It's official. I'm an eBay moron magnet.

[ianoid]

When you remove one side from having an opinion regardless of the reason this is not improved.

 

Word.

 

Alright, I'm convinced, I'll see if I can set up a 'bot to automatically leave positive with payment.

 

I still think it's a bow to a broken system. Sure, I may be in denial. And I still think it's perfectly reasonable for me to only leave positive when they have, but clearly that's far from universal. Especially with the buyers, who despite being somewhat clueless (bit of a god complex here with most of them WE, THE BUYERS, CREATED YOU, THE SELLERS), remain my primary clientele on eBay. Is there an irony emoticon?

[ianoid]

And the...

After all, if you (bidder) aren't bothering to leave me feedback, why would I bother? I'm probably alot busier anyway.

...*IS* turd scented.

 

It was meant to be. See above post by me. I try to put in my policies that I don't want to be 'blessed' with anyone's bids. If you aren't ready to work WITH me on a transaction, I don't want to work with you (not you Jetset, I mean the buyer who isn't looking at this as a cooperative effort).

 

If I could block bids on people with under 20 feedback for approval, I would. On the other hand, I'd lose a ton of business. Newbs tend to be less reasonable, like this idiot who left this neg.

 

And in the past I've spelled out the policy in my auctions 'I leave feedback after you do' among other things. And eBay says it's good to have policies. But they seem to have no effect on anything. Nobody reads them, and I can't enforce them without risk of negative reciprocation. So I'm probably going to delete most of my policies.

 

----

 

 

eBay reminds me of Goodwill. Remember how about 10 years ago Goodwill added neon to the stores and tried to make them look more mainstream and acceptable, with an ad campaign to match? eBay is clearly undergoing the same identity issues, trying to create more mainstream appeal. They see the Amazons of the world with their unified appearance, and how much growth they have undergone, and they (eBay) look at their stale growth figures, and they ask big marketing agencies to figure out why they aren't growing as much. And the people in the focus groups say 'because we're so confused, is it a store, or is it a person we're buying from? We like stores!' So eBay wants to make it less like a P2P place, and more like a store. More anonymous. Hence, Buy It Nows, Stores, and encouraging free shipping. They are trying to get more buyers, make it more like a mall with a bunch of little shops. I think that community is lacking, and that's one facet that will be exploited when other sites rise to take eBay down.

Edited September 10, 2008 by ianoid

[jetset]

I hear ya.

For the most part, here at AA I do definetly see the down side to the changes from the standpoint of the good sellers. Of course, this is a community so most of the sellers here are also hobbyists themselves so there's a lot less of the 'bad'. Really, were I to buy from you, or macgrail, or cpuwiz, or albert via ebay knowing you all are good sellers I wouldn't mind the asking for feedback first. Even though I don't know you personally I know I can trust you. Too many sellers though aren't honest and the "leave me feedback first", even with a "please" come across as a way to have the upper hand to try and screw you if there's a problem.

Anyways brucebidder had the best idea and it's been mentioned a million times, the blind feedback thing is the best way. Why ebay doesnt consider that I'll never understand.

[video game addict]

...to have the upper hand to try and screw you if there's a problem.

 

 

If you received what was purchased and are happy with it, why does there need to be any upper hands or screwing involved? Why doesn't a buyer leave feedback if they get what they paid for and are satisfied?

[BigO]

...to have the upper hand to try and screw you if there's a problem.

 

 

If you received what was purchased and are happy with it, why does there need to be any upper hands or screwing involved? Why doesn't a buyer leave feedback if they get what they paid for and are satisfied?

That's what I do, when I give feedback. It seems like a huge waste of my time and energy to play the games people play with feedback. I can only control what I do and am responsible only for what I do.

 

Knowing that somebody has, I can see how someone might take exception to the way the request was made. I guess it could be seen as coercive. But, I also think the guy did overreact. For me, I think I'd write something like "I'd appreciate you leaving positive feedback once you're satisfied with our transaction": assume the positive outcome and let them know that you'd appreciate their taking the time to give you the feedback. (Note that I have never sold one single thing on eBay.)

