Revolution Controller Revealed

[ferrarimanf355]

For some reason, I received a copy of OPM in the mail with a free demo disc (Sony randomly advertising? I don't know). I popped it in and tried out Destroy All Humans... to my dismay, the control was absolutely terrible. You run around with the left stick, try in vain to aim with the right stick, and doing pretty much anything in the game involves pressing two buttons at once. Combined with the atrocious voice acting and (in my opinion) lame humour, I gave up on that one.

That's more lame programming than anything else.

Then I tried playing the demo of Rise of the Kasai, and was again treated to Sony's diagram of which of the 10 buttons does what... I played for about 15 seconds before giving up on that too.

Don't know what to say on that... you should have given it some more time.

I've been playing games for about 20 years now, but it seems like it just takes too long these days to learn the controls for a game, especially if I only want to play it for maybe 10-15 minutes. It never seems obvious what buttons on a dual shock controller are supposed to do what. Different games use different buttons for pretty much everything. At least with the Gamecube controller (and presumably with this Revolution controller) you get a big A button that's obviously going to used for the most common action (jump, shoot, accelerate, whatever), and the Z button is obviously only going to be used for obscure things that you won't be doing very often. I never managed to get into games like Rainbow 6 or Splinter Cell mostly because the controls always seemed like a giant mess.

 

Hopefully with this controller, everything will be a matter of "move the controller left to move the character left" and stuff like that. When things are like that, you don't NEED to spend 20 minutes learning how to control your character, you just turn things on and play and the controls will be mostly obvious. That just seems more fun to me, while figuring out all the controls on most PS2 games is more of a chore. I'm all in favor of Nintendo's push to simplify games. I guess this makes me a "casual" gamer after all.

 

--Zero

933335[/snapback]

I really don't see things this way. Complexity doesn't always have to mean a giant mess. With something like Splinter Cell, all it takes is practice, practice and more practice. The devteam behind that game made Splinter Cell great because of controls that add layers of depth without becoming overtly complex for complexity's sake. Racing games have gotten more complex as well: you have multiple viewpoints, and in sims like Forza Motorsport, you have look back and look left/right commands, and pit strategies. It never overwhelms me, because it's implemented in such a natural way.

 

I don't think more complex means more frustrating, and it's because of that that I'm skeptical of this push to simplify games. I mean, yeah, I'm fully aware that some of the best games ever made are very simple... but complex can be beautiful as well.

[JB]

I think it'd work great for some classes of game.

 

 

933442[/snapback]

I think people are missing exactly how great this will be for fighters. They act like that's the prime example of how it will suck. Think for a second. Circle motion + shove forward + trigger 1 = fireball. Circle motion + pull back + A = Dragon Kick. Circle motion + slash = sword charge. That's just using the wand. Add the analog which can do the normal forward forward back type moves (and movement) and the fact that a weapon slash will be simple with the wand and Nintendo could release an awesome fighter unlike anything that we've played before.

933451[/snapback]

Actually, I don't think it'll work well for the genre as we know it.

 

Combined with something else(like IGN's stupid GameCube dock shell), it'd make for some nice 3D fighters, though. Use d-pad and buttons for jump/beat-up, and tilt it forward/back to step towards/away from the camera. Beats holding a button to change jump/crouch behavior.

[Avid Fan]

I dunno, I think the revolution will be a cool system, but they can kiss their 3rd party support goodbye with that thing

[Dones]

And if you consider how weak 3rd party support has been in the past, your statement could be even more so. Sorry guys, while this problem improved somewhat with the cube, the console still gets the shaft from 3rd party devs. Depending on the market acceptance of the tv remote, Nintendo will either given devs a reason to be excited or a reason not to develop for it.

[sega saturn x]

Developers seem to love being able to do new things with the DS with any luck they will have similar feeling toward the revolution.

[Atarifever]

And if you consider how weak 3rd party support has been in the past, your statement could be even more so. Sorry guys, while this problem improved somewhat with the cube, the console still gets the shaft from 3rd party devs. Depending on the market acceptance of the tv remote, Nintendo will either given devs a reason to be excited or a reason not to develop for it.

