Marius Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 Solution: fit Ultimate 1MB in more than one Atari. I have over 100 Atari 8bit computers, and I never know which one I want to use Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 Heh. I have Ultimate in a 600XL, 800XL, 1200XL, and 130XE (plus Incognito 800). That covers all my whims... I only have two hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kogden Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 I should make a PBI extender as a separate board. It would be easier than to rebuild the RAM card. It's quite hard to route 50 signals from one side of th eboard to the another on a two layer PCB when you have lot of SMD components in between. Now THAT would be truly awesome. Would also make experimenting with the PBI bus easier for me too w/ like a 50-pin header instead of edge connector. I'd buy a couple for sure. That RAM320XL board I got from you is great! If you get to the stage of wanting to fit internal upgrades to a 600XL, note that Ultimate 1MB fits in a 600XL just fine, if you're considering fitting some kind of internal upgrade anyway. That's true, being a fully socketed machine it would be almost plug and play. Probably a pain to install in my 130XE which is why I thought it was so cool the RAM 320XE had ECI pass-through. With the exchange rate at what it is though, it's about $70 USD to get an Ultimate 1MB board from Lotharek at present. Quite a bit more than a bare SIO2SD. I am intrigued by the Ultimate 1MB upgrade in my already 64K upgraded 600XL. Explain to me why I NEED a 1MB RAM upgrade. You don't but RAM is cheap now so there isn't much reason not to if you're already looking for a RAM expansion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 The Freezer 2011 works also with a pass-thru board. The freezer itself is connected on that board. Works great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 (edited) SIDE2 + U1MB (ATR PBI boot + mem exp) is not the do all and be all because some ATRs just refuse to work due to custom SIO routines, the same is true for MyIDE2 + U1MB (for MyBIOS + mem exp), there are a few suckers that just don't work. In general no matter what RAM solution you have pairing it with "non SIO solutions" (PBI or otherwise) does not achieve 100% yet. For those ATRs ("Seven Cities of gold" for example) you need an SIO device (for real) ... Sijmen (MyBIOS author) kindly attempted to patch "Seven Cities ..." a while ago for MyIDE2 but it wasn't enough, he found quite a few spots of custom code .... in the end it meant that every weird game [i mean custom SIO, raw data pumping via Pokey] had to be patched .... way too much work to consider either the "be all" solution, heck MyIDE2 won't work with PicoDOS fast SIO access either, it does work with std SIO though, I haven't tried it on SIDE2 + U1MB. As an owner of a "PBI challenged" XEGS I'd love if RAM exp would work out of the cart slot but I believe it is simply not possible, so I do envy the possibility offered by the non "PBI challenged" Ataris to have RAM exp without requiring a soldering iron. Now so told as I fitted my "PBI challenged" XEGS with U1MB, I guess my quest is over (one way or another). As for "was it worthy?", well being in NTSC land there's really not much that works that requires 1MB, can't even watch Numen .... , but there's a few games in 256K or 320K format (likely patched), and I even found one (Lucasart, can't remember the title) which works in CompyShop mode but not Rambo mode of U1MB (or the other way around, it just locks at the LucasArt logo screen, don't know if the problem is U1MB, my installation of it, or really it only works in either mode). Note to self: stop longposting on out of topic subjects Edited October 18, 2014 by phoenixdownita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari8warez Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 What if the Atari user wants to use a productivity (or other) cartridge such as Action!, etc.? How would that work? -Larry In that case U1MB + IDE+2, like I did with my 600XL.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
576XE Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 PBI extender sounds like Atari 1090. Are you think that these boys moved to the right azimuth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I should make a PBI extender as a separate board. It would be easier than to rebuild the RAM card. It's quite hard to route 50 signals from one side of th eboard to the another on a two layer PCB when you have lot of SMD components in between. Trying to visualize how that would work... Basically an extender board like the XE and XL Freezer with a connector on the top to plug in the Ram xxx? The XL Freezer board is very compact -- probably 2+ inches, and all the lines are carried through. I've tested the Ram 320XL module on both the Freezer extender boards (Freezer removed, of course) and it works fine on both. The XE Freezer board is larger since it must have a cartridge jack on top of it, and has the standard PBI configuration on the back of the extender. But that would cause a major re-design of your XL version, wouldn't it? Still, a pass-thru would interest a lot of folks. Pictures here in post 206, if interested: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/189738-turbofreezer-xlxe-2011-preorder-starts-now/page-9 -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kogden Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Trying to visualize how that would work... Basically an extender board like the XE and XL Freezer with a connector on the top to plug in the Ram xxx? The XL Freezer board is very compact -- probably 2+ inches, and all the lines are carried through. I've tested the Ram 320XL module on both the Freezer extender boards (Freezer removed, of course) and it works fine on both. The XE Freezer board is larger since it must have a cartridge jack on top of it, and has the standard PBI configuration on the back of the extender. But that would cause a major re-design of your XL version, wouldn't it? Still, a pass-thru would interest a lot of folks. Pictures here in post 206, if interested: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/189738-turbofreezer-xlxe-2011-preorder-starts-now/page-9 -Larry Using the freezer board, maybe one could just stick RAM320XL on PBI edge connector and make a cable for IDE+ that connects to 50 pin connector for freezer board? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctirad Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 And what about using some flex cable with suitable connectors as ECI/CART extension? I mean like IDE cables. Is it possible at all electrically? Technically, yes. But it would still require PCB and other connectors in between or a lot of soldering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctirad Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) Trying to visualize how that would work... Basically an extender board like the XE and XL Freezer with a connector on the top to plug in the Ram xxx? I'd like to have an universal PBI to multiple PBI (ok, two PBIs should be enough) rather than to use a proprietary connector just for a ramcard. Also the XL and XE versins are not functionally the same. The XE version utilizes /HALT singnal for true 130XE and COMPY SHOP mode, for example. BTW, how did you solved the missing signals between PBI and CART/ECI? I believe many PBI hardware including RAM320XL utilize the /CASINH signal, for example. Edited October 22, 2014 by ctirad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
