morelenmir Posted June 12, 2015 Author Share Posted June 12, 2015 No. The signal from the WP pin simply tells the address decoder when the VBXE control registers are addressable. So, it will do this (via logic 0 or 1, I don't know which) either when the CPU addresses D6xx, D7xx, or not at all, depending on the Ultimate BIOS setting (which is - internally - two bit: one bit is an on/off toggle, and the other selects $D6/D7). I expressed myself poorly - what you describe is what I meant. Basically that connection does not set the address, it only signals on or off. The address is set by "Ultimate1MB" and only referenced when the logic state signals the VBXE is on. I believe the 'Enabled' signal is low, according to the guide: pin 7 - Hi = VBXE configuration disabled (optional) What I don't understand is: pin 8 - CS (chip select) signal of D6xx or D7xx page goes to 74LS138 pin #9 (D6xx) or pin #7 (D7xx) Do you only connect Pin 8 if you are setting the address permanently and not using the "Ultimate1MB" to do so dynamically? Finally, Pin 4 of 'J3' requires to go to the 'CASNH' signal - Pin 16 - of the MMU chip. However that IC is swapped out for one of the cable connectors to the "Ultimate1MB". How do you connect it? Going from your photo above I suspect you have soldered it to the back of the MMU socket? Easy on the 130XE with that convenient hole in the motherboard, but not on the 800XL, which is solid!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted June 12, 2015 Share Posted June 12, 2015 Just pick off CASINH from the underside of the MMU socket or a nearby via. Regarding pin 8: the guide is assuming you're hard-wiring the base address. Just connect CS to WP on the ultimate and you're done. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted June 12, 2015 Author Share Posted June 12, 2015 Excellent! Many thanks FJC. As soon as the double-row 90degree pin headers come I can finally start soldering this thing in. The irony is, without the mini-SCART and ST->SCART cable I can get the VBXE attached but not tested!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted June 16, 2015 Author Share Posted June 16, 2015 A good few hours of work were required to fit this. However - I think - it is done and done properly. Certainly with the daughter board replacing the bare ANTIC chip, which in turn is reconnected as a pass-through, 'Q8' and 'R110' removed and all patches soldered in I still get a normal screen on boot up. I am fairly certain if there were a problem at this stage I would get no screen at all as after removing the two components mentioned above the VBXE becomes the main clock for the whole machine. To be totally honest - and perhaps tempting fate as I cannot fully test it until I get an ST->SCART lead and then micro-SCART->SCART adapter - it was a very easy install. Simpler I would say than the 'SimpleStereo'. The most fiddly bit as ever was replacing the bog standard native ANTIC socket with the precision engineered one. It also took a minute or two to find a convenient point to attach 'CASNH' as the MMU on my system is replaced by an "Ultimate1MB" and its pins are not available. Actually this ease of fitting surprised me a lot as it has taken me a long time to work up the courage to start. I would say to anyone who is considering a VBXE but discouraged by the perceived difficulty of installation - do not be. It is much, much simpler than it seems. A good part of that is I think due to the continued improvement and refinement of the design by candle'o'sin and lotharek. Going from some old pictures, the v1's perhaps deserved the reputation of being a tough install. One point I would draw to the attention of any who are playing along at home with their own hardware; for some reason 'J6' has Pin 1 mirrored - that is Pin 1 is at the far right when looking at the header with the writing on the VBXE the correct way up. Maybe there is a good reason for this that escapes me, but it caused me almost an hour's worth of greatly frustrated checking then re-checking before the penny dropped. It is even more confounding as 'J3' is the right way around, with Pin 1 at the far left... Infuriating but it seems thankfully not damaging. Also, there appear to be two of the cool new type of LEDs soldered on to the daughter board - labelled 'D1' and 'D2'. One of them is lit green but the second isn't. Should it be? At first I thought it might be to indicate if the board was soft-on or soft-off, but switching the state from the "Ultimate1MB" changes neither. Nor does it seem to flag the base memory address as altering that does not change the LEDs either. Is one perhaps to indicate PAL and the other NTSC configuration? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted June 16, 2015 Author Share Posted June 16, 2015 Is the wiring given on this post how the 13pin DIN plug should be wired for ST->SCART? http://atariage.com/forums/topic/167209-someone-who-can-make-a-cable/ '1 - Sound out' is obviously the mono audio that can be patched from the standard monitor socket. '2 - Composite Sync' is puzzling me at the moment. '6, 7, 10 & 13 - Green, Red, Blue & GND' would seem to logically connect to "VBXE" 'J6' Pins 3, 4, 5 & 1 respectively. Which only leaves VBXE J6 Pin 1 'RGB Control'. Is this perhaps the 'composite sync' signal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 (edited) If you're going to wire up the jack just like the ST, then yes - this will work. Composite sync can be taken from the composite pin of the DIN5 monitor jack. You're better off looking at the SCART cable design here: http://info-coach.fr/atari/hardware/interfaces.php Connect RGB control to what's described in the ST SCART cable design as "12v pullup". Note, as I said in PM, that the VBXE doesn't really need any resistors on the RGB lines. Edited June 16, 2015 by flashjazzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted June 16, 2015 Author Share Posted June 16, 2015 If you're going to wire up the jack just like the ST, then yes - this will work. Composite sync can be taken from the composite pin of the DIN5 monitor jack. You're better off looking at the SCART cable design here: http://info-coach.fr/atari/hardware/interfaces.php Connect RGB control to what's described in the ST SCART cable design as "12v pullup". Note, as I said in PM, that the VBXE doesn't really need any resistors on the RGB lines. Ahh, excellent - I'm going to wire up accorind to the SCART/Peritel Cable section. Are 'Monochrome Detect' and 'VSync' not supplied by the VBXE? Going from what we discussed I have asked the fellow who supplies those snazzy gold plated custom leads if he can remove any resistors that are attached before shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted June 17, 2015 Author Share Posted June 17, 2015 Soldered up, connected up and buttoned up!!! I think this is done. Frustratingly I cannot tell for sure or even test the new abilities until my ST->SCART cable and micro-SCART->SCART adapter come. However, running the 'core' setup utility 'FC.EXE' seems to successfully communicate with the "VBXE" board, so I am feeling quietly confident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 As it stands the "S_VBXE.SYS" driver is too large to fit on the SDX ROM., which is quite annoying as it must therefore be loaded off a disk of some sort. 'CON.SYS' will fit on the ROM, which is something at least. I am wondering if somewhat smaller 'RC_VBXE.SYS' would supply all the functionality I need - specifically 80 column output through 'CON.SYS'? Update: I see 'RC_VBXE.SYS' does indeed allow 80 column display. It also fits on the SDX ROM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MacRorie Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 Soldered up, connected up and buttoned up!!! I think this is done. Frustratingly I cannot tell for sure or even test the new abilities until my ST->SCART cable and micro-SCART->SCART adapter come. However, running the 'core' setup utility 'FC.EXE' seems to successfully communicate with the "VBXE" board, so I am feeling quietly confident. morelenmir, Did you happen to take any pics of the work? I have a VBXE/Simple Stereo sitting here waiting for me to install, but the install manual makes me more trepidatious rather than less. Any pics would go a long way in assuaging my fear. Also, how did you install the stereo? I was thinking of putting two RCA jacks on the outside and then running them to the TV/Monitor for sound. You cannot connect the RCA to anything on the VBXE cable, correct? Thanks! -M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MacRorie Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 Also, didn't someone have a drilling template for the ST (right angle) monitor connector? I have on for this project and thought I downloaded the pic, but cannot find it and cannot figure out the search terms that will let me turn it up here. Thanks! -Mac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 I'll upload the template later (PM if I forget). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted August 11, 2015 Author Share Posted August 11, 2015 morelenmir, Did you happen to take any pics of the work? I have a VBXE/Simple Stereo sitting here waiting for me to install, but the install manual makes me more trepidatious rather than less. Any pics would go a long way in assuaging my fear. Also, how did you install the stereo? I was thinking of putting two RCA jacks on the outside and then running them to the TV/Monitor for sound. You cannot connect the RCA to anything on the VBXE cable, correct? Thanks! -M I am actually in the process of writing a lengthy and detailed guide of my own for fitting the "VBXE", including the basic soldering techniques I used as I would like to dispel the myth it is a tough install. I will either upload it as a *.TXT file when I finish or make it a multi-post so I can have integrated photographs which would be nice. The existing 'Guide' is a little... terse... and becomes very confusing at points. I specifically found the advice on how to remove the crystal clock generator on the motherboard and replace it with the clock on the VBXE confusing and self-contradictory. Sadly I did not feel brave enough to try the board-mounted DIN13 plug, despite paying to import one from Hong Kong. Instead I connected a simple case-mount unit through the enlarged coax/RF output port I drilled. It is still pretty neat though and just requires unbolting and unplugging if you need to