phoenixdownita Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) @phoenix I have zero problems with my seven myide 2 carts and ultimate 1mb. Could you describe a step by step which I can repeat here so I can see for myself that myide 2 and u1mb won't play nicely together? Simple, stock U1MB, put U1MB flasher ATR on MyIDE2 partition space, start U1MB flasher ATR from MyIDE2 partition space, flasher can't' find SDX board [i believe I tried to use FAT32Loader to start U1MB flasher ATR from FAT32 but it complains as the "disk" is too big at 720KB, so can't use FAT32Loader for that ATR] Go to U1MB activate SDX, reboot, MyIDE2 is bypassed so cannot get to partition space to start the flasher ATR as U1MB starts SDX. Solution would have been that MyIDE2 can be supported thru PBI via U1MB SideLoader so we can start the flasher ATR with SDX on, but that does not work either and I believe fjc hinted at a MyIDE2 design decision as to the culprit. BTW I do like the extra functionality that MyIDE2 has over Side2 [like the available flash for whatever I may need there and the extra SRAM for R16 support] it is just I can't really use it to take care of my U1MB flashing needs. If I limit U1MB usage to RAM expansion then there's no issue whatsoever. As soon as I have a Side2 though to take care of the flashing needs then the need for MyIDE2 subsides a lot, as SideLoader supports ATR [via U1MB] and XEX, a few 8KB ROMs can be shoved into BASIC or XEGS slots [and MyIDE2 has no support for any other mapper so it's a wash], so we're really left with the 512Kb of SRAM and support for R16. Yes MyBIOS is actually quite great for what it does, but in the end what it does is mainly targeted at supporting MyIDE2 via SIO redirection and what not. Soft reset, cold reboot etc... are supported by U1MB as well so again duplicate functionality. If you do have a real SIO device that can take care of the flashing needs of U1MB then MyIDE2 can be your only CF cart. I am not sure if uflash can change this fact so that MyIDE2 can be used to flash U1MB at will without the need of a SIO device, if it does then at that point Side2 may be the redundant choice. Edited February 21, 2014 by phoenixdownita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Keep the good working here Greetings to you all atari friends. ProWizzard : Wat kan je met myide2 en u1mb board ? is het nodig ? als ik alleen 800xl/xe gebruik met 1050 mini speedy lees nu mee vind het interessant. Sorry mijn engels beetje bagger beetje old scool computer engels hahahahha. Hi Marco, What do you have now? Only 800xl/xe and 1050? If you are questioning what upgrade you are thinking of, you'd better tell what you want to be able to do. There are some differences between all the available interfaces. Greetz P! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Both Posted February 21, 2014 Author Share Posted February 21, 2014 Dear guys, I´m very happy ProWizard is helping me. You may have a look at the threads name. It´s called MyIDE II and Ultimate. For discussing MyIDE versus Side, you may open another thread. At least the help of ProWizard and Sijmen, I´ll get those damn things running. That´s for sure. Stefan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Simple, stock U1MB, put U1MB flasher ATR on MyIDE2 partition space, start U1MB flasher ATR from MyIDE2 partition space, flasher can't' find SDX board [i believe I tried to use FAT32Loader to start U1MB flasher ATR from FAT32 but it complains as the "disk" is too big at 720KB, so can't use FAT32Loader for that ATR] Go to U1MB activate SDX, reboot, MyIDE2 is bypassed so cannot get to partition space to start the flasher ATR as U1MB starts SDX. Solution would have been that MyIDE2 can be supported thru PBI via U1MB SideLoader so we can start the flasher ATR with SDX on, but that does not work either and I believe fjc hinted at a MyIDE2 design decision as to the culprit. BTW I do like the extra functionality that MyIDE2 has over Side2 [like the available flash for whatever I may need there and the extra SRAM for R16 support] it is just I can't really use it to take care of my U1MB flashing needs. If I limit U1MB usage to RAM expansion then there's no issue whatsoever. As soon as I have a Side2 though to take care of the flashing needs then the need for MyIDE2 subsides a lot, as SideLoader supports ATR [via U1MB] and XEX, a few 8KB ROMs can be shoved into BASIC or XEGS slots [and MyIDE2 has no support for any other mapper so it's a wash], so we're really left with the 512Kb of SRAM and support for R16. Yes MyBIOS is actually quite great for what it does, but in the end what it does is mainly targeted at