Wrathchild Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 we played KO2 for years every saturday...My flatmate and I used to have many great games on my STE whilst I was at unithere was a nice KO2 100% goal when you played from down to up...Curling the ball in from a corner kick was often a simply way of getting some goals on the scoreboardnever played sensible soccer... is it good? After you got used the difference in after-touch control, it was nicer in many ways to KO2 but didn't quite have its fast pace. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carmel_andrews Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 It's going to be an Arsenal Vs Newcastle Utd. FA Cup final... any takers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snicklin Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 Wasnt there a Thorn EMI Soccer game - I thought that was pretty good/fun???? It wasn't a bad game by comparison to other A8 football attempts. If done vertically and with a better control mechanism, in my mind it could have been a version of Sensible Soccer. Oh, and add some some player selection routines and it would have been closer to SS. All we need to do is combine it with "Football Fantasies" (a shameless plug for an old PD game of mine) and it would be perfect! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 (edited) An old thread... you might need to look at the bottom end of the league table for Arsenal this year ...I'm on the blue side of my city ..although the less said about last weeks CL in Munich the better. Sensible Soccer or Kickoff would be a welcome addition to the A8, I didn't know that Harlequin were looking at doing Kickoff. Edited October 2, 2011 by Tezz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svenski Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 Kickoff would be a welcome addition to the A8, I didn't know that Harlequin were looking at doing Kickoff. Tezz, KickOff is out for the A8, and has been for years. This is what happens when old threads get necro-bumped Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 Tezz, KickOff is out for the A8, and has been for years. This is what happens when old threads get necro-bumped Ah yes! so it was. I've just DL it now and remember it, I should have the original tape with my stuff in storage. I know why I forgot about it looking at it again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svenski Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 I know why I forgot about it looking at it again Yeah, it doesn't look great and takes some time to get used to. I remember paying full price for it many years ago, should have waited for the budget re-release. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carmel_andrews Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 An old thread... you might need to look at the bottom end of the league table for Arsenal this year ...I'm on the blue side of my city ..although the less said about last weeks CL in Munich the better. Sensible Soccer or Kickoff would be a welcome addition to the A8, I didn't know that Harlequin were looking at doing Kickoff. Man city or everton (seeming as though there are a few scousers in mancs) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 mcfc Carmel, there's no Evertonians here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 I remember paying full price for it many years ago, should have waited for the budget re-release.I think it was the budget release that I bought back then, I tried to buy everything that came out for the A8 to support it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 On 3/11/2005 at 2:56 PM, Wrathchild said: Anyway, one thing I did do was to take the men from KO2 or Sensible Soccer (I can't recall) and produce A8 equivalents of them. Here's a piccy and the data statements if anyone feels like trying to animate them. The colour palette is: 0 - green - pitch 1 - red - Team 1 Skin/Team 2 Shirt 2 - white - Team 1 Shirt/Team 2 Skin and Ball 3 - black - hair, shadows, shorts I think the A8 could do with a great soccer game! The Zeppelin one was painful to play! The sprites look good -- being lower-color versions of the original Sensible sprites; but the problem is the graphics mode being Antic D (160 x 96) would end up at 1/4 screen size of the original. One of the things that makes Sensible Soccer work is good view of the playing field. It would be possible to work up a version in hi-res mode, and use artifacting to get your other colors (similar to how Micro League Baseball was done). You'd still have to do some sprite conversion to make it look right, though; and I'm not too keen on the forced colors of artifacting. So, I started working up a scaled conversion of everything in Antic E. This is just 5 color (no PMG's), which includes the background grass changes. I was thinking wide mode might be a little nicer, to eliminate the borders; though it might slow things too much, since speed is primary. Probably be good to cut number of players per team down a little too. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 Oh, sensible soccer on the Atari, that is a nice thought... If only... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Philsan Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 @MrFish your mock-ups are gorgeous. Regarding high resolution, someone is using it on Sensible Soccer ZX Spectrum's conversion (the only news about it are on coder's account on Twitter). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 5 hours ago, Philsan said: @MrFish your mock-ups are gorgeous. Thanks... no PM's used on anything yet either. I was thinking of PM's for the score and information displays, and ball (probably)... not sure. 5 hours ago, Philsan said: Regarding high resolution, someone is using it on ZXSoccer to convert Sensible Soccer to Spectrum (the only news about it are on coder's account on Twitter). It looks good for 2 colors. I was already messing around some in Antic F, but I hadn't yet thought about using black as the second color, which offers a different approach for converting the sprites. As I said, there's artifacting too, but PAL artifacting is a bit different. I also have some different versions of the same sprites for Antic E. Just kinda pondering the whole thing, ATM... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patjomki Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 (edited) Great mockups. 👍 Seems the ball is just 3 pixels wide with two colours? If that's the case you could use all missiles for it (although this means that one player is always black and the other white as they share the same colours with the missiles). Players could be used for the goalkeepers as they need different colours. And when you are using DLIs for the grass (COLBAK) you get another extra colour. So no need for ugly artifacting. 😉 Edited January 3, 2023 by patjomki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 27 minutes ago, patjomki said: Great mockups. 👍 Thanks. 