The F18a DIY alternative with HDMI :)

[Duewester]

6 hours ago, doode968 said:

V2 FAT board and socket assembled.

 

Case1: standalone mode (usb-c powered tang nano 9k to HDMI alone, not mated to fat board) displays the debug screen.

 

             TN-VDP

       RETRO to HDVIDEO

----------------------------------

TANG NANO 9K  TMS9918 VDP

   16KB RAM - HDMI/AUDIO

           VERSION 1.03

----------------------------------

 

@doode968, Yep. That looks correct. I verified on a Tang programmed for the FAT board and a Tang Programmed for the V2 board.

 

6 hours ago, doode968 said:

Case2: Tang Nano 9K mated to the FAT board, powered by USB-C results in blank screen. (not connected to socket board)

When the tang is plugged into a FAT or V2 board I get a variety of screens depending on what I plug in first. HDMI first and then USB-c power get a screen sometimes on FAT board. Plug in USB-c first on FAT board and then HDMI and I get the tang startup.

 

6 hours ago, doode968 said:

Case3: Tang Nano 9K mated to the FAT board, connected to socket board installed in the 9918 socket on the TI99/4a results in HDMI OUT OF RANGE 31.4KHz / 950Hz displayed on an LG monitor.  Samsung TV does not detect a signal. Verified ribbon cable orientation pin 1-1, 2-2, 3-3 etc...

 

Audio and Mode1 not connected.

5 outer LEDs on the tang board are on.

Tested with short (3") and long(12") ribbon cable.

Pressing the S1 button on the Tang during Case3 results in corrupt debug screen.

 

TI99/4A functional in its stock composite video mode. HDMI cable tested good with

 

Anyone experienced this behavior?

 

This is the first build... will assemble a second setup.

I ended up going with the OLDEST HDMI capable TV I have with the oldest HDMI cable  to get this to go away. I discovered that many adapters (used to try to get HDMI from board through the case  and on to the TV) don't work.

 

Anyway, welcome to the TN-VDP world and good luck.

[doode968]

Another successful journey with this project.

 

After building a second set of carrier and socket board and spending half a day with various permutations of socket/carrier/tang/hdmi cable/monitor/tv and getting nowhere, the HDMI OUT OF RANGE message from the LG monitor I am using kept telling me the "obvious".  Its obvious in hindsight, sort of.

 

Anyway, I changed the VIDEO_ID_CODE in tn_vdp/fpga/tn_vdp_v2_v9918/src/hdmi/hdmi.sv

 

from

 

parameter int VIDEO_ID_CODE = 1

 

to

 

 parameter int VIDEO_ID_CODE = 4. 

 

This sets the output resolution from 640x480 to 1280x720.  Thank you Sameer Puri for the well commented source file.

 

I now have a crystal clear HDMI output from a 42 year old TI99/4a.   Boots and displays correctly 9/10 power cycles.

 

Thanks @Duewester for the hints and pointers.

 

Thank you @retrocanada76 for this neat project and sharing it with the rest of us.

 

Edited September 14, 2023 by doode968

[Duewester]

On 9/14/2023 at 4:08 PM, doode968 said:

Anyway, I changed the VIDEO_ID_CODE in tn_vdp/fpga/tn_vdp_v2_v9918/src/hdmi/hdmi.sv

 

from

 

parameter int VIDEO_ID_CODE = 1

 

to

 

 parameter int VIDEO_ID_CODE = 4. 

 

This sets the output resolution from 640x480 to 1280x720.  Thank you Sameer Puri for the well commented source file.

 

I now have a crystal clear HDMI output from a 42 year old TI99/4a.   Boots and displays correctly 9/10 power cycles.

 

@doode968 that's great. THANK YOU for the tip on HDMI resolution. I will look into it the next time I do a TI-Tang board. Might do it to my spare V2 board anyway.

[doode968]

Over the last few days of experience with this setup, its really a hit/miss.  Without the VIDEO_ID_CODE, the LG monitor I am using is a 100% fail (OUT OF SYNC). Setting the VIDEO_ID_CODE=4 or 16 improves things, but any given day or even hour with various cartridge games the system is really only at ~50% 'working' state. I can see the LED on the tang corresponding to the TI beep tone on startup blink a second or so after power cycle, but the display only comes up at best case 50% of the time when I select a game (as the display is switched between modes?).. I verified that the TI still works by going back to stock.

 

I think a monitor supporting a wider range of modes is likely a requirement for this setup. @Duewester, what is the make/model of the display you are using?