supporting MyIDE2 via SIO redirection and what not. Soft reset, cold reboot etc... are supported by U1MB as well so again duplicate functionality. If you do have a real SIO device that can take care of the flashing needs of U1MB then MyIDE2 can be your only CF cart. I am not sure if uflash can change this fact so that MyIDE2 can be used to flash U1MB at will without the need of a SIO device, if it does then at that point Side2 may be the redundant choice. From a stock situation (when you already built in Stock U1MB) I would do this: 1) I would edit SDX package on PC using the SDXconfig tool. I would add the MyBIOS rom and and UFLASH.XEX to the CAR: 2) I also would adapt the config.sys of this package to be sure that the RAMDISK of U1MB can be accessed. 3) Then I would add this SDX package to the FAT32 partition of MyIDE 4) Then I would start Atari with MyIDE 2 in cartridge port, and U1MB set to 320KB and U1MB set to DEFAULT XL/XE OS 5) Then I would copy the UFLASH.XEX and the MYBIOS.ROM from the CAR: to the Ramdisk (Do:) by using SDX Type command. 6) Then I would go into U1MB menu and set SDX to Enabled, and reboot with C 7) Then SDX would start, and I would go to Do: and run UFLASH.XEX from Ramdisk. You see... even without any SIO device (but a PC) you would simply be able to flash your U1MB with MyBIOS.ROM (or any other thing) out of the box. I must admit: I did not test this yet, but I'm pretty sure it would work. Only thing to know is how to copy files from CAR: to a regular drive which does not work with COPY command, but works with TYPE command (TYPE CAR:FILENAME >>Do:FILENAME) As soon as you have MyBIOS in U1MB you can perfectly use SDX even without MyIDE.SYS, and the native MyBIOS partitions. Only thing you have to do is creating a SpartaDos formatted partition first, and make sure there is a CONFIG.SYS on your SpartaDos formatted partition, and use the DEVICE SIO /A line in config.sys 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aking Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 From a stock situation (when you already built in Stock U1MB) I would do this: 1) I would edit SDX package on PC using the SDXconfig tool. I would add the MyBIOS rom and and UFLASH.XEX to the CAR: 2) I also would adapt the config.sys of this package to be sure that the RAMDISK of U1MB can be accessed. 3) Then I would add this SDX package to the FAT32 partition of MyIDE 4) Then I would start Atari with MyIDE 2 in cartridge port, and U1MB set to 320KB and U1MB set to DEFAULT XL/XE OS 5) Then I would copy the UFLASH.XEX and the MYBIOS.ROM from the CAR: to the Ramdisk (Do:) by using SDX Type command. 6) Then I would go into U1MB menu and set SDX to Enabled, and reboot with C 7) Then SDX would start, and I would go to Do: and run UFLASH.XEX from Ramdisk. You see... even without any SIO device (but a PC) you would simply be able to flash your U1MB with MyBIOS.ROM (or any other thing) out of the box. I must admit: I did not test this yet, but I'm pretty sure it would work. Only thing to know is how to copy files from CAR: to a regular drive which does not work with COPY command, but works with TYPE command (TYPE CAR:FILENAME >>Do:FILENAME) As soon as you have MyBIOS in U1MB you can perfectly use SDX even without MyIDE.SYS, and the native MyBIOS partitions. Only thing you have to do is creating a SpartaDos formatted partition first, and make sure there is a CONFIG.SYS on your SpartaDos formatted partition, and use the DEVICE SIO /A line in config.sys that's pretty much what i was going to suggest 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 @Stefan Both by the way: that should also work. If your U1MB is not completely ruined yet, you also could follow that SDX route. You have to know how to edit your SDX package. If you want I could help you with that. Should also do the trick, but only if your U1MB still does a few things (like booting it's built in SDX, and your ramdisk is 100% ok; uflash.xex needs extended ram!