576XE Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Ctirad, Yes I understand that anyway PCB needed and really ECI/CART BOOSTER as an expansion module is preferable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I'd like to have an universal PBI to multiple PBI (ok, two PBIs should be enough) rather than to use a proprietary connector just for a ramcard. Also the XL and XE versins are not functionally the same. The XE version utilizes /HALT singnal for true 130XE and COMPY SHOP mode, for example. BTW, how did you solved the missing signals between PBI and CART/ECI? I believe many PBI hardware including RAM320XL utilize the /CASINH signal, for example. Hi Ctirad- I'm not sure that I understand your question, but the Freezer XL carries all PBI lines through to the end of the board. The XE version takes the ECI lines and terminates them with the PBI set at the end of the extender. So in both cases they are the same on the end where the Ram 320XL was plugged in. Never have used Compy Shop mode on anything that I know of. Definitely not common here in the U.S. If I haven't answered your question, ask again. -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctirad Posted October 23, 2014 Author Share Posted October 23, 2014 Hi, I looked at your eagle files of the CART/ECI->PBI extender and see the CASINH singnal (named as EXT.B in your schematics) is not connected there. It is quite interesting that the RAM320XL can work with that. It is probably because unconnected line is decoded as log1 and thus basic RAM expansion will work when onboard jumper removed. However the mode with rempped base RAM cannot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Yes, I definitely have the jumper removed. -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctirad Posted November 19, 2014 Author Share Posted November 19, 2014 Just a brief update and a question.1. The new firmware that uses the /RAS trickery and thus allows to use the 576KB RAMBO and 320KB COMPY (with a functinal independent ANTIC banking) modes without modification is finished and sucessfully tested. Eventually, I will release an upgrade for the preproduction version as well.2. I named the upgraded version RAM320XE/576 to avoid confusion (or introduce more confusion? )3. The boards are now semi populated and wait for the rest of the ordered components. Another PCBs were ordered.4. The brand new RAM576XL design is 80% done.And now the question. The RAM320XE(/576) has COVOX audio as an option. Unfortunatelly, as I noted earlier, the original idea was to fill the unused space of the CPLD by something useful, but it failed. The option is still there, but it requires to fit larger CPLD and some other components not needed for the RAM alone. The price increase would be somewhere between 10 to 15$ for this option. If you still think it is acceptable, let me know.And the last question is also COVOX related. It now listens on the address $D600, which is most common address, but some people say it can conflict with some PBI devices. I can make it listening on any address or even multiple addresses, but I have to do it in the firmware without a possibility to change it later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I'm not interested in Covox. The only two add-ons I would see as a very welcome feature are: 1) A cold-boot reset key (with preservation of Ramdisk Content of course) 2) A battery powered RAM. So the Ramdisk would survive a power cycle. But feature 1 would be the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roydea6 Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I would like to see a 90k locked ramdisk that could be loaded with a DOS and used for BOOTING without a disk drive attached.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I would like to see a 90k locked ramdisk that could be loaded with a DOS and used for BOOTING without a disk drive attached.. This would require a major redesign, since this is only possible with some kind of a bios (firmware). I don't see this happen soon... but if the upgrade would be battery backupped and you install a Qmeg in your Atari, this is possible, since Qmeg can boot from ramdisk (!) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 And the last question is also COVOX related. It now listens on the address $D600, which is most common address, but some people say it can conflict with some PBI devices. I can make it listening on any address or even multiple addresses, but I have to do it in the firmware without a possibility to change it later. The Simple Stereo by Candle, allows for 3 selectable addressed. $D600, $D700, and $D280. The first two can be used by the VBXE2. As far as I know, nothing else touches $D280. If non-alterable, I would suggest using that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mathy Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Hello Ctirad $d600 will interfere with PBI devices. And since $d700 is the only alternative for the VBXE, $d280 would be the best address for Covox. Sincerely Mathy (who thinks $10 to $15 extra is OK) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+CharlieChaplin Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 Hmmm, how about taking a look at the software that uses/supports Covox ? Think in the latest Neotracker versions one can choose the Covox adress (so Neotracker should work with $D280, $D600 and $D700 as well as other adresses). But if I remember correctly Inertia and Protracker do have fixed adresses or look only for Covox at one adress (thus, they will not work if the hardware uses a different adress). Do not remember atm what adress Inertia and/or Protracker are using/looking for... Since there are not dozens or hundreds of programs that use/support Covox, it would be nice, if the few programs that are available would ALL work (meaning Inertia and Protracker and Neotracker should work)... -------------------------- Regarding the 576XE or 576XL: It would be nice if there is a mode that supports both Rambo & Compyshop banks, meaning 8 blocks (02468ACE) with 4 banks each. Any program that requires either Compyshop (blocks 26AE) or Rambo (blocks 8ACE) could simply use the banks it wants then (no need to switch between Compyshop and Rambo). Is this the case with your 576k Rambo mode (or does it use 4 blocks -8ACE- with 8 banks each) ?!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctirad Posted November 20, 2014 Author Share Posted November 20, 2014 OK then, the $D280 looks like a winner. Problem is the Inertia players and probably protracker as weel will need to be patched becuase they have harcoded $D600. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctirad Posted November 20, 2014 Author Share Posted November 20, 2014 The supported RAM modes are: 130XE: 320XE: 576K RAMBO 320K COMPY SHOP The 130XE and 320K COMPY SHOP modes support independend CPU/ANTIC banking. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 Very nice! -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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