rpmxxipt Posted May 30, 2002 Share Posted May 30, 2002 I hate to complain about something so stupid as who gets what Atari carts, but is this kind of lassez-faire stuff admired or disgusting? Sylent here brags about scrapping a legit auction: http://pub27.ezboard.com/fretrogamingfrm4....picID=693.topic Congrats to him, I suppose, for convincing the seller to cancel, but I'm beginning to wish I hadn't heard of this whole thing. Totally disgusting. - RPM [ 05-30-2002: Message edited by: rpmxxipt ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Room 34 Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 Well, I'm not exactly sure what happened here... but I will just say I've bought a bunch of carts from Sylentwulf on eBay and while the prices are not the cheapest around, I can always rely on good communication, fast delivery, and decent quality. I don't condone suckering clueless sellers, but I can appreciate the urge to sneak away with a good deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 I agree. Makes me a bit disgusted -- at least an admirable person would e-mail the seller to offer fair value for what they are auctioning, or at least wait until the auction ends. Buy It Nows are a whole other issue. Those kind of auctions take some luck and skill to find a great deal. However I doubt that this person and many others like them really give them fair value for the cartridges when they scrap the auction. What'd you offer, 40 bucks including shipping? But, then again, I might be wrong. I don't spend all day on eBay waiting around like an overweight bully to scare and con people out of their lunch money. Call me crazy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philflound Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 Well, sylent wolf is a sneaky bastard. He snipes bids at the last minute, but that is fine with me. But when you coax someone to end an auction and probably pay them alot lower than what they would have gotten, that is slimey. Though I did contact this seller and inform him that he would probably get a certain amount of money if he did not end the auction and he got hosed if he gave his games away. We could of course contact ebay with this information and possibly get the sylent freak to get his user id suspended. Any suggestions? Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jahfish Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Andrew: I agree. Makes me a bit disgusted -- at least an admirable person would e-mail the seller to offer fair value for what they are auctioning, or at least wait until the auction ends. Buy It Nows are a whole other issue. Those kind of auctions take some luck and skill to find a great deal. However I doubt that this person and many others like them really give them fair value for the cartridges when they scrap the auction. What'd you offer, 40 bucks including shipping? But, then again, I might be wrong. I don't spend all day on eBay waiting around like an overweight bully to scare and con people out of their lunch money. Call me crazy... so you're telling everybody: "please pay the price noted in the DP guide!" ? we decided that the value you put on something is a personal thing. whether you pay 1$ or 1000$ for your game is your decision, based on a certain rarity, availability, ... etc ... and it's the same for the seller. there's some that would like 100s of $$$ for their sets ...... others - who might alternatively just trash it - are happy with 20$ (wheter a magicard is included or not) ... and finding those is a question of luck ... quote: Originally posted by Philflound: Well, sylent wolf is a sneaky bastard. he is, and i am too sometimes quote: Originally posted by Philflound: But when you coax someone to end an auction and probably pay them alot lower than what they would have gotten, that is slimey. Though I did contact this seller and inform him that he would probably get a certain amount of money if he did not end the auction and he got hosed if he gave his games away. then there's tons of "illegal collectors" who are constantly ripping fleamarket sellers .... and they're all here. albert should all suspend them ... seriously.... since i have to do more communication than you before bidding (shipping to germany? check the costs, paypal or not ...), i often also ask if there's more items, or if the seller is interested to end his auctions so that all items are bought from just one person (easier payment, communication, shipping). some sellers are happier about just one buyer ... quote: Originally posted by Philflound: We could of course contact ebay with this information and possibly get the sylent freak to get his user id suspended. Any suggestions? Phil TILT! ... BAD IDEA! that's a pretty stupid idea ... he's providing tons of carts on ebay regularly. for "normal" gamers that don't collect tons, it's a good way to get all their favorites at once ... you should respect that too and not just see it from a collectors point of view. of course for us a space invaders is worth nothing, not more than 50 cts. at least. but some guys haven't played it for ages and they would spend 20$ to get it. they'll surely find one on sylentwulfs auctions way cheaper for 2$ or 4$ .... not that bad, right? and what's up with you? imagine you find a magicard on the fleamarket ....the guy goes "dunno. the cart is bigger than atari carts but it might work" ...... are you gonna give that guy 495$ on top of the 5$ he asked for? so it's time everybody cools down before al closes the topic ... don't start personal flaming until you're really sure about what you do .