933587[/snapback]

I would argue that the only way for Nintendo to get third party support is with something like this. What would you all have Nintendo do? The Gamecube has proven that even with better hardware graphically (over the PS2) Nintendo still has problems getting as much 3rd party support. What more could they do, really? At least this way they give third parties a reason to try their new hardware. Also, if you listened to the speech they made you'll notice one of their big ideass is that something like this opens a lot of possibilites to smaller developers to make one of a kind type stuff without having to worry about putting graphics on it that match with the 360 or PS3. Small companies can have a great idea for a game that can only be played on Revolution hardware and that has graphics as a far distant secondary concern. I mean, Nintendogs is hardly Burnout Revenge graphically, but Nintendo showed how a great idea can sell itself.

[Dones]

Well said, but Nintendogs is a 1st party title. 3rd party devs do not think along the same lines as Nintendo. No innovation will come from 3rd parties if the financial risk is too much. Only Nintendo has the money to indulge themselves in risky niche gimmicky gadgets.

 

What would you all have Nintendo do?

How about getting their heads out of their asses, wake up and smell coffee? (however aromathic that may be) They have been in denial for years, pretending they are not competing with Sony or M$ (though in fairness M$ and Sony do the same). Why hide behind innovation to keep pushing kiddie games and derivative mario spinoffs? Bring more action titles, cater to the same gamers as the others, diversify to them also! EDIT: unnecessary rant removed.

Edited September 18, 2005 by Dones

[sega saturn x]

cater to the same gamers as the others

Than who would make games for people who don't give a shit about GTA or violent games? Nintendo does have a market it's just not as big as the others.

[JB]

What would you all have Nintendo do?

... cater to the same gamers as the others...

Sweet merciful Althena, please watch over us and protect us from evils such as this.

 

I like Nintendo partially BECAUSE they aren't the XStation.

Nintendo offers a diffrent gaming experience than the competition.

 

 

Which isn't to say that the PlayBox doesn't have some fine titles, just that I like diversity.

[Dones]

Well you can nitpick it and spin it anyway you like, but that is not what I meant.

Edited September 18, 2005 by Dones

[sega saturn x]

What do you mean nit pick? All you really said was they should stop trying inovate and do what every one else does and you want less spin offs and sequels. You act like nintendo is the only developer who does spin offs or sequels. It's amazing that people complain about nintendo and their spin offs, but there is about to be 4 jak games and 4 ratchets not to mention 3 sly games that seems like a hell of a lot of sequels to me.

Edited September 18, 2005 by sega saturn x

[JB]

Well you can nitpick it and spin it anyway you like, but that is not what I meant.

933663[/snapback]

Maybe you can explain it in a way that someone ELSE understands it. Because it sounded like you said "be just like the other guys so you can compete with them."

 

Not that it really works... MS is nowhere near Sony's sales. They're closer to the 'Cube than the PS2.

[Mindfield]

Good God.

 

I just looked over the Revolution controller and all I have to say is: What in the sweet fuck were they thinking?!

 

Have they played with this thing for any length of time during testing? And by "any length of time" I mean the average length of time anyone would play a single game concurrently. Who the hell is going to want to hold their arm up, pointing, twisting, tilting and rotating this thing in 3D space in order to play a game? I mean ... that's work! Nobody wants to work for their entertainment. Seriously, WTF, Nintendo? Did you learn nothing from the utter failure of mouse rings and remote pointing devices in anything but business presentations?

 

Bad, bad, bad idea. Novel, gimmicky, but just ... no. The only revolution that'll go on here is against that damn controller.

 

But on a bright note, at least all those people who insist on calling controllers "remotes" will finally be using the right terminology.

[Dones]

At least I am glad to see I am not completely alone in thinking about the shortcomings of the "remolution". I tought about the "exercise" part too when I saw the keynote videos. The actors in the video exaggerated their movements. In real life people who use this controller will do as little as possible to interact with the console. Maybe when playing with friends more physical action would be elicited, but this won't be the norm for most players.

