Andromeda Stardust Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 (edited) Sadly, I have no rose-tinted nostalgia goggles to try on. It's not so much the bizzare designs of the vintage controllers that causes so much discomfort but the force required to actuate the controls. The original Atari CX-40 joystick was bad, and the 5200 (analog flop stick), 7800 (Proline and Europad), both 'visions, etc., all had controller ideas that seemed good on paper but suffered from bad execution. If the controller is sturdy and takes only light pressure to activate the controls, but also built sturdy enough to withstand heavy-handed play, then it is a good controller. I have large man-hands, and while size is not a problem, some of the vintage controllers seem to be very stiff for me to use, requiring excessive force to register movements yet simultaneously feel like I have to be extra careful because they might also break easily. 30-year-old brittle plastic doesn't help but I can't imagine they were that much better back in the day. I had a pair of NIB Atari CX-40 joysticks, one of which made a loud popping sound while playing shortly after I first got my Atari. The joystick in question still operates but makes a crinkling sensation when I try to game with it. I put it away and started using the Genny pad until I completed my "ultimate" Atari arcade joystick (w/ built in paddles). I can only imagine the agony such a controller would cause in the hands of a small child or someone with weaker hands than I. Having grown up in the 80s, I still consider the NES/SNES to be the gold standard of retro controllers, and the PS2 to be the gold standard of modern controllers. However I appreciate a good joystick as well and have created several of my own arcade controllers using real arcade parts in wooden enclosures. The Flashback 2 joysticks proved to me that the classic design could be improved using modern manufacturing, and I hope that the new Intelli/Coleco controllers will be no exception. Off topic: Gallery of my custom joystick builds: https://www.flickr.com/photos/30203515@N04/sets/72157629736738048/# Edited July 2, 2014 by stardust4ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Off topic: Gallery of my custom joystick builds: https://www.flickr.com/photos/30203515@N04/sets/72157629736738048/# My, what big joysticks you have!!! I'm also hoping that the new stuff isn't "creaky." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 OK, here's the answer regarding the overlays. The box designs have already gone to the printers, so they can't be changed, but the actual overlays themselves will have the little tabs. We're discussing right now about putting the game titles somewhere on the overlays (perhaps the tab), since, unlike back in the day, there is no cartridge slot to stick the overlays in so you know which overlay goes with which game. I'm also confirming that indeed EVERY game will have an overlay, even those ColecoVision and Intellivision games that didn't originally come with them. I don't think that plan has changed, but we may as well be absolutely sure since we're presently discussing them. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelboy Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 OK, here's the answer regarding the overlays. The box designs have already gone to the printers, so they can't be changed, but the actual overlays themselves will have the little tabs. We're discussing right now about putting the game titles somewhere on the overlays (perhaps the tab), since, unlike back in the day, there is no cartridge slot to stick the overlays in so you know which overlay goes with which game. Thanks for looking into this, Bill. I'm also confirming that indeed EVERY game will have an overlay, even those ColecoVision and Intellivision games that didn't originally come with them. I don't think that plan has changed, but we may as well be absolutely sure since we're presently discussing them. Every game? Even titles that never really used the keypad except for selecting skill levels or game options? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Every game? Even titles that never really used the keypad except for selecting skill levels or game options? Yes, that was the original plan. All 60 (or 61) games on each Flashback will have their own overlay. I'm just trying to confirm it since that portion is now being settled. That's been kind of my point about the overlays and new controllers alone being enough for most of the hardcore in our community even if they don't care a lick about the console portion. $40 for two new controllers and 60 (or 61) overlays is enough on its own considering what we often pay for much less. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zwackery Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Yes, that was the original plan. All 60 (or 61) games on each Flashback will have their own overlay. I'm just trying to confirm it since that portion is now being settled. Very interesting. I'm thinking I'm going to be buying several CV Flashbacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimerians Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Damn now I want to order more of them but I'm hanging back mainly because the biggest thing for me is the controller. I loved the Atari Flashback controllers, I bought extra flashbacks just to have those controllers which I now use on real Atari 2600's and C64's etc. If the controller is really good I can see buying 3 or 4 of these consoles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 As was stated elsewhere, though they can be a bit difficult to track down (usually just on the AtGames site or Amazon), AtGames does usually make the controllers available for separate purchase. