So how would you rate the 400 mini?

[JPF997]

My rating is 9, fantastic little machine that does everything it promised and more, honestly the only mini consoles I would rate higher would be the Astro City mini, the PC Engine mini and the Sega Genesis mini.

[Razzie.P]

I gave it a "5 - It's mediocre"

 

I returned it already, but may repurchase at some point in the future after some fixes, hacks, and a major price drop or sale (which I'm sure will happen)

 

I have a BUNCH of mini console type of things here, and it's not the worst of the bunch, not among the good ones either.  Joystick issues aside (others have covered that pretty well) it just makes all the games feel "less" than what they are and not fun for me.  From my testing, for example, I can boot up a game on the original console or Mister and, not only does it feel right, but my performance/score is where it should be.   I play the same game on this, and it's crazy how much I'd struggle to get close to that score thanks to lag and how the game just generally feels "off."   

 

If you or anyone else is having a blast with it, that's great, but it's not for me in its current state.

 

 

[Razzie.P]

Funny thing about the PS1 classic, though, since it's in the list as the worst of the bunch 😁  It stunk straight out the box, no doubt about that, but I grabbed that thing super cheap at some point, and thanks to hacks n' such, it's a great little gadget now!   I'm hope we'll see a similar treatment with 400 mini at some point.

 

 

[+Stephen]

Bad.  Sub-par controller, sub-par quality of emulation.  No use for someone that 1 - still has their real hardware, or 2 - someone that has a PC and runs emulators.  It's sad that so much garbage like this continually comes out.  Each new product like this devalues the original hardware and its library because people then believe the original (hardware and software) was also crap.

[Video]

I gave it a seven. Its good, absolutely could use improvement (slight lag, though no experience with actual hardware, but I assume original doesn't lag) and who the hell thought buttons on the ring disc thing was a good idea? No knock on games, that would never satisfy everybody anyways, even if it contained every original production run game.

[+GoldLeader]

IIRC,  The PS1 Classic was just fine out of the box,  Give or take a few issues that people exaggerated (frame rates and wrong versions or something),  but it was Playable and Fun,  With GOOD CONTROLLERS!!!.  Then with some doing it became, Well a CLASSIC!

 

(But,  I get it,  people love to mod, hack, and tinker...Hell I played my PS1 Classic for all of 5 minutes before changing it up)...

 

The 400 MINI OTOH was the WORST Mini I personally have Ever seen.  Everything was confusing and crap right out of the box.  People online,  people actually old enough to know better in some cases have actually already been conflating the CX40 (Awesome controller from BITD Included with the VCS (NO The REAL VCS from the 80's etc.)) with whatever Abomination came with the 400 Mini.

 

I Kept the Original Atari Flashback (and it was crap too but not this bad).  I kept the Jakks Pacific Plug & Plays,  I enjoy the C64 Plug & Play in a joystick!...And then you get to High Quality stuff like the NES, the SNES Minis,  the Genesis, The Turbografxs, etc.  And there is No Contest!  Those are fun!   Those are well made!  This is the ONLY one I Returned.  (Everybody has their limits.)

 

Every time I click on a YouTube video about this one I expect to see someone Open fire and not hold back,  But instead they instantly start making excuses...Like well lemme just grab another joystick here and see what's up...Weren't these the Same people who ripped on all of the Atari Flashbacks?  The Later ones, from 2 on up, with the Good joysticks, which were by and large just fine?

 

Yeah I suppose I could have done the same;  But I wanted it to be fun right out of the box,  with More Fun later on...Not CRAP from the get go and maybe we can make it Average with a ton of Tweaking...

 

I guess the Only difference is people love tinkering, modding, and tweaking and figure its part of the experience (Unlike the closed system Atari Flashbacks before they added the card slot)...

 

I actually gave it a 3 instead of a zero or anything because other people on YT and in comments seem to be Doing OK with it,  and they probably enjoy tinkering with it to see if they can salvage it...

[zzip]

17 minutes ago, GoldLeader said:

Every time I click on a YouTube video about this one I expect to see someone Open fire and not hold back,  But instead they instantly start making excuses...Like well lemme just grab another joystick here and see what's up...Weren't these the Same people who ripped on all of the Atari Flashbacks?  The Later ones, from 2 on up, with the Good joysticks, which were by and large just fine?

How many of those units were purchased by the reviewer vs given to them pre-release by the manufacturer?   That colors people's reviews unfortunately, even when they try to be objective.