[Atarifever]

The Revolution's controllor should be good for RTS games too (which I think someone already said). You have an air mouse that can contol a cursor on the screen and would allow quick tilts to move the camera all over the map. To me it seems like computer developers would have *less* trouble porting RTS games to the Revolution than to the other consoles. Also, as already stated it would probably allow for inntuitive FPS control too. Also, in Sims type games having a mouse should be be more intuitive as well. In fact, with it's control setup (with something that easily serves as a mouse) perhaps the Revolution will see more ports of computer games than either of the other consoles. I mean, if the computer companies have a control setup similar to the one they're familiar with, then porting should be much easier. And that's not even thinking about how easy it will be if Nintendo simply puts out a keyboard add on. You could lay the keyboard and remote on a table and use it like a normal keyboard and mouse.

Also, I realized yesterday that Nintendo did put out the touch screen we were all expecting. The remote controls a cursor on the screen in one of the demo games, so basically you can *draw* on your TV screen (just at a distance). This means a game just like Kirby CC could be made for the Revolution.

[Cousin Vinnie]

All I can say is that it looks like alot of fun. Hate to say it folks, but I'm bored out of my mind with First Person Shooters, Thug games and Driving games. Doesn't look like a gimmick to me. The DK Bongos were gimmicky. This looks like an innovation.

 

All the nay-sayers sound like the ones who thought the DS would bomb. Nintendo looks like its actually listening to gamers like me. I want fun, new experiences w/ games. Looks good!

 

Cousin Vinnie

[Dones]

Let's hope after the novelty wears off you still feel the same.

[ferrarimanf355]

What would you all have Nintendo do?

... cater to the same gamers as the others...

Sweet merciful Althena, please watch over us and protect us from evils such as this.

 

I like Nintendo partially BECAUSE they aren't the XStation.

Nintendo offers a diffrent gaming experience than the competition.

 

 

Which isn't to say that the PlayBox doesn't have some fine titles, just that I like diversity.

933644[/snapback]

Yeah, while you're busy choosing between Mario Superstar Baseball or Hello Kitty Roller Rescue, I'll be busy playing some 50-player multiplayer deathmatches on Perfect Dark Zero or looking at the latest in GothamTV highlights on Project Gotham Racing 3. If Nintendo wants to innovate, they really should stop it with the Mario sports titles and the kiddy image, much less the rehashing of tired franchises. The Revolution will become the next generation's Dreamcast- and don't take that the wrong way, I bought a Dreamcast at launch and loved it.

[Jetboot Jack]

Wow what a wonderful and innovative idea, a controller that breaks the existing paradigms. Just like Atari did with the joystick, Nintendo did with the d-pad and the analogue stick - thank goodness that you Luddites (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luddite) weren't around then to talk down those ideas...

 

I can hear it now...

 

What a lame idea from Atari, the cx-40 joystick! Paddles are the only way to control games - Atari will go bust by forcing players to use this insane new joystick thing...

 

I bet you nay sayers were the same idiots who said d-pads (NES) were stupid and the analogue stick (N64) was utterly wrong.

 

Get over yourselves, wait until you actually use the thing, it might be great, it might not, but give Nintendo the benefit of the doubt until you see and use the revolution.

 

Personally I (and loads of my colleagues) think this looks very interesting because it does change the way the player interfaces with the game, and that is a challenge to us designers/developers....

[Ze_ro]

I think people are missing exactly how great this will be for fighters.  They act like that's the prime example of how it will suck.  Think for a second.  Circle motion + shove forward + trigger 1 = fireball.  Circle motion + pull back + A = Dragon Kick.  Circle motion + slash = sword charge.  That's just using the wand.  Add the analog which can do the normal forward forward back type moves (and movement)  and the fact that a weapon slash will be simple with the wand and Nintendo could release an awesome fighter unlike anything that we've played before.

How about a version of Punch-Out where you hold a controller in each fist, and actually punch and dodge? Now we can hopefully get the Power Glove Punch-Out experience we should have gotten 20 years ago. Remember Supreme Fighter? The terrible FMV 1st-person fighting game for the SegaCD? Maybe something like this could actually do a game like that justice.

 

I really don't see things this way. Complexity doesn't always have to mean a giant mess. With something like Splinter Cell, all it takes is practice, practice and more practice.