[Duewester]

@doode968 shorten up that ribbon cable. Stability really improves when the cable is like an inch or so long. 

I even went as far as putting a socket on the bottom of the V2 board and sticking it on the adapter board. This makes it nearly identical to the FAT board footprint.

[retrocanada76]

@Duewester what do you mean electrical drawings ? It's all there in the KiCad project file. Open the pro file and select schematics.

 

For people having a bad time with specific monitors I suggest you give a shot to this thingamagik: https://www.amazon.ca/axGear-Repeater-Booster-Extender-Amplifier/dp/B07DFWW8NC/ref=sr_1_9?crid=1I5XAAB3CYX0X&keywords=hdmi+booster&qid=1695261091&sprefix=hdmi+booste%2Caps%2C148&sr=8-9

 

It costs 8 dollars and what it does it re-converts the HDMI signal to a more reliant one. You will need an intermediate hdmi cable so get a short one. It does not require power it gets it from the hdmi. Neat gadget.

 

[RickyDean]

I'm new to this thread, though not to the Atariage TI99 forum. I just ordered 10 tang  20k's from alibaba with the idea I was going to emulate the 9958. But the reason I'm posting is this. Is it possible to modify the programming to be able to use the 9958 emulation as a 9938? Meaning using the tang in a computer like the Myarc Geneve with a 9938/58 footprint, but using the pins for the 9938 complete with mouse function. The 9958 can be slightly altered to fit in a Geneve, but you lose the mouse, and a couple of other functions. Or has this already been covered in previous traffic? Thanks

[Duewester]

On 9/20/2023 at 9:53 PM, retrocanada76 said:

@Duewester what do you mean electrical drawings ? It's all there in the KiCad project file. Open the pro file and select schematics.

 

For people having a bad time with specific monitors I suggest you give a shot to this thingamagik: https://www.amazon.ca/axGear-Repeater-Booster-Extender-Amplifier/dp/B07DFWW8NC/ref=sr_1_9?crid=1I5XAAB3CYX0X&keywords=hdmi+booster&qid=1695261091&sprefix=hdmi+booste%2Caps%2C148&sr=8-9

 

It costs 8 dollars and what it does it re-converts the HDMI signal to a more reliant one. You will need an intermediate hdmi cable so get a short one. It does not require power it gets it from the hdmi. Neat gadget.

 

Hey @retrocanada76, sorry it has taken so long to get back to you.

Yea, now that I have been delving into Git and Kicad I see that everything I need is indeed there. I just lack the skills to do anything with it.

To be honest, I've been tied up doing some other stuff and have not had the time to invest in my Ti or Commodore projects. Sometimes, regular life intrudes into our desired life.

[retrocanada76]

On 9/26/2023 at 8:47 AM, RickyDean said:

I'm new to this thread, though not to the Atariage TI99 forum. I just ordered 10 tang  20k's from alibaba with the idea I was going to emulate the 9958. But the reason I'm posting is this. Is it possible to modify the programming to be able to use the 9958 emulation as a 9938? Meaning using the tang in a computer like the Myarc Geneve with a 9938/58 footprint, but using the pins for the 9938 complete with mouse function. The 9958 can be slightly altered to fit in a Geneve, but you lose the mouse, and a couple of other functions. Or has this already been covered in previous traffic? Thanks

Well you can set it to 9938 (it will disable the 9958 features) but the light pen/mouse and color bus features are not implemented. They are analog inputs/outputs these things don't work as simple on FPGA. 

[muramasa]

Hi @retrocanada76.  I saw your video about the wondertang and wanted to see if you had any plans on releasing it as a standalone master system hdmi mod? Looking forward to digging into this project more.

[craftsman1234]

Hi @retrocanada76 just curious I've recently installed one of my original V1 boards into my Coleco Adam.   Seems to be working great in it.   The monitor in the pictures is a Dell 19in HDMI with a 4:3 display and does not appear to have an adjustment for a wide or narrow display.     I was wondering if there is a way in the Tang 9k software to remove the approx. 1in border around the display to make the visible text fill the screen.  Most CRTs come close to filling it.   Thanks.

[retrocanada76]

On 10/2/2023 at 8:35 PM, craftsman1234 said:

Hi @retrocanada76 just curious I've recently installed one of my original V1 boards into my Coleco Adam.   Seems to be working great in it.   The monitor in the pictures is a Dell 19in HDMI with a 4:3 display and does not appear to have an adjustment for a wide or narrow display.     I was wondering if there is a way in the Tang 9k software to remove the approx. 1in border around the display to make the visible text fill the screen.  Most CRTs come close to filling it.   Thanks.