[Razzie.P]

51 minutes ago, Stephen said:

 Each new product like this devalues the original hardware and its library because people then believe the original (hardware and software) was also crap.

That really sums up the part that makes me sad with this sort of thing.  I've seen many cases where new users would be introduced to these games via lackluster gadgets like these, and come away with the impression that "these old games suck.  I let them play the same games on the real thing, and they have a blast with the same games. 

26 minutes ago, GoldLeader said:

Every time I click on a YouTube video about this one I expect to see someone Open fire and not hold back,  But instead they instantly start making excuses...Like well lemme just grab another joystick here and see what's up...Weren't these the Same people who ripped on all of the Atari Flashbacks?  The Later ones, from 2 on up, with the Good joysticks, which were by and large just fine?

 

 

I know at least one has said that they got it "virtually free" (whatever that means) and they were afraid if they were truly honest about it, they won't get any more loot in the future.  Not gonna name drop, because that'd be a douche move, but I imagine they're not alone in that way of thinking.

[4ever2600]

No opinion, don't have one yet.

[+x=usr(1536)]

Where's the poll option for, "just watching from the sidelines to see what shakes out?"

 

I am asking that in all seriousness.  The machine is definitely of interest, but given recent Atari's history of releasing devices that aren't quite 100% ready for prime time, it seemed prudent to see what others thought once they'd received them rather than buying early.

[+GoldLeader]

9 hours ago, zzip said:

How many of those units were purchased by the reviewer vs given to them pre-release by the manufacturer?   That colors people's reviews unfortunately, even when they try to be objective.

 

That's a fair question - and the first one said "I paid for this with my own money.  It's not some freebie"...Pretty sure I also saw one saying,"I ordered this from Amazon",  implying he paid for it not got it free...

[Flyindrew]

Being that I own every Atari console since 1975, I had to purchase the 400 mini to add to the collection.

 

I rate it as "pretty good", and I totally get what it is supposed to do and does a good job of it.

 

Me, personally, I much prefer to get my 8 bit fix on my original 5200,8 bit machine or XEGS, but thats just me. 

[THX-1138]

I rated it 9.  I love the 400 anyway, was my first Atari computer back in the day. I do have a 130XE but I'm done with old hardware - it's a pain in the arse to setup, connect various peripherals and cables and then the TV output is obsolete in the UK so I have to convert it to HDMI.  I really do understand people who want original hardware, but I think I am done with all that.  I enjoy the simplicity of the 400 mini.  I've got all my stuff and not just games on it, I'm very very happy with mine, but each to their own.

[Video]

I think part of peoples expectations is "its Atari, and they can do no wrong" mentality, and of course, that attitude WILL severely skew results when they get their hands on a less than perfect product. In my case, in my case, I went in with the expectation that it wouldn't be perfect, despite being Atari, so when I see "bad" it wasn't as bad for me.

 

Still the controller ring buttons give me the impression someone designed it "to be cool" but didn't consider ergonomics, and obviously didn't play test the thing. Pretty sure the 400 used the same cx40 the 2600 did (8direction digital stick with one button) with the exception it was beige instead of black. The actual computer used the, well, computer, for all the options. The mini tries to make the stick be a do-all, and the stick suffers. If the mini had a few buttons to fake needed options, instead of trying to cram everything onto one stick (which lets face it, the original is awkward anyways, we just give it a free pass as we grew up with it) the controller could have been better. Nix trying to simulate paddles and the 5200 stick, or just make a 5200 mini instead of a 400 mini.

 

Anybody that thinks the 5200 stick was better is so full of crap their eyes are brown. Granted, most of the 5200 sticks problem is how fragile it is (the same issue the flashback one had, sticks broke easily), but it still had issues outside that, turning what could be fun games frustrating because they tried an early, non centering analog stick to run largely digitally controlled games. It worked better than expected for the few analog games, but as most those were pong types (breakout) while it worked pretty well in those cases, it left many of us just wanting a rotary paddle still.

 

Anyhow, from the context of I wasn't expecting perfection, the 400 is (in my OPINION) pretty good. I've got more issues with them "trying to be cute" with the stick than with the rest of the unit.

[+Torq]

I gave it a 7 - "It's good."

That's in the context of what I bought it for ... a plug-and-play, small/cute, way to play classic 8-bit games on the big panel in the living room, with friends, without duplicating PITA-to-get hardware and/or infesting the room with a PC/Mac.