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAZ Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 Several of my games came from Sylentwulf. I don't think relations between him and I are good at all. He's got great communication and very fast shipping on his auctions. Being from a "collector's" point of view, his auctions were perfect for me, since just about every game that was on my "to get" list he had. Since I was buying several at once, to save on shipping costs, I failed to view alot of the pictures. Had I done that, I would've seen some cartridges that were in horrible shape. When I took Q-tips and isopropyl alcohol to all the carts he sent me, there seemed to be a mound of dirt inside the cartridges. Not a biggie really, but I think he should CLEAN some cartridges instead of running them through mud on a farm, before selling them. Some were VERY dusty. I don't fault him much at all, since he sells so many cartridges, it simply isn't realistic to clean each and every one. If I bid on one of his auctions again in the future, which I probably wouldn't, he'd probably cancel it anyway. I know he's on this message board from time to time, and I'm sure he'll read this too. [ 05-31-2002: Message edited by: KAZ ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylentwulf Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 Well well. Lets see what we have here. Everyone who has EVER found a good deal on an atari game, please leave, and retract anything you've said. Because that's all it was. Ever find a decent cart for $1 at a goowill, salvation army, ebay, friend, or flea market? Then I guess you ripped them off and you are also considered slime. I'm NOT going to defend my own auctions. I take pictures of the carts and you WILL receive the cart pictured, I test ALL games before listing them. Can you honestly tell me a cart has never worked once, but then NOT worked a week later? And for the Record, no I didn't buy that auction just to re-sell obelix, I needed it and am keeping it, If I didn't need it I probly would have let someone else get it. I try to be reasonable with all of my games and prices, I just listed a picture label submarine commander in mint condition for $1.00, no reserve. I combine shipping on everything, and if someone has a problem with a game or it breaks in the mail, I am VERY reasonable, often replacing the cart or refunding the payment, and taking the shipping costs myself. I've also held contests on the DP board and with some of my ebay bidders and given away free games, free CD's, and accessories. Don't make me out to be the money-grubbing jerk who tries to rip everyone off unless you can back it up somehow. P.S. Thanx Jahfish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skatepunk60 Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 I think You guys are being retarded , Sylent found a good deal and went for it , u woulda done the same thing. Geez if the seller thought he coulda got a better deal he woulda said so. Anyway good find Sylent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Sylentwulf: Well well. Lets see what we have here. Everyone who has EVER found a good deal on an atari game, please leave, and retract anything you've said. Because that's all it was. Ever find a decent cart for $1 at a goowill, salvation army, ebay, friend, or flea market? Then I guess you ripped them off and you are also considered slime. I'm not going to get into the whole morality issue here (if there even is one), but this is not really the same thing. There is no policy being violated when you make such a transaction in a thrift store or flea market. You might want to be aware that your actions (as I understand) are a violation of the eBay user agreement (circumventing the eBay fee structure). If anyone does get upset enough and report you, eBay can suspend your account if they choose. So, in the future, you might want to keep this kind of thing to yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylentwulf Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 Actually, I had told the seller to do the sell it now "offer" button thingy if they wanted feedback, so technically I think just the seller would get in trouble for the ebay fee's. I've had one other person end an auction for me and they used ebay's sell now feature. Ahh well, I guess I've learned my lesson and I'll just keep any good finds to myself. Too bad, I, like a lot of other people, get excited when I find a game I need for a good price. I know I see a LOT of posts that start with "Wow, I had a great find today!" I guess Enthusiasm among collectors will just have to be on it's way out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Room 34 Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 I think Sylentwulf is giving us the truth here in his last post. I get the feeling the seller was not too familiar with how certain things on eBay work, and canceled the auction out of ignorance of his/her other options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Sylentwulf: Ahh well, I guess I've learned my lesson and I'll just keep any good finds to myself. Too bad, I, like a lot of other people, get excited when I find a game I need for a good price. I know I see a LOT of posts that start with "Wow, I had a great find today!" I guess Enthusiasm among collectors will just have to be on it's way out. Come on now, that's not true. There may be some people upset with this particular situation but don't take that to mean that enthusiasm is dying. As for eBay policy, I don't know how they would handle it if could show that you didn't ask them to sell outside of eBay. Certainly if you ask them to end it and relist with a BIN, I don't believe that would violate anything (nothing wrong with being aggressive). And while it is the seller who is defrauding eBay out of their fee (albeit a small fee), you would still be in violation according to their policy. I'm not trying to come down on you, just trying to clarify the situation for anyone who does this type of thing. The only thing you could really do here is insist that they use the BIN feature, but I know that is asking a lot in the real world. If they insist on selling to you straight up, I just wouldn't post about it so that eBay has easy