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) Simple, stock U1MB, put U1MB flasher ATR on MyIDE2 partition space, start U1MB flasher ATR from MyIDE2 partition space, flasher can't' find SDX board Ultimate flasher requires SpartaDOS X, so MyIDE is culpable here, I'm afraid. Solution would have been that MyIDE2 can be supported thru PBI via U1MB SideLoader so we can start the flasher ATR with SDX on, but that does not work either and I believe fjc hinted at a MyIDE2 design decision as to the culprit. I explained that the positioning of the MyIDE2's IDE base register meant an Ultimate MyIDE PBI BIOS would never be a possibility. I doubt that MyIDE 2 was deliberately made incompatible, but who knows. Neither party, though, is especially interested in making MyIDE 2 and Ultimate PBI work together, and who can blame them. MyIDE users use MyBIOS or SDX/APT soft drivers, and SIDE users use the Ultimate PBI BIOS. Some forethought is therefore required when purchasing the equipment in the first place. If I limit U1MB usage to RAM expansion then there's no issue whatsoever. So you must, for the reasons outlined above. That MyIDE 2 will get PBI support is a vain hope indeed, but as I say, SDX users can use the MyIDE 2 soft-driver if they prefer the simple life. As soon as I have a Side2 though to take care of the flashing needs then the need for MyIDE2 subsides a lot, as SideLoader supports ATR [via U1MB] and XEX, a few 8KB ROMs can be shoved into BASIC or XEGS slots [and MyIDE2 has no support for any other mapper so it's a wash], so we're really left with the 512Kb of SRAM and support for R16. Yes MyBIOS is actually quite great for what it does, but in the end what it does is mainly targeted at supporting MyIDE2 via SIO redirection and what not. Soft reset, cold reboot etc... are supported by U1MB as well so again duplicate functionality. Duplicated functionality is exactly correct: if you have the cash to buy both cartridges and use SIDE2 as some kind of stepping-stone to flashing MyBIOS, then all well and good, but it seems like a lot of extra expenditure when you could have bought Ultimate and SIDE2 as a package in the first place. Ken's question, in those circumstances, becomes quite reasonable, and as already mentioned elsewhere, given the major advantages Ultimate+SIDE offers in terms of read/write ATR access in the FAT partition, I completely fail to see how some SRAM and an on-screen disk swapper makes MyIDE2 a clearly superior choice, providing the user already has Ultimate 1MB in the machine, which you clearly do. I am not sure if uflash can change this fact so that MyIDE2 can be used to flash U1MB at will without the need of a SIO device, if it does then at that point Side2 may be the redundant choice. Not a hope in Hell of me shoehorning UFLASH into MyBIOS, especially not if doing so made SIDE2 "the redundant choice". SIDE2 was not designed to form one half of a flashing kit for MyIDE2 users. Again: MyIDE2+MyBIOS... SIDE2+Ultimate. 1) I would edit SDX package on PC using the SDXconfig tool. I would add the MyBIOS rom and and UFLASH.XEX to the CAR: ... 5) Then I would copy the UFLASH.XEX and the MYBIOS.ROM from the CAR: to the Ramdisk (Do:) by using SDX Type command. This won't work, since UFLASH.XEX is 16KB long and the maximum file length on CAR: is currently 8KB. I could split the utility into two overlays (as I have done with the yet-to-be-released FDISK and MATR), but it never occured to me that a flashing tool is something people would need to run from CAR:. Is it??? I must admit: I did not test this yet, but I'm pretty sure it would work. As I say, it won't because CAR: won't take a 16KB executable. It´s called MyIDE II and Ultimate. For discussing MyIDE versus Side, you may open another thread. Unfortunately people are attempting to use tools designed for Ultimate and SIDE with Ultimate and MyIDE, and wondering out loud whether they can have Ultimate PBI support for MyIDE, and whether the Ultimate SDX build can work with MyBIOS, etc, etc, so it ain't quite that simple, I'm afraid. Edited February 21, 2014 by flashjazzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Hmm i did not know CAR was limited to 8K... so a ROM file wouldn't fit there too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 The limitation will (apparently) be lifted at some stage, but for now it's proved no great hardship to split up larger applications. Data files are quite a different matter, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 ... but it seems like a lot of extra expenditure when you could have bought Ultimate and SIDE2 as a package in the first place. I hear you loud and clear. It just happened I bought MyIDE2 first then wanted to try those bigger than 64K "games" hence U1MB + Side2 package (Side2 on a hunch that it would work better with U1MB). With "the widowm of tomorrow" now in my possession I probably would not have done it that way but I was a beginner and ended up buying more than strictly needed. And many apologies to Stefan for hijacking his thread, good luck in sorting out your issues and by any mean document how it worked out so another user will benefit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 I have to ask fjc for permission but I could split uflash.xex and a rom for the myide slot and deliver a tool that links those parts into