27 minutes ago, patjomki said: Seems the ball is just 3 pixels wide with two colours? If that's the case you could use all missiles for it (although this means that one player is always black and the other white as they share the same colours with the missiles). Players could be used for the goalkeepers as they need different colours. Same things that I had in mind... The ball is 3 pixels; but it's really 2 pixels white & black (ball) + 2 pixels black (shadow). The shadow needs to go off on it's own sometimes. So, it would just need 3 missiles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patjomki Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 (edited) Don't know the rules of football too good but I think there is no situation where both goalkeepers are at the same vertical position so there is only 1 multicolour player (=two players) needed which means that you do not only have one missile but also two players left for additional colours. Score and information can be done on top or bottom of the screen with overscan (and more colours with dli). The only difficulty are the soft sprites when scrolling as hardwarescrolling does not consume too many cpu cycles but you need to adjust all softsprites accordingly. Edited January 3, 2023 by patjomki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 14 minutes ago, patjomki said: Don't know the rules of football too good but I think there is no situation where both goalkeepers are at the same vertical position so there is only 1 multicolour player (=two players) needed which means that you do not only have one missile but also two players left for additional colours. Right, except -- as you say -- the colors are being shared with some missiles; but I think there's not much to be concerned with about it. 14 minutes ago, patjomki said: Score and information can be done on top or bottom of the screen with overscan (and more colours with dli). I like the idea of scores and information that stay in a fixed position on the screen and float over top of the playfield graphics as they scroll by. That's why I was thinking of using the players that won't be used for the goalkeepers. 14 minutes ago, patjomki said: The only difficulty are the soft sprites when scrolling as hardwarescrolling does not consume too many cpu cycles but you need to adjust all softsprites accordingly. Thorn soccer has similar-sized softsprites; although, it only scrolls horizontally, and also only to and from 3 fixed positions (left, right, center). Sensible is constantly player-position based 8-way. Most likely some compromises would be needed, here and there -- maybe less players per side, as I mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patjomki Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 7 hours ago, MrFish said: I like the idea of scores and information that stay in a fixed position on the screen and float over top of the playfield graphics as they scroll by. Most likely some compromises would be needed, here and there -- maybe less players per side, as I mentioned. I agree scores and information on the playfield would give more an impression of a football game watched on tv but as the atari is capable of scrolling linewise I suppose it would help performance to have a fixed panel. Well, we'll see. Regarding performance: What programming language do you plan to use? Can't imagine any other than assembly language for such a fast paced game, right? Less players per side seems legit. In sensible soccer I think there are never 20 field players in the visible area of the game at the same time (although I suppose football rules would allow it? Just doesn't make sense even in the real game.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 18 minutes ago, patjomki said: I agree scores and information on the playfield would give more an impression of a football game watched on tv but as the atari is capable of scrolling linewise I suppose it would help performance to have a fixed panel. Well, we'll see. Sure, it could help; depends on how big of a scrolling area would end up providing good/acceptable performance. If the area is smaller, then a fixed panel would have the better aesthetic. 18 minutes ago, patjomki said: Regarding performance: What programming language do you plan to use? Can't imagine any other than assembly language for such a fast paced game, right? I've no serious plans for programming it in the immediate. I'm basically sizing up the possibilities and working out some of the graphical pieces of the puzzle. I only have basic assembly skills ATM, anyway. It's something I plan on getting into in the future (when life isn't so busy, retirement, etc.). I wouldn't attempt anything like this without assembler; I doubt anything else can provide proper performance for good game pace. If I was using another language (C, Pascal, etc.), it'd be just a manager for assembly routines, in a case like this, anyway. 18 minutes ago, patjomki said: Less players per side seems legit. In sensible soccer I think there are never 20 field players in the visible area of the game at the same time (although I suppose football rules would allow it? Just doesn't make sense even in the real game.). In most situations, yes, you're only going to have a portion of your team in the viewing area. I'm pretty sure it's possible to set up a variety of formations/strategies for offense and defense in SS. Although, it's probably something beyond the scope of what's reasonable here. So, yeah... the need to reduce players on field may not be needed, providing decent formations could be designed that would keep the screen from sprite overload. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 9 hours ago, patjomki said: Don't know the rules of football too good but I think there is no situation where both goalkeepers are at the same vertical position so there is only 1 multicolour player (=two players) needed which means that you do not only have one missile but also two players left for additional colours. 9 hours ago, MrFish said: Right, except -- as you say -- the colors are being shared with some missiles; but I think there's not much to be concerned with about it. I was thinking about 5th player mode, and (unless I've missed something in my sleepiness) here is what you'd end up with in each case -- assuming 2 black missiles & 1 white missile (or 1 white player, if using 5th player setting) are to be used for the ball & shadow. PMG (standard) [for ball & shadow] missile (black) missile (black) missile (white) [for goalies & other uses] player (black) player (black) player (white) player/missile (choice) PMG (5th player) [for ball & shadow] missile (black) missile (black) player (white) [for goalies & other uses] missile (black) missile (black) player (choice) player (choice) player (choice) Using the 5th player setting provides more control over color choices, at the cost of trading 1 player for 2 black missiles. I can't remember (have to look it up later), using the 5th player possibly has some effect on priorities that could be restrictive. May or may not be an issue, if it's the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrathchild Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 One thought I'd had before was to use white missiles for the pitch (length) sides. Maybe even with DMA disabled and use DLIs to switch on/off based on the goal lines being visible. Although to add/remove only the extra pixels based on the scroll size could be quick enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Philsan Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 The game we talked about on January, Speccy Soccer, has been released. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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