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S1500 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Here's an idea for the future: an LCD touchpad that puts the right overlay on it for whatever game you are playing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Here's an idea for the future: an LCD touchpad that puts the right overlay on it for whatever game you are playing. I don't necessarily find that idea satisfying unless there's sufficient haptic feedback, and even then, I think there's something missing. The lack of "feel" was part of the reason I was disappointed with the Intellivision DS game, which more or less implemented a version of your idea. In any case, the point of these products is to tickle the fancy of the average nostalgic consumer. If you deviate too much from the look and feel of the original, then you don't necessarily engage that lucrative target audience, instead engaging our much smaller and pickier community. Certainly the digital versions of these products for iOS and Android devices will all be touch-based, so at least we'll see some form of that whenever those are released. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Here's an idea for the future: an LCD touchpad that puts the right overlay on it for whatever game you are playing. I had the same thought. It could be done with today's technology for the classic game enthusiast who has everything. ColecoVision by Vertu. Wretched excess! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) LCD touchpad (capacitive or resistive) embedded inside the controller would be stupid expensive anyway. Plus, If I understand the schematics correctly, there's no +5VCC pin on the control port to supply power so it would never be backwards compatible. Might as well make another DS/3DS compilation if you're going that route. Oh, and iPad would suck because you can't accurately replicate the action buttons/Dpad. Nearly all classic remakes that map buttons to a pad have completely failed in the controls department. Does anybody know if you can preorder goods from the Dollar General website? Also, are Dollar Generals good at stocking items the day they're released? They tend to be the redneck Walmart of the south. Many towns that are deemed to small for a Walmart Super Center have a Dollar General. There is a Dollar General on the street corner outside my neighborhood. I just want to be able to walk in on October 1st and pick one up. Edited July 3, 2014 by stardust4ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted July 3, 2014 Author Share Posted July 3, 2014 For IOS/Android, what would be ideal is a CV bluetooth controller A replica of the original CV controller just like in the Flashback Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcadeJunkie Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I just wanted to send a quick thanks to Bill for keeping us in the loop with this and the intv flashback.... thanks man! Also, as a side note, its a shame you can't put the controllers into the console like the original... but its probably wayyyy too late for any design changes, since I'm sure China is already inprocess of producing them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I just wanted to send a quick thanks to Bill for keeping us in the loop with this and the intv flashback.... thanks man! Also, as a side note, its a shame you can't put the controllers into the console like the original... but its probably wayyyy too late for any design changes, since I'm sure China is already inprocess of producing them No problem. I'm just not sure that would work because the controller cables aren't coiled and the console itself weighs about the same and is roughly the same size as one controller, so it might end up being a bit awkward since you'd have to mount the controllers on each side of the unit. Either way, side mounted or doing the original cavity design, that would be a lot of extra empty plastic that may not make much fiscal sense over hundreds of thousands of units. I'm not sure this is meant to be a permanent TV fixture, just something you plug in now and again when you want a quick nostalgia fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcadeJunkie Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 No problem. I'm just not sure that would work because the controller cables aren't coiled and the console itself weighs about the same and is roughly the same size as one controller, so it might end up being a bit awkward since you'd have to mount the controllers on each side of the unit. Either way, side mounted or doing the original cavity design, that would be a lot of extra empty plastic that may not make much fiscal sense over hundreds of thousands of units. I'm not sure this is meant to be a permanent TV fixture, just something you plug in now and again when you want a quick nostalgia fix. Sounds perfectly reasonable and rational to me... at least with it being so small I can plug it into the TV next to my toilet and enjoy some classic games while doing my business! (Yes, I'm so spoiled I have a 32" TV mounted on the wall near my toilet.... just be jealous and move on...hahaha) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Sounds perfectly reasonable and rational to me... at least with it being so small I can plug it into the TV next to my toilet and enjoy some classic games while doing my business! (Yes, I'm