairXL or other future FPGA Ataris.

Not sure about the modern connectors. Hdmi connectors require a license to have been paid. (That's why you don't see Sophia 2 with an HDMI out). Not sure about usb-c. 

 

 

[Beeblebrox]

17 minutes ago, Tickled_Pink said:

Some interesting responses there. I think you have to bear in mind that if we're talking about maintaining "look and feel", I'm not sure if a third-party could legally manufacture something with the look and feel of the original because copyright in the original design would still rest with Atari, and therefore there would likely be some license agreement required. There was a Mini-ITX Apple II case released a few years ago but I'm pretty sure that had to be licensed from Apple.

With the alternative option(s), I was thinking about this, which I'm sure most of us have seen.

Wow, that is the first time I've seen that revision atari St casing.. Sleek. Wonder if it weighs as much? My ST weights an absolute ton!!! 

[_The Doctor__]

oh look it's the ST Amiga C128 Case... come back to visit us again, still no room in the boot/(trunk)

Edited January 18, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[+ZuluGula]

4 minutes ago, Beeblebrox said:

Not sure about the modern connectors. Hdmi connectors require a license to have been paid. (That's why you don't see Sophia 2 with an HDMI out). Not sure about usb-c.

As much as I love my CRTs, I understand that most of the people now have only newer LCD as a display. Modern connectors would save you money and effort required to obtain legacy power supplies, video cables and adapters just to get the old machine running. Look at all those new retro mini consoles.  

 

[Irgendwer]

29 minutes ago, Tickled_Pink said:

With the alternative option(s), I was thinking about this, which I'm sure most of us have seen.

Looks quite nice, but my first thought was: No computer should have an "Atari ST" label without an "UNDO" and "HELP" key...

[_The Doctor__]

whatever PCB you put in the case has it's own connectors, get out of the weeds. Just make sure the holes line up with where the connectors are as a universal unified panel or allow for custom panels to slide in or mount. You could have panel bay slots for that matter.

 

800 case with pbi slots/mod holes, style it however you like

Edited January 18, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[Vyvyan B.]

The 800s seem to be leading the way by far for damaged and broken cases. I would imagine there would be plenty of interest in producing some new ones. The original molds must be floating around out there somewhere.

[Beeblebrox]

31 minutes ago, ZuluGula said:

As much as I love my CRTs, I understand that most of the people now have only newer LCD as a display. Modern connectors would save you money and effort required to obtain legacy power supplies, video cables and adapters just to get the old machine running. Look at all those new retro mini consoles.  

 

Sure, but as I say HDMI is off the cards due to anyone creating anything with hdmi connections having to pay the hdmi license fees. 

 

Plus afaik this is mainly about shell casings. The tech involved in providing a digital output for our Atari's isn't as such part of this I thought. We already have upgrades like Sophia 2 with DVI out, and VBXE with RGB out.  

[Tickled_Pink]

47 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said:

whatever PCB you put in the case has it's own connectors, get out of the weeds. Just make sure the holes line up with where the connectors are as a universal unified panel or allow for custom panels to slide in or mount. You could have panel bay slots for that matter.

 

800 case with pbi slots/mod holes, style it however you like

The exchangeable panels is what I was thinking. You could still have something with the look and feel, apart from some changes to the back and sides with some simple slide mounts.

[+mytek]

2 hours ago, Rybags said:

...we'd then need some sort of replacement solution for the RF shielding which tends to rust and go ugly, not to mention hiding most of the motherboard which defeats the purpose of a transparent case (maybe partial shielding for noisy areas could be developed)

Just so people know, the RF shielding can be left out if you never intend to use the RF audio/video output. And if you plan on only using Composite, S-Video, VBXE, or a Sophia the only real benefit of keeping the metal shielding intact is if you want to listen to an AM/FM radio close by that uses it's aerial to receive broadcasts. And even in this scenario only trying to pull in a weak station might be an issue.

 

The main benefit to the metal RF shield is to prevent visible herring-bone interference patterns when using the RF output for display.

[_The Doctor__]

Shields off and I get to listen to the radio when the Atari is on, attach the tape storage and it gets louder, I am three miles away from an AM/FM broadcast tower...

it's gotten worse as they now have the full spectrum of analog and digital technologies on the bands...