proof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomyou Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 sylent is a direct competitor of mine but a friendly one at that and there is plenty of merhcnadise and classic gmers for all so give the guy a break. He got a good deal and was excited about it. Sure he and I both sell a very large percentage of what we buy but I would say we both also have quite an extensive collection of classic merchandise as well. If the seller got more than he wanted for it than it was a good deal for him. How many pick up great finds at yard sales and flea markets. Say a $5.00 chuckwagon. Do you tell the person "wait a minute here I must pay you more for this as $5.00 is not enough" or do you tell him "You need to raise the price on this and I'll check back later and if it is still here I'll buy it." I think Not you break your fingers trying to get that $5 out of your pocket and go home happy as you should. anyways not trying to step on any toes but some seem to be a little harsh on the ole wulf man I say Great Find and congrats ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 How does that work exactly? I thought the Personal Offer feature was only for sellers to offer the item to a second bidder if the high bidder doesn't follow through. Ending an auction early effectively reduces eBay's final value fees, so I'm not sure why they would want to do that. But I've never tried that so maybe it's just something I haven't encountered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylentwulf Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 One way, when you go to the "end your auction early" page you can either cancel all bids, or sell to the current high bidder. I believe at that point you can enter the amount it is to be sold for, making it a legit ebay transaction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmctm1sw Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 For what it's worth. Right from eBay. I don't know who's right or wrong. I didn't read all the posts... Can I close my auction early, while honoring the current high bid? To end your listing early, please follow the steps below. If there are no bids on the auction listing, you may skip step 3. 1. Click on the "site map" link located on the Navigation Bar. Scroll down to the "End my auction early" link and click on it. 2. On the next page, enter your User ID, password, and the item number, and click on "Continue". 3. If there are bids on the item, you will see two choices. The first is "Cancel bids and end listing early". The second is "Sell item to high bidder(s) and end listing early". If you wish to end the item without selling it to any bidder(s), please select the first option and click on "Cancel bids". If, however, you wish to sell the item to the high bidder(s) for the current high bid price without waiting for the listing to end on its own, please select the second option and click "Sell item". 4. If there are no bids on the item, or if you choose to cancel the bids on the item, you will be prompted to select a reason for ending the item early. You can finish ending your listing by clicking on "Continue". 5. If there are bids and you select to sell the item to the high bidder(s), you will end the listing at the current high bid price by clicking on "Sell item". You will then be instructed to contact the high bidder to complete the transaction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jahfish Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Alex: I'm not going to get into the whole morality issue here (if there even is one) there is none ... ebay tries to make every penny on us, and we try to save every penny ... just normal human behaviour .... quote: Originally posted by Alex: You might want to be aware that your actions (as I understand) are a violation of the eBay user agreement (circumventing the eBay fee structure). If anyone does get upset enough and report you, eBay can suspend your account if they choose. So, in the future, you might want to keep this kind of thing to yourself. as long as they make very good money from me for tons of fees for every single small feature and offer no service when there's problems .... well my honest and pretty direct answer is: f*ck yabe! quote: Originally posted by Sylentwulf: One way, when you go to the "end your auction early" page you can either cancel all bids, or sell to the current high bidder. I believe at that point you can enter the amount it is to be sold for, making it a legit ebay transaction. when i am trying to snipe auctions that way, i do it early, so that no other bidders are involved ... i wouldn't make the seller cancel bids ... that might lead to a real fraud and would really be unfair those who allready were bidding ... but ending an auction while you're leading is cool i think, even if what you offered is above the ending price .... the ending price isn't necesarily the price dealed by mail .. [ 05-31-2002: Message edited by: jahfish ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincYnoTi Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 this is an interesting thread, and probably more so if emotion could be removed from responses . but then, without emotion, there probably wouldn't be any follow-ups on the thread. i think the garage sale anology is closer than some might want to think. how many times have you offered MORE than what someone is asking? now if there was another guy behind you that said "i'll give you ten bucks more than him", that essentially becomes ebay. the closest i came to that situation was over a waterworld at a flea market. the guy in front of me picked up earthworld and fireworld and my eyes (and hands) happened to find waterworld first. the other guy found the waterworld instructions next to earth&fire and asked the vendor if he had the waterworld cartridge. "umm, that guy is holding it..." thinking back, it's amazing i only ended up paying