Well that would require to stretch the image there is no magic, the resolution for the V1 is 640x480. But there is no frame buffer the image is generated on the fly so with limited memory from the TN9K this is not possible.

 

 

[retrocanada76]

On 10/2/2023 at 2:59 AM, muramasa said:

Hi @retrocanada76.  I saw your video about the wondertang and wanted to see if you had any plans on releasing it as a standalone master system hdmi mod? Looking forward to digging into this project more.

what do you mean by standalone ? A full SMS loading from the SD ? I'm not thinking on that.

 

[muramasa]

On 10/8/2023 at 11:42 PM, retrocanada76 said:

what do you mean by standalone ? A full SMS loading from the SD ? I'm not thinking on that.

 

I was thinking more along the lines of a Master System HDMI VDP replacement. My understanding is for it to work on the MSX you would be emulating the Master System VDP already so figured it wasn't too far of a leap to do the same hdmi style mod on the master system it self.

[M-S]

This is awesome, I didn't check it before because I thought it was only for that TI computer, if the title included something like "VDP" it would be more clear about what it is. 

There's a NES core for that same FPGA board, I wonder if it would be possible to turn it into a HDMI PPU replacement, I should ask the creator about it.

[retrocanada76]

On 10/16/2023 at 12:13 AM, muramasa said:

I was thinking more along the lines of a Master System HDMI VDP replacement. My understanding is for it to work on the MSX you would be emulating the Master System VDP already so figured it wasn't too far of a leap to do the same hdmi style mod on the master system it self.

I don't have a master system.

[RickyDean]

I'm ordering 5 v3 boards, and 5 9958-socket boards from pcway. Do they make quality boards? I'm new to ordering pcb's and they are reviewing my order now.

[RickyDean]

Well they've been ordered now. We'll see.

[RickyDean]

Well I got both the version 3 phat and the slim boards in today. The Tangs I though I'd ordered, turned out to be Breadboards. The Ali Express screens were confusing. I've ordered 3 tangs 20k's, waiting for them.

[RickyDean]

Got my 3 Tang nano 20k's in today, finshing the assembly, and hopefully programming and testing soon on one unit.

[RickyDean]

Well it's pretty much assembled, except I forgot that Mouser had back ordered my 74VLC245's, so I must wait on them

[RickyDean]

@retrocanada76, I got my Tang 20k's in and have followed this guide, but I am at a loss when I use the terminal, I'm using putty. I copied and pasted the text in, shown here in the picture, but I don't know what to do next. I disconnected the unit and reconnected it, reestablishing the com port and Gowin let me program it, but when I plug it into the Geneve and turn it on I get nothing, So I'm assuming I need to program it from Putty? Or a different programmer? If so, which and what commands do I use? I'm in Windows 10. Thanks

[RickyDean]

@retrocanada76, I would be here in the process, how do I flash the next step from here? When I pull up the tn_vdp_v3_v9958.fs in Gowin and run the programmer, at this point, I get no USB Cable Connection and a blank cable setting screen:

 

 

 

[RickyDean]

@retrocanada76, Not sure which of these options I need to use to flash the 9958.fs file, none of these seem to match the ones you mentioned earlier in the threads here. I have tried several varitations and still no screen displayed on the Geneve, also does the fat board or the Tang need power at the usb-c for this to work? Well after sending this I tried it again and went in and tried to different TV's, finally got the boot screen to come up, thought the initial screen displaying the swan doesn't come up yet. But tomorrow I'll try to boot from a floppy and see if it goes into the Geneve OS. But it does display!

Edited December 5, 2023 by RickyDean
additional content

[RickyDean]

Well, I just moved my Genny into the Den and pulled my TI stuff out of the box. I then proceeded to hookup the Tang unit and a USB-C cord to power it as it does not power from the HDMI or the V9938 socket. I then hooked up my HFDC and placed the boot disk HFE into my  HXC floppy emulator and powered up. I get a corrupted screen where the Swan should be. But after some seconds the floppy drive is activated then it activates it again and after some moments I get the Enter Time screen for Geneve OS. I don't have a keyboard hooked up, so cannot go further at the moment. Did take a video, but it's 181MB in size so can't upload it. But the main thing is, it works.

 

Just uploaded the video to youtube, here is the link