 

Since it also affected some of the ham radio equipment around and about, it's just been best to keep the shielding on.

Even when not in this area, keeping the shielding on made many an upgrade or device work or work better... myIDE etc....

it also still allows broadcast tv to receive better when they are on... I don't like audio drop outs and squares, rectangles that happens when watching some channels with the shields off. Old signals you'd get herring bone, ghosts etc, digital just says piss off when it's not damn near perfect.

Edited January 18, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[+mytek]

2 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

keeping the shielding on made many an upgrade or device work or work better... myIDE etc....

Not true . Those upgrade devices are unaffected, and in many cases you won't be able to fit them with the top shield in place anyway. I'd venture that when people have upgraded their systems, in at least 75% of those cases the top shield never gets re-installed. I have yet to hear someone pinpoint a problem with their MyIDE, ect. due to not having the shields in place. 9 times out of 10 it's due to mis-wiring, lack of understanding, or sometimes a faulty device.

 

2 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

Shields off and I get to listen to the radio when the Atari is on, attach the tape storage and it gets louder, I am three miles away from an AM/FM broadcast tower...

it's gotten worse as they now have the full spectrum of analog and digital technologies on the bands...

As I said the shields are likely needed when wanting to listen to a radio with an aerial input (which would include HAM radio).

[_The Doctor__]

is true, and has been noted, discussions about mass et al were promulgated as to why items worked or didn't as well (bottom line was it didn't matter if it was the mass or actual blocking by shielding just so long as it worked, that could be left for the EE books), also how is a plug in cartridge going to be bothered by a shield being in place? or any of the other items that have fit under the shielding time in memorium? shields being on allowed the largest range of components to work, and for the IDE+flash more so when choosing from different flash chips and CF cards... as you've noted all the other benefits are nice too, gravy if you will all things considered.

 

I've got a couple shields and cages I keep around for just such situations, from time to time I've had to install them for folks with those concerns and complaints. If it works, I do it.

Edited January 18, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[flashjazzcat]

12 minutes ago, mytek said:

I have yet to hear someone pinpoint a problem with their MyIDE, ect. due to not having the shields in place.

You'd be surprised. Not only MyIDE, but I can specifically remember the behaviour of the first generation SIDE cartridge changing (i.e. improving when it came to IO errors with certain CF cards) when the bottom shield was re-attached to the machine. This was way back in 2011 or so, of course. Inexpertly, I assume that since the shield is attached to GND, it improved grounding in some way and thus influenced signal level transitions, but the person who recommended I reattach the shield in the instance I recall (Candle) would doubtless be able to explain it better.

12 minutes ago, mytek said:

9 times out of 10 it's due to mis-wiring, lack of understanding, or sometimes a faulty device.

Certainly SIDE1 had an issue with power delivery to the CF card (ameliorated by an extra thick wire on the 5V trace to the CF connector), and early MyIDE carts represented the very defintion of 'faulty device', since there was no data buffering whatsoever, IIRC.

 

Not that I have any desire whatsoever to re-attach RF shields to upgraded Ataris, and it thankfully does not seem to have much effect with more modern devices.

Edited January 18, 2023 by flashjazzcat

[Tickled_Pink]

20 minutes ago, mytek said:

Not true . Those upgrade devices are unaffected, and in many cases you won't be able to fit them with the top shield in place anyway. I'd venture that when people have upgraded their systems, in at least 75% of those cases the top shield never gets re-installed. I have yet to hear someone pinpoint a problem with their MyIDE, ect. due to not having the shields in place. 9 times out of 10 it's due to mis-wiring, lack of understanding, or sometimes a faulty device.

 

As I said the shields are likely needed when wanting to listen to a radio with an aerial input (which would include HAM radio).

If the shield was necessary, rather than have it attached to the motherboard in some way, would it make any difference if it was actually attached to the inside of the case? That would provide enough clearance for add-ons, or would there be some kind of signal leakage because it wouldn't fully shroud the components?

[Tickled_Pink]

4 hours ago, Beeblebrox said:

Wow, that is the first time I've seen that revision atari St casing.. Sleek. Wonder if it weighs as much? My ST weights an absolute ton!!! 

That's actually just a piece of concept art someone did and posted on DeviantArt years ago.