original files on the ramdisk and then you could run them from SDX .. But as said I can not release a modified version of uflash without permission. In the meantime I am thinking of something else. I might write a ramdiskprogram for mydos so you could put files on ramdisk with Mybios and then after you boot SDX you could acces the files on the ramdisk in SDX... That last solution would be cool anyway. But I have to investigate the structure of the ramdisk in SDX. Also I could release a non intelligent version of such tool that only puts a fixed data block on the extended memory... That would work for now, but is an ugly solution. The Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 I have to ask fjc for permission but I could split uflash.xex and a rom for the myide slot and deliver a tool that links those parts into original files on the ramdisk and then you could run them from SDX .. Use this: UFLASH for CAR.zip Use the SDX imaging tool to place UFLASH.COM and the three OVL files in CAR:. NOTE: The OVL files MUST have the hidden attribute set. Do this by right-clicking on the file once in CAR, and choosing "File Information". Run by typing "UFLASH" at the SDX prompt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 But I'm afraid that won't do the trick. phoenix want to be able to flash u1mb in a stock situation where SDX in u1mb does not have myide drivers, and he has not mybios in a rom slot on u1mb. So that's where I got the idea to create a SDX where your flasher (uflash) is on car. When he starts THAT sdx package from MyIDE FAT32 he could 'copy' needed files to ramdisk, then restart atari with the u1MB SDX enabled, and run the flasher from ramdisk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 Hmmm... this is becoming profoundly convoluted. So do you need the same thing but with a loader that reads non-hidden files from the RAMdisk? If so, that's easy enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 But I'm afraid that won't do the trick. phoenix want to be able to flash u1mb in a stock situation where SDX in u1mb does not have myide drivers, and he has not mybios in a rom slot on u1mb. So that's where I got the idea to create a SDX where your flasher (uflash) is on car. When he starts THAT sdx package from MyIDE FAT32 he could 'copy' needed files to ramdisk, then restart atari with the u1MB SDX enabled, and run the flasher from ramdisk. Hmmm... this is becoming profoundly convoluted. So do you need the same thing but with a loader that reads non-hidden files from the RAMdisk? If so, that's easy enough. I appreciate the concerted effort and I believe it would be great for MyIDE2 owners if this would be supported, but as far as I am concerned I found my nirvana first in a EPROM burner (and eventually got tired to push/pull the flash chip), then Side2 and the test PBI 0.6 that allow me to flash to my heart's content the whole 512K as generated by TRG and/or U1MRomBld. I'm looking forward to the fixes for SideLoader to allow uflash.xex to perform its magic via FAT32, I believe uflash.xex should have a place in the U1MB flash itself within/on the side of SideLoader {dunno, press "F"} so it is always available but that is just my preference. That would be it for me as then I would have even single slot U1MB flashing capability all within FAT32 ..... and yes one of the usages for me would be to flash new MyBIOSes as sijmen makes them available. Regarding this topic let's help Stefan first and maybe have another topic wrt stock U1MB flashing via MyIDE2 only, if that is even a goal with enough support from involved parties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 OK, well I'm going out to relax with friends tonight, which is a welcome prospect since I am entirely burned out right now. I'll be available tomorrow (releasing drivers, etc, barring more bugs), so if I can help futher, just shout up. Roger and out for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 I appreciate the concerted effort and I believe it would be great for MyIDE2 owners if this would be supported, but as far as I am concerned I found my nirvana first in a EPROM burner (and eventually got tired to push/pull the flash chip), then Side2 and the test PBI 0.6 that allow me to flash to my heart's content the whole 512K as generated by TRG and/or U1MRomBld. I'm looking forward to the fixes for SideLoader to allow uflash.xex to perform its magic via FAT32, I believe uflash.xex should have a place in the U1MB flash itself within/on the side of SideLoader {dunno, press "F"} so it is always available but that is just my preference. That would be it for me as then I would have even single slot