I don't want to have to practice just to understand the controls. That was my whole point in the first place. Overly complicated controls will often turn me away from a game that might otherwise be excellent. Maybe you're looking forward to playing the full 80-hour experience, but I'm just looking for a casual thrill.

 

Have they played with this thing for any length of time during testing?

Considering they've already put millions of dollars into designing the Revolution, and are about to put many millions more into marketing and development projects, I can only assume the answer here is "YES". Have you played with this thing for any length of time? Nintendo is not a stupid company by any stretch of the imagination...

 

--Zero

[Inky]

I love Nintendo, I like Sony, and despise M$, but even I have to say about this controller "TRY BEFORE I BUY"

[JB]

What would you all have Nintendo do?

... cater to the same gamers as the others...

Sweet merciful Althena, please watch over us and protect us from evils such as this.

 

I like Nintendo partially BECAUSE they aren't the XStation.

Nintendo offers a diffrent gaming experience than the competition.

 

 

Which isn't to say that the PlayBox doesn't have some fine titles, just that I like diversity.

933644[/snapback]

Yeah, while you're busy choosing between Mario Superstar Baseball or Hello Kitty Roller Rescue, I'll be busy playing some 50-player multiplayer deathmatches on Perfect Dark Zero or looking at the latest in GothamTV highlights on Project Gotham Racing 3.

Assuming the Rev gets a similar showing as the 'Cube, I'm more likely to be choosing between Metroid Prime 3 and FZero RX.

 

If Nintendo wants to innovate, they really should stop it with the Mario sports titles

Agreed, actually. Once or twice was all right, but EVERYTHING?

If this keeps up, we'll be seeing yearly releases of every sport around with Mario. Just like EA.

 

The Revolution will become the next generation's Dreamcast- and don't take that the wrong way, I bought a Dreamcast at launch and loved it. 

Actually, I thought the 'Cube was a lot like the Dreamcast this generation.

Only without the suicide.

 

And I love the DC too. Couldn't afford to get one until they were being cleared out for 50$, but...

 

That was kind of my point, really.

The DC also had a lot of non-mainstream software.

If Sega'd copied Sony, they might've done better. But it wouldn't be the Dreamcast we know and love.

 

 

 

 

I'll wind up with a PS3 and XBox 360. Eventually. After a few price cuts.

They're impressive hardware, and there's gonna be some damn nice titles on them.

 

But I want the Revolution because, even without the motion-tracking controller, it's DIFFRENT.

There's a diffrent mindset behind development for Nintendo's hardware, much like there was for Sega's.

 

It's like the diffrence between indie films and Hollywood blockbusters.

There's great stuff and some real stinkers in both camps.

But indies aren't tailored to have the widest possible audience. They make what they think is a good film. Hollywood makes the film that it thinks will draw the most viewers.

...

Obviously, it's not a perfect analogy, but it's the closest I can think of.

[CPUWIZ]

JB, how much Nintendo stock do you own?

 

Probably just as many shares as Foxy has in Microsoft.

 

Or you are both just helpless fanboys/girls.

[JB]

JB, how much Nintendo stock do you own? 

 

Probably just as many shares as Foxy has in Microsoft. 

 

Or you are both just helpless fanboys/girls. 

933845[/snapback]

I own exactly 0.

 

I just find Nintendo's software on the whole to be more interesting than Sony's and MS's.

 

 

 

I USED to be a Nintendo fanboy, back int he SNES days. Was years before I gave the Genesis a fair chance.

The N64 fixed all that, though. THAT was a system I saw little of interest on.

[Foxy Cleopatra]

JB, how much Nintendo stock do you own? 

 

Probably just as many shares as Foxy has in Microsoft. 

 

Or you are both just helpless fanboys/girls. 

933845[/snapback]

 

 

Oh geez I think you probably should have done a sku_u and asked if JB was Satoru Iwata or I was Bill Gates. That would have been really cool ha ha ha ha

 

oo oo Can I play? So CPU are you Nolan Bushnell?

Edited September 18, 2005 by Foxy Cleopatra