[brucebidder]

I hear ya.

For the most part, here at AA I do definetly see the down side to the changes from the standpoint of the good sellers. Of course, this is a community so most of the sellers here are also hobbyists themselves so there's a lot less of the 'bad'. Really, were I to buy from you, or macgrail, or cpuwiz, or albert via ebay knowing you all are good sellers I wouldn't mind the asking for feedback first. Even though I don't know you personally I know I can trust you. Too many sellers though aren't honest and the "leave me feedback first", even with a "please" come across as a way to have the upper hand to try and screw you if there's a problem.

Anyways brucebidder had the best idea and it's been mentioned a million times, the blind feedback thing is the best way. Why ebay doesnt consider that I'll never understand.

 

 

YOu bring up a great point the people here discussing this isn't the problem, the problem is sellers with piss poor attitudes that send you a 200.00 sealed game in a bubble mailer media mail, and the buyers who are clueless and leave feedback for things like I didn't like the color of the box the item was shipped in. I guess here we generally are preaching to the choir.

 

Also as a side note I thouhgt this was funny, I saved this from a year or so ago, what I thought was completely innapropriate from a seller I bought from, "Just so you know I do not generally leave feedback unless you neg me then its fair game, so please refrain from asking for positive feedback as I am to busy."

 

 

I reported him and then found out the son of a witch that was to damn busy to leave feedback was also schill bidding on his own auctions so he must not of been to damn busy. I reported him for it and he was promptly kicked off. Of course that was back when you could still see the bidding histories and catch the bastards that were schilling, another great ebay change....

[jetset]

...to have the upper hand to try and screw you if there's a problem.

 

 

If you received what was purchased and are happy with it, why does there need to be any upper hands or screwing involved?

 

Because many sellers used(d) the feedback system to do so. Slow shipping, overcharging on shipping, sending the item broken or damaged if at all, there's so many things (some) sellers do that they KNOW will leave the buyer unsatisfied but they didn't have to care.

Pretty easy to figure out the answer to that one. Sellers needed an upper hand so they could get away with whatever they wanted to.

 

 

Why doesn't a buyer leave feedback if they get what they paid for and are satisfied?

 

I couldn't agree more! Of course if the seller hasn't been courteous enough to thank them for your business they don't deserve thanks back now do they?

The whole "I want to make sure the buyer is satisfied", line is for the most part a crock. Here's a REALLY easy way to make sure without playing games with feedback.

Send an Email (DUH!)

Hi there buyermax345;

By now you should have received your deluxe monogramed colostomy bag. I certainly hope you're pleased with your purchase. If not kindly reply to this email and let me know the problem so that I can correct is. As a business my priority is customer satisfaction and I want to ensure you are completely satisfied.

When the buyer responds "yeah thanks I got it and love it"!

 

You know he's satisfied. Your email can even be automated and just change the item and buyer name.

 

No matter what it is what it is. Everyone claims that "buyer feedback is worthless". I would agree. But moreso with the old feedback system seller feedback was even less relevant. Buyers would RARELY leave a neg or a neutral for fear of retaliation. The only 2 negs I myself ever had were just that. SO when I felt screwed or dissatisfied I didn't bother, put them on my "do not buy from" list and moved on. In truth I was being selfish since I should have been taking one for the team and warning other buyers, just as I would have hoped they would do for me.

 

Really though the discussion is moot. Because of the sellers who played games the rules changed for ALL sellers including the good ones.

Edited September 10, 2008 by jetset

[hex65000]

If you received what was purchased and are happy with it, why does there need to be any upper hands or screwing involved?

[ . . . SNIP . . . ]

Of course if the seller hasn't been courteous enough to thank them for your business they don't deserve thanks back now do they?The whole "I want to make sure the buyer is satisfied", line is for the most part a crock. Here's a REALLY easy way to make sure without playing games with feedback.

Send an Email (DUH!)

Yeah, that will work reliably.