U1MB flashing capability all within FAT32 ..... and yes one of the usages for me would be to flash new MyBIOSes as sijmen makes them available. Regarding this topic let's help Stefan first and maybe have another topic wrt stock U1MB flashing via MyIDE2 only, if that is even a goal with enough support from involved parties. One thing to add (I already wrote this before): As soon as you have MyBIOS in your U1MB you can flash rather easily from your MyIDE. If you want to be able to do that, and you need assistance by that, let me know. Greetz Prowizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roydea6 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Use this: UFLASH for CAR.zip Use the SDX imaging tool to place UFLASH.COM and the three OVL files in CAR:. NOTE: The OVL files MUST have the hidden attribute set. Do this by right-clicking on the file once in CAR, and choosing "File Information". Run by typing "UFLASH" at the SDX prompt. This got me to wondering just what parts of your software might go into future releases of SDX4xxx... I would hate loosing some of the MAN files not of my choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 (edited) This got me to wondering just what parts of your software might go into future releases of SDX4xxx... I would hate loosing some of the MAN files not of my choice. Well, you can put them right back using the SDX Imager. There's so much MAN stuff on CAR, though, that I have to remove some or all of it, and since I can't know what bits to leave and what to take away, I remove the lot. That's the only way I can get the software to fit on the cart. As I say: SDX Imager is your friend here. You can put back and take away anything you like. The fact is that since you now have a hard disk anyway, it's actually faster to read the MAN files off the HDD that it is to read them from CAR:. Edited February 23, 2014 by flashjazzcat 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Both Posted February 23, 2014 Author Share Posted February 23, 2014 Back at home again. I prepared my second Xl (unsolder ICs, place socket instead) Tested it - same problems like before. Because of the reading problems occured by using the disk containing the Uflash.xex, I loaded Atari DOS 2.5. in D1: After that, I had a look into D2: where I placed the Disk with the Uflash. 1) Dos assumed to have a XE130 present? (said something like Ramdisk) 2) Directory of DF2: disk showed Trash?! Why? Is there a chance to load SDX by Disk, inserting the Uflash Disk and start all over? Stefan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 You read trash because it is in SpartaDos format. That is normal. Perhaps you can find a version of Spartados 3.2 or 3.3 on Internet (that is a disk version, but it is not SDX!) ... that can read this format. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 There must be something wrong with or the MyIDE interface, or the Ultimate 1mb, or the used CF card (which I don't think). When you set your U1MB to Default XL/XE os and you use your MyIDE interface, you still do not have any problem at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Both Posted February 23, 2014 Author Share Posted February 23, 2014 Most times without problems. Some programs does not run at all. (Mostly Games). But Iĺl test it tomorrow again. Stefan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 do you run these games with the FAT32 loader or with MyBIOS from the MyIDE cart. The latter is not so compatible (That's why you want MyBIOS in ultimate). I mean: do you notice any instability of the Ultimate 1MB. Could you do some serious testing of that u1MB without the MyIDE 2. And if that was successful could you then test the MyIDE 2 cart very well on that Ultimate 1MB machine, but then still set to Default XL/XE os. And if games do not run, could you then describe which game, and what your steps were (running from MyBIOS or Fat32). The problem is that I can't see what is happening. I try to understand what is going wrong. I am puzzled. I should really build in the Lotharek version of U1MB in one my atari's to see whether that one is less stable than the one that member candle produced. The candle ones are very good, that's something I'm 100% sure about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Both Posted March 6, 2014 Author Share Posted March 6, 2014 The projekt is still in progress. Iḿ sorry about the delay, but I already spend a lot of time and work to solve the problem. At the moment I've to catch up all the things regarding "normal life" Stefan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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