Beyond that, it gets a bit involved/long …

I’m not going to knock the 400 Mini in a comparison to a MiSTer setup; those are WAY more involved to buy, let alone get running (likely beyond the abilities/interest of most of the 400 Mini's target market) and several times the price.  Same when comparing to PC/Mac based emulation.  Sure, they’re both objectively better in terms of end results, but its not the same playing field. 

 

Taken as a mass-market/nostalgia plug-and-play unit ... it's good.

 

Not great; good.

Emulation:

Emulation “quality”, at least for the 400/800/XL/XE model is about what I’d expect for the class.  Good enough to casually enjoy the games that matter to me, but not at a level where it is going to be a full-time alternative for someone using Atari800 or Altirra – much less FPGAs or original hardware.

Games:

The games selection is better-than-I-first-expected, but with some odd-to-WTF inclusions.  Again, there is a nostalgia factor here for me; if I didn’t play it back in the day then it contributes nothing to that here, so “WTFs” are not necessarily because it is not a “good game”.

Star Raiders is a glaring omission in my opinion; it should have at least shown up as a “bonus” game if a keyboard was plugged in.

Having both Centipede and Millipede seems hugely redundant.  Same with Battlezone and Encounter – I’d have switched in Stealth or Dimension X instead of Encounter. And, while I get the licensing issues, Pole Position or Pitstop would have been preferable to Elektra Glide.

Would have been nice to see River Raid or Pitfall.

I was very happy to see Jeff Minter’s work in the collection; however, Hover Bovver is not the way I would have gone; it’s not his best work and something with llamas would seem more fitting.  Can’t do Gridrunner, of course, as it’d be too close to Centipede/Millipede.  Wonder how much of an issue licensing/timing was with the new Jeff Minter Story release in play.

Issues:

• The CXSTICK - I don’t have issues with mine mis/not-registering inputs, but a center post at the bottom of the stick would probably be a good idea.  And it would be improved by making it possible to disable the extra buttons during play or making them require more force to actuate.

• 5200 Input Issues - Supporting the 5200 is, currently, a bit pointless due to the way the control/input translation works.  Response is so slow as to render pretty much everything here unplayable.  It needs to be fixed; other emulators handle this far better.

• M.U.L.E. - It’s being fixed, and it was easy to work around, but I was surprised that this was borked out of the box.

Wants:

• Ability to put games from the USB drive on the carousel, with a cover graphic.
• Better remapping options for controllers other than the CXSTICK.
• Option to turn off the ring buttons when playing.

Beyond That:

 

I might give it a 7.5 or 8 with the issues fixed, an 8.5 if my “wants” were addressed. Getting to a 9 would require that and changing out half the included games.

[Giles N]

***processing, please wait***
 

a-hem

[+Torq]

Thinking about my prior post ... on the games specifically ...

 

I think "Encounter" is a better game than the 8-bit version(s) of Battlezone (oddly, while less "technically impressive", the 2600 version was more fun), so maybe it should stay and Battlezone should go.  The fact that my best arcade score on Battlezone was in the 20K range, and my FIRST game on 8-bit Battlezone was in the 50K+ range says a lot.

 

Elektra Glide, also, was a fun game.  It had no history/context/recognition compared to either Pole Position or Pitstop, but for the time was one of the more impressive 8-bit games you could actually buy "over the counter" (at least in the UK).

 

I don't get "Airball".  At all.  That's probably just me; obviously it's very technically competent.  I just don't find it fun.  Random isometric-explorers seem to have that effect on me.  

 

"Henry's House" ... seems to have come up about the time I was moving on from the 8-bit stuff.  Would have been interesting to combine this level of technical execution with Miner 2049er (though there's no question that I prefer Miner 2049er as a game).  No doubt I'll play it to the end.

 

"Yoomp!" - extremely impressive tech-demo meets "Trailblazer".  Turns out to be a lot of fun.  Glad it is there because, while I'd read about it all over the place, I'd never bothered to play it before.  And the more I play it, the more "zen"/"flow" it becomes.

 

 

[Giles N]

My impressions so far, - not feeling I’ve tested it like comprehensively, are:

 

Out-of-the-box:

 

On the good side:

 

Yes, you get emulations for the entire line-up of Atari 8-bit systems (…at least I think so).

That’s good.

 

You do get a fairly good selection of built-in games: representing many genres made over a long time.