 

Seriously though, I'm not gonna speak for anyone but myself and how I do stuff. I've tried the E-mail route every once in a while and it has yielded no response typically. Since I ship with delivery confirmation, I'll wait a little while and if I don't hear anything then I'll leave feedback. If they leave feedback during that waiting interval then I know life is good and I'll comment appropriately. As a buyer I tend not to leave feedback until after I've tested an item out. Unfortunately, sometimes an item will sit for over a month until I get around to messing with it. Sometimes I'll do a maintenance sweep and leave positives if the item looked good and I haven't gotten to testing it out (typically that happens to the really aged stuff where there's no way they'd take me seriously if something was really wrong.

 

Now, after saying all that, you can guess how much of an 'upper hand' I'm looking for. I agree that the double-blind system is the closest answer to the problem. However, as a general rule the least common denominator on EBay fail their basic reading skills. I'm not talking about 4 pages of boilerplate either. It's like the idiots who say, "I paid for the item and it didn't arrive the next day."

 

I agree with you on your stance of shipping things and the padding of that cost. I don't find myself agreeing about this feedback matter though. I'm sure if there is excessive hostage-taking on CTCW, I think Mike will put the proverbial boot down.

 

For the record, I don't like getting nagged to leave feedback. If I haven't left feedback it's most likely because I haven't done anything with an item since it arrived.

 

Hex.

[ Taking boots and hammers to the feisty bigger ones... ]

[ianoid]

I just don't think that waiting for feedback is 'taking hostage'. It's more a battle of the lazies. Taking hostage would be "if you don't leave me positive I will leave you negative" (previous system).

 

I think that even using the word 'hostage' with regard to feedback is overstating the situation. I figured it wasn't that big of a deal to wait. I think it's a much bigger deal to get the item and be happy with it, rather than worry about the nuances of my treatment, eg 'I don't like how he worded his email to me'.

Edited September 10, 2008 by ianoid

[modlowarvai]

well i must ad that any company affiliated with ebay is horrible

 

Half.com - yeah, get some really cheap stuff here and hope that after you pay that the seller who probably listed the item 2 yrs ago, wakes up and ships your item or you have to wait 30 days when your credit card is due before then, a great ripoff.

 

ebay - well, reading all the comments on this forum, i think the new policy changes now puts the buyer in control and no matter what you do, you bound to get a negative feedback for some reason or another, i had a buyer try to blackmail by stating he will pay when he can since i can't give negative feedback but he didn't realize that after 7 days i filed a non-payer strike against him which he turned around and gave me neg. feeback, yet another long consuming fight with ebay to get it removed.

 

paypal.com - well, these are far the worse, they award buyers anything they seem to want no matter what proof you offer them, just had a customer who opened my product which was a sterile item and paypal allowed her to return the box after it was opened which can't be sold due to sterility, who wants to use something after she touched it, pretty absurb.

 

Craigslist - Try posting an ad, half of them are flagged for no reason whatsoever, I am sure people who are listing up stuff are flagging the competition. This will not happen on my site.

 

 

Final outcome - Well, we all know that ebay is changing it's policies to re-coop losses they claim they received but it is more that there anticipated goals were not met so now the consumer and sellers are the ones who must fill there pockets to satisfy them. Well, like most, i have stopped using ebay affiliated companies and created my own auction site http://www.modlow-arvai.com or http://mastamps.com in which i offer free listings and classifieds which all have the features of ebay plus more yet we are not removing the ablilities or features are necessary like given feedback from both sides. the only difference is we will be moderating feedbacks as we don't agree with a buyer/seller given neg. feedback just becasue they feel like it. We also have created a paypal like site as well at http://mypayme.com which isn't active yet but as our site grows, we will enable it as a form of payment over paypal thruout our entire site. Ebay has got greedy and it is only the sellers and buyers that can show them that by stop using their sites. Our site has all these sites(myspace, craigslist, paypal, ebay) combined into one place. We are not greedy, don't like something or want something added to the site, just ask. We make the changes to the likes of our traffic and registered users.

 

MY POINT- If given something for nothing slows them down a bit, i am so there.