so spoiled I have a 32" TV mounted on the wall near my toilet.... just be jealous and move on...hahaha) Hmm, I've heard the saying "shit or get off the pot", but never have heard "get the high score or get off the pot". Anyway, other people's bowel movements are not something I have ever gotten jealous over, unless I was battling a bout of constipation. Thankfully this thread is not in the Inty Forum because if it was, I could not even imagine the direction that it would take, but I'm pretty sure that it would head very quickly down the toilet with a lot of potty mouth talk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Hmm, I've heard the saying "shit or get off the pot", but never have heard "get the high score or get off the pot". Anyway, other people's bowel movements are not something I have ever gotten jealous over, unless I was battling a bout of constipation. Thankfully this thread is not in the Inty Forum because if it was, I could not even imagine the direction that it would take, but I'm pretty sure that it would head very quickly down the toilet with a lot of potty mouth talk. I've used my 3DS on the toilet before. I'll forget that I came in there to give birth to Mr Hankey and just start gaming. I have a big ass and if I sit too long the seat pinches against a nerve in my thigh and one or both of my legs fall asleep. Then it's a real PITA to get up and walk around when I can't feel or move my feet. Usually I have to lean myself against the wall or counter until I regain full use of my leg. Never happens if I just do my business and get off the pot. I'm 33 years old; I shouldn't have to worry about that kind of stuff yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcadeJunkie Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Hmm, I've heard the saying "shit or get off the pot", but never have heard "get the high score or get off the pot". Anyway, other people's bowel movements are not something I have ever gotten jealous over, unless I was battling a bout of constipation. Thankfully this thread is not in the Inty Forum because if it was, I could not even imagine the direction that it would take, but I'm pretty sure that it would head very quickly down the toilet with a lot of potty mouth talk. i wasnt really talking about the pooping aspect.... i was talking more about being jelous of me having a nice tv to play games on while pooping.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slab0meat Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 OK, I have some significant news. While this will likely be irrelevant to the target audience of casual consumer, this will certainly impact hardcore fans and collectors of both the Intellivision and ColecoVision, so you'll want to adjust any preorders accordingly. Unfortunately, the final versions of both controllers, for whatever reason, are not electrically compatible with the originals. This means that you can't use original controllers on either Flashback, and these will NOT be a source of replacement controllers for original consoles despite the fact that in all other ways these function exactly the same as the originals. Further, there will NOT be a full complement of overlays in the box. For the Intellivision Flashback, all editions will include 10 game overlays, with a special version for Sam's Club containing a total of 15 game overlays. All 60 game overlays will be shown in the black and white manual as a "how to play" along with simple game descriptions. For the ColecoVision Flashback, all editions will include 4 game overlays, with an additional 4 (for a total of 8 in the Sam's Club version. The manual will not have pictures of any overlays in it, but does contain relatively detailed summaries of how to play (I wrote those myself and gave as much detail as possible in the space provided). Of the 4 (or 8 ColecoVision overlays, they will have the name of the game on the pull tab. Until I get further clarification, assume that the Dollar General version has the standard set of overlays, but one extra bonus game. So that means that there are three possible versions of both the Intellivision and ColecoVision Flashbacks at retail: standard, Sam's Club with extra overlays, and Dollar General with one extra game. Obviously, as a fellow collector, I'm most disappointed by these no longer being a source of replacement controllers. The overlays would have been nice from a collecting standpoint and cool factor, but are not as dramatic a loss. To keep things in perspective, and outside of the frustration from there being three different editions of each product, nothing else has changed, and again, by all reports to date, both the emulation and the actual authenticity of the controllers are spot on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyperboy Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Well that kinda blows.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slab0meat Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Yep, not very good news........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimerians Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 That sucks. Cancelled my pre-order of two. Will probably just get one of the editions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 This sums up the latest update provided about the CV Flashback and now there will be a third variation!!! I think that I am quickly losing interest, but still glad to see the Colecovision getting some love. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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