 

You do get a hardware unit with strong future potential, given its’ many USB-slots.

 

It’s easy to connect.

 

- - -

 

Negatively: 

The dysfunctional controller that comes with the system, will have the potential to be a really strong turn-off for casual retro-gamers ‘exploring’ what are out there. 
If this boxed-in controller was the only controller they’d ever get, it may make them not want to check out any more Atari retro-stuff.

You cannot mess with gameplay.

 

Emulation do lag. I can feel it. And for some of the arcade titles, responsive controls are core. Like period.

 

That means if Atari have possibilities to update/upgrade the emulation software, they should really, really do that and reduce lag as much as possible.

 

Moreover, as I was using a third-party controller that had a very good grip, sometimes I experienced buttons to react differently from game to game, from system to system.

But I cannot really tell, if it’s about running the wrong ROM on the wrong system, or if the 3rd party controllers just gets confused.

So this point is undecided.

 

The take-aways are:

- quite a wide and long game-library is opened to retro-gamers who play in their living rooms.

- good inbuilt games

- the joystick is a turn-off and makes gamers frustrated. I don’t believe casual gamers would’ve come back if this was all they ever could play with

- it feels to me, it’s just too much lag for the price, given we now write 2024, not 1984.

 

Atari should try to mend as many of these issues as possible (guess within the limits of technological and economical realities). The stuff about ‘iconic looks’ aren’t the only point worth preserving. I believe there are many retrogamers who would find the physical aesthetics to hardly be on their top-ten list of priorities. Atari don’t serve themselves by listening to a echo-chamber of reviewers and gamers whose only need is to see the physical presence of an old Atari unit of some kind. Retro gamers who come to this because they explore the retro-scene wants (I believe) the actual hands-on & on-screen experience to be as solid as can be.

 

These are my initial impressions.

 

Score?

 

Hard to say. 
 

Had I gotten this in 2017, without any research or overview, I’m sure it would’ve come to me as a messy, utter turn-off. 
What are all the systems about?

What works with or without what? Where is a manual that gives an overview?

Why do I have to use this stiff controller booby-trapped with function & action buttons which do, I-know-not-what…?

Did the games go so slow, or play so unresponsive back in 79-84… hmm, if so, probably this is just too dated…?

 

Thankfully I know that optimal functionality and the pure fun-factor with real hardware or emulation on stronger PCs, is much higher than what one gets out of the box here.

 

And since it’s somewhat exclusive to some retailers, I had to pay quite a lot to get it (import done by the Norwegian retailer made the price-tag go up).

This results in paying quite a lot of money for a product whose best possibilities and most interesting potentials are sub-optimally presented out-of-the-box, compared to the quality you’d get from a NES-mini, SNES-mini, Genesis/MD-mini given their release prices.

 

If emulation-software and firmware can be updated to make for less lag, and if users can get some better overview as to the systems, and retailers told to recommend 3rd party controllers, it’ll serve Atari. 
People don’t want to pay for frustration, when they are looking for fun-time. That simple really.

 

Perhaps I’ll change opinions later, getting more time with it.

 

Time will show.

 

But these are my first-impressions.

Edited April 8 by Giles N

[Flyindrew]

Though Ive had the 400 mini since day 1, this past weekend I got to spend considerable amount of time with it.

 

I actually like the CX stick so much more than the CX + (2600 +) or the VCS classic controller. The 400 mini CX stick took less time to break in for me than the CX +, felt so much more comfortable and doesnt hAve a cheapy feel to it like the VCS classic controller. I guess its "to each his own", but I much prefer the 400 mini joystick as opposed to the recent Atari CX variations.

[scitari]

I gave it an 8. Would have gone higher but the joystick needs some serious improvement. 

[+jgkspsx]

On 4/7/2024 at 4:29 PM, Torq said:

I don't get "Airball".  At all.  That's probably just me; obviously it's very technically competent.  I just don't find it fun.  Random isometric-explorers seem to have that effect on me.

I love Airball (or is it Stockholm Syndrome) on the ST. And the NES. And the GBA. But this one, while fun for a bit, loses way too much because of the muddy, rudimentary graphics. They really should have skipped it for something more suited to the system's strengths.

 

I rated it a 7. I didn't have problems hitting the ring buttons - how do y'all hold your joysticks anyway? But the game list is so so and I fully believe there's lag. I have never played any Atari 8-bit computer before so it was fun anyway. I liked Wavy Navy a lot.