extract the motherboard - in order to work on the reverse face for instance. I have since got hold of a pillar drill, so with that I may try out the template and its super-fine holes through the motherboard. In regards the "SimpleStereo", the first time I installed it I took the output from the 'L,GND,GND,R' pin header to a 3.5mm stereo socket, only connecting up one of the grounds as they are shorted internally on the board. I thought that was more useful than separate Banana/RCA sockets as it made it simple to connect up powered speakers (and required one less hole in the case!). However the second time I installed the board I took advantage of the fact my existing SCART connection for the VBXE output carries audio as well as video - unlike a 'VGA' DSUB cable. Therefore I connected the audio lines directly to the DIN13 socket so I could get stereo from my 'monitor' TV speakers. I kept the existing 'L' channel and on FJC's advice I used the 'Audio In' (Pin5) on the DIN13 socket to carry the 'R' channel. In order to do this I had to slightly modify the wiring of the ST->SCART lead I bought (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Atari-ST-High-Quality-RGB-GOLD-Scart-AV-Lead-Video-Cable-TV-Lead-2mtr-/250978089310?hash=item3a6f75b95e) to firstly unshort the L+R audio (Pin1&Pin3) on the SCART socket and then lengthen and solder up an unused wire through the cable from the 'Audio In' (Pin5) on the DIN13 plug to the 'R' pin on the SCART plug (Pin3). The cable remains all but ST-compatible - if that is important to you - at the DIN13 plug as 'Audio In' is rarely/never used and the SCART plug becomes more compatible with separated L&R channel stereo sound. This is an extremely useful guide to wiring: http://info-coach.fr/atari/hardware/interfaces.php I have referred to it many, many times. One other thing to remember is to connect the "RGB Control" pin from the "VBXE" J4 pin-header to Pin12 of the DIN13 socket which should carry through to Pin16 of the SCART plug. The direction FJC gave to connect it to Pin8 was wrong - he tells me he does not have total recall Again: 'RGB Control' to DIN13 Pin12/SCART Pin16. This is extremely important - without it the monitor will not switch to RGB input. I spent two intensely frustrating days struggling with the install, reworking all the joints and wondering why I was not getting proper RGB SCART before I independently worked it out. But when it works for the first time... Wow... The "VBXE"'s RGB SCART output explosively removes one's socks as promised!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 Looks like the template is long gone, unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 I am actually in the process of writing a lengthy and detailed install guide for the "VBXE", including the basic soldering techniques I used as I would like to dispel the myth it is a tough install. I will either upload it as a *.TXT file when I finish or make it a multi-post so I can have integrated photographs which would be nice. The existing 'Guide' is a little... terse... and becomes very confusing at points. I specifically found the advice on how to remove the crystal clock generator on the motherboard and replace it with the clock on the VBXE confusing and self-contradictory. (snip...) I'm looking forward to your write-up. I've been procrastinating for at least two years. Part of that is just trepidation at the possible outcomes, and the larger part is due to the absence of some "killer" app or game needed to spur me onward. Of course, "a killer app" is a very subjective thing, especially since I rarely play games. Jon's GUI might do it when it is ready. -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morelenmir Posted August 11, 2015 Author Share Posted August 11, 2015 I'm looking forward to your write-up. I've been procrastinating for at least two years. Part of that is just trepidation at the possible outcomes, and the larger part is due to the absence of some "killer" app or game needed to spur me onward. Of course, "a killer app" is a very subjective thing, especially since I rarely play games. Jon's GUI might do it when it is ready. -Larry I'm over half-way through I would say; I started just after I got the thing working, but then became distracted with something and so it stalled. I'll get it done soon though and then post it up! Although I have been beguiled all over again by 'FarCry3' and that is taking up a good deal of my time - an amazing game!!! The RGB SCART output is, I would argue all the killer feature the "VBXE" needs. Had I known how good it was I would have got it done sooner myself! I was expecting a debatable difference in quality that you needed to be persuaded it existed at all. The reality is just... Wow. I have kept the 'monitor' output plugged in to the composite video socket of my tv/monitor and the "VBXE" out to the SCART so I can switch between them, just when I want to remind myself again how good it is. If the "VBXE" did absolutely nothing else it would be worth a good part of its price. When I get in to ASM proper I am sure I will enjoy all the 'BitBlt' functions along with the extra ANTIC modes. Seriously though, just the display alone is worth the effort - it is exactly as good as 'Altirra' on a PC monitor. I cannot imagine how it could be better given the limitations of the A8 itself. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MacRorie Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Looks like the template is long gone, unfortunately. Well, crap. SCART sounds nice, but, I would need a converter from that to everything else, so I figure putting an ST monitor port on the 8bit serves some kind of cosmic justice . . . :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KLund1 Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 I personally like the Atari ST Monitor option... Nice to have an Atari branded monitor! Could not resist. Here is my Atari Branded 1084S Monitor showing super video 2.1 upgrade, note the colors, XL series. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MacRorie Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 (edited) Well, I did it! I installed it. It is all connected . . . . . except for the monitor jack. Yeah, I have one friend who says the DB9 is the best way to go and, then there is my heart that keeps saying . . . that 13 pin Atari monitor jack would be BE-U-TEE-FULL instead. I could connect the SC1224 up directly. It would be (kinda) glorious! I could develop a cable/box that changed the pinouts. Part of me REALLY wants to do it this way. I mean REALLY.All that being said, I had a question: How can I tell everything is working with the VBXE *without* a monitor connected? Can I turn it on in the U1MB setup and still get composite output? I think I should be able to, but not 100% certain. The LED on the VBXE is lit and green, so there's that . . .The 800XL boots without a problem and all *seems* well, but curious as to what I can do to test things out until the 13 pin comes from the UK (I have a right angle, but without a template THAT ain't going in) *OR* the DB9 jack comes from Amazon. Maybe I should make it a race? UK was ordered a week before I did the Amazon order . . .Anyway, thanks for the help and if you have answers, I am anxious to listen! [Edited for the 14/13 pin error; Thanks FJC] Edited August 20, 2015 by MacRorie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 Your legacy video should still work. Are you talking about a thirteen pin DIN connector, BTW, for the SC1224? You could then wire the jack pin compatible with the standard ST cable (that's the way I went). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Z Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 Well, I did it! I installed it. It is all connected . . . . . except for the monitor jack. Yeah, I have one friend who says the DB9 is the best way to go and, then there is my heart that keeps saying . . . that 13 pin Atari monitor jack would be BE-U-TEE-FULL instead. I could connect the SC1224 up directly. It would be (kinda) glorious! I could develop a cable/box that changed the pinouts. Part of me REALLY wants to do it this way. I mean REALLY. All that being said, I had a question: How can I tell everything is working with the VBXE *without* a monitor connected? Can I turn it on in the U1MB setup and still get composite output? I think I should be able to, but not 100% certain. The LED on the VBXE is lit and green, so there's that . . . The 800XL boots without a problem and all *seems* well, but curious as to what I can do to test things out until the 13 pin comes from the UK (I have a right angle, but without a template THAT ain't going in) *OR* the DB9 jack comes from Amazon. Maybe I should make it a race? UK was ordered a week before I did the Amazon order . . . Anyway, thanks for the help and if you have answers, I am anxious to listen! [Edited for the 14/13 pin error; Thanks FJC] You can boot up the atari, load the rambo core, and run an extended RAM tester. That's about it, I think, without a monitor. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 Here: http://coolnovelties.co.uk/coolnovelties/connectors/135-13-pin-din-female-chassis-panel-mount-socket-connector.html is a panel mount DIN connector. It would be easier than using a board mount one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MacRorie Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 Here: http://coolnovelties.co.uk/coolnovelties/connectors/135-13-pin-din-female-chassis-panel-mount-socket-connector.html is a panel mount DIN connector. It would be easier than using a board mount one. That is the one on its way from the UK. Indeed, that is the company I bought it from. I have the board mount one in hand, but without a template of where to drill . . . .oh, I just thought of a way to make a template while writing this email. Hmmmm..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 Go for the template if possible. A board-mounted jack looks significantly better than a connector bolted to the plastic casing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 Go for the template if possible. A board-mounted jack looks significantly better than a connector bolted to the plastic casing. Yes it does, but some of us (such as myself) don't have the fine drills, steady hands, or the patience required to board mount the connector. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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