like $5 for cart&docs. the biggest difference is the visibility of ebay. if a seller ends something early, it can still show up in ebay searches, or if you had it bookmarked, you find out too late it has ended early. my usual response is "dang, wish i'd asked the guy to end it early". at a garage sale, the seller will never be told how much that rare game he sold for $1 that morning was worth. and nobody knows the identity of "sumguy that bought a ton of atari junk an hour ago." now, telling a story about a "good deal" or "great find" is the second part of this story. everyone wants to make a great find. my "greatest find" on ebay was probably a xante cart. i was probably taking a great risk letting the auction run its full course, but still...great find. does anyone here think they would have told that seller, hey relist that cart with "atari 2600 xante" in the title so you can might make a bunch? is there anything objectionable with telling that story in this forum? off-topic: did anyone else see the mis-spelled atari 2600 obelik? i wonder if marco missed the boxed atari 2600 canon man this week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Weis Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 personally i have NO problem with what Sylentwulf did.... i have never asked a seller to cancel an auction early! but i have asked a seller if they would sell a certain item in an auction!! (and YES i would give the a more then FAIR price for it!) i know this is against the "ebays rules" oh well... sh*t happens.... i don't do it that much just once in awhile... (i know that don't make it right by ebays rules!!) once in awhile i will see an auction end early that i have a bid on and i will just say oh well!! the seller could of gotten more for it from me! their loss!! well... and mine too ;( there are many things that can be talked about and i'm sure people will see things differently some pro some con... like sniping i don't like sniping i do belive it is a good way of getting things cheaper but still i won't snip (unless i'm sniping to resnipe a sniper..did that make sense?) anyway i say CONGRATS Sylentwulf!!! nice find!!! Take Care, Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jahfish Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 yeeeaahhh, coool cheap obelix! ma kinda price range! let's get back to work ... ehhm ... i mean braggin' ! and of course back to ebay, the s*it we love to hate ... [ 05-31-2002: Message edited by: jahfish ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 I don't have a problem with anything Sylentwulf did. It's borderline unethical, but he pulled a good business move. But, deleting the original topic on digitpress to cover his tracks is pretty cheap. If you brag, deal with the consequences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Weis Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 quote: Originally posted by jahfish: by: jahfish ] as long as they make very good money from me for tons of fees for every single small feature and offer no service when there's problems .... well my honest and pretty direct answer is: f*ck yabe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylentwulf Posted May 31, 2002 Share Posted May 31, 2002 The most humorous thing I found about all of this, is noone even ASKED what I paid. For all anyone knows I could have paid $200 for him to end that auction early. As for deleting the post on DP, I listed the amount I bought it for, and had one or 2 other reply's, and decided to delete the post so people DIDN'T know what I paid for it (It wasn't $200, but it wasn't $25 either). And ALSO because I didn't want another post like this to open up on that board too At any rate. Happy hunting and Game-on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAZ Posted June 1, 2002 Share Posted June 1, 2002 I didn't know it was against the rules of Ebay to ask a seller to sell individual items they have up for auction, and then have them relist.... Unless it is against Ebay rules that a seller stop an auction early. If that is wrong, then it is wrong. But it isn't the fault of the person asking the question. Like if someone asked me to shoot someone else, and then I do it....are they at fault or am I? Um, oops...yeah hiring hitmen is against the law. Um, what was I saying? hehe Like if a seller is selling 200 Atari 2600 games, but I want like TWO out of the whole mess, I might ask the seller if they would be willing to sell those to me, and then relist. Not as bad as hiring a hitman, but perhaps I'm starting to see the logic. So I, therefore, would be as "guilty" as Sylentwulf in asking people to end auctions early. Like the hitman scenario, we shouldn't tempt people to break Ebay's rules (if there are any like this). Also, one time someone was selling a bunch of Atari 5200 games, but I wanted like 6 out of the 18 being sold. I made him a good offer, and said that he would probably make more in the long run if he relisted. So I was "helping" him make a profit, while acquiring only the games I wanted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philflound Posted June 1, 2002 Share Posted June 1, 2002 I'm not knocking him down for finding carts he needs or wants to resell for a cheap price. I'm knocking the fact that he did it against the ebay policy. I'm the one who was trying to get a "garage sale corner" or "in the wild" section going to see how people find great things for great deals, but going about it in the wrong way, then bragging about it is downright wrong. If he had gotten this in the wild, I would have said, "good for you", but to do something sneaky does not show good faith among the other collectors. If I'm totally offbase with this, then I apologize, but I have a feeling that I'm not, since Al mentioned the whole thing about Ebay violation. That's all I have to say. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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